Jimmy Carter lashes at Bush Admin

[Darth Wong]

Carter just released a book about the Middle East in which he likened Israel's policies towards the Palestinians to those of apartheid-era South Africa towards blacks...

But the wierd thing is, I've heard Israelis make the same criticism...

Well, left-wing Israelis, anyway. Obviously self-loathing.

I remember a while ago someone E-mailed me on my personal website link to say that I'm obviously an anti-Semite. I E-mailed her back saying that "People like you don't understand <blah blah blah>" and she promptly replied "People like you? You're proving my point! You're an anti-Semite!", even though she never gave any indication that she was Jewish and I certainly wasn't talking about race. They look for any excuse to lob the "anti-Semite" bomb.

[The Yosemite Bear]

As a half-jew I can easily see and state the simularities between the two. Yeah the biggest supporters of the old south africa were the isrealis

[Axis Kast]

They look for any excuse to lob the "anti-Semite" bomb.

In the United States, many Jews regard it as an obligation to vote for the Democratic Party, which they percieve as the most reliable way to guarantee Israel's future security. My best friend's parents were astonished to discover that I identify as a Republican. When I asked why they thought I ought to vote Democrat, they responded not by singing the praises of any particular candidate or expressed platform, but with a simple, "Because you're a Jewish, of course!" When I probed further, they declared that Republicans were hands-down anti-Semites and could never be expected to "stand by Israel in a time of need." A lot of this seems to be predicated on the fact that it was a Democrat (Truman) who first endorsed Israel. Nixon's reputation for insensitive remarks on race and religion also seems to be a major issue.

I have encountered a number of Jews who insist that supporting Israel is necessary because, "You never know when things might get bad here and we'd have to go [to Israel]." That strikes me as alarmism of the worst kind. First of all, I am an American before I am a Jew. Second of all, if things get bad here, there won't be an Israel to go to. But, in any event, a lot of the "criticism of Israel = criticism of Jews" crowd seem to believe that any shortcoming in unconditional support for Israel will doom the Israeli state, and hence all Jews. Not everybody who plays the "anti-Semitism" card is doing so in order to win arguments dishonestly. They just don't realize that their logic is flawed.

[Sea Skimmer]

Elfdart, do you really actually think that Libya blew up Pan Am Flight 103 because the US shot down an Iranian airliner? That reason really makes more sense to you then doing it in retaliation for a little thing called Operation El Dorado Canyon involving about 300 bombs falling on Libya it's self???

[Darth Wong]

Indeed, that definitely looks like a non sequitur. On the other hand, it's not as if the destruction of the Iranian airliner should be thought of in a better light if there was no retaliation.

[Durandal]

I've split the completely irrelevant B1 bomber discussion from this thread. Feel free to continue your self-pleasuring escapades there, Shep.

[Elfdart]

Elfdart, do you really actually think that Libya blew up Pan Am Flight 103 because the US shot down an Iranian airliner? That reason really makes more sense to you then doing it in retaliation for a little thing called Operation El Dorado Canyon involving about 300 bombs falling on Libya it's self???

I remember a 60 Minutes piece about an Iranian defector who claims that Iran was behind the Pan Am bombing in retaliation for the Airbus being shot down by the Vincennes.

[Big Orange]

In other words, many of the catastrophic bungles we've had to clean up in the last few years are traced back to the inabiulity of the Carter Administration to see reality. Look at it this way: the Air Force to this day lacks a good and proper new bomber to replace the B-52 fleets because Carter refused to fund the B1. The M1 tank program was delayed because Carter's half-assed funding. We lost a lot of human intelligence resources (spies) because Carter thought that there was no need for spies and satellites could do the job better.

Getting rid of many US spies abroad obviously seemed like a far greater mistake than reigning back the excessive military-industrial complex and is potentially fatal in the context of the Cold War or even today.

Carter just released a book about the Middle East in which he likened Israel's policies towards the Palestinians to those of apartheid-era South Africa towards blacks. Any criticism of Israel in this country will get you smeared as a Jew hater. The fact that Carter (rightly) put Olmert and Aryan Sharon in the same boat as P.W. Botha is a triple-whammy because right-wingers don't like being reminded that they were fanwhores for South Africa when the country was run by racist, fascist thugs. The fact that Shamir and Sharon were also big time fanwhores for Botha's regime is another embarassment.

Some critics have panned the book as one sided, naive and simplistic, although I may take the criticism with a grain of salt (but I haven't read it to form a fair opinion of the book and Carter himself). And as bad as Israel is in it's own way you've got to keep things in perspective - what about the profound sexism, theocratic asshattery and murderous fanaticism so manifest in the Islamic Middle East? That is why I'm not too quick to feel totally sorry for the Palestinians (their leaders anyhow, not the blameless women and kids).

I remember a while ago someone E-mailed me on my personal website link to say that I'm obviously an anti-Semite. I E-mailed her back saying that "People like you don't understand <blah blah blah>" and she promptly replied "People like you? You're proving my point! You're an anti-Semite!", even though she never gave any indication that she was Jewish and I certainly wasn't talking about race. They look for any excuse to lob the "anti-Semite" bomb.

Is anybody aware of the boy who cried wolf? And as I said a million times before I swear the word "anti-Semite" has devolved into a oxymoron or brainbug in the context of the Middle East, where the hatred and prejudice primarily stems from theocratic religious intolerance rather than biological racism stemming from late 19th century anthropological pseudo science. Either way the term has been greatly cheapened and has highly dubious origins anyway (it was coined by a bigot because it sounded more "technical").

[wolveraptor]

Aren't the Arabs semetic anyways? The term anti-semite is meaningless in the Middle East. Everyone's a fucking semite.

Is he really a fundamentalist? I would never have guessed that. I remember hearing about him being "born-again", but I didn't think that was the same.

As many people have said before, your behavior has more to do with your personailty and less to do with your religion. Carter was intrinsically a good guy, so he must've instinctively payed attention to only the best parts of Christianity.

[Big Orange]

Aren't the Arabs semetic anyways? The term anti-semite is meaningless in the Middle East. Everyone's a fucking semite.

Pre-fucking-cisely but "anti-Semitism" is a very well ingrained brainbug word for hatred against Jews, even though the majority of Middle Eastern people are legitimately Semitic themselves and that many if not most Ashkenazi Jews are technically Indo-European anyway - Southeastern Europeans in general probably look less "white" than Russian Jews and the Palestinians who do not practice Judaism are perhaps ironically more direct descendents of the Biblical Hebrews.

[Elfdart]

Is anybody aware of the boy who cried wolf? And as I said a million times before I swear the word "anti-Semite" has devolved into a oxymoron or brainbug in the context of the Middle East, where the hatred and prejudice primarily stems from theocratic religious intolerance rather than biological racism stemming from late 19th century anthropological pseudo science. Either way the term has been greatly cheapened and has highly dubious origins anyway (it was coined by a bigot because it sounded more "technical").

I think it's worse than that. Supposedly, when Patrick Henry was called a traitor for upteenth time, he responded

If this be treason, let us make the most of it!

One survey on alleged anti-Semitism listed as an example, people selling Palestinian-style kaffiyehs to college students. If that's anti-Semitism, then Bed, Bath and Beyond must be some kind of Jew-hating home furnishing store, since that's where I bough a set of dish towels as a gift and they look just like kaffiyehs.

At some point, people are going to hear "If you support the Palestinian right of return, you're an anti-Semite" or similar bullshit and decide "If that makes me an 'anti-Semite', so be it".

[Big Orange]

At some point, people are going to hear "If you support the Palestinian right of return, you're an anti-Semite" or similar bullshit and decide "If that makes me an 'anti-Semite', so be it".

Not only is "anti-Semite" a term of abuse when Zionists don't get it all their own way it's an essentially correct term incorrect term as well, when the Palestinians and other assorted Arabs are (as said before) legitimately Semitic while the Ashkenazi Jews, the main champions of Israel, are mostly Indo-European with a minority of them even looking more white than the average white guy (although on the other side of the ethnic assimilation coin you get Christian Europeans who look more Semitic than the average Russian Jew; the late author Kurt Vonnegut, Nazi war criminal Adolf Eichmann, American Pie's Jason Biggs and NYPD Blue's Dennis Franz spring to mind).