Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

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SirNitram
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Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by SirNitram »

No, seriously.
PHOENIX -- Sheriff Joe Arpaio rolled out the tanks to take down a man suspected of cockfighting.

West Valley residents in the neighborhood are crying foul after armored vehicles, including a tank, rolled into their neighborhood to make the bust.

Neighbor Debra Ross was so worried she called 911 and went outside where a nearby home had its windows blown out, was crawling with dozens of SWAT members in full gear, armored vehicles and a bomb robot.

“When the tank came in and pushed the wall over and you see what's in there, and all it is, is a bunch of chickens,” Ross said.

In a massive show of force on Monday, the Maricopa County Sheriff’s Office executed a search warrant and arrested the homeowner, Jesus Llovera, on charges of suspected cockfighting.

Llovera was alone in the house at the time of the arrest, and he was unarmed.

“I think taxpayers should be shocked,” said Robert Campus, Llovera’s attorney. Campus said he believes the operation costs tens of thousands of dollars.

Deputies had no probable cause to believe Llovera was armed or dangerous, according to Campus.

Campus said he believes the entire scene was basically a stage, to help actor Steven Seagal’s TV show, “Lawman.”

Seagal was riding in the tank.

The Sheriff’s Department has entered into a contract with Seagal and part of that contract gives Seagal carte blanche to go along with the sheriff as he arrests people.

Thousands of dollars in damages were made to the property and 115 birds were euthanized on the spot.

Llovera was convicted of a misdemeanor last year of attending a cockfight and has no history of owning weapons.

Yet the sheriff’s office said they had reasons to believe Llovera might be armed.

“We're going to err on the side of caution. We're going to make sure that we have the appropriate amount of force in case we do run into anything like that,” said Sgt. Jesse Spurgin.

Even if we assume media inaccuracy, there was still an armed armoured vehicle sent after cockfighting.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Crossroads Inc. »

Damn beat me to it, and no No media inaccuracy here, this actually happend.. With Steven "The Lawman" Seagal riding up front. For Arpaio this is par for the course. But his days are numbered, several court cases are pending against him and while HE may not go down, the tin pot dictatorship he has established for his needs is crumbling around him.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Duckie »

I love how they got him on cockfighting, which is basically an animal cruelty charge...

Then euthanize all 115 chickens.

I mean, if we're trying to avoid senseless cruelty to animals (which I agree with), was it really necessary to put down all 115 of these chickens?

Well, then again, who would adopt them, I guess, it's not like they're abused cats or something (and even then they end up euthanizing most of those for lack of demand).

But still, it seems like a massive contradiction in ideals, unless your ideal is "Enforce the law because it's the law, who cares about the reasons behind this being illegal" (an all too common justification- I've seen people object to legalisation of marijuana because 'illegal drugs are illegal and wrong' (sometimes they add 'for a reason', but few can articulate that reason, just they're confident that it exists).

Such a conception of the law is a strange, strange thing.
Last edited by Duckie on 2011-03-23 10:37pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Zaune »

Cost-effective this most certainly wasn't, but I suppose it's good to know they take animal cruelty seriously down South...
On a more serious note, I'll reserve judgement until we know exactly what intelligence the police involved had on this guy; if the warrant was executed because they thought he had a meth lab on the property or something then that would be a different matter.

And I take it that by "tank", they actually mean a third-hand M113 or something?
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Duckie »

He's got multiple, judging by google images. He has at least one gunned up armoured car that some local media called "practically a tank" when protesting against the cost (this was presumably before his actual purchase of armoured vehicles). It looks almost like a van that's been armoured and has a machine gun of some sort on the top (maybe how swat vans look?).

But he also has at least one one media tank (that is, an APC of some kind just like Media Machine Gun = Rifle), and at least one actual honest to god tank (probably only one even with him spending the bloated law enforcement budget like crazy).

I'm no milwanker, but:

Swat Van of some kind with a (pintle? I dunno the right word) mounted heavy machine gun on top unless my eyes deceive me.
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APC or Armoured Car or something
Image

Tank (Looks kind of like a 1950s style american tank- it's clearly not an M1A1 as that'd strains belief as those things are expensive as hell. then again, buying any tank is expensive and pointless, so maybe I'm wrong)
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Police militarization in the US is a big deal. Though mostly because the US doesn't have experience with military gendarmes policing civilians, it seems to work for many countries as well as a civilian force and I don't see why it couldn't.

But here, this is clearly wasteful (there is no need for an actual tank or armoured vehicle to protect phoenix arizona from invading soviet mexican gangsters with armoured car divisions or something. I mean maybe the APC could be useful for transporting SWAT officers safely especially to a potential shooting situation with high calibre assault weapons (though how often does that happen)) but what's the point of the tank?). And also I'd argue that it's ominous, even if it's not inherently fascist to be policed by the military I'd say militarisation of civilian police is the same bad feeling as militarisation of civilian society.
Last edited by Duckie on 2011-03-23 10:54pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Steven Snyder »

The justification was to 'err on the side of caution'???

The guy had no history of violence or weapon charges, just a single misdemeanor a year ago for trying to start a cock-fighting ring?

There should be a law against using excessive and unreasonable force.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Aaron »

The last one actually looks like an M109 or similar vehicle. Not a tank but rather a Self Propelled Gun.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Akhlut »

Aaron wrote:The last one actually looks like an M109 or similar vehicle. Not a tank but rather a Self Propelled Gun.
Which is even more questionable; a tank is fairly unnecessary as it is, but why the hell would Arpaio need to shell positions from kilometers away?
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Fingolfin_Noldor »

That's not a tank per se but a self-propelled artillery. SOme variant of the M109. Of course, it's even more funny considering that getting ammo to fire on that thing is impossible.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Duckie »

Man haha that's amazing. What possible use could that have? Even a tank would make more sense.

Maybe he's planning on shelling the barrios.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Aaron »

Akhlut wrote:
Aaron wrote:The last one actually looks like an M109 or similar vehicle. Not a tank but rather a Self Propelled Gun.
Which is even more questionable; a tank is fairly unnecessary as it is, but why the hell would Arpaio need to shell positions from kilometers away?
He doesn't. And I seriously doubt he has any ammo for it anyways. It's just for intimidation and driving through shit, for which he'd be just fine with an M113 with a dozer blade.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by eion »

Looks like Joe got ahold of one of my father's old howitzers. How nice for him. :roll:

Question, if Mr. Llovera is aquitted could he sue Maricopa county and Iron Joe for the loss of 115 roosters and the damage to his property?
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by fgalkin »

So, let's see

Armored vehicles: check
Artillery: check
Special forces: check
Labor camps: check

Sheriff Joe is the MVD?! :shock:

Have a very nice day.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Aaron »

fgalkin wrote:So, let's see

Armored vehicles: check
Artillery: check
Special forces: check
Labor camps: check

Sheriff Joe is the MVD?! :shock:

Have a very nice day.
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Doubt he's even half as competent. :lol:
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Duckie »

Well he can't be too incompetent at what he does, considering the population he's managed to round up into chain gangs and work camps and the fact that he's got the admiration and support of terrified* old white people.

*I will leave it as an exercise to the reader to figure out what exactly they're afraid of
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by RogueIce »

I guess it's easier to post snarky comments than spend 30 seconds on Google?
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Sheriff Arpaio takes his war on drugs to the streets with our new "Tank". Well, actually it's a self propelled "Howitzer" emblazoned with anti-drug messages and a new tool to educate our children of the dangers of drug abuse. The Howitzer was donated by the Department of Defense and we are proud to have the ultimate weapon on the war on drugs in our arsenal. Kids are given a program which includes audio and video displays on the dangers of drug abuse.
So the actual 'tank' of which everyone is crowing about here seems to be a very flashy (but apparently donated, so I'm betting he didn't blow the budget on it) form of the various DARE cars other agencies use.

As to the raid itself, it may well have been excessive force, it all depends on what intel the Sheriff's Office had. This NPR article has a video at the bottom, and the vehicles I can see from that video are the wheeled APC types that a lot of SWAT units have. Didn't see any evidence of the actual tank being used.

Indeed, the first article says that "Seagal was riding in the tank" and if you look at Seagal's statement on the article I linked to, he says, "I came in on the 150 and we broke down the gate." (emphasis mine)

The "150" likely being this which seems consistent with what I saw on the second video.

So the "tank" is pretty much the 'media version' of a tank. And again, while using those vehicles and/or the SWAT team may have been overboard, it does depend on what intel the SO had and so on and so forth.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Duckie »

oh man, so they use it on that? That's a laugh. Not only is it the most expensive way to use that (Although I suppose it does excite young boys maybe to get a tank ride), but most of those programs actually increase rates of substance abuse in a community by reminding kids that they can get drugs just about anywhere. (The most noticeable one being DARE, whose 'don't give into peer pressure' campaign caused a noticeable uptick in drug use by making kids feel peer pressure to use drugs even when none of their friends were)
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by weemadando »

Look, why can't Arpaio just admit that he has a serious inferiority complex and just wishes his force was even a tenth as respected and feared as BOPE.

Actually his force is that feared. Just not by criminals. Instead its feared by anyone with a goddamn brain.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Simon_Jester »

Duckie wrote:Police militarization in the US is a big deal. Though mostly because the US doesn't have experience with military gendarmes policing civilians, it seems to work for many countries as well as a civilian force and I don't see why it couldn't.
The problem is that the gendarmes need a kind of training and doctrine that simply doesn't exist in the US- at least, not with Arpaio. He's not a gendarme, he's just a gung-ho idiot who thinks the Wild West was cleaned up by pistol-packing lawmen and wants a bigger pistol.

The institutional sense of restraint, and of how to apply force intelligently rather than just dropping bigger and bigger hammers on an increasingly alienated population, just isn't there.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by eion »

Guess I'm just confused how a glorified gun carriage with a top speed of 35mph is supposed to convince a 12 year old that drugs are bad.

As to the armored car vs. tank debate, it's still overkill regardless. And while most police departments might warrant (yuck yuck) the benefit of the doubt in such a case, Joe of the Pink Underwear has consistently demonstrated a lack of respect for the law and its dutiful enforcement, and so he can go suck it.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Iroscato »

I mean, for fuck's sake. I can understand if they were cyborg chickens preparing to take over the world. But sending an armoured vehicle for a small crime like that? What the hell do they do to murderers in that town?

Here in sane old Blighty, a single, maybe two police cars would turn up, arrest the man, then call in the RSPCA to take the chickens away. Less awesome and less gruesome, but much, much more sensible :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Thanas »

Simon_Jester wrote:
Duckie wrote:Police militarization in the US is a big deal. Though mostly because the US doesn't have experience with military gendarmes policing civilians, it seems to work for many countries as well as a civilian force and I don't see why it couldn't.
The problem is that the gendarmes need a kind of training and doctrine that simply doesn't exist in the US- at least, not with Arpaio. He's not a gendarme, he's just a gung-ho idiot who thinks the Wild West was cleaned up by pistol-packing lawmen and wants a bigger pistol.
It took Europe several hundred of years to transform the gendarmes from "murdering thugs" to "special police". I'd say Arpaio has reached the first stage by now.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Darksider »

Am I the only one who saw those pictures of Arpaio's vehicle collection and though that his penis must be measurable in millimeters?

Seriously. Judging by past articles about this douche, his whole shtick is the whole "tough, bad-ass frontier sheriff" thing he's got going on. And he put Steven fucking Segal in the front of this particular bust. It just seems like he's buying all these giant manly vehicles and acting all tough and shit to prop up his own ego rather than for any legitimate reason.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Zaune »

Darksider wrote:Am I the only one who saw those pictures of Arpaio's vehicle collection and though that his penis must be measurable in millimeters?
No, that occurred to me as well. I just chose not to say anything for fear of hastening the moment when this thread degenerates into a cock-pun contest.
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Re: Arpaio brings tank to cockfight.

Post by Phantasee »

Euthanized 115 chickens on the spot? Why do I get the image of 115 chickens run over?
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