[Discussion] Wanderer: Plagarist.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

I can confirm that Shep actually wrote the review in question; more to the point I can confirm it because I still have hardcopies of my old message board, DS.com, which I can upload and show that Shep posted that review there a couple years ago.

So we have Wanderer shamelessly plagiarizing Shep on another board. Anything we can do about it? Probably not, since it's not against the rules as such, but I thought it important enough--whatever else we may say about him, Shep has the same right to his works as anyone else--to temporarily break my absence from the Senate to post this for consideration. I can verify the hardcopies of DS.com on request, though it'll take a day or two--I'm about to leave for work and Arik's (Coyote) is coming tomorrow and the power cable for my backup harddrive is lost somewhere in the closet. But anyway, just providing this for consideration--Plagiarizing someone is, in my opinion, the worst crime you can commit from an academic or artistic standpoint, so I'd like the fucker strung up.

EDIT: Looks like this is a matter for us after all.

Scroll down a couple posts in this thread--Shep reposted the review here, which is quite possibly where Wanderer got it, since he was never a member of DS.com.

So we have a little shitstain posting the works of one of our members, posted on this board, to other boards, and claiming they're his.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

Updated with evidence that Shep actually posted the review on SD.net as well, making the issue an even more damning one.

[Imperial Overlord]

There was an investigation several years ago by moderators when Zor was wrongly accused of plagiarism. Now since he wasn't guilty of anything other than a confusing choice of title, nothing came of it but there seemed to be the opinion that it was board business. We do have rules against illegal and "underground" activities, which plagiarism would seem to fall under.

As for my own opinion, I believe plagiarism should be severely punished on this board. It violates not only the author's ownership of his or her work, but the principle of intellectual honesty that is one of our central tenets.

[CmdrWilkens]

I would concur both that this is Senate/Board business and that some form of punihsment or reaction is waranted. The post in the other forum is not very clearly a near perfect lift from Shep's work with no citation or other indication that he was the original author. Now that being said I am uncertain what, if any, actions we can take in order to rectify this situation in paticular as I am unfamiliar with the other board so unsure of what their reaction might be if approached to reprimand at the site of the infraction.

[The Yosemite Bear]

Actually we banned someone for Plaugerism of Fanfics already.

[Simplicius]

Actually we banned someone for Plaugerism of Fanfics already.

Was this an instance where a plagiarized fanfic was posted here, or taken from here and posted elsewhere?

I'm not sure how I feel about meting out the harshest punishment in a case like this. But given that this is not a common offense and certainly a rotten thing to do, I would say that established guilt for one of our members should warrant a custom title of "Plagiarist" or "[Unpleasant adjective] Plagiarist" or some such at very least.

Now that being said I am uncertain what, if any, actions we can take in order to rectify this situation in paticular as I am unfamiliar with the other board so unsure of what their reaction might be if approached to reprimand at the site of the infraction.

At the very least, their moderator or admin staff might be willing to append a note to that post pointing back to Shep's original post, thereby making official the callout that has already taken place in the Viridian Dreams thread.

[RedImperator]

Just so there's no confusion: is this the same as our Wanderer? If so, how do we know?

Now if it is, I'll come right out in favor of an immediate, permanent ban. Plagiarism is vile, and we have precedent for banning for it in the past. Imperial Overlord is right: we can't claim to be a board where intellectual dishonesty is a cardinal sin and tolerate a plagiarist at the same time.

[Edi]

If these two Wanderers are the same person, an immediate permanent ban is the only option. We had one Lord Jax who was banned for plagiarizing somebody else's work and posting it here on their own. If we have one of our own plagiarizing the work of another member, it is obvious the same standard must apply.

As far as the evidence goes, it does look pretty damning. Wanderer has made several posts about being a rancher in various threads, several of which can be found in the hypothetical scenario thread where SDnet is transported to some bumfuck village somewhere in Europe during the Middle Ages. He has made posts about sheep husbandry and horses as well. Combined with the thread the Duchess found that he posted about the Michigan agricultural situation, it looks pretty damning. The evidence so far is strong enough that I am convinced they are the same person. It is not a 100% certainty, but good enough that any doubt I can come up with goes into the realm of unreasonable.

[CmdrWilkens]

I would think the ideal thing to do would be to contact the other board to see if we can get the IP of their Wanderer and compare it against the IP of our Wanderer. Again this would require their co-operation but it would be the most certain way of establishing identity.

[Edi]

Since this thread is supposed to have links and other evidence directly instead of relying on some thread in Testing that may vanish whenever, we will rectify that now.

The suspected plagiarism.
Viridian Dreams Forum introduction post for the Wanderer of that forum

A second suspected instance

Shep's original post of the review


WANDERER'S LOCATION

SDnet thread that gives some indication Wanderer is from Michigan
Proof positive that Wanderer is from Michigan (The SDnet goes Medieval thread)


On that second forum (Total War Center), the plagiarist uses the following pic in his sig:



Said picture has appeared on this forum in somebody's sig, but I don't remember whose. Possibly DarkSilver's, whom Imperial Overlord has pegged as the creator of the pic. According to IO, the pic first appeared on Librium Arcana where DarkSilver also has an account under that user name. However, when one examines the webhosting location of the plagiarist's sig pic there, it identifies it as a Photobucket hosting under the account of one Wanderer17, which strongly suggests that both the TWC thread and the Viridian Dreams thread were made by the same person. Especially since the post contents are exactly identical.

Hopefully this post will make it unnecessary to shuttle between half a dozen different threads whenever one wishes to examine the situation.

[Imperial Overlord]

I just talked to Dark Silver(a member of this board and Librium Arcana), who was the first person I saw with the Megatron signature. The signature is Dark Silver's creation and a recent one (created a month or two ago) at that so it was probably picked up here or at Librium. Librium's a small board and most of the members are also members here.

EDIT: Dark Silver isn't happy that his image got taken without being asked or given credit.

[LadyTevar]

I can second the fact that Dark Silver (aka DarekSteele of LibriumArcana) is the creator of the Megatron sigpic, and that he did NOT give permission to anyone to use that signature.

[RedImperator]

Since this thread is supposed to have links and other evidence directly instead of relying on some thread in Testing that may vanish whenever, we will rectify that now.

<snip>

That's pretty damning. Unless Wanderer has a really good explanation (and I mean, at this point, it would have to be fucking dynamite), it's obvious he's a plagiarist. The only area left for discussion is the punishment. I think I've already made my views clear on that.

[Eleas]

Indeed. I admit to feeling somewhat uncomfortable by the fact that the weakest part is determining that this guy is indeed the same Wanderer, but the likelihood of it not being so is... pretty damn remote. It would be nice to have a real name, or something. Oh well, evidence is damning enough as it is.

As well, anyone who plagiarizes this flagrantly is hardly likely to adhere to any other standards of honesty, either. My views on that echo RedImperator's.

[Ender]

Hey, fun fact - Daggersword is taking images I took and posted in the new Clone Wars crap review thread, and posting them at TFN without giving credit to me for getting them. What timing.

[Simplicius]

The scope of the offense has broadened since last night, and the circumstantial evidence is stronger now. It would be ideal to make the case against Wanderer ironclad before this goes to vote, but I no longer feel inclined to spare the rod.

[Surlethe]

Edi's post seems to make the issue pretty much cut-and-dried. As a matter of principle, I would like to give Wanderer a chance to defend himself or explain his actions, via PM or a Testing thread, but that probably won't change the evidence lined up against him.

Hey, fun fact - Daggersword is taking images I took and posted in the new Clone Wars crap review thread, and posting them at TFN without giving credit to me for getting them. What timing.

Is "Daggersword" Wanderer, or is this a different discussion? And do you have a link?

[Ender]

Hey, fun fact - Daggersword is taking images I took and posted in the new Clone Wars crap review thread, and posting them at TFN without giving credit to me for getting them. What timing.

Is "Daggersword" Wanderer, or is this a different discussion? And do you have a link?

Totally separate case.

My thread

TFN thread. Note post may not show at link depending on page view settings, with my settins it is on page 459 of the thread.

Image I took

Image he "found"

You can even still see my fucking bedspread in the corner. Now I'm not sure this is plagiarism - I am not the original source, Jason Fry would be, and I haven't decided if I want to press for board discipline (I've certainly cross posted before, though I typically attribute credit). But I do want it on record.

[The Yosemite Bear]

should we go and ask Rob Dalton for his essay on "The Sanctity of Fanfics"?

I mentioned what our current punishment on record for the offense is, and people seemed to yell at me.

then again sometimes I am a bit overly sensitive....

[Simplicius]

I mentioned what our current punishment on record for the offense is, and people seemed to yell at me.

then again sometimes I am a bit overly sensitive....

Nah, my question was in earnest. The case you brought up was before my time, so I didn't know anything about the salient details. As it was, I was pretty laid back last night and didn't feel like taking a hard line without knowing a bit more.

[CmdrWilkens]

Well from a purely procedural standpoint I do want to ask/state a few things:

1) Has anyone yet contact him via PM/e-mail? While the circumstantial case is certianly very strong the accused's side of the case would be interesting and useful to hear.

2) Currently there are no motions on the floor and as I have a long day at work tomorrow I would expect the earliest any vote goes up would be Monday night.

3) Within the confines of above I will remind any and everyone who does want to put this to a vote to observe proper procedure.

[Surlethe]

1) Has anyone yet contact him via PM/e-mail? While the circumstantial case is certianly very strong the accused's side of the case would be interesting and useful to hear.

I just sent him a PM:

If you have any explanation to offer, please comment on this thread. I will post any replies in full to the Senate, without editing.

[Eleas]

1) Has anyone yet contact him via PM/e-mail? While the circumstantial case is certianly very strong the accused's side of the case would be interesting and useful to hear.

I just sent him a PM:

If you have any explanation to offer, please comment on this thread. I will post any replies in full to the Senate, without editing.

I sent him a PM to the same effect as well:

Hello.

I'm discussing the charge of plagiarism against you in this thread. I was wondering as to your position regarding the matter. Do you have any pertinent facts you'd like to enter into the discussion?

[The Duchess of Zeon]

Well, since wanderer hasn't replied, should we put this thing to a vote?

[The Yosemite Bear]

sure, though I won't accuse you of being bloodthirsty this time....