Legolas vs. DD

Robert Treder · Post by **Robert Treder** » 2003-03-06 06:27am

Scenario 1:
Legolas and Daredevil (comics) in Mirkwood, starting distance 100 yards.

Scenario 2:
Legolas and Daredevil in Hell's Kitchen, starting distance 1 city block.

They are hunting to kill (and Daredevil won't have any moral issues with this, for the sake of the scenario). They both have super senses, though DD's are undoubtedly better. Legolas balances this out by having a bow and arrow with which he is extremely proficient. But, DD has experience with badasses that don't miss (see my avatar)...

I haven't decided just who would walk away yet.

Post by **Vympel** » 2003-03-06 06:37am

If Bullseye doesn't miss- how come DD is still alive?

And how did you feel about the DD version of Bullseye, out of curiosity?

Robert Treder · Post by **Robert Treder** » 2003-03-06 06:51am

Vympel wrote:If Bullseye doesn't miss- how come DD is still alive?

Good question.

And how did you feel about the DD version of Bullseye, out of curiosity?

I liked him. It was definitely a diversion from the comics, but it worked. I would have liked the costume, but it wasn't as necessary as I thought it was going to be. He did everything he needed to do in the movie: be a total badass, provide slight comic relief, and piss the shit out of DD. Plus, they set him up to be even cooler in the sequel (adamantium, anyone?).
In general, the movie was lacking in that it probably was terrible if you didn't know much about DD to begin with. But, being a big DD fan, I could appreciate it. I had to fill in a lot of things left out of the movie with my own explanations, but whatever, I liked it anyways. If I had it my way, they'd have just directly adapted Frank Miller's "Man Without Fear" plus his death of Elektra arc into a long-ass movie, but I unfortunately don't have it my way.

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2003-03-06 08:49am

Vympel wrote:If Bullseye doesn't miss- how come DD is still alive?

Well if DD stood still I am sure that Bullseye would have hit the target! I.E. DD moves after Bullseye has made the throw, so there isn't much he could do after that.

Post by **Vympel** » 2003-03-06 09:06am

Crown wrote:
Vympel wrote:If Bullseye doesn't miss- how come DD is still alive?
Well if DD stood still I am sure that Bullseye would have hit the target! I.E. DD moves after Bullseye has made the throw, so there isn't much he could do after that.

He doesn't know how to lead a target? Or do you mean that DD can literally dodge bullets?

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2003-03-06 09:21am

I would hardly call throwing ninja stars and the like really fast 'dodging bullets'. But that's what happens DD doesn't 'see' the projectile he hears it, so no he can't dodge bullets (they tavel faster than sound), but he can dodge hand thrown projectiles (since he also has fast reflexes). Also DD did 'miss' a crucial grab at something that Bullseye threw due to a loud sound messing up his hearing...

greenmm · Post by **greenmm** » 2003-03-06 10:47am

For Bullseye (movie or comic) to effectively hit a target like Daredevil (i.e. extremely agile, has super-senses to detect danger and attacks), he has to near-simultaneously throw enough weapons at the target that it is physically impossible (based on the target's speed) to dodge every single weapon...

Bartman · Post by **Bartman** » 2003-03-06 12:03pm

Which Legolas, book or movie? Either way I think DD takes it but it will be a much closer fight vs the movie version.

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2003-03-06 01:24pm

Crown wrote:I would hardly call throwing ninja stars and the like really fast 'dodging bullets'. But that's what happens DD doesn't 'see' the projectile he hears it, so no he can't dodge bullets (they tavel faster than sound), but he can dodge hand thrown projectiles (since he also has fast reflexes). Also DD did 'miss' a crucial grab at something that Bullseye threw due to a loud sound messing up his hearing...

Actually in the comic he doesn't just hear and dodge.

Post by **weemadando** » 2003-03-06 06:21pm

OK.

How about DD vs...

Riff with his super stake launcher?

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2003-03-06 06:31pm

How about Daredevil, vs. MLRS battalion at fifteen miles range? Can he doge four square kilometer of assured death?

Robert Treder · Post by **Robert Treder** » 2003-03-06 06:59pm

At at least one point in the comics that I can think of, Bullseye has used a gun to shoot DD, and scored a hit.
DD has also "dodged" bullets by hearing the trigger before it completes its pull. He can feel the direction that the gun is pointed (radar sense). This obviously wouldn't help with supersonic rounds at a great distance.

As for the original topic, I'm thinking DD would take it. Camouflage doesn't help Legolas in Mirkwood, and DD can take care of arrows fairly well (see any time he goes up against the Hand or trains with Stick). He closes the distance, and pwns Legolas in hand-to-hand.

But the real winner is the audience, because that would be super sweet to see, whichever way it goes.

Shocker · Post by **Shocker** » 2003-03-07 12:47am

Yeah, DareDevil has caught three arrows fired at him at a range just above ten feet fired at him from three different forward angles from three expert bowman and DareDevil was suffering from a rattled radar sense due to a head injury AND an earthquake tremor.

DocMoriartty · Post by **DocMoriartty** » 2003-03-10 03:01pm

Just to balance things out.

1. Legolas is several thousand years old. He has more fighting experience in his little finger than DD will ever have.

2. Legolas has waded into the path of dozens (if not hundreds) of orcs and came away with barely a bruise on the forehead.

3. Legolas walks so softly he walks on top of snow. Will there be any noise for DD to hear? I know he has other senses but hearing at least will be less effective against Legolas.

4. Legolas is probably stronger than DD. In the Two Towers he appeared to quite easily pull Aragorn and Gimli up the wall up Helms Deep. He pulled them the total distance in a matter of seconds and was not out of breath afterward.

Cal Wright · Post by **Cal Wright** » 2003-03-10 03:30pm

DocMoriartty wrote:Just to balance things out.

1. Legolas is several thousand years old. He has more fighting experience in his little finger than DD will ever have.

So he's an old fart. Now, while my knowledge in the books is lacking, I will use the movie versions of both characters. In this, I don't recall seeing Legolas do anything that Daredevil couldn't at least counter, if not outright defeat.

2. Legolas has waded into the path of dozens (if not hundreds) of orcs and came away with barely a bruise on the forehead.

Daredevil resides in HELL'S KITCHEN. He's waded into a bar full of gun slinging combatants and came out the victor.

3. Legolas walks so softly he walks on top of snow. Will there be any noise for DD to hear? I know he has other senses but hearing at least will be less effective against Legolas.

So his Bow string is silent as well. He can stalk all damn day, but when he begins to pull that string back, DD will hear it, and I don't think any of his arrows travel faster than sound, so unless he's within point blank range, DD will easily dodge. Just like he did with Bullseye and his bullshit.

4. Legolas is probably stronger than DD.

Oh my, this isn't good. The ground...it's shaking...it's the trampling feet of...

BULL-FUCKING-SHIT

Probably doesn't cut it. Can Legolas literallyleap from buildings, down it's sides and land unhurt on scafolding and then bounce across? Can Legolas take on the Kingpin? Just how strong is the Kingpin? Strong enough he can bat around super enhanced combatants.

In the Two Towers he appeared to quite easily pull Aragorn and Gimli up the wall up Helms Deep.He pulled them the total distance in a matter of seconds and was not out of breath afterward.

That's twice this is happening.

BULL-FUCKING-SHIT

Grunting like your crapping is not effortless, and he was breathing hard. Was Gimli and Aragorn dead weight? Did they try to scale the wall? Yes, so that's just bull shit there.

Maybe in the woods, Legolas has the upper hand, but if you get into Hell's Kitchen Daredevil isnt' going to have much of a problem.

DocMoriartty · Post by **DocMoriartty** » 2003-03-10 03:35pm

I can see you fuckwads still have not grown up.

Get your half inch dicks out of each others asses and try discussing without acting like the average 10 year old that just discovered profanity.

You fuckheads are pathetic.

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2003-03-10 03:47pm

Actually with that horse trick that Legolas did in TTT, he must half some pretty strong muscles to flip like that.

Cal Wright · Post by **Cal Wright** » 2003-03-10 03:50pm

Don't pull absurd bullshit out of your fucking ass you half twit fucktard cockmonkey. Why don't you tell Wong that he acts like a 10 year old when he uses profanity.

By the way, nice title shitface.

Cal Wright · Post by **Cal Wright** » 2003-03-10 03:53pm

neoolong wrote:Actually with that horse trick that Legolas did in TTT, he must half some pretty strong muscles to flip like that.

With a little push from your legs and the momentum coupled with the speed of the horse, it's actually a neat trick that his arm wasn't ripped from the socket. It's just like the Native American trick you see in westerns. I'm not saying that he doesn't have strength, just that saying he PROBABLY is stronger than Daredevil is really quite literally bullshit. The orcs and überorcs haven't really shown anything more than being able to grunt and run in with a shit load of numbers.

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2003-03-10 04:02pm

DG_Cal_Wright wrote:
neoolong wrote:Actually with that horse trick that Legolas did in TTT, he must half some pretty strong muscles to flip like that.
With a little push from your legs and the momentum coupled with the speed of the horse, it's actually a neat trick that his arm wasn't ripped from the socket. It's just like the Native American trick you see in westerns. I'm not saying that he doesn't have strength, just that saying he PROBABLY is stronger than Daredevil is really quite literally bullshit. The orcs and überorcs haven't really shown anything more than being able to grunt and run in with a shit load of numbers.

Actually from the way it looked, he flipped himself forward and upwards using his arm. That indicates to me, at least from what I remember, that his arm must be pretty strong to do something like that.

The momentum of the horse is moving him forward, and then he counteracts that with only his arm.

What's the Native American trick in westerns?

Cal Wright · Post by **Cal Wright** » 2003-03-10 04:07pm

That's where they flip from one side of the horse, touch off on the ground, jump over, and touch the other side then hop back on. I don't know if it's in the older westerns, but I've seen in it plenty of times in at least the last 15 years. Neat looking that's for sure.

Robert Treder · Post by **Robert Treder** » 2003-03-10 05:39pm

The Marvel Encyclopedia indicates that DD can press at least 200 lbs. I wouldn't be surprised if Legolas can beat him in that or any other strength test, but it's not going to be by enough of a margin that it will guarantee him victory.

What it comes down to is this: there isn't a good reason to believe that DD couldn't close the distance to Legolas, and there isn't a good reason to believe that Legolas could beat DD in close quarters.

Raptor 597 · Post by **Raptor 597** » 2003-03-10 05:54pm

Elves are 1.5 strengths of a strong man. So he is probably stronger then DD and benching 200 isn't exactly a big feat. I myself can do 150 and I'm no muscle man..

Bartman · Post by **Bartman** » 2003-03-11 12:54pm

Captain Lennox wrote:Elves are 1.5 strengths of a strong man.

1.5 huh? That is a precise number, I don't suppose you have a precise cite to go with it?