Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by NecronLord » 2018-01-03 08:54am

The alternative, of course, is superweapons and epic stakes forever. Neither really works in and of itself, and is much more about how they're written.

But I'm still disappointed in the Resistance that is the size of the People's Front of Judea. I'd much rather there actually be a republic rather than the re-tread of the Empire-vs-Rebels dynamic, with more hopelessly outclassed rebels and even stronger empire we got.

EDIT: The simple answer is to never suggest the Second Republic took the whole galaxy, and that there are many post-imperial strongholds out there, still doing their evil, and that the First Order is either a force that revitalizes them, or the most capable/notorious of these.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Shroom Man 777 » 2018-01-03 12:39pm

Bob the Gunslinger wrote:
2018-01-02 10:49am
Shroom Man 777 wrote:
2018-01-02 12:29am
Bob the Gunslinger wrote:
2018-01-01 09:11pm
Anticipating? If they weren't stupid, they would have had an intelligence apparatus keeping tabs on all the fringe groups so they wouldn't have to anticipate anything. Are you suggesting that an organization that fills its volumous ranks with kidnapped, brainwashed children was beneath the notice even of the Republic's law enforcement agencies?
Not the first time we've seen galaxy-upsetting military capabilities manufactured in secret to the surprise of a great galactic power.

In what Star Wars movie did that happen? One of the terrible prequels? Is that the level of quality to which the ST should aspire?
:P

But that's already canon though... and the rapidity and ease with which a shit-ruining military force can be built would make anti-minimalists happy. :P
ray245 wrote:
2018-01-02 06:23pm
What this basically results in is an emotionally unsatisfactory journey to Luke's character arc. What some fans are hoping to see is for SW to adhere to the fairytale tradition where people do live happily ever after. SW is built so heavily on escapism, constructing an more escapist reality for the characters to inhabit. I think there are people who have legitimate issues with Rian Johnson trying to deconstruct what's the basic essence of Star Wars. Star Wars is an escapist fantasy, perhaps similar to works like LOTR where good triumphs over evil and peace lasted for several generations at the very least. People want to see Star Wars as a franchise where they could escape from the doom and failures of the reality they are living in.

The basic problem with the sequel trilogy is trying to solve the problem of Luke. JJ Abrams and Michael Arnt have both mentioned that one of the problems they had with the development of EP 7 was they could not write a story where Luke doesn't overshadow Rey. There's an expectation that Luke is so powerful in the force that he can basically do everything for the new young protagonists and overshadow their character development. So what they did, in the end, was to pass the buck to Rian Johnson.

Rian Johnson did the only thing he could with the set-up offered to him by JJ Abrams. In order for Luke to not overshadow Rey, Luke must be a failure on some level. Any alternative solution is completely thrown out with the set-up of TFA. I think the major mistake the sequel movies are making on a fundamental level is to make a new conflict a brand new galactic wide conflict. Luke must be involved in the story somehow because the fate of the Galaxy is at stake. An alternative solution would be to limit the scale of the conflict to something much smaller. Instead of a brand new Galactic civil war, narrow the conflict to a few system on the outskirts of the New Republic.

Give us a setting where the reach of the NR and the new Jedi Order are limited. Let the new protagonists be Luke's students that are cut off from their master's help. Allow Luke to be stuck doing something even more pressing so he can't be easily available to bail out the new protagonist. At the same time, Luke's character arc as a master can be very much learning to let his students go on their own and stretch their own wings

The new protagonist can be nobody because you don't need to be a special someone of some bloodline to be the hero of the story. Everyone is a hero of their own little story, regardless of how big the conflict is. A story about a nobody saving one solar system is about someone saving billions of lives. At the same time, you can give the old protagonist some sense of peace and allow them to retire, because they should not be expected to be constantly putting out every small-scale conflict or bushfire wars around the whole galaxy. They've done their bit for the Galaxy and they are learning to pass on their knowledge to a new generation.

IMO, the sequels need to depict a much smaller conflict than a new war about the fate of the whole galaxy. The FO as an evil organisation works if the conflict is a few local star system dealing with Imperial remnants. The Resistance also works if the scale of conflict is merely about a few star system where NR rule is weak. A superweapon that can stop any New Republic fleet in the region and reinforcements can also be a dramatic point if you want to reuse a superweapon in your plot. Luke, Han, and Leia being able to play a minor supporting role also work because they are at an age where they are supposed to be retired and can't go running about saving the Galaxy.
Hmm... I don't disagree with your primary takeaway, though I'm really more than fine with Luke being a failure. I differ, I guess, in that I accept it whereas you find it harder to swallow.

The failures of Luke and that unsatisfying post-ROTJ arc he's got is anti-escapism. Just like how with Poe, if it was in Abrams' Trek, what he did would be analogous to the bullshit AbramsTrek Chris Pine Kirk did, and if it was escapist, he'd be rewarded for it! But here, Poe's actions results in fuckups. I loved it!

I think the struggle with the FO and the Resistance is some weird combination of "it's galactic in level" yet at the same time "it's not as big as before" since the FO are the remains of the Empire, nowhere near as huge as it once was, and the Resistance is also even MORE ragtag than the Rebel Alliance... the New Republic purposely minimized its forces, so while this is still a continued galactic conflict, it's shrunk and most of the bystanders are just dicking around in Canto Bight and other such places letting the FO and Resistance finish each other off.

An alternate-alternative to your proposal of Luke would be to make him a Gandalf figure.

Hmmm... it would be hilarious if the sequels were actually time-skipped to CENTURIES after ROTJ with Rey, born centuries after Palpatine's death, and Kylo who is a Vader fetishizing Skywalker descendant relying on centuries-old and distorted tales of Vader... yet Luke is still alive and looks just as he does in TFA and TLJ.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Shroom Man 777 » 2018-01-03 12:47pm

NecronLord wrote:
2018-01-03 08:54am
The alternative, of course, is superweapons and epic stakes forever. Neither really works in and of itself, and is much more about how they're written.

But I'm still disappointed in the Resistance that is the size of the People's Front of Judea. I'd much rather there actually be a republic rather than the re-tread of the Empire-vs-Rebels dynamic, with more hopelessly outclassed rebels and even stronger empire we got.

EDIT: The simple answer is to never suggest the Second Republic took the whole galaxy, and that there are many post-imperial strongholds out there, still doing their evil, and that the First Order is either a force that revitalizes them, or the most capable/notorious of these.
I'd be fine with this, I think TFA made the slate too clean. Maybe putting the audiences in the midst of a continuing Galactic Civil War might've been too confusing? I don't know, but I wouldn't have minded. The continuing conflicts, with the post-Rebellion galactic coalition or whatnot of non-Imperial systems struggling hard, the warlordism... all these could've contributed visibly to the circumstances that weathered Luke down and made him fail!

It can avoid "galatic scale again!" without being "smaller stakes, boo!" since the stakes would be more ambiguous! Is this gonna shake the entire galaxy? Is this just a whimper? Who knows... but it's right in front of us and if we don't do anything, all these people will die!

That would be a great way to touch upon the anti-escapist fantasy.
Civil War Man wrote:
2018-01-03 12:26am
This part got me thinking, and I've made an interesting connection here.

New topic: The Last Jedi is Go Set A Watchman to the original trilogy's To Kill A Mockingbird, with the deconstruction of Luke depicting him as an abject and utter failure mirroring the revelation that Atticus Finch was actually racist the whole time.

Discuss.
I don't know about that, but I did get an Alan Moore's Watchmen-esque vibe from what happened to Luke. He turned to Nite Owl or something - a disgraced superhero.

The galaxy should've passed an Anti-Midichlorian Act! Then Snoke would be a Snokomandiaz and we'd get Lukeschach or Reyschach! Yes.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by ray245 » 2018-01-03 12:59pm

Vympel wrote:
2018-01-03 08:47am
A few local star systems dealing with Imperial remnants? So why isn't the New Republic just hyperspacing in with their massive fleet and just smashing them? Is Admiral Nechayev going to call Captain Picard and tell him he's the only ship in the sector, too?

This is all remarkably low stakes.
Because the drama doesn't have to be centered on the galactic conflict, but the more immediate challenge faced by the heroes? Make the area a disputed sector, or area that never joined the Republic formally. Or just use the whole cold war set-up with the Republic being unwilling to risk an all-out open war with the Imperial Remnants.

Or do you seriously think dramatic stakes is all about the scale of the conflict? Even when a few local star system can still involve billions of lives? What matters is the stakes that matter for our protagonist. Make the stakes more personal to our protagonist. Make the place their home planet or something.

Plenty of films managed to convey the epic-ness of a conflict by having the right stakes for our protagonist. Take The Dark Knight for instance. The only people in danger is 2 ship worth of people, the hostages and the police. Yet the story as a whole has great dramatic weight because of the way the stakes are set-up for Batman and the rest of Gotham.
Shroom Man 777 wrote:
2018-01-03 12:39pm
Hmm... I don't disagree with your primary takeaway, though I'm really more than fine with Luke being a failure. I differ, I guess, in that I accept it whereas you find it harder to swallow.

The failures of Luke and that unsatisfying post-ROTJ arc he's got is anti-escapism. Just like how with Poe, if it was in Abrams' Trek, what he did would be analogous to the bullshit AbramsTrek Chris Pine Kirk did, and if it was escapist, he'd be rewarded for it! But here, Poe's actions results in fuckups. I loved it!

I think the struggle with the FO and the Resistance is some weird combination of "it's galactic in level" yet at the same time "it's not as big as before" since the FO are the remains of the Empire, nowhere near as huge as it once was, and the Resistance is also even MORE ragtag than the Rebel Alliance... the New Republic purposely minimized its forces, so while this is still a continued galactic conflict, it's shrunk and most of the bystanders are just dicking around in Canto Bight and other such places letting the FO and Resistance finish each other off.

An alternate-alternative to your proposal of Luke would be to make him a Gandalf figure.

Hmmm... it would be hilarious if the sequels were actually time-skipped to CENTURIES after ROTJ with Rey, born centuries after Palpatine's death, and Kylo who is a Vader fetishizing Skywalker descendant relying on centuries-old and distorted tales of Vader... yet Luke is still alive and looks just as he does in TFA and TLJ.
I think what Rian Johnson is trying to do is to try and break away from the standard model of SW storytelling. Most of his films has been about deconstructing the genre they are set in. If what Rian Johnson is doing is to create a brand new IP that is similar to Star Wars and deconstruct the familiar SW tropes using that, well there will probably be less outcry.

The issue is there are many fans happy with SW being escapist in nature and hated any attempt to add more "reality" into the stories. I think much of the dislike towards the prequels is also to do with this, with Lucas basically deconstructing some of the basic storytelling structure, abit on a much smaller scale.

I really think Disney might have made a mistake when they tried to create the FO in TFA. I don't think JJ Abrams and Kennedy realized how they might limit the story-telling potential of the franchise with their creative decision. I don't think Rian Johnson was entirely happy with the set-up he was given for TFA, which is why you got the whole Canto bright side plot feeling so out of place in a renewed Galactic conflict.

Making Luke into a Gandalf figure would work, but that will still result in a situation Disney would want to avoid. Killing off Luke early. Gandalf worked in Fellowship because he was killed halfway into the plot. The rest of the fellowship now have to carry on with the journey without such a powerful figure guiding them. But Gandalf returned from the dead in the Two Towers.

If Luke was killed early and cannot return from the dead, what you have is effectively less anticipation for Ep 8 and 9. You want the OT cast to be around as long as possible for the sequel trilogy because that's what many fans are paying money for. It's part of the hype and why people wanted to see EP 7 in the first place.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Shroom Man 777 » 2018-01-03 01:08pm

ray245 wrote:
2018-01-03 12:59pm
Because the drama doesn't have to be centered on the galactic conflict, but the more immediate challenge faced by the heroes? Make the area a disputed sector, or area that never joined the Republic formally. Or just use the whole cold war set-up with the Republic being unwilling to risk an all-out open war with the Imperial Remnants.

Or do you seriously think dramatic stakes is all about the scale of the conflict? Even when a few local star system can still involve billions of lives? What matters is the stakes that matter for our protagonist. Make the stakes more personal to our protagonist. Make the place their home planet or something.
Sans Starkiller Base, the Sequels could've done this. TLJ was kind of like this, "we're the last members of an organization" isn't exactly THAT galaxy-shattering. Well, the First Order stomping through the galaxy IS... but the action in the film was really focused on something decisively non-galactic. Hence the outcry of the minimalists...

And... I guess The Phantom Menace counts as this too. :D
I think what Rian Johnson is trying to do is to try and break away from the standard model of SW storytelling. Most of his films has been about deconstructing the genre they are set in. If what Rian Johnson is doing is to create a brand new IP that is similar to Star Wars and deconstruct the familiar SW tropes using that, well there will probably be less outcry.

The issue is there are many fans happy with SW being escapist in nature and hated any attempt to add more "reality" into the stories. I think much of the dislike towards the prequels is also to do with this, with Lucas basically deconstructing some of the basic storytelling structure, abit on a much smaller scale.
If the Prequels were better edited, if Lucas had someone watching over him, and if they had a different actor for Anakin or even Padme... it would've been incredible IMO.
I really think Disney might have made a mistake when they tried to create the FO in TFA. I don't think JJ Abrams and Kennedy realized how they might limit the story-telling potential of the franchise with their creative decision. I don't think Rian Johnson was entirely happy with the set-up he was given for TFA, which is why you got the whole Canto bright side plot feeling so out of place in a renewed Galactic conflict.
The FO could've been less-sloppily worldbuilt, aye.
Making Luke into a Gandalf figure would work, but that will still result in a situation Disney would want to avoid. Killing off Luke early. Gandalf worked in Fellowship because he was killed halfway into the plot. The rest of the fellowship now have to carry on with the journey without such a powerful figure guiding them. But Gandalf returned from the dead in the Two Towers.

If Luke was killed early and cannot return from the dead, what you have is effectively less anticipation for Ep 8 and 9. You want the OT cast to be around as long as possible for the sequel trilogy because that's what many fans are paying money for. It's part of the hype and why people wanted to see EP 7 in the first place.
Hmmm... hence Han was the quasi-Gandalf there. I see your point, well I guess Luke could be a Gandalf or something but it doesn't mean he has to be there all the time...
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Galvatron » 2018-01-03 01:37pm

I don't know about anyone else, but I'd be more than satisfied with Luke appearing in Episode IX as a force ghost for Rey like he did in the Legacy comics for Cade. Let's face it, the man had to die eventually and I'm not sure I'd prefer the saga to end without some sort of closure to his story.

I also didn't need to see a REAL final clash between Luke and Kylo any more than I needed a rematch between Yoda and Palpatine in ROTJ. Let Rey carry that torch.

Another thought just occurred to me: would Disney be violating their word if they just take existing footage of Leia and insert her into a scene as a smiling Force ghost next to Luke at the end of Episode IX? It would be a nice touch, IMO.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by PhoenixKnig » 2018-01-03 01:42pm

Kurgan wrote:
2017-12-31 02:21pm
Just for those saying they liked The Last Jedi and it thought was a good movie:

Do you feel TFA was a good movie? Was it better or worse, in your view, than TLJ? Not in terms of calcs, I mean in terms of entertainment value and as an "installment in the Star Wars saga."

I personally didn't think much of both, and think this new one was worse. But I'm curious to hear what you think.
As a to treat ST as individual movies by themselves, *mulled it over* they were ok to good.
TFA(at the beginning IMO was ok) kind of grew on me a bit (story and entertainment-wise) as time went on to good. Now on TLJ IMO if I were blackhole-plots; decent on char development with a KR, good vishal scenes, decent value.

On "installment in the Star Wars saga" I hate TLJ.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by ray245 » 2018-01-03 01:45pm

Shroom Man 777 wrote:
2018-01-03 01:08pm
Sans Starkiller Base, the Sequels could've done this. TLJ was kind of like this, "we're the last members of an organization" isn't exactly THAT galaxy-shattering. Well, the First Order stomping through the galaxy IS... but the action in the film was really focused on something decisively non-galactic. Hence the outcry of the minimalists...

And... I guess The Phantom Menace counts as this too. :D
Well Starkiller can easily be a fleet-killer or something, forcing the Republic fleet to stay out of the area. So the heroes are basically on their own barring a few starfighters from the New Republic or something.
If the Prequels were better edited, if Lucas had someone watching over him, and if they had a different actor for Anakin or even Padme... it would've been incredible IMO.
Doesn't matter. There will still be a loud minority of fans who complain about midichorians or something.
The FO could've been less-sloppily worldbuilt, aye.
In a way, I'm glad JJ Abrams is returning for Ep 9. Now he has to be one actually trying to resolve the conflict that he built up. Rian Johnson basically forced Abrams to do something different with the story with the death of Snoke.

Hmmm... hence Han was the quasi-Gandalf there. I see your point, well I guess Luke could be a Gandalf or something but it doesn't mean he has to be there all the time...
Let Luke be trapped with all the Galactic bureaucracy or be involved in some other conflict elsewhere in the Galaxy ( because heaven forbid if the Jedi Order have to deal with multiple crises at the same time in a Galaxy!) The point is Luke cannot be the one flying all over the Galaxy solving everything himself. At some point in his life as a master, he has to trust his students to deal with situations where he cannot bail them out.

You can have a story with new conflict, while allowing the old guards to retire and entrust the fate of the Galaxy to a new generation.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Galvatron » 2018-01-03 01:50pm

ray245 wrote:
2018-01-03 01:45pm
In a way, I'm glad JJ Abrams is returning for Ep 9. Now he has to be one actually trying to resolve the conflict that he built up. Rian Johnson basically forced Abrams to do something different with the story with the death of Snoke.
It's interesting that Abrams made his story pitch for Episode IX only AFTER the release of TLJ. This is in stark contrast to how TLJ was written before Disney and Johnson had a chance to analyze the reactions to TFA and all the questions it raised.

I have a feeling that Colin Trevorrow was all set to undo some of TLJ's revelations in Episode IX when he announced that Rey's origin would turn out to be "profoundly satisfying."


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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Vendetta » 2018-01-03 04:11pm

Galvatron wrote:
2018-01-03 01:50pm
I have a feeling that Colin Trevorrow was all set to undo some of TLJ's revelations in Episode IX when he announced that Rey's origin would turn out to be "profoundly satisfying."
Probably a good job he made The Book of Henry and they realised that there were problems in time to abort....

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Civil War Man » 2018-01-03 04:24pm

Shroom Man 777 wrote:
2018-01-03 12:47pm
I don't know about that, but I did get an Alan Moore's Watchmen-esque vibe from what happened to Luke. He turned to Nite Owl or something - a disgraced superhero.
In short, Go Set A Watchman is a highly polarizing sequel for To Kill A Mockingbird, set a couple decades or so after the original. One of the main themes seems to be about how the people we regard as heroes are mere mortals, and does this by revealing something about one of the heroic characters that seems completely anathema to their characterization in the original. Like Luke, who is revealed to have contemplated murdering his nephew despite willingly facing darkness and death to redeem his father, Atticus Finch is revealed to be racist against black people in a "they are too primitive to deserve equality" way, despite having put his own life at risk to defend a black man who was wrongly accused of beating a raping a white woman in pre-WWII Alabama.

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by ray245 » 2018-01-03 05:45pm

NecronLord wrote:
2018-01-03 08:54am
The alternative, of course, is superweapons and epic stakes forever. Neither really works in and of itself, and is much more about how they're written.

But I'm still disappointed in the Resistance that is the size of the People's Front of Judea. I'd much rather there actually be a republic rather than the re-tread of the Empire-vs-Rebels dynamic, with more hopelessly outclassed rebels and even stronger empire we got.

EDIT: The simple answer is to never suggest the Second Republic took the whole galaxy, and that there are many post-imperial strongholds out there, still doing their evil, and that the First Order is either a force that revitalizes them, or the most capable/notorious of these.
That's my problem with the old EU Legends. Star Wars shouldn't be like a Marvel movie where you can have new bad guys constantly taking over the Galaxy and the heroes having to save the galaxy again and again. What will Disney do for Ep 10, 11 and 12? Are they going to drag the conflict with the FO? Are we going to have a brand new Imperials mk 3.0?
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Tychu » 2018-01-03 05:57pm

I saw it twice in theaters. Once with friends who loved it, while others who hated it more than I. The 2nd time was at home on a bootleg stream with my brother. The 2nd time in theatres was with my girlfriend (bless her nerd/sport loving heart) and her friends. Her friend loved it but when I pointed out the terrible parts; she admitted she loves Marvel movies. So here are my reasons for disliking it. If I remember to reply about past comments I will.

In the very beginning of the film, we have wise cracking Poe. I didn’t like it in TFA, and it’s even worse here. From the beginning I was taken out of the movie. It would have been “ok” if Hux didn’t play into it. In TFA we have a Hux that is a fully competent (albeit crazy) First Order officer. In this one he’s a bumbling, face making fool.

The suicide bombing run was just a way for ONLY movie viewers to learn about Leia grooming Poe for leadership. She’s been doing it in the Poe comics for a year now.

Having an “a” story being about running out of fuel in a Star Wars MOVIE is terrible. Done in Rebels and BattleStar Galactica. What would have worked better is, Leia sending Poe on a mission to find help, and he runs out of fuel and trying to get back to the Resistance in time when they bunker down on Crait. So Leia is SuperMan?!?! I don’t care that she can survive space. Jedi have done it before. But she could have floated back stoically.

The “b” story Luke and Rey felt like a parady to me. More like SpaceBalls. I DO Like and despise the same scene. Luke acts like his mentor Yoda while training Rey. Now I know that Rey grew up in a desert, but she can’t tell the difference between the force and a thick leaf on her hand?!?! To answer others; Yoda blew up the tree because he KNEW Rey has the books and KNEW Luke didn’t know and would incorrectly ASSUME Yoda meant “knowledge she has (in her head)” when he taps his head.

“C” story....I know 20 minutes were cut from it and they are supposed to be in the blu-ray. Also who knows what weirdo Finn did, BUT YOU DONT GET THROWN IN A HOLDING CELL FOR PARKING ILLEGALLY! If I took my old ‘99 Corolla to Monaco; parked it, in front of Monte Carlo. I would not get arrested. It’ll get towed and if I wanted it back I would pay a fine. Canto Bight should have went off without a hitch and Maz’s boy would have helped.
To those who are lost. DJ overhears the conversation between Poe and Finn about the Resistances plan. They even zoom in on him.

The ending I’ll get to. I don’t really have a problem with it.

But here is the thing. We all remember Hidalgo for his minialmalist rants, back when we can laugh about his no real powers. Now; the last two years of expanded universe have shown us they are trying to weave a Cold War story. Which is cool, but doesn’t work when you have two nations. Why do I bring this up? Well, what currency are those “rich people who profit off war using”? In the Phantom Menace, we see the Republic uses credits. Way to says he needs real currency, not something that is just insured by some bank. In ANH, we see the Empire has used some type of physical coins but they still give credits our. Well guess what? Both the Republic and First Order weee whipped out. So those rich people are now poor as fuck. IF the First Order still lives, they have some explaining to do. I know the Empire were suppose to be the Nazis. In real life, Hitler didn’t trust any commander, so everyone was trying to One-up the other while watching another. The First Order is Nazis on steroids. I get that a First Order admiral or somebody may not want to help their rivals Ren and Hux. But, when they saw them failing, wouldn’t they want to show Snoke they are better? SO THERE IS NO REASON WHY NO FIRST ORDER SHIP WOULDNT JUMP 5 MINUTES INFRONT OF LEIA. It would be hilarious (and good) if Episode 9 starts off with a newscast in the style of OJ Simpson’s 1994 car ride. “In other news; Daughter of Vader fled with her Resistance squadron to an old Rebellion Era base. They were perused by the remnants of the First Order cultists. Your highlights of the Space Soccer Premier League Matchday 27 are up next”
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Crazedwraith » 2018-01-03 06:06pm

Tychu wrote:
2018-01-03 05:57pm
. Her friend loved it but when I pointed out the terrible parts; she admitted she loves Marvel movies.
What do you even mean by this?
The “b” story Luke and Rey felt like a parady to me. More like SpaceBalls. I DO Like and despise the same scene. Luke acts like his mentor Yoda while training Rey. Now I know that Rey grew up in a desert, but she can’t tell the difference between the force and a thick leaf on her hand?!?!
I really love that bit.
“C” story....I know 20 minutes were cut from it and they are supposed to be in the blu-ray. Also who knows what weirdo Finn did, BUT YOU DONT GET THROWN IN A HOLDING CELL FOR PARKING ILLEGALLY! If I took my old ‘99 Corolla to Monaco; parked it, in front of Monte Carlo. I would not get arrested. It’ll get towed and if I wanted it back I would pay a fine. Canto Bight should have went off without a hitch and Maz’s boy would have helped.
In Real Life maybe. On an alien planet, who knows? It's hardly a massive flaw in the film that it had stricter parking laws that Earth.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Tychu » 2018-01-03 06:11pm

SO you’re telling me it’s MORE plausible that every single one of those rich people who are portrayed as not caring a lick for the greater galaxy or downtrodden; CARE about following the law and waiting for an official parking spot?
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Crazedwraith » 2018-01-03 06:15pm

Tychu wrote:
2018-01-03 06:11pm
SO you’re telling me it’s MORE plausible that every single one of those rich people who are portrayed as not caring a lick for the greater galaxy or downtrodden; CARE about following the law and waiting for an official parking spot?
Sure. Or they all have space-uber or chauffeurs to park for them.

Being a massively successful white-collar business person says zero about their parking.

This is a silly conversation, indeed.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Q99 » 2018-01-03 06:25pm

I rather liked the Luke/Rey plot. It was solid character stuff, showed how Done Luke was, and was good for Rey's development.

As for the parking, if you're a super-rich person, you want your casino well-maintained and orderly, which means having parking laws and people keeping out the riff raff.
Tychu wrote:SO THERE IS NO REASON WHY NO FIRST ORDER SHIP WOULDNT JUMP 5 MINUTES INFRONT OF LEIA.
Do Hyperdrives work like that? Could you get that specific a distance with no landmarks and not end up, say, just so far ahead that they redirect around you and continue the chance?

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Tychu » 2018-01-03 06:34pm

You’re the one that decided to nitpick that one aspect of my post. It is silly, it’s a silly and moronic subplot of a story too.

A more interesting hole in the sequel trilogy is the Republic navy. In TLJ; I kept turning to my friend and saying “this is when the Republic Navy comes in!” We saw Snoke utterly overconfident. Why wouldn’t Hux have been when he boasted “destroying the Republic fleet”? What nation on Earth, keeps their ENTIRE military stationed at their capital? Even the demilitarised (Old) Republic confederation had small regional and local fleets around their autonomous member’s worlds.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Tychu » 2018-01-03 06:48pm

Q99 wrote:
2018-01-03 06:25pm

Do Hyperdrives work like that? Could you get that specific a distance with no landmarks and not end up, say, just so far ahead that they redirect around you and continue the chance?
A specific nEU (new EU; my one man crusade since 2013), no I don’t. But I haven’t been looking out for it, because it seemed like a given. But in The Force Awakens it seems quite clear that the Falcon’s hyperdrive was giving Han a countdown and distances to Star Killer base. Sooo disregard the rest of this post. YES we have specific evidence that you can tell where you are popping out of light speed. We only ever see jumps to planets and asteroid belts (they are actually really small). But the Resitance wasn’t in Deep Space. Crait was “big” enough to be seen as an orb. It also wouldn’t be a stretch for some one to take a risk and plot an intercept course originating from Crait.

Also your talking about a universe that has Astronech droids. Whose job it is to plot jumps.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Gandalf » 2018-01-03 08:21pm

Tychu wrote:
2018-01-03 06:11pm
SO you’re telling me it’s MORE plausible that every single one of those rich people who are portrayed as not caring a lick for the greater galaxy or downtrodden; CARE about following the law and waiting for an official parking spot?
It's a rich people's playground and the badly parked ship owned by people of no real standing was fucking up the view of the beach. People pay a lot for those views, so it's on the local cops to keep rich people's order.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Vympel » 2018-01-03 08:24pm

Tychu wrote:
2018-01-03 06:34pm
You’re the one that decided to nitpick that one aspect of my post. It is silly, it’s a silly and moronic subplot of a story too.

A more interesting hole in the sequel trilogy is the Republic navy. In TLJ; I kept turning to my friend and saying “this is when the Republic Navy comes in!” We saw Snoke utterly overconfident. Why wouldn’t Hux have been when he boasted “destroying the Republic fleet”? What nation on Earth, keeps their ENTIRE military stationed at their capital? Even the demilitarised (Old) Republic confederation had small regional and local fleets around their autonomous member’s worlds.
Yeah so that was an extremely silly belief. Why would you assume that TFA is lying to you? So that TLJ can stop for a moment to explain "well accchuallly the entire Republic fleet wasn't destroyed". Jesus, that would be terrible story-telling - and no, story-telling is not the same as plot.

Also, I don't know why you'd assume anyone would know or care what the (I assume EU) Old Republic had around autonomous member worlds. The New Republic is not the Old Republic. It didn't just suddenly become the size of the Old Republic (or the Empire), or indeed anywhere close to it. Many of the planets that seperated from the Old Republic in the Clone Wars and were gobbled up by the Empire returned to self-rule.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Tychu » 2018-01-03 10:48pm

Vympel wrote:
2018-01-03 08:24pm
Tychu wrote:
2018-01-03 06:34pm
You’re the one that decided to nitpick that one aspect of my post. It is silly, it’s a silly and moronic subplot of a story too.

A more interesting hole in the sequel trilogy is the Republic navy. In TLJ; I kept turning to my friend and saying “this is when the Republic Navy comes in!” We saw Snoke utterly overconfident. Why wouldn’t Hux have been when he boasted “destroying the Republic fleet”? What nation on Earth, keeps their ENTIRE military stationed at their capital? Even the demilitarised (Old) Republic confederation had small regional and local fleets around their autonomous member’s worlds.
Yeah so that was an extremely silly belief. Why would you assume that TFA is lying to you? So that TLJ can stop for a moment to explain "well accchuallly the entire Republic fleet wasn't destroyed". Jesus, that would be terrible story-telling - and no, story-telling is not the same as plot.

Also, I don't know why you'd assume anyone would know or care what the (I assume EU) Old Republic had around autonomous member worlds. The New Republic is not the Old Republic. It didn't just suddenly become the size of the Old Republic (or the Empire), or indeed anywhere close to it. Many of the planets that seperated from the Old Republic in the Clone Wars and were gobbled up by the Empire returned to self-rule.
The New Republic capital rotates, so why wouldn’t you assume they keep a naval presence around the other capitals. Isn’t there a royal guard presence at the various castles that the British royal family use.

And we have seen the autonomous member worlds forces in movies. Did you forget the Naboo Navy (small I know) and the Trade Federation fleet in The Phantom Menace? We see the Neimodians have dissolved their trading empires by the time of the sequel trilogy. However the more wealthy families now posses security companies and FEW have a defense fleet. Crappy I know but still present
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Vympel » 2018-01-03 11:59pm

Tychu wrote:
2018-01-03 10:48pm
The New Republic capital rotates, so why wouldn’t you assume they keep a naval presence around the other capitals. Isn’t there a royal guard presence at the various castles that the British royal family use.
Well the capital rotates by democratic election, there isn't a list of pre-determined capitals.
And we have seen the autonomous member worlds forces in movies. Did you forget the Naboo Navy (small I know) and the Trade Federation fleet in The Phantom Menace?

We see the Neimodians have dissolved their trading empires by the time of the sequel trilogy. However the more wealthy families now posses security companies and FEW have a defense fleet. Crappy I know but still present
I'm sure there's still some piddly forces like that floating about, but there's no reason to assume they'd fight to save the Resistance - especially in circumstances where Hosnian Prime hasn't finished exploding in TLJ's timeframe.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by APlayerHater » 2018-01-04 10:03am

Hyperspace ramming in TLJ seems to completely contradict Rogue One



Vader doesn't seem particularly concerned he might be hyperspaced into.

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi release thread (spoilers)

Post by Crazedwraith » 2018-01-04 10:16am

The Raddus started much further back and had accelerated a lot more before impact. Simple as that as far as I can see.

(Though that doesn't open the possibility of why they wouldn't ram the Death Star like that, maybe worried about having Endor as a backstop)
Last edited by Crazedwraith on 2018-01-04 10:17am, edited 1 time in total.
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