Holy shit, Heroes is pretty damn good this season (spoilers)

[Vympel]

After the mediocrity of over half of Season 3, I've got to say 8 episodes into Season 4 that the show is pretty damn cool, and at near Season 1 quality in terms of writing IMO. Robert Knepper is an excellent antagonist that really holds the season together, with Sylar lurking in the background like usual.

The last episode (eight to air) had a very intricate, well written episode where Hiro goes back to the Texas diner to save Charlie once again. The effort they put into making it all fit, to have Hiro agonize over how to preserve future events with the very minor difference that Sylar didn't kill Charlie, the in-jokes (two times he identifies himself as "Future-Hiro" and both times he's asked where his katana is) and the detail was just great.

If the show continues like this I'll be a very happy camper. Ratings have been steadily rising since the premiere, so hopefully it continues.

[KrauserKrauser]

I definitely agree that the last episode was great, almost makes the previous dreck episdoes leading up to it worthwhile.

However I wouldn't say that this season has been all that great excluding the last episode as alot of the plotlines need to start actually moving, most of them are just circling the same idea over and over again.

[Agent Fisher]

Heroes, well, except for Hiro and by extension the carnival guy, non of the story lines are grabbing me. Where's the fallout from last year? I mean, the government goes from bagging and tagging gitmo style on those with abilities to nothing? Not even keeping an eye on some of them? Instead, we get a carnival. Sylar is somewhat interesting, at least the physical sylar. Head-Sylar/Parkman plot, well, I just can't invest myself into it, and Parkman used to be my favorite character.

[lance]

Heroes, well, except for Hiro and by extension the carnival guy, non of the story lines are grabbing me. Where's the fallout from last year? I mean, the government goes from bagging and tagging gitmo style on those with abilities to nothing? Not even keeping an eye on some of them? Instead, we get a carnival. Sylar is somewhat interesting, at least the physical sylar. Head-Sylar/Parkman plot, well, I just can't invest myself into it, and Parkman used to be my favorite character.

I like head Sylar, expecally when he took control and took a bite out of the apple the apple while laughing.

[Ted C]

I hadn't even been keeping up with this season... now you make me wanna go back and catch up.

[Oskuro]

On the last episode I kinda noticed how the show has changed tone. The first season had a grim tone, with all the characters being ruthlessly killed by Sylar, and Charlie's death scene was particularly chilling. My favourite Sylar incarnation was from back when we didn't see his face, he was really scary.
No, although this episode tries, it kind of dilutes the grimness of what Sylar is doing by so easily stopping him, and more importantly, by even getting him to help! Where's that ruthless monster that would've killed Hiro and taken his power when his back was turned, and time-travelled to find out about his future himself?

Still, the season is looking up compared to previous ones, although the whole Carnival crowd is rubbimg me the wrong way, specially with the utter stupidity that it is to bring Sylar into the fold. What do they expect would happen if he recovered his memories? Oh well.

I'm also sad they got rid of Nathan so soon, I was kind of looking forward to learning more about his past, and possibly seeing him realize he isn't in his own body, and even face off aganist Head-Sylar. But, then again, they might bring him back.

[Vympel]

I'm also sad they got rid of Nathan so soon, I was kind of looking forward to learning more about his past, and possibly seeing him realize he isn't in his own body, and even face off aganist Head-Sylar. But, then again, they might bring him back.

You don't really think they got Adrian Pasdar for this season so he could do a few scenes at the start and then never go back to him?

Heroes, well, except for Hiro and by extension the carnival guy, non of the story lines are grabbing me. Where's the fallout from last year? I mean, the government goes from bagging and tagging gitmo style on those with abilities to nothing? Not even keeping an eye on some of them? Instead, we get a carnival. Sylar is somewhat interesting, at least the physical sylar. Head-Sylar/Parkman plot, well, I just can't invest myself into it, and Parkman used to be my favorite character.

Nathan-Sylar had it shut down, that's what the whole resolution was for. Screw fallout from last year, that Volume is over. We've seen enough of it what with Danko getting killed off.

[Terralthra]

The only thing I don't like about the current Heroes is how they have robbed Peter's powers. The way they worked in Seasons 1/2 had thematic cohesion (as did most of the heroes' powers). Peter was the most empathic of all the characters, thus his empathic power. The new version, where Peter can only gain a power by touch, and only hold one at a time, isn't nearly as appropriate to his character.

[Themightytom]

The only thing I don't like about the current Heroes is how they have robbed Peter's powers. The way they worked in Seasons 1/2 had thematic cohesion (as did most of the heroes' powers). Peter was the most empathic of all the characters, thus his empathic power. The new version, where Peter can only gain a power by touch, and only hold one at a time, isn't nearly as appropriate to his character.

Thats a convenient trapdoor they can spring when they write themself into a corner. they can resolve any ultiamte cliffhanger with "OMG Peter's powers are all back! he was suppressing them the whole time" or whatever.

Sylar rocks in any context, he's one of the best villians on TV. Even when they try to wipe his mind he's lurking around. I honestly don't like Matt Parkman's character, he's just weak, in every sense of the word. What they're doing with him this season would mean nothing to me if it wasn't more face time with Sylar.

Um. were they just WAITING for Hayden Panetierre to turn 18? Now shes a confused bisexual sorirty cheerleader? Lets go for broke, have her major in nursing join a nunnery and then drop out to become a librarian??? in her own words when she was trapped in the box with her girlfriend there are whole website s dedicated...

The carnival theme is getting a little overdone in my mind. I would have liked to see it come and go every few episodes isntead of featured EVERY episode, but i suppose ereccting a carnival set is rather expensive.

WTF is Kneppers power? Is that ink power his too or is just an Earth bender.

[Vympel]

The only thing I don't like about the current Heroes is how they have robbed Peter's powers. The way they worked in Seasons 1/2 had thematic cohesion (as did most of the heroes' powers). Peter was the most empathic of all the characters, thus his empathic power. The new version, where Peter can only gain a power by touch, and only hold one at a time, isn't nearly as appropriate to his character.

Yeah, that's always bothered me as well- the writer's have said that Peter isn't as empathic as he used to be because of everything that's happened to him, and hinted that this may be the reason why he can only hold on to one power at a time. Another possibility they've acknowledged is Baby Parkman resetting him to factory settings. I don't have a problem with him replicating powers by touch, as it's easier to write - you don't have every fan going "he was next to this person with an ability, how come he doesn't use their power" so you can control it more easily. The effect of his replicating is also a lot like his father's power theft, visually speaking.

[lance]

WTF is Kneppers power? Is that ink power his too or is just an Earth bender.

I think he is moving the earth in the ink, or something like that.

[CaptainChewbacca]

According to heroes-wiki, he's manipulating some mineral in the ink.

Personally, I loved this week's episode. It was a great look at Hiro, and I'm glad he finally figured out how to save Charlie, if it was only for a few minutes.

[Terralthra]

Yeah, that's always bothered me as well- the writer's have said that Peter isn't as empathic as he used to be because of everything that's happened to him, and hinted that this may be the reason why he can only hold on to one power at a time. Another possibility they've acknowledged is Baby Parkman resetting him to factory settings. I don't have a problem with him replicating powers by touch, as it's easier to write - you don't have every fan going "he was next to this person with an ability, how come he doesn't use their power" so you can control it more easily. The effect of his replicating is also a lot like his father's power theft, visually speaking.

Well, the solution to the last question is "He doesn't empathize with them," as it was shown in Season 1 explicitly that he has to feel like the owner of the power to use it.

That, to me, has always been an interesting characteristic of the power-acquiring Heroes. Peter, who empathizes with people, learns their powers just by understanding them as people, feeling like they feel. Sylar's power is very much the same in effect; however, because he is so sociopathic, so incapable of empathy, is unable to do this (except just the once), and has to go about understanding the power in a coldly amoral sense. Arthur, by further contrast, has never cared about understanding what people are like, nor empathizing with them, only manipulating them so he can get from them what he needs, and his power suits that selfishness.
Spoiler

Digressing slightly, I personally think one of the biggest "fuck yous" the writers tossed out was how Adam Munroe died. If you have to off one of your previous season's incredibaddies, fine, but doing so in order to resurrect another bad guy is an utterly pointless gesture if none of us knew who he was, or that he was "dead". If you're going to kill someone awesome to resurrect a big bad, make it a villain we know exists.

[Losonti Tokash]

Yeah, well, that was just another symptom of the "there is no season 2" cleanup.

[Vympel]

Well, the solution to the last question is "He doesn't empathize with them," as it was shown in Season 1 explicitly that he has to feel like the owner of the power to use it.

Yes. In particular, note how he took Emma's power accidentally even though he's demonstrated back in Volume 4 that with practice he was perfectly capable of choosing when and how to replicate someone's power - it happened after touching her and asking if she was alright.

If Peter can somehow retain more than one power at a time, he'll be pretty damn powerful again - he won't have Claire's healing, but he will have:-

Flight (Nathan);
Enhanced Strength & Agility (Mohinder);
Freezing (Tracy);
Telepathy (Matt);
Shape Shifting (Sylar);
Super Speed (Edgar);
Sound manipulation (Emma);
Space-Time Manipulation (Hiro); and
Healing/Death Touch (Jeremy).

He lacks much needed offensive powers though - electrical manipulation, telekinesis, pyrokinesis, etc.

[FireNexus]

I'm half-tempted to say "Fuck this show" at this point. They took what was to be a ballsy maneuver and theySpoiler

TOLD US IN THE PREVIEW FOR THE NEXT EPISODE THAT THEY DIDN'T INTEND TO MAKE IT STICK! What the fuck. "We're going to do something dramatic and take a big chance here by killing Matt Parkman and Head Sylar!" Next Week On Heroes: HAHA! Just kidding!!

[Manus Celer Dei]

I'm half-tempted to say "Fuck this show" at this point. They took what was to be a ballsy maneuver and theySpoiler

TOLD US IN THE PREVIEW FOR THE NEXT EPISODE THAT THEY DIDN'T INTEND TO MAKE IT STICK! What the fuck. "We're going to do something dramatic and take a big chance here by killing Matt Parkman and Head Sylar!" Next Week On Heroes: HAHA! Just kidding!!

This is hardly something exclusive to Heroes. As I understand it, the next episode previews are normally put together by the network airing the show, with little (if any) input from the writers, which is why you quite often get stupid crap like that spoiling the next episode.

[Themightytom]

I'm half-tempted to say "Fuck this show" at this point. They took what was to be a ballsy maneuver and theySpoiler

TOLD US IN THE PREVIEW FOR THE NEXT EPISODE THAT THEY DIDN'T INTEND TO MAKE IT STICK! What the fuck. "We're going to do something dramatic and take a big chance here by killing Matt Parkman and Head Sylar!" Next Week On Heroes: HAHA! Just kidding!!

I hear that! The end of last episode and the first half of this one was awesome!
Spoiler

Head Sylar has psoessed Matt Parkman, Matt can do nothing because Sylar beating people with a tire iron if he interferes. Hero is under the thumb of the enemy (And stilly dying get it over already) Sylar's body was reassertying its psychotic personality. Claire and her room mate have called in the big guns to flush out and start exposing and urnaveling Samuel's agenda.

Then they waste half an hour of my life with a shitstorm of hack audience manipulation:

Matt is dead in a seeming dead end to two plots, which I couldn't buy for a second because the previous episode clearly demonstrated that Samuel isn't shy about messing with time to suit his purposes and in fact, messing with time may be his end goal. I could buy perhaps that matt will take the original Sylar to teh grave with him, but no way do I believe the writers are going to leave a submerged nathan Petrelli personality in Sylar's body. that shit is coming to a head, literally. Sylar is obviously getting back into his body and who sthe F knows where nathan will end up but he's got to go somewhere ebcause EVENTUALLY someones going to wonder where a SENATOR went..

Nioah and Claire are poised to start a whole new round of trust bullshit, and its gotten so old. Noah Bennett was the batman off this show, always with a plan always in control. Fine, show him having his doubts for a few episodes, even some marital problems, but don't completely neuter the character! This shit needs to be over with, at least he's back to looking for Samuel, I BELIEVE there was some dangling thread about him running a new Company?

And DAMNIT if Sylalr doesn't think he's Nathan again! he's no longer at the carnival, he up and flew away! negative progress from last weak in terms of adversary developement.

[FireNexus]

Snip

Spoiler

I would absolutely love to have seen that get carried through, and have maybe seen that the whole "Head Sylar" thing was some manifestation of Parkman's power. Basically, I was thinking that Parkman was subconsciously maintaining a connection with Sylar's mind to keep him as Nathan. Sylar, incapable of beating Parkman, does manage to work backward through the mental connection to mess with him. Neither of them would realize that this was what was happening, but the death of Parkman could have been shown to coincide with the slow reemergence of the Sylar personality.

It would have been an interesting way to go, and by allowing Parkman to have a heroic death, even if it turned out that his death wouldn't do what he thought, would have tied up his character arc in a satisfying way while also setting the stage for the reemergence of Sylar. Maybe Sylar would be irrevocably changed by his experience as Nathan. I'd like to see them explore a sort-of-good Sylar, just in a less stupid way than they did previously.

In any case, I'll give them until the mid-season finale because this season has been compelling so far. If they don't do something good to make up for this, though, I'm done with this show.

This is hardly something exclusive to Heroes. As I understand it, the next episode previews are normally put together by the network airing the show, with little (if any) input from the writers, which is why you quite often get stupid crap like that spoiling the next episode.

I understand. The preview bit was annoying, but the excessive use of the reset button on this show is what frustrates me.

[Terralthra]

I don't watch the preview for next week for just that reason.
Spoiler

Worth noting that they do show Matt receiving defibrillation in the episode proper.

[septesix]

I'm half-tempted to say "Fuck this show" at this point. They took what was to be a ballsy maneuver and theySpoiler

TOLD US IN THE PREVIEW FOR THE NEXT EPISODE THAT THEY DIDN'T INTEND TO MAKE IT STICK! What the fuck. "We're going to do something dramatic and take a big chance here by killing Matt Parkman and Head Sylar!" Next Week On Heroes: HAHA! Just kidding!!

I don't quite feel it that way. I think the point was to show Parkman's resolve, and how he is willing to do everything in his power to stop Sylar. I don't think they ever intent to actually kill the character.

[FireNexus]

I don't quite feel it that way. *snip spoilers*

I completely agree that this was the point. It doesn't change the problem: The writers don't take risks.

[Vympel]

Major spoiler:-
Spoiler

Adrian Pasdar is getting written out of the show. By the end of this season he's gone. The writing was on the wall for this one since the real Nathan is already dead, though. The circumstances in which Nathan 'goes' can be read up on spoiler sites.

[Thraxis]

I agree that Peter losing his empathy powers as his own empathy decreases is an interesting tie to the character's mentality. It also strikes me, though, as an interesting out for the writers. I mean, someone previously mentioned above that the writers could have his powers come *back* as a plot device, but I think the powers vanishing in the first place were kind of a "oh crap, this guy's getting way stronger than Sylar! What now??" The one power at a time still has something of the feel, yet removes the balance issues.

Yes. In particular, note how he took Emma's power accidentally even though he's demonstrated back in Volume 4 that with practice he was perfectly capable of choosing when and how to replicate someone's power - it happened after touching her and asking if she was alright.

What's especially interesting about this as well, is that he was specifically feeling empathy for another (Emma) when he touched her, which ties his power back to his feelings for others.

WTF is Kneppers power? Is that ink power his too or is just an Earth bender.

I think he is moving the earth in the ink, or something like that.

I concur. Many inks, especially the oriental variety, are made of charcoal and dirt, which is arguably dirt and more dirt.

Um. were they just WAITING for Hayden Panetierre to turn 18? Now shes a confused bisexual sorirty cheerleader? Lets go for broke, have her major in nursing join a nunnery and then drop out to become a librarian??? in her own words when she was trapped in the box with her girlfriend there are whole website s dedicated...

As soon as I saw that scene, I couldn't help think that they threw that scene in just to boost ratings... I mean, really...

The carnival theme is getting a little overdone in my mind. I would have liked to see it come and go every few episodes isntead of featured EVERY episode, but i suppose ereccting a carnival set is rather expensive.

Spoiler

As was just revealed in a recent episode, Samuel's power isn't limited to just earth bending, nor are his intentions so clean and selfless. The reason the carnival's been such a persistant theme, I believe, is because Samuel's going to end up being to this season what Sylar was to the first season.

Still, the season is looking up compared to previous ones, although the whole Carnival crowd is rubbimg me the wrong way, specially with the utter stupidity that it is to bring Sylar into the fold. What do they expect would happen if he recovered his memories? Oh well.

Spoiler

I think Samuel's intentions were purely selfish. Since Chandra Suresh detected that energy that all people with powers emanate, I think that Samuel figured "if more people with powers equals more energy and makes me more powerful, maybe someone who is HELLA powerful will equal a LOT of energy, and thus give me more bang for my buck than gathering people with powers one or two at a time..."

[lance]

I think it has more to do with sylars copying abilities. They are looking for an empath, for what ever reason, and the only three empaths that we know about are sylar, his dad, and peter.