Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

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How do you rate "The Girl Who Waited?"

5 - Here they are, out among the stars, waiting to begin a new life. Ready to out-sit eternity. They're indomitable... indomitable!
21
39%
4 - Just go forward in all your beliefs, and prove to me that I am not mistaken in mine.
23
43%
3 - Amy Pond. The girl who waited. All night in your garden. Was it worth it?
4
7%
2 - I'm not going to sit here like a spare lemon waiting for the squeezer.
4
7%
1 - Two hearts. Two hearts like me. If we wait, we just wait.
2
4%
 
Total votes: 54

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby The Romulan Republic » 2011-09-11 04:26pm

Broomstick wrote:
The Romulan Republic wrote:Finally, Jesus Christ the Doctor is a manipulative, cold blooded son of a bitch. Its rare I feel such a strong desire to inflict physical violence on the supposed hero of a show.

You mean someone who knows their own future, is bloody-minded, contradictory, and completely unpredictable? That Doctor?

The Doctor needs to change his future, too, if he wants to survive. As soon as I heard that line in regards to Amy I though it could also apply to the Doctor as well. So does Amy save the Doctor in the series finale, or does the Doctor save himself?

While the episode seems to have absolutely no connection to the season arc, I have a feeling that will apply in the end.

And aren't you glad that the Doctor is, for the most part, benign in motivation? Can you imagine what it would be like if he was full of malice and wanted to do more than just travel about?


I don't deny the Doctor's motivations are (mostly) benign. But there's no point denying that he's reckless, manipulative, and ruthless. He's demonstrated it again and again.

They way I see it, the Doctor's always had a dark side, and since the Time War its become more and more pronounced. This will not end well.

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Hillary » 2011-09-11 04:42pm

Ha! The last two episodes I quite liked, when the general consensus was "garbage". Now I come on here expecting to join in the general slagging and find you all bloody well liked it. Bloody Hell!

My God, how much did they drrrraaaaaggggggg out the scene at the TARDIS door. Yes we know he's going to have to leave her behind - let's not go all Hollywood, please. It made Armageddon look tame. I also thought it was completely see-through. I was able to spot things happening way before they did (not something I ever intentionally look for).

Rory coming in to rescue Amy but she's now old.
Rory using the looking glass to make Amy see Amy.
The Doctor lying when he said the TARDIS could take both Amys.
The old Amy realising that she had to give the young couple a chance.

All very predictable.

However, I DID love ninja-Amy and the ageing make-up was fantastic.

To my mind, the reason the episode exists is to foreshadow the same decision that is going to have to be made in respect of Melody/River in the finale. They either rescue the baby or allow River's timestream to stay (with the obvious knock on effect being that young Melody shoots the Doctor dead in Utah).
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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Parallax » 2011-09-11 06:15pm

Broomstick wrote:
Atlan wrote:
Broomstick wrote:And aren't you glad that the Doctor is, for the most part, benign in motivation? Can you imagine what it would be like if he was full of malice and wanted to do more than just travel about?

Yeah, like The Master. We know where that goes.

Yeah, except as far as results go the Master isn't nearly as effective as the Doctor. In my opinion.


True, though the Master did once destroy a third of the entire Universe just as a message to the rest of it (Logopolis).

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Starglider » 2011-09-11 06:21pm

Good episode, not quite great; suffered somewhat from a bland setting. The manipulative Doctor was great and I thought very much echoed the personality of his seventh incarnation.
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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Vaporous » 2011-09-12 01:55am

I was struck with a terrible feeling that this is all going to come back into play later with the Doctor's "death" on the beach. He's supposed to be two centuries older; well, alternate speed time stream! And we never see his alternate future TARDIS. I don't think it's even mentioned back in the impossible astronaut at all. so handwave handwave explosive paradox. yet another non-doctor sacrifice/death to tie up loose ends.

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Alkaloid » 2011-09-12 04:49am

TDW was an extremely well-written, well-executed episode that did what may be irreparable harm to the franchise


What? How?

Frankly, the Silence and the army that created River would be entirely justified in their thinking and would be wiped out in seconds.


I've got to be honest, I'm completely baffled by their motivations. They claim that they're trying to kill him because he is to dangerous and a threat to the universe? Fair enough. Then eyepatch lady tells him to his face she isn't afraid of his threats because he is a good man. So your position is to find a powerful individual, who is dangerous, yes, but fundamentally has good intentions for pretty much everyone, and try to kill him by kidnapping his friends and their children and brainwashing them into assassins. Does it not occur to them that this sort of thing is likely to drive him to being the galaxy devouring horror they're so afraid of?

I was struck with a terrible feeling that this is all going to come back into play later with the Doctor's "death" on the beach.


Given that he flat out stated that knowing your future makes it possible to change it if you're bloody minded and clever enough, I'd say so. This still bugs me though, why was River so insistent they not tell him they saw him die. He invited them and his past self to his own death, so he clearly knew how and when he was going to die already, which means it can't matter that much if they tell him, and he may actually be able to take steps to, you know, not get shot and die?

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby AMT » 2011-09-12 07:39am

Maybe that River is still part of the Silence, and wanted to make sure he dies and stays dead, all her lovey doveyness of the time still an act.

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Crossroads Inc. » 2011-09-12 10:45am

Can I just say that, while this was a GOOD strong emotional episode, and by itself I can't say it was bad.. But...

Is anyone else gettign REALLY sick of the "GRIMDARK DOCTOR!" we have been getting?
Ok YES the universe is dangerous, we GET that, yes the Doctor has to make tough choices we KNOW this. Can't you lay off the heavy handed gloves and just give us some fluffy happy candy once in a while??
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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Themightytom » 2011-09-12 11:38am

I did not like this episode for several reasons.
A. the girl who waited has been rehashed So Many Times now.
B. Oh no, time moves faster in some places, yet we don't have to eat or take a shit, so some things change some things don't What a wonderful time to look at a grim future.

We saw this in the Doctor's wife, where Rory went bonkers in the halls of the TARDOS.

C. No Amy, No. You are NOT smart enough to build a sonic screwdriver from robot parts, even if you have thirty years with no sleep.

D. Karen Gillan, much love, but, makeup doesn't really make you look older when you still have your hot body. Walking slightly stiffer doesn't fix this, and making grumpy expressions, and presenting a bizarre unfamiliarity with a pair of glasses doesn't cut the mustard. In your defense, i wouldn't have been watching so closely if BBC hadn't dropped a commercial right into the episode stating "Wow look at what Karen did here, she's a brilliant actor!"
When TV hangs a lantern, it should be to get you to look past the obvious, not draw attention to it, and attempt to frame it positively. We know you can't really age, we'd let it slide for an hour of entertainment, but it wasn't shakespeare.

E. Pretty sure I saw this several times on Stargate.

F. Amy fight scenes were awful to the point of offense. I practice with a sword for Kung Fu, and even a beginner would have better technique, the slow motion just made me want to change the channel.

G. Of Course The Doctor Was An Asshole, We've Been Through This. besides, did anyone really think Karen Gillan was going to keep doing double duty? What about Rory, his story would be totally undercut by the presence of two Amy's.

H. "Can't you just check on interplanetary quarantines before you pop in for a visit" "That's not how I travel"

Well you're an asshole, doctor

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Drooling Iguana » 2011-09-12 08:33pm

Alkaloid wrote:
TDW was an extremely well-written, well-executed episode that did what may be irreparable harm to the franchise

What? How?

By pinning the TARDIS's personality down to a single portrayal. By removing any kind of ambiguity from its behaviour and simply stating "this is what the TARDIS has always been and always will be." Even the Doctor isn't pinned down that tightly, since he regenerates into a new personality every few years. The TARDIS, on the other hand, has just become a whole lot less interesting.
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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Hillary » 2011-09-13 05:50am

Crossroads Inc. wrote:Is anyone else gettign REALLY sick of the "GRIMDARK DOCTOR!" we have been getting?
Ok YES the universe is dangerous, we GET that, yes the Doctor has to make tough choices we KNOW this. Can't you lay off the heavy handed gloves and just give us some fluffy happy candy once in a while??


Did you not see last week's episode?
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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby lance » 2011-09-15 09:32am

I don't think Doctor actually lied, I think he thought it was possible up until things started exploding around him

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Hillary » 2011-09-15 09:54am

lance wrote:I don't think Doctor actually lied, I think he thought it was possible up until things started exploding around him


I'm sure he admitted he knew all along. It also fits in with the bit in Let's Kill Hitler. "Rule number one; the Doctor lies"
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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Themightytom » 2011-09-15 12:16pm

Hillary wrote:
lance wrote:I don't think Doctor actually lied, I think he thought it was possible up until things started exploding around him


I'm sure he admitted he knew all along. It also fits in with the bit in Let's Kill Hitler. "Rule number one; the Doctor lies"


Which was quoted to Amy by River in The Big Bang

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Anarchist Bunny » 2011-09-15 07:40pm

Was I the only one yelling at the screen "HE WAITED 2000 FUCKING YEARS FOR YOUR ASS" when Old Amy was being so bitter at Rory?
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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby The Guid » 2011-09-15 07:47pm

Anarchist Bunny wrote:Was I the only one yelling at the screen "HE WAITED 2000 FUCKING YEARS FOR YOUR ASS" when Old Amy was being so bitter at Rory?


No you weren't and the fact it wasn't brought up was a little galling.
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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Alkaloid » 2011-09-16 12:50am

Rory chose to wait for 2000 years, he wasn't left for 2000 years, and he wasn't going to age. Plus, it was the doctor she hated, not Rory.

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Vaporous » 2011-09-16 04:30pm

And why has no one mentioned Melody for two episodes? Are we supposed to believe Amy and Rory got over the fact that they'll never get to raise their daughter because they found out they went to school together? We had an entire episode about the Doctor helping a scared child and at no point do either of them say "like you helped ours?" Amy is crazy in isolation for forty years and in all her talking with Rory and with all her regret and resentment and hate she never brings up her daughter?

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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby Johonebesus » 2011-09-16 09:10pm

Drooling Iguana wrote:
Alkaloid wrote:
TDW was an extremely well-written, well-executed episode that did what may be irreparable harm to the franchise

What? How?

By pinning the TARDIS's personality down to a single portrayal. By removing any kind of ambiguity from its behaviour and simply stating "this is what the TARDIS has always been and always will be." Even the Doctor isn't pinned down that tightly, since he regenerates into a new personality every few years. The TARDIS, on the other hand, has just become a whole lot less interesting.



My take was that the TARDIS isn't quite fully conscious and aware like we are, and her personality in that episode was the product of the "heart" being put in a human brain. Hasn't the Doctor in the past used phrases like "almost sentient?"
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Re: Doctor Who S32E10, "The Girl Who Waited" [spoilers]

Postby avatarxprime » 2011-09-16 11:55pm

Themightytom wrote:I did not like this episode for several reasons.
C. No Amy, No. You are NOT smart enough to build a sonic screwdriver from robot parts, even if you have thirty years with no sleep.

Yes, I felt the same way. I like Amy, I think she's actually a pretty good companion, an adventurer with a good heart and a bit of a wild side, but no way is she smart enough to do everything she is shown to have in that episode. Now if it was Captain Jack, or Martha, or someone like that I'd just go along with it, but not Amy. That being said, I actually liked the episode quite a bit, mostly due to Rory and Amy being a great couple.


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