Malaysia Airlines 777 missing en route to beijing

[Broomstick]

Just in case anyone wants more info on ADS-B here's the wiki. It stands for "automatic dependent surveillance-broadcast".

[Sea Skimmer]

So opening old Google earth, even discounting all reverse fuel, based on the intended flight path and last known point, this plane had at least enough remaining range to be anywhere from the Australia coast to nearly the Pakistani border across India, or two thirds of the way across the Indian ocean towards Madagascar.

Hopefully Indonesia will now be able to find the track on its own radar tapes, because otherwise we may be in a situation in which this plane will never be found, if it has not ditched or crashed somewhere around Sumatra. If it dropped low to avoid radar, it could still have gone a very long distance.

[Col. Crackpot]

A new 777-200 ER goes for about a $300 million. Thats a fancy prize. Has anyone stolen an airliner before?

Edit: obviously planes have been hijacked before. I mean literally stealing one.

[Broomstick]

I don't recall all the details but yes, I do believe airliners have been stolen before in Africa where radar coverage is very spotty. I'll see if I can find some detail on it beyond my hazy memory.

Really, though, you just need a secluded spot to land it outside of radar coverage, on a surface that can support the plane's weight, and a means to get fuel to it. A dirt road will serve for a fuel truck, a dock for a barge.

[Broomstick]

Ah, here we go, a B737 stolen in Angola in 2003. Apparently still not found.

[Broomstick]

Er.. sorry, apparently it was a 727 that was stolen. Typo.

[Zaune]

Somehow, I can't quite see that being the cause here. If it'd been a cargo aircraft or flying empty for whatever reason then maybe, but how the hell are you supposed to get rid of two hundred and forty-odd potential witnesses?

[Block]

Somehow, I can't quite see that being the cause here. If it'd been a cargo aircraft or flying empty for whatever reason then maybe, but how the hell are you supposed to get rid of two hundred and forty-odd potential witnesses?

That many people have been killed for less than that before. I'd think unloading a plane to a potential buyer would be the hard part.

[Thanas]

The theft idea is absolutely stupid. If they want to do that they can easily steal a cargo plane of equal value much easier.

[Zaune]

Let me rephrase myself. How do you dispose of that many potential witnesses without damaging the merchandise and/or drawing a lot of unwanted attention to yourself? Or get to the nearest place where you might conceivably hide that many bodies in one go, namely the Australian outback, without being spotted on radar by someone?

[Broomstick]

I can think of at least one way to do it, although it would take at least two people because you need at least one to fly the airplane. Well... maybe just one if he doesn't mind cutting safety margins to an insane degree...

But this is really getting off the deep end here.

[General Zod]

Maybe the pilots simply . . . fell asleep and nobody was able to signal an emergency mechanical failure? It's not like pilots haven't passed out on the job before.

[Broomstick]

That does not explain the airplane doing a near 180 and changing altitude to one customarily used for the new course. When pilots fall asleep/unconscious the autopliot continues on the original course.

[Sea Skimmer]

And for the bonus win of Malaysia, now the head of the air force is denying he ever said they tracked the plane west, but they don't rule out that. It took twelve hours for them to deny such a thing? Really makes you wonder if anyone is even in charge of this.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-26527390
Malaysia's air force chief has denied remarks attributed to him that a missing Malaysia Airlines plane was tracked by military radar to the Strait of Malacca, far from its planned route.

Rodzali Daud said such reports in local media were untrue, but it was possible the plane had turned back.

Flight MH370 from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing went missing on Saturday, after taking off with 239 people on board.

Meanwhile, Vietnam said it was scaling back some of its search activities.

"We've decided to temporarily suspend some search and rescue activities, pending information from Malaysia," Vietnam's deputy minister of transport Pham Quy Tieu said on Wednesday.

Earlier this week, Malaysia widened the search for the missing plane amid conflicting reports on its last known position. Early search efforts focussed on waters between Malaysia and Vietnam.

On Tuesday, a local media report quoted Gen Rodzali Daud as saying that the flight was last detected by military radar at the Strait of Malacca, off Malaysia's west coast.

On Wednesday, Gen Rodzali Daud said he "did not make any such statements", but the air force had "not ruled out the possibility of an air turn-back".

Meanwhile, AFP news agency reported that the search had been expanded into the Andaman Sea, north of the Strait of Malacca, citing Malaysian civil aviation chief Azharuddin Abdul Rahman.

Too bad, while the plane heading west opened up a massive search problem, it also meant some renewed hope it could have ditched or crashed somewhere that left survivors, even landed if it was part of some implausibly complicated plot.

[AniThyng]

Yeah well if there ever was a time for someone to exercise dictorial power and oversight over the whole thing it's now.

I don't think the RMAF was so asleep on the job that we would not have scrambled at least one of those expensive Sukhoi's or Hornets we spend our defense budget on to check it out if they tracked it turning off course though, but I may yet be proven wrong.

Question #1 - how much of what we are seeing here a result of the 24-hour internet news cycle?

Question #2 - relative to other disasters, is the handling of the situation markedly worse? E.g. compared to the Japanese handling of Fukushima*?

Basically how ashamed should I be for my country at the moment?

*I mean from a PR and disaster management standpoint, e.g. lack of transperency from TEPCO, conflicting reports on the severity of the incident, internet armchair conspiracy theories etc. Not interested in comparing if a nuclear meltdown is comparable to a missing airliner as such.

[AniThyng]

http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/mala ... ubled-back

Vietnam today disclosed it noticed Flight MH370 had turned back to the west on Saturday and informed Malaysian authorities the same day but received no response.

The revelations came as the search for the missing Malaysia Airlines jet swung northwest towards the Andaman Sea on Wednesday, far from its intended flight path.

"We informed Malaysia on the day we lost contact with the flight that we noticed the flight turned back west but Malaysia did not respond," Vietnam deputy minister of transport Pham Quy Tieu was quoted as saying by AFP today.

"We've asked Malaysian authorities twice, but so far they have not replied to us," Tieu said, when asked about a media report that the plane had been detected over the Strait of Malacca.

Vietnam scaled back its efforts today to locate flight MH370, which was carrying 239 passengers and crew, on the South China Sea where the jet last made contact on a journey between Kuala Lumpur and Beijing.

No trace of the plane has been found since it vanished on Saturday, and contradictory and incomplete information from Malaysian authorities has infuriated relatives enduring an unbearable wait for news of their loved ones.

"We are not going to leave any chance. We have to look at every possibility," civil aviation chief Datuk Azharuddin Abdul Rahman told AFP, confirming the expansion to the Andaman Sea, which lies north of Indonesia's Sumatra island.

He did not indicate whether the decision to expand the multi-nation hunt hundreds of kilometres (miles) to the northwest of the original search radius was based on any firm indications the plane might be there.

Authorities had earlier expanded the zone to the Malacca Strait off Malaysia's west coast after citing radar data they said indicated a "possibility" the plane may have changed course from its intended flight path over the South China Sea.

But the shifting search areas have fuelled perceptions of official bungling, AFP said.

Frustration mounted in Malaysia, with the country's active social media and some press outlets turning from sympathy for families of relatives to anger over the fruitless search.

Twitter users took aim at contradictory reports, and confusion over whether the jet had deviated from its intended course.

"If the Malaysian military did not see MH370 turn toward the Malacca Strait, then why the search? Who decided to look there and why?," one comment said.

"I think Malaysia Airlines and the Malay government is trying to cover up or hide something about flight MH370," wrote another.

The anger and embarrassment were compounded by a report aired in an Australian news programme of a past cockpit security breach involving the co-pilot on the missing jet.

Malaysia Airlines said Tuesday it was "shocked" over the report that First Officer Fariq Abdul Hamid, 27, along with a fellow pilot violated airline rules in 2011 by allowing two young South African women into their cockpit during a flight.

The report included photos of the women in the cockpit, with one appearing to show them posing with a man resembling Fariq. Passengers have been prohibited from entering cockpit during flights after the 9/11 attacks on the United States.

Analysts said pressure on Malaysian authorities could derail complicated search and rescue efforts.

"Public pressure may result in the command structure and unity of the search to crack. This is not what we want," said Gerry Soejatman, an independent aviation analyst based in Jakarta.

"Once that cracks, information and ability to verify becomes a problem and reckless speculation will overwhelm common sense."

Malaysia's air force reiterated on Wednesday it had not ruled out the possibility the Boeing 777 inexplicably changed course, but denied the report it had been detected in the Malacca Strait, far from its planned flight path.

"For the time being, it would not be appropriate... to issue any official conclusions as to the aircraft's flight path until a high amount of certainty and verification is achieved," Royal Malaysian Air Force chief General Rodzali Daud said in a statement.

"However, all ongoing search operations are at the moment being conducted to cover all possible areas where the aircraft could have gone down in order to ensure no possibility is overlooked."

Authorities have so far revealed no details on radar data they said indicated a possible "turn-back".

The search zone shift is the latest twist in the mystery surrounding the plane. On Tuesday, Malaysian authorities said two men travelling on stolen passports appear to be Iranian illegal immigrants - easing fears of terrorism.

Malaysia's national police chief Tan Sri Khalid Abu Bakar has said his officers are not ruling anything out but were now focusing on a possible hijacking, sabotage, or psychological or personal problems among passengers or crew.

The search operation grew to involve 42 ships and 35 aircraft as of yesterday (Day 4), from Southeast Asian countries, Australia, China, New Zealand and the United States.

China, which had 153 of its nationals on board the plane, said it would harness 10 satellites equipped with high-resolution imaging to help in the search.

Boeing said it was joining a US government team to try to unravel the mystery of what happened to its 777-200 plane. – March 12, 2014.

Hmm. Okay. The only thing that I wonder about this is if the Vietnamese knew this, regardless of anything Malaysia did, wouldn't they also check their assets used in the search to account for this possibility?

[Thanas]

If they were flying very low to keep from being detected by radar I wonder why not a single merchant ship picked them up, it is one of the busiest sealanes there is and merchant radar does pick up helicopter flights over the channels for example. Maybe the reach is too little?

As for the cockpit breach, this is beyond embarrassing, it is highly unprofessional and corrupt. Malaysian Airlines might get banned from flying to western states, as Indonesian airlines did after their safety incidents.

[InsaneTD]

Wild speculation/Anyone on board Iran might want?/wild speculation.

[Thanas]

The Iran guy wanted to emigrate illegally to Germany, which many Iranians do each year. There is no reason to assume he had the goal of attacking anybody.

[Sea Skimmer]

Civilian surface search radar is normally velocity gated to filter out fixed wing aircraft. Also nobody is watching it most of the time. Helicopters may be seen because they are slow and low enough to be ships.

[Mr. Coffee]

To soon?

[Col. Crackpot]

To soon?

Really? Your asshole status has been upgraded to between "Sarah Silverman" and "Rush Limbaugh". keep trying and you may make it to "Dick Cheney".

[Mr. Coffee]

The only reason Dick Cheney is a bigger asshole than me is he has a much, much larger budget than I do.

[Zaune]

Yes, yes it is, and I'm a horrible person because I laughed anyway.

[Broomstick]

Possible wreckage sighting from two sources:

1) Chinese satellite imagery
2) Tomnod website crowd-sourcing image search

Of course, both are being checked out.

It would be nice to find something.