Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

N&P: Discuss governments, nations, politics and recent related news here.

Moderators: Alyrium Denryle, Edi, K. A. Pital

User avatar
Straha
Lord of the Spam
Posts: 8198
Joined: 2002-07-21 11:59pm
Location: NYC

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by Straha »

Nah, y'all don't understand Giuliani. Tuesday was the 20th anniversary of Giuliani's most famous (of, weirdly, many) ferret rant:



He needed to distract people who wanted to write about him from that. Hence, this.
'After 9/11, it was "You're with us or your with the terrorists." Now its "You're with Straha or you support racism."' ' - The Romulan Republic

'You're a bully putting on an air of civility while saying that everything western and/or capitalistic must be bad, and a lot of other posters (loomer, Stas Bush, Gandalf) are also going along with it for their own personal reasons (Stas in particular is looking through rose colored glasses)' - Darth Yan
bilateralrope
Sith Acolyte
Posts: 5970
Joined: 2005-06-25 06:50pm
Location: New Zealand

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by bilateralrope »


Jeffrey Epstein found injured with marks on his neck in New York jail cell, sources say

A source questioned whether Epstein might have staged an attack or a suicide attempt to get a move to another facility.

July 25, 2019, 3:12 PM GMT+12 / Updated July 25, 2019, 3:31 PM GMT+12
By Jonathan Dienst and Tom Winter


Jeffrey Epstein, the millionaire financier who is being held on federal sex trafficking charges, was found injured and in a fetal position in his cell at a New York City jail, sources close to the investigation told NBC News on Wednesday night.

Epstein, 66, was found semi-conscious with marks on his neck in his cell at the Metropolitan Correctional Center in Manhattan some time in the last two days, the sources said. Epstein is on suicide watch, two sources said.

Two sources told NBC News that Epstein may have tried to hang himself, while a third source cautioned that the injuries weren't serious, questioning whether Epstein might have staged an attack or a suicide attempt to get a transfer to another facility.

Another source said that an assault hadn't been ruled out and that another inmate, identified by sources as Nicholas Tartaglione, had been questioned.

Tartaglione, 49, is a former police officer in Briarcliff Manor, New York, who was arrested in December 2016 and accused of killing four men in an alleged cocaine distribution conspiracy, then burying their bodies in his yard in Otisville, according to court records. He was charged with drug conspiracy and four counts of murder and is awaiting trial.

Sources said Tartaglione claimed not to have seen anything and not to have touched Epstein.

An attorney for Tartaglione denied that his client attacked Epstein, saying that Tartaglione and Epstein got along well and that Epstein appeared to be fine on Wednesday.

Attorneys for Epstein didn't immediately return calls for comment. A spokesperson for the Bureau of Prisons didn't return calls, and spokesmen for the U.S. Marshals and U.S. attorney's office declined to comment.
Then the article goes over listing what we already knew from previous coverage of Epstein. So I've cut that bit out.


I don't want to see Epstein dying before his trial.
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Suicide attempt, staged attack or suicide attempt for sympathy, or contracted hit from one of his rape orgy buddies? Place your bets folks.

Edit: Or just random prison violence. Pedophiles tend not to fair well in the general populace, IIRC.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
User avatar
aerius
Charismatic Cult Leader
Posts: 14792
Joined: 2002-08-18 07:27pm

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by aerius »

bilateralrope wrote: 2019-07-25 01:01am I don't want to see Epstein dying before his trial.
What did I say 2 weeks ago?
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic. ... 9#p4083782

The odds of him making it alive to his trial are getting lower by the day.
Image
aerius: I'll vote for you if you sleep with me. :)
Lusankya: Deal!
Say, do you want it to be a threesome with your wife? Or a foursome with your wife and sister-in-law? I'm up for either. :P
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Well, if it was a murder attempt, it was a pretty incompetent one.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
User avatar
Knife
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 15769
Joined: 2002-08-30 02:40pm
Location: Behind the Zion Curtain

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by Knife »

My first thought was staged. But if the guy has to be in solitary to keep him safe until trial, I'm ok with that.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong

But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
User avatar
EnterpriseSovereign
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4095
Joined: 2006-05-12 12:19pm
Location: Spacedock

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by EnterpriseSovereign »

bilateralrope wrote: 2019-07-14 04:00pm
Tvpnbb wrote: 2019-07-14 02:13pm
Elheru Aran wrote: 2019-07-14 01:46pm

Would YOU want to go up in front of a bunch of press and say something like "yes I fucked an underage girl BUT HE'S THE BAD GUY HERE!"

Really there's no way you engage in activity like that and come out looking good, even if you're being blackmailed over it. Exposing him would expose you in turn.
Yeah, but the same logic applies to Epstein - exposing the blackmail material would expose you as a child molester in turn.
That does limit Epstein's options to only threatening people if he's going down unless they do something to make the charges go away.

And once he got that initial non-prosecution deal, anything on the tapes that implicated Epstein in anything covered by the deal is no longer a threat to Epstein.
Isn't there a fifth-amendment issue in play here?
User avatar
Straha
Lord of the Spam
Posts: 8198
Joined: 2002-07-21 11:59pm
Location: NYC

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by Straha »

EnterpriseSovereign wrote: 2019-07-25 03:01pm
Isn't there a fifth-amendment issue in play here?
Kind of. Epstein will have good lawyers, they'll make sure that in the negotiations of any plea bargain that he won't reveal anything that can actually be held against him (that is, they'll protect his 5th amendment rights).

However, any deal that is made will have two clauses in it, first that he waives his fifth amendment right against self-incrimination in any of the matters discussed, and second that he reveal all criminal activity that he's been involved in so far to prosecutors. In return prosecutors will only stick him with a limited number of charges, and, given that there's no way he's walking out as a free man, probably not seize all of his assets while giving him some limited privileges as a prisoner. This means that Epstein is going to have to flip on a whole lot of people who were involved with him, and if he holds back and then the prosecutors find out the deal is off and they'll still get to use his testimony against him in the subsequent legal case(s).
'After 9/11, it was "You're with us or your with the terrorists." Now its "You're with Straha or you support racism."' ' - The Romulan Republic

'You're a bully putting on an air of civility while saying that everything western and/or capitalistic must be bad, and a lot of other posters (loomer, Stas Bush, Gandalf) are also going along with it for their own personal reasons (Stas in particular is looking through rose colored glasses)' - Darth Yan
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/jeffrey-e ... -1.5231753
The soonest American financier Jeffrey Epstein will stand trial on sex-trafficking charges is June 2020, though his defence lawyers are pushing for a later date.

Epstein, 66, a hedge fund manager who once hobnobbed with some of the world's most powerful people, was back in court Wednesday in New York City for a pretrial hearing on charges of having sex with girls as young as age 14.

Unlike previous court appearances where Epstein was communicating with his lawyers and looking through papers, he appeared subdued with his hands folded in front of him throughout the brief hearing.

Epstein, whose friends have included Prince Andrew, Bill Clinton and now U.S. President Donald Trump, has pleaded not guilty to sex-trafficking charges that carry the potential for up to 45 years in prison.

There were no visible signs of any injuries after he was found on the floor of his cell last week with neck bruises. After the court appearance, Epstein's lawyer refused to answer what caused the neck bruising.

The bruises weren't so serious that he was unable to remain at the Metropolitan Correctional Center, which is adjacent to the downtown Manhattan courthouse.

U.S. District Judge Richard M. Berman has ordered Epstein to remain behind bars until trial after concluding he is a danger to the community and a flight risk.

Prosecutors have said they fear he might try to influence a growing number of witnesses who support charges that he recruited and abused dozens of girls in New York and Florida in the early 2000s. His lawyers had argued he should be allowed to stay under house arrest in his Manhattan mansion.

His lawyers have argued an agreement reached with federal prosecutors a dozen years ago disallows the charges, and they say he has committed no new crimes.

The deal was reached before he pleaded guilty in state court in Florida to prostitution-related charges involving underage girls. Afterward, he was required to register as a sex offender and pay restitution to many victims. While he served a 13-month jail term, he was permitted to leave the jail to work for 12 hours a day, six days a week.

On Monday, Berman ordered lawyers in the case against Epstein to meet prior to Wednesday's hearing and discuss how the case will proceed, including the timing of pretrial written arguments over legal issues and when a trial should be scheduled.

Epstein was arrested July 6 when he arrived at a New Jersey airport on a private jet from Paris, where he has a home.
So, presuming he lives that long, his trial is likely to be running as headline news (and therefor shining a constant light on his connections to Trump and the Trump rape allegations) right at the height of the election.

There is nothing in this situation that should make anybody happy, but I admit I feel a certain satisfaction at that timing.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Straha wrote: 2019-07-25 03:11pm
EnterpriseSovereign wrote: 2019-07-25 03:01pm
Isn't there a fifth-amendment issue in play here?
Kind of. Epstein will have good lawyers, they'll make sure that in the negotiations of any plea bargain that he won't reveal anything that can actually be held against him (that is, they'll protect his 5th amendment rights).

However, any deal that is made will have two clauses in it, first that he waives his fifth amendment right against self-incrimination in any of the matters discussed, and second that he reveal all criminal activity that he's been involved in so far to prosecutors. In return prosecutors will only stick him with a limited number of charges, and, given that there's no way he's walking out as a free man, probably not seize all of his assets while giving him some limited privileges as a prisoner. This means that Epstein is going to have to flip on a whole lot of people who were involved with him, and if he holds back and then the prosecutors find out the deal is off and they'll still get to use his testimony against him in the subsequent legal case(s).
Yeah, as I recall this is basically the same approach Mueller took with Manafort.

Manafort broke the deal and fucked himself even more than he already was fucked. I wonder if Epstein is that dumb/arrogant. Probably, given what we know about him already.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Court documents reveal Epstein is not, in fact, a billionaire:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/lisettevoy ... illionaire
Topline: Court documents unsealed after disgraced former financier Jeffrey Epstein’s Monday bail hearing revealed new insight into his wealth, confirming what Forbes has written since 2011: Epstein is not a billionaire.

A financial disclosure form filed by Epstein’s legal team said he has over $550 million in assets. In terms of bank accounts, listed are cash ($56,547,773), fixed income from bonds ($14,304,679), equities ($112,679,138), and hedge funds/private equity ($194,986,301.)

Although it was known his properties were worth collectively in the hundreds of millions, their values were confirmed by Epstein’s team for the first time. The Manhattan mansion is listed at $55,931,000; the New Mexico “Zorro” ranch at $17,246,208; the Palm Beach house, $12,380,209; the Paris apartment, $8,672,823; and his two islands in the Virgin Islands: Great St. James $22,498,600, and Little St. James Island, $63,874,223.

The judge overseeing Epstein’s case dismissed the document as “cursory” and said he would unseal more of Epstein’s financial information unless either his legal team or prosecutors can successfully argue for them to stay sealed. Epstein will next appear in court on Thursday to hear the decision from Monday’s hearing, which will determine whether Epstein will be held behind bars or released to heavily monitored house arrest at his Manhattan mansion.

Epstein’s legal team said he’s willing to post up to $100 million in bail. Prosecutors argued against allowing Esptein to be released, stating he’s a flight risk given his wealth, multiple homes, and that he allegedly attempted to pay off two co-conspirators (and could possibly pay off more.)

Epstein was charged last week with two federal counts of sex trafficking and sex trafficking conspiracy, reviving decade-old allegations that he ran a sex ring of underage girls for him and his famous friends.

Key background: Epstein has been under scrutiny since a 2007 federal indictment in Florida was negotiated through what most agree was a very lenient plea deal, which granted him and his anonymous co-conspirators immunity and sealed all documents. (A federal judge ordered in July to unseal documents associated with the case, which could implicate other rich and powerful men.) The Miami Herald’s “Perversion of Justice” investigative series examined the case, which detailed how former secretary of labor Alexander Acosta helped broker—and then shelve—the plea deal. Acosta resigned his Cabinet post last week after coming under fire for his role in the plea deal. Epstein ended up serving a 13-month prison sentence in a county jail, with 12 hours of work release six days a week under a Florida state prostitution charge, and registered as a sex offender both in Florida and New York (but not New Mexico.)

Surprising fact: A transcript was released Monday from a 2011 hearing with assistant district attorney Jennifer Gaffney—then the deputy chief of the Manhattan DA’s sex crimes unit—in which she argued in favor of assigning Epstein a lesser sex offender classification. The judge presiding over Epstein’s Monday hearing said in response to the transcript, “I have to tell you, I’m a little overwhelmed because I’ve never seen the prosecutor’s office do something like this. I have never seen it.” Her request was denied by the judge, and Epstein had to register as a Level 3 offender, the most severe classification in New York.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
User avatar
Zaune
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 7464
Joined: 2010-06-21 11:05am
Location: In Transit
Contact:

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by Zaune »

Well, he's not flipping on anyone now.
Wealthy financier Jeffrey Epstein has been found dead in his prison cell while awaiting trial on sex trafficking charges, US media report.

His body was discovered at 07:30 local time (11:30 GMT) on Saturday at the jail in New York.

Epstein had pleaded not guilty to sex trafficking and conspiracy charges and was being held without bail.
There are hardly any excesses of the most crazed psychopath that cannot easily be duplicated by a normal kindly family man who just comes in to work every day and has a job to do.
-- (Terry Pratchett, Small Gods)


Replace "ginger" with "n*gger," and suddenly it become a lot less funny, doesn't it?
-- fgalkin


Like my writing? Tip me on Patreon

I Have A Blog
User avatar
FaxModem1
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 7700
Joined: 2002-10-30 06:40pm
Location: In a dark reflection of a better world

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by FaxModem1 »

Suicide, or something else?
Image
User avatar
Broomstick
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 28782
Joined: 2004-01-02 07:04pm
Location: Industrial armpit of the US Midwest

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by Broomstick »

One can't help wondering if it was "assisted suicide".
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. - John F. Kennedy

Sam Vimes Theory of Economic Injustice
User avatar
Mlenk
Jedi Knight
Posts: 984
Joined: 2003-12-13 02:29am
Location: Sin City

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by Mlenk »

His “suicide” was eerily predictable. I’m not usually a conspiracy theory kinda guy but given how much dirt he most likely had on some very wealthy and powerful people, one just has to truly wonder about all this.
User avatar
SolarpunkFan
Jedi Knight
Posts: 586
Joined: 2016-02-28 08:15am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by SolarpunkFan »

Mlenk wrote: 2019-08-10 11:27am His “suicide” was eerily predictable. I’m not usually a conspiracy theory kinda guy but given how much dirt he most likely had on some very wealthy and powerful people, one just has to truly wonder about all this.
Too bad the only hashtags on Twitter trending are #ClintonMurders.

Fuck it, is there any point anymore? Republicans get a free pass and have social media bots on their side.

Homo stultus: we deserve to go extinct.
Seeing current events as they are is wrecking me emotionally. So I say 'farewell' to this forum. For anyone who wonders.
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

I'm not terribly surprised, but I'm disappointed. And I'm angry.

Epstein should have stood trial. He should have been dragged into the light of day, held accountable by the Justice System, and sentenced according to the law. His victims deserved that. Our society deserved that. And now, Justice has been cheated.

I don't know if he killed himself or if someone killed him. If the latter, I don't know who it was- there were a lot of powerful people with an incentive to shut his mouth, and even less notable child predators don't tend to fair well in prison. The fact that he was on suicide watch makes it more disturbing, as it suggests someone at the prison either dropped the ball, or was complicit in his death. But while I obviously can't say for certain, two things keep coming back to me: the alleged teen rape victim of Donald Trump during the 2016 elections, who withdrew her allegations at the last moment citing threats. And Trump boasting he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and not lose a single vote. Trump likes to "joke" about the things he's done, or wants to do.

I just hope the FBI uncovered enough about his co-conspirators before he died that this story cannot just be buried. And that there is a very thorough investigation into his death.

I will also add that, given the extreme credibility of the accusations against Epstein, and his prior conviction, anyone alleged to have participated in his crimes should be assumed guilty and punished accordingly in the court of public opinion, even if they never stand trial.
SolarpunkFan wrote: 2019-08-10 01:25pm
Mlenk wrote: 2019-08-10 11:27am His “suicide” was eerily predictable. I’m not usually a conspiracy theory kinda guy but given how much dirt he most likely had on some very wealthy and powerful people, one just has to truly wonder about all this.
Too bad the only hashtags on Twitter trending are #ClintonMurders.

Fuck it, is there any point anymore? Republicans get a free pass and have social media bots on their side.

Homo stultus: we deserve to go extinct.
Or, here's a thought, maybe the Left should get off its collective ass and hit back just as hard, instead of wallowing in collective defeatism and misanthropy.

While its sleazier than the Left generally likes, there is no reason the hashtag #TrumpMurders can't be trending on Twitter. Except that Leftists collectively are still too "civil" to make it happen- even though its fucking accurate, regardless of how Epstein died, because Trump can be held responsible for numerous deaths as a result of his inhumane economic, border, and foreign policies.

Our problem is not that we're out numbered or outgunned- its that we lack backbone.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
User avatar
Elfdart
The Anti-Shep
Posts: 10648
Joined: 2004-04-28 11:32pm

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by Elfdart »

Either he was no longer on suicide watch, which if true is criminal OR his "suicide" had help from one or more of the guards, inmates or his attorneys* so depending on the coroner's report and the FBI's investigation (they've just been called in to investigate, rather than a self-examination by the Bureau of Prisons), those are the three plausible options.

* The one place inmates can meet privately is the attorney-client meeting room. This was how George Jackson's lawyer smuggled him the pistol he used to kill three guards and two inmates before he was shot and killed.
SolarpunkFan wrote: 2019-08-10 01:25pm
Mlenk wrote: 2019-08-10 11:27am His “suicide” was eerily predictable. I’m not usually a conspiracy theory kinda guy but given how much dirt he most likely had on some very wealthy and powerful people, one just has to truly wonder about all this.
Too bad the only hashtags on Twitter trending are #ClintonMurders.

Fuck it, is there any point anymore? Republicans get a free pass and have social media bots on their side.

Homo stultus: we deserve to go extinct.
Don't be so glum. It's really quite hilarious that right-wing dipshits are trying to bring back the Clinton Death List.
aerius wrote: 2019-07-25 09:29am
bilateralrope wrote: 2019-07-25 01:01am I don't want to see Epstein dying before his trial.
What did I say 2 weeks ago?
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic. ... 9#p4083782

The odds of him making it alive to his trial are getting lower by the day.
That doc release a day or so ago, naming everybody and their grandmother as clients of Epstein's sealed his fate but honest to goodness I am still genuinely surprised. I'm beginning to think this wasn't a classic Jack Ruby/Palermo send-off, but simply a matter of Epstein realizing that not only was he going to die behind bars, but he would have to look over his shoulder because lots of people want him dead. So he probably took the easier way out.
Image
User avatar
aerius
Charismatic Cult Leader
Posts: 14792
Joined: 2002-08-18 07:27pm

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by aerius »

Elfdart wrote: 2019-08-10 03:13pm That doc release a day or so ago, naming everybody and their grandmother as clients of Epstein's sealed his fate but honest to goodness I am still genuinely surprised. I'm beginning to think this wasn't a classic Jack Ruby/Palermo send-off, but simply a matter of Epstein realizing that not only was he going to die behind bars, but he would have to look over his shoulder because lots of people want him dead. So he probably took the easier way out.
I'm not surprised, I didn't expect him to make it to his trial but as soon as that list came out I knew he was done. Also, expect everything to get quietly buried, they might whack a few token guys to show that they "did something" but no one who holds real power is going to be touched. Overall, everything happened more or less as I expected, just sooner.
Image
aerius: I'll vote for you if you sleep with me. :)
Lusankya: Deal!
Say, do you want it to be a threesome with your wife? Or a foursome with your wife and sister-in-law? I'm up for either. :P
Ralin
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4378
Joined: 2008-08-28 04:23am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by Ralin »

Guys, not to interrupt a good cynicism fest but you realize he was probably in Rich White Collar Criminal jail, right? The kind with all sorts of amenities where they aren't treated like animals and constantly monitored? It's completely plausible that he could get ahold of stuff to hang himself with or whatever despite a suicide watch, and given that he was used to living in luxury and being on top of the world not hard to believe he'd choose roping over spending the rest of his life behind bars.
User avatar
Solauren
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 10213
Joined: 2003-05-11 09:41pm

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by Solauren »

Also, with a man like Epstein, it could have been a control thing.

"You assholes think you can CONTROL ME? I'M the one in Control...." then hangs himself to prove the point.
I've been asked why I still follow a few of the people I know on Facebook with 'interesting political habits and view points'.

It's so when they comment on or approve of something, I know what pages to block/what not to vote for.
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Ralin wrote: 2019-08-10 09:30pm Guys, not to interrupt a good cynicism fest but you realize he was probably in Rich White Collar Criminal jail, right? The kind with all sorts of amenities where they aren't treated like animals and constantly monitored? It's completely plausible that he could get ahold of stuff to hang himself with or whatever despite a suicide watch, and given that he was used to living in luxury and being on top of the world not hard to believe he'd choose roping over spending the rest of his life behind bars.
Actually, I have to correct my earlier statement- he was no longer on suicide watch, but had been put in a high security area. Which suggests that the Feds weren't convinced he was suicidal, but thought he might be in danger from others.

That said, we really don't know what happened, but I suspect its too big to be entirely concealed at this point, with or without Epstein. I certainly hope so.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Statement from the Southern District of New York District Attorney:

https://justice.gov/usao-sdny/pr/statem ... ey-epstein
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Saturday, August 10, 2019
Statement Of Manhattan U.S. Attorney On The Death Of Defendant Jeffrey Epstein
Manhattan U.S. Attorney Geoffrey S. Berman said: “Earlier this morning, the Manhattan Correctional Center confirmed that Jeffrey Epstein, who faced charges brought by this Office of engaging in the sex trafficking of minors, had been found unresponsive in his cell and was pronounced dead shortly thereafter of an apparent suicide. Today’s events are disturbing, and we are deeply aware of their potential to present yet another hurdle to giving Epstein’s many victims their day in Court. To those brave young women who have already come forward and to the many others who have yet to do so, let me reiterate that we remain committed to standing for you, and our investigation of the conduct charged in the Indictment – which included a conspiracy count – remains ongoing.



We continue to urge anyone who feels they may be a victim or have information related to the conduct in this case to please contact 1-800- CALL FBI.”
A bit quicker than I'd like to label it a suicide (though they do add the caveat "apparent" suicide), but they confirm the investigation is ongoing, and that one of the counts against Epstein was for conspiracy, which by its nature means other targets of the investigation.

Edit: Might as well add this:

https://globalnews.ca/news/5751460/epst ... se-letter/
Nebraska Senator Ben Sasse says the Department of Justice has “failed” and is demanding that investigations be launched into the apparent suicide of disgraced financier Jeffrey Epstein.

“The Department of Justice failed, and today Jeffrey Epstein’s co-conspirators think they might have gotten one last sweetheart deal,” Sasse wrote in an open letter to U.S. Attorney General William Barr on Saturday.

“Every single person in the Justice Department — from your Main Justice headquarters staff all the way to the night-shift jailer — knew that this man was a suicide risk, and that his dark secrets couldn’t be allowed to die with him.”

Epstein was found unresponsive in his New York jail cell at 6:30 a.m., Saturday, the U.S. Department of Justice Federal Bureau of Prisons confirmed.

He was being held at the Metropolitan Correctional Centre in Manhattan on federal sex trafficking charges.

In a statement, the Federal Bureau of Prisons said the FBI would be investigating his death.

According to an NBC report, two weeks ago Epstein had been found in his jail cell “semiconscious with marks on his neck.”

The report, citing unnamed sources, said Epstein had been placed on suicide watch.

However, a person familiar with the matter told the Associated Press that Epstein had been taken off suicide watch prior to his death.

According to a Reuters report, it was not immediately clear why Epstein had been taken off suicide watch, and officials had not responded to requests for comment.

Sasse said given Epstein’s previous apparent suicide attempt, he “should have been locked in a padded room under unbroken, 24/7, constant surveillance.”

“Obviously, heads must roll,” he wrote.

Sasse said it should have been “abundantly clear” that Epstein would go to “any lengths” to avoid being held accountable for his alleged crimes.

“Being responsible for Epstein’s custody and prosecution, the Department of Justice should not have allowed this to happen,” Sasse wrote. “His death not only deprives his victims of the opportunity to confront him in court and to see him held accountable for his crimes, but also makes it harder to unravel his ring and to hold accountable the many other powerful men who raped and exploited these children.”

Epstein was arrested in July for the alleged sex trafficking of minor girls through his Upper East Side mansion in Palm Beach Florida. He had pleaded not guilty.

Some of the charges are almost two decades old. If convicted, Epstein would have faced up to 45 years in prison.

In 2008, under a deal called a non-prosecution agreement, Epstein pleaded guilty to state charges in Florida of soliciting and procuring a minor for prostitution.

He served 13 months in a work-release program.

In the letter, Sasse called on Barr to confirm that he would be ordering an investigation the Bureau of Prisons’ mismanagement of Epstein’s incarceration, and another into potential criminal activity surrounding the mismanagement.

In a statement issued Saturday, U.S. Attorney General William Barr said he was “appalled” to learn that Epstein was found dead, and announced an additional investigation would be opened.

“Mr. Epstein’s death raises serious questions that must be answered,” the statement reads. “In addition to the FBI’s investigation, I have consulted with the Inspector General who is opening an investigation into the circumstances of Mr. Epstein’s death.”

If you or someone you know is in crisis and needs help, resources are available. In case of an emergency, please call 911 for immediate help.

The Canadian Association for Suicide Prevention, Depression Hurts and Kids Help Phone 1-800-668-6868 all offer ways of getting help if you, or someone you know, may be suffering from mental health issues.

-With files from Jessica Vomiero, Kerri Breen and the Associated Press
I'd like to think that this is a rare case of a Republican Senator finding the last vestiges of their conscience, but given that he's a Republican, its more likely a ploy to further discredit the Justice Department (or as the Republican Party calls it, the Deep State) and/or a starting point for another round of partisan investigations of the Clintons. Especially since the quoted parts of the letter seem to stop short of directly critiquing Barr himself.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
User avatar
Rogue 9
Scrapping TIEs since 1997
Posts: 18644
Joined: 2003-11-12 01:10pm
Location: Classified
Contact:

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by Rogue 9 »

The Atlantic
Epstein’s Death Has a Simpler Explanation

Baseless speculation abounded after the accused sex trafficker died, but criminal-justice scholars point instead to a broader suicide problem.

Aug 11, 2019
Lindsay M. Hayes
Project director for the National Center on Institutions and Alternatives

Until the end, their lives were different in countless ways. Jeffrey Epstein, 66, a wealthy white financier with many powerful friends and clients, was a previously convicted sex offender who was facing a new indictment on sex-trafficking charges when he died by suicide early yesterday in the federal Metropolitan Correctional Center (MCC) in New York City.

Sandra Bland, a 28-year-old African American woman, was driving to a new job in Texas in July 2015 when a state trooper pulled her over for failing to signal a lane change. Incredibly, the trooper transported Bland to the Waller County jail. Three days later, a jail officer found her hanging from a plastic garbage-can liner tied to a post in her cell. She had not been seen by any jail staff for more than 90 minutes.

Both cases led to a nationwide furor, as incredulous commentators searched for explanations. On social media yesterday, many people speculated, without evidence, about who besides Epstein might be responsible for his death. Tellingly, many criminal-justice experts pointed instead to a broader issue: Suicide has been a lingering problem in detention facilities, and systemic factors—such as inattention, understaffing, or inadequate training—generally offer a simpler explanation for a prisoner’s death than nefarious intent.
More Stories

Employee looks for items in an Amazon warehouse
There’s More Than One Way to Fight Monopoly
Nathan Schneider Sandeep Vaheesan
The Shame and Disgrace Will Linger
David Frum
Children's bunk room with colorful flags and approximately 15 children
When Children at the Border Got Compassion
Eric Fanning
Marianne Williamson
Can Self-Help Heal the Body Politic?
Natalia Mehlman Petrzela

The New York Times and other outlets have reported that Epstein had attempted suicide a few weeks earlier, on July 23, but had been taken off suicide watch at the time of his death. The MCC is administered by the Federal Bureau of Prisons. Attorney General William Barr has ordered an investigation, declaring in a press release that he “was appalled to learn that Jeffrey Epstein was found dead early this morning from an apparent suicide while in federal custody. Mr. Epstein’s death raises serious questions that must be answered.”

In Bland’s case, subsequent investigations found numerous deficiencies at the jail that included not only lapses in observation, but inadequate intake screening. Her death did not go unnoticed. In 2017, Texas enacted the Sandra Bland Act, which mandated that county jails develop better intake screening processes, as well as divert individuals with mental-health and substance-abuse issues toward treatment options. The legislation eased bail conditions for defendants with mental illnesses or intellectual disabilities and required that independent law-enforcement agencies better investigate jail deaths.

Hundreds of individuals are thought to commit suicide each year in jails throughout the country, and suicide is still thought to be the leading cause of death in such facilities. Why such uncertainty? The U.S. Justice Department’s reporting program for deaths in correctional institutions has not released any data since 2016. The program was first established in 1990 to require the Justice Department to collect data on all deaths in custody from state and local authorities. As last reported in 2016, 2014 saw 372 suicides in local jails throughout the United States, resulting in a suicide rate of 50 deaths per 100,000 inmates. In state and federal prisons, 249 inmates died by suicide during 2014, resulting in a suicide rate of 20 deaths per 100,000 inmates.

What do these numbers mean? Several things. First, until 2014, there had been a significant decrease in the rate of suicide in jails throughout the United States. My studies of jail suicides for the Justice Department found that suicides had decreased by two-thirds over 20 years, from 107 per 100,000 inmates in 1986 to approximately 36 suicides per 100,000 inmates in 2006. Many believe that the suicide rate has continued to rise since the Justice Department’s last data dump in 2016, but we cannot be sure—because there are no data. In other words, the United States does not currently know how many inmates commit suicide in custody each year.

Of course, many might ask: Who cares? My answer has always been and continues to be the same. Preserving life is our moral and legal responsibility. Sandra Bland could have been our daughter, our sister, our loved one, our friend. Jeffrey Epstein was certainly not a sympathetic character, but his death, while perhaps leaving some victims relieved, deprives others of a sense of justice. We also need to remember the other victims in his case, including the first responders to the medical emergency yesterday, as well as those responsible for his care and custody.

The decline in inmate suicide rates from 1986 to 2006 suggests that many such deaths are preventable—and that the rate can go lower still. Over the years, greater general awareness of the problem, better training of all correctional and health-care personnel, more in-depth inquiry of suicide risk factors during the intake process, better design of physical facilities, and the continued threat of litigation reduced the numbers. We now know that Bland’s suicide certainly was preventable, and we await federal investigators to tell us whether Epstein’s death was.

Sandra Bland’s death resulted in significant reform of local jail suicide-prevention practices in Texas. At a minimum, perhaps Jeffrey Epstein’s death will result in renewed efforts to require an accounting of the number of people that die in jails nationwide.
The idea that his death could have been a hit to silence him has a certain attractiveness, but this isn't a new or unique problem.

Meanwhile, of course Trump couldn't keep his stubby fingers off the touch screen on this.
The Shame and Disgrace Will Linger

On Saturday, President Trump spread a conspiracy theory accusing the Clintons of murdering Jeffrey Epstein.


Aug 10, 2019
David Frum
Staff writer at The Atlantic

August 10, 1969: San Clemente, California—President Richard Nixon accused his predecessor Lyndon Baines Johnson of complicity in the assassination of President John F. Kennedy. Speaking with reporters on the first day of a 10-day stay at his Pacific Ocean vacation home …

Of course, that never happened. Obviously. How could it; how dare it? But had it happened, such an accusation—by a president, against a former president—would have convulsed the United States and the world. Today, President Donald Trump accused his predecessor Bill Clinton—or possibly his 2016 campaign opponent, the former first lady and Secretary of State Hillary Clinton—of complicity in the death of the accused sex trafficker Jeffrey Epstein.

Many seem to have responded with a startled shrug. What do you expect? It’s just Trump letting off steam on Twitter.

Reactions to actions by Trump are always filtered through the prism of the ever more widely accepted view—within his administration, within Congress, within the United States, and around the world—that the 45th president is a reckless buffoon; a conspiratorial, racist moron, whose weird comments should be disregarded by sensible people.

By now, Trump’s party in Congress, the members of his Cabinet, and even his White House entourage all tacitly agree that Trump’s occupancy of the office held by Washington, Lincoln, FDR, and Eisenhower must be a bizarre cosmic joke, not to be taken seriously. CNN’s Jake Tapper on August 2 quoted a “senior national security official” as saying: “Everyone at this point ignores what the president says and just does their job. The American people should take some measure of confidence in that.”

Everybody at this point ignores what the president says.

So even though Trump just retweeted the comedian Terrence K. Williams accusing the Clinton family of murder, the people who work for Trump may ignore that, too. They know that the president punching the retweet button like an addled retiree playing the slots through a fog of painkillers means nothing. The days of “taking Trump seriously, not literally” have long since passed. By this point, Trump is taken neither seriously nor literally. His words are as worthless as Trump Organization IOUs.

But cosmic joke or no cosmic joke, Donald Trump is the president of the United States. You may not like it. I don’t like it. Mike Pompeo doesn’t like it. Mitch McConnell doesn’t like it. Kevin McCarthy doesn’t like it. But it’s still a fact, and each succeeding outrage makes it no less a fact. Grinning and flashing a thumbs-up over an orphaned baby? Yes, still president. Tweeting that a third-tier dictator has threatened him with more missile tests unless he halts military exercises with a U.S. ally——and that he has surrendered to that blackmail? Shamefully, still president. Accusing a former U.S. president of murder? It’s incredible, it’s appalling, it’s humiliating … but, yes, he is the president all the same.

Trump’s circle probably expects the world to sputter for a while and then be distracted by some new despicable statement or act. That is how it has gone for nearly three years, and that is how it is likely still to go. Trump is steering the U.S. and the world into a trade war, and perhaps a financial crisis and recession along with it. He is wrecking the structure of U.S. alliances in Asia, and his rhetoric is inciting shooting rampages against minorities. Compared with that, mere slurs and insults perhaps weigh lighter in the crushing Dumpster-load of Trump’s output of unfitness for the office he holds.

But it shouldn’t be forgotten, either, in the onrush of events. The certainty that Trump will descend ever deeper into subbasements of “new lows” after this new low should not numb us to its newness and lowness.

Neither the practical impediments to impeachment and the Twenty-Fifth Amendment process, nor the foibles and failings of the candidates running to replace him, efface the fact that this presidency shames and disgraces the office every minute of every hour of every day. And even when it ends, however it ends, the shame will stain it still.
It's Rogue, not Rouge!

HAB | KotL | VRWC/ELC/CDA | TRotR | The Anti-Confederate | Sluggite | Gamer | Blogger | Staff Reporter | Student | Musician
User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 21559
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Jeffrey Epstein arrested in New York on child sex trafficking charges.

Post by The Romulan Republic »

Yeah, that's where this seems to be going: instead of justice for the victims, they get used again, to give the Republicans an excuse to trot out another round of Clinton conspiracy theories.

Which isn't to say that Bill Clinton is innocent. He's at best sexually exploitative, dishonest and sleazy, with some very dubious associations, and I wouldn't be remotely surprised if he were found out to be a child rapist. But there is a LOT of blame to go around in the Epstein case, and it should go without saying that focusing it all on the Clintons, and trotting out all the old Clinton murder conspiracy theories again, is a purely partisan exercise, not a search for truth and justice.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"The greatest enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."-General Von Clauswitz, describing my opinion of Bernie or Busters and third partiers in a nutshell.

I SUPPORT A NATIONAL GENERAL STRIKE TO REMOVE TRUMP FROM OFFICE.
Post Reply