Star Trek warship designs

Cpt_Frank · Post by **Cpt_Frank** » 2002-09-02 02:17pm

There's a third choice:
Vader wanted 3-dimensional images of his captains to communicate with because he finds that more comfortable and he
DOESN'T GIVE A SHIT IF THAT MEANS SACRIFICING A SHIP!

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2002-09-02 02:20pm

*sigh the wall climbs higher, ISDs use subspace communcation between Systems and Holo-Net for Long Range, BOTH systems are blocked when the shields are up Captian Brillant because it is Cannon that SW shields block everything from Kinetic Attacks to Energy which as any fool who managed to stumble his way through a single year of High School should know is what comuncation is based on it only changes form but it does not disrupt the basic fact that All so called Wireless communcation relys on turning the information an energy state(Be it FTL or not) and then transmiting it, ISDs can use other ships with that part of their shielding off as repeaters if they wanted through hard-line through shield communcation or drop a shield sideing temproarly to communcate but the basic fact remains is that ISD's Shields stop everything when they are up and running from Radation and Radio Waves to large chuncks of Rock but it did not have its ships up to begin with this is what the novelistation holds up and the on-screen visuals hold up to

Look at ROTJ, HDS has some pics I belive as does Wong of a TIE Smashing full into a ISD Tower exploding and causing no damage

Guest · Post by **Guest** » 2002-09-02 02:24pm

That is really intelligent.... sacrificing a ship in order to see a 3D image of the captain.

If the Empire wastes its resources so foolishly how can you ever hope to conquer the entire Milky Way galaxy! It is more reasonable to assume that the SD had its shields up and still couldn't resist the asteroid. What is worse, extreme stupidity or weaker equipment? Take your pick.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2002-09-02 02:31pm

Uhhh... Commander, did you even read what we were saying? All forms of communication are blocked by shields. In order to communicate, one must lower the shields.

Also, the capture of the Falcon was worth more to Darth Vader than all five ISD's in Death Squadron, and possibly as much as all of Death Squadron put together. He took a risk in going into the asteroid belt, but he accepted that as being reasonable. Thus, it was not a sacrifice. Also, the ship was not destroyed by the impact.

starfury · Post by **starfury** » 2002-09-02 02:34pm

That is really intelligent.... sacrificing a ship in order to see a 3D image of the captain. If the Empire wastes its resources so foolishly how can you ever hope to conquer the entire Milky Way galaxy! It is more reasonable to assume that the SD had its shields up and still couldn't resist the asteroid. What is worse, extreme stupidity or weaker equipment? Take your pick.

and the Klingons dropping their guns and using viking tactics are are so intelligent

Guest · Post by **Guest** » 2002-09-02 02:39pm

I never said Star Trek was more intelligent. At least they don't have to drop shields to send messages.

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2002-09-02 02:39pm

*Sigh he builds the wall yet higher

Do you know Gravity kills people? Besides the obvious falls and the like after 100 years you body can't take much more of it and you die through things like Heart-Faulier or broken bones thats one of those

SCIENTIFC LAWS
Tell me captian Obvious should they delibratly build Shields that can be percided by Energy on Certain Wavelengths so you can communcate with your shields
up

Whats to stop somone
FROM BULIDING A WEAPON THAT USES THOSE SAME WAVELENGHTS TO ATTACK YOU RENEDERING YOUR SHIELDS USELESS, OH WAIT I KNOW WHO DOES THAT STAR-TREK WITH THIER SHIELD MODULATION WITH HAS THE SHIELD FLICKERING ON AND OFF THOUSANDS OF TIME A SECOND, AND THEY CAN BARLEY TAKE A 200 MEGATON NUKE!

Let me say this very simple for you, The purpose of Shields is to protect the ship from harm, WHY Delebratly build vunarabiltes into your Shielding so your not protected from certian things hmmm?

Its called not doing dumb things when you build it
This aurgment is pointless, We know that SW ships field guns at least of the 6MT Range and Go up to 200GT as of twenty years before ROTJ. We know those same ships can take half an hour of bombarment from weaponry of that magnitude

Your acutal suggestion that they delebratley desgined shielding that can only take 100 Mega-tons of(Rough Estmate) of Kinetic damage but can take roughly 300 Teratons of Energy Damage then why the Hell Genius do every single SW ship mount tons of Energy Weaponry and Not a Realy Big Stick to take advantage of those very weak shields you claim

Why?

Please Enlighten me as if we assumed you where right that they would desgin ships and weapons specficly to attack the enemy when he's strongest

I guess thats why they arm Stormys with large foam sticks to prevent them from acutal hurting anyone

Turn it around the other way and you can see how increably, IDIOTIC your claim is

Guest · Post by **Guest** » 2002-09-02 02:40pm

The ISD may not have been completely destroyed, but how effective could it have been without the ENTIRE BRIDGE SECTION! If you look at the scene closely it is obviously not there after the impact.

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2002-09-02 02:45pm

Commander LeoRo wrote:The ISD may not have been completely destroyed, but how effective could it have been without the ENTIRE BRIDGE SECTION! If you look at the scene closely it is obviously not there after the impact.

What, you mean look like this http://supreme_sheridan.tripod.com/aotc_ics_vs_tesb.html#damage

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2002-09-02 02:46pm

Commander LeoRo wrote:The ISD may not have been completely destroyed, but how effective could it have been without the ENTIRE BRIDGE SECTION! If you look at the scene closely it is obviously not there after the impact.

Okay, a couple things. First of all, if you look at the picture closely, you should be able to see that the bridge section is still there. It's tough, but if you have a good picture then you will be able to tell. Second, even if the bridge was destroyed then the ISD would still be reasonably effective. When Executor's bridge was destroyed, it did cause a temporary loss of control, but had the Executor not plunged into the DSII, it would have survived to continue in the fight. ISD's have similarly redundant control abilities, with the second bridge being a part of engineering.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » 2002-09-02 02:59pm

Where have we seen in the movies/screen plays/ movie novelizations/ that the SD's have a separate or auxiliary bridge that they can switch to? I don't buy for a second that a SD can operate just as efficiently or even effectively without its entire bridge. If SD's do have the capability to switch bridge control to engineering I would like to know about it.

Grand Admiral Thrawn · Post by **Grand Admiral Thrawn** » 2002-09-02 03:02pm

Commander LeoRo wrote:Where have we seen in the movies/screen plays/ movie novelizations/ that the SD's have a separate or auxiliary bridge that they can switch to? I don't buy for a second that a SD can operate just as efficiently or even effectively without its entire bridge. If SD's do have the capability to switch bridge control to engineering I would like to know about it.

SSDs have it. Presumably so do ISDs.

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2002-09-02 03:14pm

Can we have it both ways, the fleet was in the astroid field for awhile, and the ISD took various hits to the bridge section before the VFX shot of the astroid that got passed the shields(if they were still up) and hit the conning tower.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2002-09-02 03:18pm

Commander LeoRo wrote:Where have we seen in the movies/screen plays/ movie novelizations/ that the SD's have a separate or auxiliary bridge that they can switch to? I don't buy for a second that a SD can operate just as efficiently or even effectively without its entire bridge. If SD's do have the capability to switch bridge control to engineering I would like to know about it.

Probably how the Captain of the damaged ISD gained a look of shock/surprise, instead of explosion and death. But you know, that's just applying logic to the situation.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2002-09-02 03:19pm

Huh. I always thought that the captain just cut the transmission and that dazed look was him shielding his eyes from whatever pyrotechnic effects the collision of shield and asteroid caused.

Apparently not.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2002-09-02 03:27pm

Commander LeoRo wrote:That is really intelligent.... sacrificing a ship in order to see a 3D image of the captain. If the Empire wastes its resources so foolishly how can you ever hope to conquer the entire Milky Way galaxy! It is more reasonable to assume that the SD had its shields up and still couldn't resist the asteroid. What is worse, extreme stupidity or weaker equipment? Take your pick.

200 GT

Go away troll

starfury · Post by **starfury** » 2002-09-02 04:00pm

[/quote]quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Commander LeoRo:
That is really intelligent.... sacrificing a ship in order to see a 3D image of the captain. If the Empire wastes its resources so foolishly how can you ever hope to conquer the entire Milky Way galaxy! It is more reasonable to assume that the SD had its shields up and still couldn't resist the asteroid. What is worse, extreme stupidity or weaker equipment? Take your pick.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

200 GT

Go away troll

Nerconlord, It seems that we have a found yet another village idiot

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2002-09-02 05:10pm

Commander LeoRo wrote:The ISD may not have been completely destroyed, but how effective could it have been without the ENTIRE BRIDGE SECTION! If you look at the scene closely it is obviously not there after the impact.

No ISD model was damaged to make ESB. Thus it is quite impossible for the bridge to have been shown blown away on screen. The fact that the explosion effect masks it does not mean it was destroyed. Blasts can obscure many things which are undamaged.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2002-09-02 06:16pm

Commander LeoRo wrote:Where have we seen in the movies/screen plays/ movie novelizations/ that the SD's have a separate or auxiliary bridge that they can switch to? I don't buy for a second that a SD can operate just as efficiently or even effectively without its entire bridge. If SD's do have the capability to switch bridge control to engineering I would like to know about it.

Oh, no, not another canon monger who refuses to accept EU evidence, even when it does not even remotely contradict anything from canon. It appears as though DarkStar has found another disciple.

[Best Yoda impersonation] Always two, there are. A master, and an apprentice.

Doomriser · Post by **Doomriser** » 2002-09-02 06:24pm

ROFL Master Of Ossus

Anyway, ST shields don't block communications like SW ones do because ST shields don't really even filter out weapons fire. Consoles explode while shields are still above 50% or so. The more effecient SW shields block out more.

It doesn't even matter anyway as it is questionable whether a ST ship would be able to damage a Star Destroyer that was broadcasting with shields down thanks to neutronium-impregnated hull claddings that can easily withstand thermonuclear explosions at point-blank range [ref: AOTC: ICS] while ST capital ships barely have low-TW weaponry if that.

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi · Post by **Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi** » 2002-09-02 08:35pm

Well, at least ISD consoles don't spontneously explode.

And, not all the ships had their bridges damaged from an asteroid. As for resources, a galaxy which can build a moon-sized battle station in less than a year can surely compensate for a lost ISD. And who says the ISD was "lost"?

Falkenhorst · Post by **Falkenhorst** » 2002-09-03 02:45pm

Here's my take on what starfleet should have done in the way of warships:

after wolf-359, had I been in charge of starfleet, I would have refitted recently decommissioned ships with remote control gear or reprogrammed their computers with seek and destroy algorithms, and then removed most of their internal volume and replaced it with antimatter explosives. Then the next time the borg showed up, I would deploy a dozen or so of these ships to attack the cube, attacking in waves and from multiple vectors to ensure hits on the borg. Would this have worked?

Basically build a load of antimatter armed ramships with enough explosive power to waste a cube (and it would only be ONE cube due to borg stupidity)

Thoughts on this?

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2002-09-03 05:03pm

You gys don't frequent the PSW area very often, do you? LeoRo is a classic Village idiot. It's just nobody has gotten around to giving him the title yet. He has a partner named aaron2 who parrots evferything he says. It's very convienent. You get the stupidity in stereo form without any extra hardware.

And now on a toatlly unrelated topic: Can I get a little fucking credit? I was the one who proved the shields were down via holonet. I posted it on SB. I defended it. I typed out all the quotes and fought back. Then it finally stared getting picked up and got posted in the hate mail page, and came here with the "Great Migration". Now it is popping up on independent site. So can I just get a little credit? Please? It's not like I got any for saying ISDs were powerd by Hypermatter back before ICS came out.[/url]

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2002-09-03 05:38pm

I elect that both Commander LeoRo and Aaron2 be our latest entrees to the title of Village Idiot.

They deserve it. Not because they don't agree with us, but because they are stupid.

And because Aaron2 is nothing more than a toadie (and I hate toadies.)

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2002-09-03 05:42pm

Perhaps Aaron 2 and Leo Roy is either one and the same or like roomates at college, I find it odd that as soon as one posts the other appears right behind him to back him up.