Alec Baldwin charged with involuntary manslaughter over death of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins

[Crazedwraith]

I happened to see a couple of videos from a candian gun lawyer youtube about the case where he described the prosecutor Clowning themselves and very obviously grandstanding and politicising the case ,playing to a right wing base, rather than arguing the facts.

They had to drop a charge at one point because it only came into existance after the Rust shooting (or because of it) and you can't charge someone ex post facto.

It seems less Baldwin tht doesn't have case to answer than the prosecutor messed up.

[The_Saint]

I happened to see a couple of videos from a candian gun lawyer youtube about the case where he described the prosecutor Clowning themselves...

<snip>

Ah, I see you too watch Runkle of the Bailey. I'm not a lawyer and it's mostly dealing with Canadian and USA law but I find it a very interesting channel giving insight into how the law works (sometimes in some places).

[Crazedwraith]

I happened to see a couple of videos from a candian gun lawyer youtube about the case where he described the prosecutor Clowning themselves...

<snip>

Ah, I see you too watch Runkle of the Bailey. I'm not a lawyer and it's mostly dealing with Canadian and USA law but I find it a very interesting channel giving insight into how the law works (sometimes in some places).

Not a regular watcher but i'd seen a couple episodes because I do watch Forgotten Weapons/InRangeTV so been following the lawsuit about their WWSD rifle

[bobalot]

From what I have read when they tested the pistol, it did actually appear to have some sort of malfunction that made it go off without needing to pull the trigger.

I don't know much about guns. Curious to how on earth something like that happens.

[Crazedwraith]

I'd heard the opposite. That the investigators had found such thing couldn't happen.

[The_Saint]

From what I have read when they tested the pistol, it did actually appear to have some sort of malfunction that made it go off without needing to pull the trigger.

I don't know much about guns. Curious to how on earth something like that happens.

That story only appears on social media. The lab testing shows it had no apparent issue and required a trigger pull (and anecdotal testing by owners of the same firearm also corroborates that it requires positive action to fire).

I note the charges have been dropped in the manner that allows them to be brought back later with same evidence if so decided (and a prosecutor with their head screwed on straight takes the case) and that it doesn't prevent any kind of civil suit. Also the show armourer is still on the hook with charges.

[Adam Reynolds]

In the general sense a misfire could have been possible because it is an 1800s revolver. They were generally unreliable to the point that most gunslingers only kept five rounds in a standard six shooter, leaving the hammer resting against an empty chamber, as the risk of an accidental shot wasn't worth the extra round. An accidental tap on the hammer could set it off, but it would still probably be negligence on Baldwin's part as he was actively handling it.

[The_Saint]

Baldwin was using a Pietta 1873 single action army, so modern made. I would suspect the biggest issue here is the difficulty of checking that design to see if it's loaded, and if so, with what kind of ammunition. In fact the latter is probably the most difficult thing to check as you'd need to eject EVERY round and if they weren't shelling out for blank-firing-only weapons permitting the cardinal sin of potentially mixing blank and live ammunition....

[Formless]

From what I have read when they tested the pistol, it did actually appear to have some sort of malfunction that made it go off without needing to pull the trigger.

I don't know much about guns. Curious to how on earth something like that happens.

Well, there are some older guns that can go off if you hit the back end of them because the firing pin is left floating. Basically with enough impulse the pin can hit the primer in the cartridge and it goes off. However, this usually required you to do something stupid like dropping the gun before it would get hit hard enough, hence the old cliche in movies of guns going off when dropped. New guns don't have this problem, designers realized it was a hazard and designed guns with either drop safeties, spring loaded firing pins, etc. so that dropping a gun won't make it go boom.

You can also fan the hammer of these old revolvers to fire them without pulling the trigger for each shot, and its actually the fastest way to rapidly shoot them. This is, however, only possible because you are holding the trigger down while you do it. So its more like the trigger is just holding back the hammer, so the hammer itself can be used as a trigger. Such a simple trigger can't be used in an autoloading firearm, btw, because what you would have is a fully automatic weapon.

Basically, the only way most guns are going off in your hand is if you pull the trigger, or the ammo cooks off in the heat (unlikely). Even a lot of reproductions have anachronistic safety mechanisms added because historicity isn't worth people getting hurt.

[Broomstick]

In the general sense a misfire could have been possible because it is an 1800s revolver. They were generally unreliable to the point that most gunslingers only kept five rounds in a standard six shooter, leaving the hammer resting against an empty chamber, as the risk of an accidental shot wasn't worth the extra round.

Hell, the people I know who carry handguns these days that are much safer modern revolvers customarily leave an empty chamber under the hammer. Aside from all other possible safety features, keeping a bullet out from under the hammer until you are truly ready to fire is still a good one.

[EnterpriseSovereign]

Alec Baldwin charged with involuntary manslaughter after fatal shooting on Rust set

A grand jury has indicted Alec Baldwin on an involuntary manslaughter charge in a 2021 fatal shooting during a rehearsal on a movie set in New Mexico.

Special prosecutors brought the case before a grand jury in Santa Fe this week, months after receiving a new analysis of the gun that was used.

Baldwin, the lead actor and a co-producer on the Western movie Rust, was pointing a gun at cinematographer Halyna Hutchins during a rehearsal on a movie set outside Santa Fe in October 2021 when the gun went off, killing her and wounding director Joel Souza.

Baldwin has said he pulled back the hammer, but not the trigger, and the gun fired.

Judges recently agreed to put on hold several civil lawsuits seeking compensation from Baldwin and producers of Rust after prosecutors said they would present charges to a grand jury.

Special prosecutors dismissed an involuntary manslaughter charge against Baldwin in April, saying they were informed the gun might have been modified before the shooting and malfunctioned.

They later pivoted and began weighing whether to refile a charge against Baldwin after receiving a new analysis of the gun.

The analysis from experts in ballistics and forensic testing relied on replacement parts to reassemble the gun fired by Baldwin, after parts of the pistol were broken during testing by the FBI.

The report examined the gun and markings it left on a spent cartridge to conclude that the trigger had to have been pulled or depressed.

The analysis stated that although Baldwin repeatedly denied pulling the trigger, “given the tests, findings and observations reported here, the trigger had to be pulled or depressed sufficiently to release the fully cocked or retracted hammer of the evidence revolver.”

The weapons supervisor on the movie set, Hannah Gutierrez-Reed, has pleaded not guilty to involuntary manslaughter and evidence tampering in the case.

Her trial is scheduled to begin in February.

The 2021 shooting resulted in a series of civil lawsuits, including wrongful death claims filed by members of Hutchins’ family, centred on accusations that the defendants were lax with safety standards.

Baldwin and other defendants have disputed those allegations.

[Crazedwraith]

It kind of sucks to have charges dropped and re-brought but i can't really say there isn't a case to answer here.

[LadyTevar]

It kind of sucks to have charges dropped and re-brought but i can't really say there isn't a case to answer here.

There is a case.
There was a monumental lapse in safety and it caused the death of one and injured another. In many minds, someone needs to pay for that lapse, and Baldwin was the Man In Charge.

Can they actually get a verdict in the case? That is going to be the harder part.

[Crazedwraith]

It kind of sucks to have charges dropped and re-brought but i can't really say there isn't a case to answer here.

There is a case.
There was a monumental lapse in safety and it caused the death of one and injured another. In many minds, someone needs to pay for that lapse, and Baldwin was the Man In Charge.

Can they actually get a verdict in the case? That is going to be the harder part.

Indeed. I agree. Note the double negative.

[LadyTevar]

Indeed. I agree. Note the double negative.

Apologies.
I was also agreeing with you that it sucks to have the charges dropped and refiled.

[EnterpriseSovereign]

Hannah Gutierrez-Reed: Trial of Rust armourer begins in New Mexico

Jury selection has begun in the trial of armourer Hannah Gutierrez-Reed for the fatal 2021 shooting of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins.

Ms Hutchins died when a gun went off on the set of Rust, a forthcoming Western film, near Santa Fe in October 2021.

Ms Gutierrez-Reed has pleaded not guilty to charges of involuntary manslaughter and tampering with evidence.

She faces up to three years in prison if convicted.

As the armourer, she was in charge of firearms on the film set.

Ms Gutierrez-Reed has tried to have the case dismissed, but a judge ruled last week it could proceed. Opening arguments are expected to begin later this week in Santa Fe, New Mexico.

In January, Alec Baldwin, the movie's star, was charged with involuntary manslaughter over Ms Hutchins' death.

The fresh charge came after previous charges against him were dropped last April when New Mexico prosecutors said new information had come to light which required further investigation.

Mr Baldwin was charged again after local prosecutors said "additional facts" had emerged from forensic tests on the weapon used in the shooting.

The actor entered a not guilty plea on 31 January. No trial date has been scheduled in his case.

Ms Hutchins was killed when a prop gun held by Mr Baldwin went off at point-blank range as they were rehearsing a scene on the Bonanza Creek Ranch set of Rust.

Mr Baldwin, 65, had been practising firing a pistol for a scene. He has maintained he did not pull the trigger of the Colt .45 pistol and only drew back its hammer.

He has also argued he is not at fault for Ms Hutchins' death because he did not know the weapon contained live rounds and because no live ammunition was supposed to be on set.

Actor Alec Baldwin departs his home, as he will be charged with involuntary manslaughter for the fatal shooting of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins on the set of the movie Rust, in New York,, 31 January 2023.

It has not been officially established how live ammunition got on to the film set.

Ms Gutierrez-Reed was first charged with manslaughter early last year, with evidence tampering charges added when she allegedly refused to provide more information about the live rounds.

Rust resumed filming in early 2023 but the movie is yet to be released.

[Solauren]

It will be interesting to see how this goes.

I'm surprised she's only facing 3 years, I was expecting 5 - 10 (shrugs).

[bilateralrope]

‘Rust’ Armorer Told Detectives She Checked Dummy Rounds ‘Most of the Time’

Feb 27, 2024 5:17pm PT
By Gene Maddaus


SANTA FE, N.M. — “Rust” armorer Hannah Gutierrez Reed told detectives that she brought dummy rounds to set that were left over from a previous film, and that had been loose in a bag in her car.

Gutierrez Reed is on trial for involuntary manslaughter in the death of Halyna Hutchins, who was killed by a live round fired from Alec Baldwin‘s gun. Prosecutors have alleged that Gutierrez Reed was responsible for bringing a box of dummies that included multiple live rounds.

On Tuesday, jurors were shown a police interview from November 2021, in which Gutierrez Reed said that she had used dummies on “Rust” that were left over from “The Old Way,” a Nicolas Cage film she had worked on a few weeks earlier.

“I went back through a bag that I had,” Gutierrez Reed said in the interview. “This bag had a bunch of loose dummies in it. I went through and I checked all of them, and I put them into two boxes… They were in my car for like two weeks.”

Gutierrez Reed loaded Baldwin’s gun — which was supposed to contain only dummy rounds — and did not notice that she loaded a live round.

Later in the interview, Gutierrez Reed described her process for checking to make sure that rounds are dummies. Most dummies on the set rattled when shaken — a safety feature indicating that they could not be fired.

“I am shaking all of them most of the time,” Gutierrez Reed said.

Prosecutor Kari Morrissey underscored that comment — “most of the time” — for the jury.

To prove involuntary manslaughter, prosecutors will have to show beyond a reasonable doubt that Gutierrez Reed acted with “willful disregard for the safety of others.” If convicted, she faces up to 18 months in prison.

The defense has maintained that Gutierrez Reed was not responsible for bringing the live bullets on set, and has instead pointed the finger at Seth Kenney, who supplied guns and ammo to the production. Kenney is expected to testify next week.

The defense is also expected to put on its case next week. In his opening statement, defense attorney Jason Bowles argued that Gutierrez Reed has been made a “scapegoat” for numerous errors made by the production, Baldwin, and others.

Prosecutors have argued that Gutierrez Reed was unprofessional, often leaving guns and ammunition unsecured and ignoring industry safety protocols.

The jury was shown an earlier police interview on Tuesday, conducted the day of the shooting, at which Gutierrez Reed did not have her lawyer present. She initially indicated that she “should probably” have a lawyer, but later agreed to answer some basic questions.

In that interview, she acknowledged that one of the dummy boxes “might have some wonky ones in it.”

The detectives showed Gutierrez Reed a photo of the lead bullet that had been removed from the shoulder of Joel Souza, the film’s director. She did not identify it as a bullet, saying at first that it appeared to be a blank.

“They’re thinking it could be a live round,” a detective told her.

“Holy fuck,” she responded.

The jury also saw bodycam video from the scene, taken shortly after the shooting, in which Gutierrez Reed appeared stunned and despondent.

The armorer, who was 24 at the time, was seen walking with a detective to the bathroom trailer on the Western set.

“Welcome to the worst day of my life,” she said. Later, Gutierrez Reed asked to be put somewhere away from the other crew, saying she didn’t want to be seen by her co-workers.

“I already feel super bad,” she said. “I just want to get the fuck out of here and never show my face in this industry again.”

On Tuesday morning, the jurors saw graphic photos from Hutchins’ autopsy. The images showed a bullet wound in Hutchins’ right armpit, and a large exit wound in her back. When the images displayed on a computer screen at the defense table, Gutierrez Reed became visibly distressed. She looked away, held the bridge of her nose, and then leaned back to look toward the ceiling.

Heather Jarrell, the state’s medical investigator, testified that the bullet punctured Hutchins’ right lung — a lethal wound — and went through her spinal cord.

The jury also heard from Lucien Haag, a veteran firearms expert who analyzed Baldwin’s Colt .45 and the ammunition for the prosecutors.

Haag testified that the gun was working properly before it was sent to the FBI for analysis. In the course of the FBI testing, an examiner struck the gun with a mallet to see if it would accidentally fire when enough force was applied. The testing broke three components of the gun.

On cross-examination, Haag also testified that the live rounds on set appeared to be “hand loaded” — that is, made by an individual by hand, rather than by a commercial manufacturer.

Baldwin is set to face a trial in July on involuntary manslaughter charges. He has maintained that he did not pull the trigger, and his defense team has raised the question of whether the gun was working properly at the time of the shooting. Baldwin’s defense has also faulted the FBI for breaking the gun.

Baldwin’s local attorney, Heather LeBlanc, was in the audience to witness Tuesday’s testimony, getting a preview of the gun evidence that will likely play a more significant role at his trial.

Gutierrez Reed’s lawyers do not dispute that the gun was functioning properly. Her defense has blamed Baldwin for negligently pulling the trigger while pointing it at Hutchins.

That's not looking good for her. Shaking the round sounds like the only way to tell if it's a dummy or live round. Anything less than checking every round as she loaded it into the gun sounds negligent to me.

[Solauren]

'Most of the Time' might as well be 'not at all'.

I have a rather rare-to-have but extremely serious food allergy. I now read the ingredients list of everything I eat.
(Tomatoes are so damn common in food...). Why? Cause accidently ingesting something from that food group could result in a strong enough reaction to kill me. (My jokes about nature taking pot shots at me have taken a rather dark turn, but that's not the point)

Live Bullets kill. Blank bullets can under the right circumstances. (qv The Crow).
If you are mixing live and blank ammo, you check EVERY SINGLE BULLET, and always make sure funds are fully unloaded and cleaned.

Anything else, Negligence.

[bilateralrope]

We are talking about dummy rounds here, not blanks.

Blanks are designed to give off the muzzle flare and bang, with a minimal projectile that can be lethal under some circumstances. My understanding is that you can tell the difference between them and live rounds by looking at them.

Dummy round are designed to look exactly like a live round. But they are completely inert. They have no gunpowder to ignite.

[Crazedwraith]

The principle remains the same though. You either don't mix them up with live rounds or you check everyone before you use them. Or ideally both.

eta: I mean they had zero need for live ammo on a film set, there's not excuse really for having any on set to start with.

[Zwinmar]

They don't even need live firearms on set, only reason they do is that they don't want to pony up the cash to get ones that look real and just shoot a jet of flame out the end.

[EnterpriseSovereign]

Jury convicts movie armourer of involuntary manslaughter in fatal shooting by Alec Baldwin

A movie weapons supervisor has been convicted of involuntary manslaughter after a cinematographer was shot dead by actor Alec Baldwin during a rehearsal on the set of the Western movie “Rust."

Wednesday's verdict against movie armorer Hannah Gutierrez-Reed assigns new blame in the death of Halyna Hutchins in October 2021.

Baldwin, the lead actor and a co-producer on “Rust,” was indicted by a grand jury in January on a charge of involuntary manslaughter.

He was pointing a gun at Hutchins on a movie set outside Santa Fe, New Mexico, when the gun went off, killing her and wounding director Joel Souza.

Prosecutors alleged Gutierrez-Reed unwittingly brought live ammunition onto the set of “Rust” while flouting basic industry gun-safety guidelines, during a two week trial in Santa Fe, New Mexico.

The involuntary manslaughter charge against Gutierrez-Reed carries a maximum penalty of 18 months in prison and a $5,000 (£3,926) fine.

She had also faced a second charge, of evidence tampering, stemming from accusations that she handed a small bag of possible narcotics to another crew member after the shooting to avoid detection.

The felony charges against Gutierrez-Reed carry a possible sentence of up to three years in prison.

The defendant was ordered to be taken into custody by deputies immediately after the verdict was read in the court.

The proceedings are a preamble to a scheduled trial of Baldwin in July on a single charge of involuntary manslaughter, to which he's pled not guilty.

His trial is in another four months.