Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

Post by Gandalf »

Captain Seafort wrote: 2021-04-10 06:53amOf being the kind of guy you'd want to meet in the pub. The kind of guy who was banging on about CO2 emissions and global warming in the 50s. The kind of guy who was worried about teenagers ending up with a criminal record because of the aggro they were causing out of boredom so he set up the DofE Award. The kind of guy who fought all the way through the war. The kind of guy who was meant to be having lunch with the CO of a Royal Marine Commando in Norway but failed to show up because he'd either brought or borrowed a mess tin and diggers and was eating with and talking to a pair of corporals because he wanted to understand as best he could the perspective from the bottom as well as the top.
As an Indigenous Australian, he'd also likely ask me about cannibalism or whether or not I'm throwing spears. I shudder to think of what he'd say to my Asian friends. Fuck meeting that guy. He's probably great if you're tied up with Britain's image of Glorious Empire or whatever, but not so much at this end.
That's what you're jealous of. You wouldn't be spouting off like an idiot if you weren't.
Odd leap. Funny nonetheless.
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Here's an article that goes into it a bit more:
CNN wrote:Laughed off for years as gaffes, Prince Philip's outbursts complicate his legacy

For many Britons, the defining characteristic of Prince Philip was not his public service or his royal standing, but his propensity to make unscripted, off-the-cuff and sometimes wildly inappropriate comments.

The longest-serving consort in the history of the British monarchy died aged 99 on Friday, leaving behind a lengthy catalog of provocative remarks that cemented his reputation as an outspoken royal, untamed by the family's carefully rehearsed public image.

Viewed charitably, those utterances could be seen as examples of a mischievous British sense of humor.
In 2011, then-Prime Minister David Cameron paid tribute to Philip's wit, saying: "Humor is a great part of British life and we thank the duke for his unique contribution."

But some comments from the prince strayed undeniably into the realm of casual racism.

During a royal visit to China in 1986, for instance, Philip described Beijing as "ghastly" and told British students: "If you stay here much longer you'll all be slitty-eyed."
He also quipped: "If it has four legs and is not a chair, has wings and is not an aeroplane, or swims and is not a submarine, the Cantonese will eat it."

Remarks like those threatened to turn him into a caricature, and the China comments were so ill-judged that they were a scandal even at the time.

But as the years have passed, his reputation has softened and some of his more problematic comments have faded in the collective British memory.

"He was a throwback to old-school racism. Painting him as a benign, cuddly uncle of the nation is simply untrue," said Kehinde Andrews, Professor of Black Studies at Birmingham City University, on Friday.

"When he says things about Chinese people's eyes and chucking spears, it's very ugly and would not be tolerated anywhere else nor from anyone else," Andrews told CNN.

Remarks like those threatened to turn him into a caricature, and the China comments were so ill-judged that they were a scandal even at the time.

But as the years have passed, his reputation has softened and some of his more problematic comments have faded in the collective British memory.

"He was a throwback to old-school racism. Painting him as a benign, cuddly uncle of the nation is simply untrue," said Kehinde Andrews, Professor of Black Studies at Birmingham City University, on Friday.

"When he says things about Chinese people's eyes and chucking spears, it's very ugly and would not be tolerated anywhere else nor from anyone else," Andrews told CNN.

n 1995, Philip riffed on a British stereotype that Scots enjoy a drink, asking a driving instructor in Scotland: "How do you keep the natives off the booze long enough to pass the test?"

He also became an unlikely public voice during the debate over gun control in Britain in the mid-1990s, which broke out after a shooting at Dunblane Primary School in Scotland left 16 dead.

"If a cricketer, for instance, suddenly decided to go into a school and batter a lot of people to death with a cricket bat, which he could do very easily... I mean are you going to ban cricket bats?" he said on BBC radio. It was an extraordinary intervention, as senior royals are expected to remain resolutely apolitical.

Sometimes, a comment from the prince presented royal officials with public relations fires that required rapid extinguishing. He came across as out-of-touch and aloof -- a charge the royals have often faced -- when he told NBC's "Meet the Press" in 1969 that the monarchy was running out of money, and that its members might have to move to smaller premises.

But it was his comments about other nationalities -- often inappropriate, occasionally racist and sometimes made on visits hosted by the nations who were the subject of them -- that most complicate his legacy.

During a 1998 conversation with a British student who had been trekking in Papua New Guinea, Prince Philip asked: "You managed not to get eaten, then?" -- an apparent reference to the historic belief that cannibalism had been practiced on the South Pacific islands.

In 2002, he shocked a Bangladeshi teenager at a London youth club by saying the 14-year-old "looks as if he is on drugs." The same year, he is reported to have asked Australian Aborigines: "Do you still throw spears at each other?"
A year later, the Queen and Prince Philip went to open the Commonwealth Heads of Government Meeting in Nigeria. It was the Queen's first visit in 47 years. Greeted by Nigeria's then-President, Olusegun Obasanjo, who was wearing traditional robes, Philip quipped: "You look like you're ready for bed."

In 2009, at a Buckingham Palace reception to honor 400 influential British Indians, he told an executive named Atul Patel: "There's a lot of your family here tonight," after seeing his name badge. Patel is a common family name in India.
Since Philip's death was announced, some on social media have argued that his more problematic remarks should not be dismissed.

"Many of the same people who were having conversations about Prince Philip's history of racism and colonialism are now saying we should also mourn him," Frederick Joseph, an American writer whose book about his experiences with racism was published last year, tweeted on Friday.

And the timing of the duke's death, just weeks after the royal family became embroiled in a row over racism following an interview given by the Duke and Duchess of Sussex to Oprah Winfrey, has added to the intensity of debate.
Egyptian-American commentator Mona Eltahawy called the blanket news coverage of Philip's death "ridiculous," saying he belonged to an institution "which colonized and pillaged so extensively."

Other online users, meanwhile, resurfaced a 2017 Al Jazeera opinion piece by Hamid Dabashi, Professor of Iranian studies and comparative literature at Columbia University, which concluded: "There is a beautiful barbarity of truth to Prince Philip's racism, exposing the ugly hypocrisy at the very foundation of 'Western civilisation.'"

The prince himself once noted his expertise in "dontopedalogy -- the science of opening your mouth and putting your foot in it" -- something, he said, he had "practiced for a good many years."
Are those people jealous too?
Solauren wrote: 2021-04-10 07:48amHer Royal Majesty is not allowed voice an opinion on, or do anything political.
Returning them to their rightful owners is seen as political.
Therefore, she can't do shit about it.
So is sitting on the throne, in fancy clothes with gems looted from every corner of the British Empire. That seems a strong endorsement of the whole monarchy, which is political.
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That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Solauren wrote: 2021-04-10 07:48amHer Royal Majesty is not allowed voice an opinion on, or do anything political.
Returning them to their rightful owners is seen as political.
Therefore, she can't do shit about it.
So is sitting on the throne, in fancy clothes with gems looted from every corner of the British Empire. That seems a strong endorsement of the whole monarchy, which is political.
The Royal family is no longer political in the traditional sense. And hasn't been for a long time.

They can't voice their own opinions on political topics, or do things that are political in nature, accept as allowed by the elected offices of the british government. They have no legal authority. They're a political tool, not a political force. They're entire lives are regulated (and regulated badly if the interview that Prince Harry and Meghan gave is any indication), and controlled.

For all intents and purposes, in terms of what they can and can not do, they might as well be well paid public servants that gave up a bunch of their rights for their positions.

For comparison, let's take me.
I work for the Canadian Federal Government, and while I have to be careful about what I say on certain topics, (especially at work when speaking to the general public, but that's a given with most jobs)
I am allowed to have my own opinion and state it in public. Members of the Royal family are not.
I am allowed to voice my concerns in public. Members of the Royal family are not.
I am allowed to say stuff like "In my opinion, Justin Trudeau is an idiot." Members of the Royal family are not.
I can choose to run for political office. Members of the Royal family are not.
I can have my own business/legal enterprises. Members of the Royal family are not.
I can give my property and money away to whomever I want. Members of the Royal family are not.


So, please, explain to me how a person, or group of people, who's lives are essentially that of show-animals, without any political rights, have the authority to return anything owned by the British Government to anyone.
I've been asked why I still follow a few of the people I know on Facebook with 'interesting political habits and view points'.

It's so when they comment on or approve of something, I know what pages to block/what not to vote for.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Solauren wrote: 2021-04-10 11:49amThe Royal family is no longer political in the traditional sense. And hasn't been for a long time.

They can't voice their own opinions on political topics, or do things that are political in nature, accept as allowed by the elected offices of the british government. They have no legal authority. They're a political tool, not a political force. They're entire lives are regulated (and regulated badly if the interview that Prince Harry and Meghan gave is any indication), and controlled.

For all intents and purposes, in terms of what they can and can not do, they might as well be well paid public servants that gave up a bunch of their rights for their positions.

For comparison, let's take me.
I work for the Canadian Federal Government, and while I have to be careful about what I say on certain topics, (especially at work when speaking to the general public, but that's a given with most jobs)
I am allowed to have my own opinion and state it in public. Members of the Royal family are not.
I am allowed to voice my concerns in public. Members of the Royal family are not.
I am allowed to say stuff like "In my opinion, Justin Trudeau is an idiot." Members of the Royal family are not.
I can choose to run for political office. Members of the Royal family are not.
I can have my own business/legal enterprises. Members of the Royal family are not.
I can give my property and money away to whomever I want. Members of the Royal family are not.

So, please, explain to me how a person, or group of people, who's lives are essentially that of show-animals, without any political rights, have the authority to return anything owned by the British Government to anyone.
In 2010, Prince William announced that he would return Pemulwuy's skull, so they clearly have some ability to do something.

The point I was making is that the very act of sitting on a throne is political. Wielding the sceptre is political. Those acts are political because they serve as an endorsement of the trappings of empire and monarchy. So the wacky royals are a political people already.
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Her Royal Majesty is not allowed voice an opinion on, or do anything political.
Returning them to their rightful owners is seen as political.
Therefore, she can't do shit about it.
Bullshit. What are they going to do, drag her out of Buckingham palace in chains for speaking her mind in public? If they did, how would the people react?
I'm not defending him, and you 'moved the goal posts' as it concerns a specific point on the Royal Families 'wealth'.
Almost all of their wealth is illgotten. To not return it is evil. End of discussion you royal ass-kissing lickspittle.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Gandalf wrote: 2021-04-10 08:59am
Captain Seafort wrote: 2021-04-10 06:53amOf being the kind of guy you'd want to meet in the pub. The kind of guy who was banging on about CO2 emissions and global warming in the 50s. The kind of guy who was worried about teenagers ending up with a criminal record because of the aggro they were causing out of boredom so he set up the DofE Award. The kind of guy who fought all the way through the war. The kind of guy who was meant to be having lunch with the CO of a Royal Marine Commando in Norway but failed to show up because he'd either brought or borrowed a mess tin and diggers and was eating with and talking to a pair of corporals because he wanted to understand as best he could the perspective from the bottom as well as the top.
As an Indigenous Australian, he'd also likely ask me about cannibalism or whether or not I'm throwing spears. I shudder to think of what he'd say to my Asian friends. Fuck meeting that guy. He's probably great if you're tied up with Britain's image of Glorious Empire or whatever, but not so much at this end.
That's what you're jealous of. You wouldn't be spouting off like an idiot if you weren't.
Odd leap. Funny nonetheless.
The guy was an asshole in a lot of ways; at the same time he was nowhere near the level of Hitler and other monsters, and things like the Duke of Edinburgh Award are a positive. He was also apparently one of the few who was nice to Meghan.

Frankly hating the royals isn't worth the energy; they're a bunch of geriatric fossils with no real power.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Almost all of their wealth is illgotten. To not return it is evil. End of discussion you royal ass-kissing lickspittle.
I'm all for returning cultural artifacts to their source country/regions, or arranging suitable compensation if that return is not feasible (source region doesn't want it/source region aboved experts says it's not safe to move it), and I think it should be done. However, I firmly believe that is the call of the actual British government, not the Royal family/Crown.
n 2010, Prince William announced that he would return Pemulwuy's skull, so they clearly have some ability to do something.
Which, I agree, was the right thing to do.

BUT....
While he did agree to take up the search for it (note: Bullshit they needed to 'search' for it, they probably knew where it was stored and just needed to find the right crate), but did he need the British Governments approval to do so and then return it?
I've been asked why I still follow a few of the people I know on Facebook with 'interesting political habits and view points'.

It's so when they comment on or approve of something, I know what pages to block/what not to vote for.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Solauren wrote: 2021-04-10 05:41pm Which, I agree, was the right thing to do.

BUT....
While he did agree to take up the search for it (note: Bullshit they needed to 'search' for it, they probably knew where it was stored and just needed to find the right crate), but did he need the British Governments approval to do so and then return it?
Beats me. But saying such a thing when returning of items to their rightful owners is such a hugely political issue might be considered a political act, yes?
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

Post by Zaune »

It's also literally illegal for the British Museum to return anything, including items we confiscated from Nazi officials in occupied Europe.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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LadyTevar wrote: 2021-04-09 02:01pm I know HRM feels right now. Half of herself is gone. Her rock.
I wonder if she'll abdicate now.
QEII will never abdicate. No more than Queen Victoria ever did.
Crazedwraith wrote: 2021-04-09 07:15am Breaking news. Not exactly surprising at that age but well can't help but think Elizabeth herself won't last much longer either.
Not at her age, no - if she's still alive in 2030 it will be remarkable.

I do have some sympathy for her being a new widow. I've been there and it totally sucks, and all her wealth and privilege won't save her from grief. I also expect she'll cope somehow and return to royal duties as she has been doing them as soon as possible. I suspect she was informed he was near the end before the rest of us were and had some time to prepare herself, even if that's never really adequate.
Gandalf wrote: 2021-04-09 08:45am I can't wait to see the hagiography in the coming days, using every euphemism to avoid calling him the piece of shit that he was.
Yes, I'm told he had some redeeming qualities but I don't recall seeing/hearing of them myself. Probably just as well he spent his life in Liz's shadow.

He may well have been kind to his family and friends, but as I am neither I haven't seen that. I'm told he was involved in a lot of charities, but you don't have to be a saint to do that. Whether or not assisting the queen for 70+ years and helping to produce an heir to the throne is a good thing depends on how you view the monarchy (as an American, I view that as Britain's business/problem, not mine).

Most likely he was a mix of bad and good like every other human being.

He was unusual in being a man who was famous because of who his wife is - a gender flip on the usual roles.
Zaune wrote: 2021-04-09 04:20pm He was an old curmudgeon with no verbal filter to speak of, but that happens to people at his time of life.
Yes, but he seems to have been that from an early age, it's not something that happened recently.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Broomstick wrote: 2021-04-12 05:13am
Gandalf wrote: 2021-04-09 08:45amHe may well have been kind to his family and friends, but as I am neither I haven't seen that. I'm told he was involved in a lot of charities, but you don't have to be a saint to do that. Whether or not assisting the queen for 70+ years and helping to produce an heir to the throne is a good thing depends on how you view the monarchy (as an American, I view that as Britain's business/problem, not mine).
Weirdly, the monarchy isn't just a British thing. The Queen is Australia's head of state too, despite their sole association with Australia being inherited from the British Empire. It's annoying seeing some monarch whenever I handle a coin, and as it's an ongoing reminder of the white supremacy which built this place on the graves of those they ethnically cleansed.
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

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"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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::: Looks at a handful of American money :::

Washington... slave owner
Jefferson... slave owner and slave fucker
Jackson... slave owner, perpetrator of genocide

Yep, plenty of White Supremacy here, too.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. - John F. Kennedy

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Broomstick wrote: 2021-04-12 05:13am
Gandalf wrote: 2021-04-09 08:45am I can't wait to see the hagiography in the coming days, using every euphemism to avoid calling him the piece of shit that he was.
Yes, I'm told he had some redeeming qualities but I don't recall seeing/hearing of them myself. Probably just as well he spent his life in Liz's shadow.

He may well have been kind to his family and friends, but as I am neither I haven't seen that. I'm told he was involved in a lot of charities, but you don't have to be a saint to do that. Whether or not assisting the queen for 70+ years and helping to produce an heir to the throne is a good thing depends on how you view the monarchy (as an American, I view that as Britain's business/problem, not mine).

Most likely he was a mix of bad and good like every other human being.

He was unusual in being a man who was famous because of who his wife is - a gender flip on the usual roles.
I read the BBC News, and they've been doing a lot of Opinion and other Articles on him and his questionable actions. They've been building a very interesting portrait of him.
Everyone should go take a read, imho: Prince Philip Overview
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Broomstick wrote: 2021-04-12 05:23pm ::: Looks at a handful of American money :::

Washington... slave owner
Jefferson... slave owner and slave fucker
Jackson... slave owner, perpetrator of genocide

Yep, plenty of White Supremacy here, too.
1899

LOL of course they fucked it up

He is the only Native American depicted on U.S. paper money, but the picture caused ill will as the Series 1899 $5 Silver Certificate pictured Running Antelope as a chief wearing a Pawnee head dress as the original Sioux head dress was too tall for the engraving.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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There's the Sacagawea dollar coin... which as many people have wanted gone and forgotten as celebrated.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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Broomstick wrote: 2021-04-13 04:35am There's the Sacagawea dollar coin... which as many people have wanted gone and forgotten as celebrated.
I don't even think they're minting the Sacagawea coin anymore. I think people collected it and never spent it -- although there was the story of several Scadians who took "goin coins" to Pennsic to spend. They found out quickly why paper won out over coin. A pouch of coins is HEAVY.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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We still get Sacagaweas at work - the record in one day was over 30. But not a daily occurrence. They certainly exist and some are still in circulation.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

Post by GuppyShark »

Interesting. We use A$1 and A$2 coins here before we switch to notes for the A$5. I wonder if there's some sort of psychological threshold between 'change' and 'money' that explains why pennies and the US$1 bill are still in circulation, whereas our smallest are the 5c coin and A$5 note respectively.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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GuppyShark wrote: 2021-04-14 05:51am Interesting. We use A$1 and A$2 coins here before we switch to notes for the A$5. I wonder if there's some sort of psychological threshold between 'change' and 'money' that explains why pennies and the US$1 bill are still in circulation, whereas our smallest are the 5c coin and A$5 note respectively.
That, and the vending machine lobby has deep pockets. They have to, to hold all those coins.

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

Post by Solauren »

Raw Shark wrote: 2021-04-14 09:26am
GuppyShark wrote: 2021-04-14 05:51am Interesting. We use A$1 and A$2 coins here before we switch to notes for the A$5. I wonder if there's some sort of psychological threshold between 'change' and 'money' that explains why pennies and the US$1 bill are still in circulation, whereas our smallest are the 5c coin and A$5 note respectively.
That, and the vending machine lobby has deep pockets. They have to, to hold all those coins.
Canada ditched the penny some time ago.
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

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... and yet Canadian pennies are still something we commonly see at my place of employment, 500 km from the Canadian border.
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Jub
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

Post by Jub »

Broomstick wrote: 2021-04-14 10:44am ... and yet Canadian pennies are still something we commonly see at my place of employment, 500 km from the Canadian border.
Probably because there's been no effort to remove them from circulation. They spend the same as a US penny so why go through the effort of culling just the Canadian ones?
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

Post by Solauren »

Broomstick wrote: 2021-04-14 10:44am ... and yet Canadian pennies are still something we commonly see at my place of employment, 500 km from the Canadian border.
Stores and banks don't take them anymore, so we spend them in the States :)
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

Post by Rogue 9 »

LadyTevar wrote: 2021-04-13 01:17pm
Broomstick wrote: 2021-04-13 04:35am There's the Sacagawea dollar coin... which as many people have wanted gone and forgotten as celebrated.
I don't even think they're minting the Sacagawea coin anymore. I think people collected it and never spent it -- although there was the story of several Scadians who took "goin coins" to Pennsic to spend. They found out quickly why paper won out over coin. A pouch of coins is HEAVY.
I do that to this day, or would if we weren't shut down. :P
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Re: Prince Philip, Duke Of Edinburgh dies aged 99

Post by LadyTevar »

Rogue 9 wrote: 2021-04-14 07:09pm
LadyTevar wrote: 2021-04-13 01:17pm
Broomstick wrote: 2021-04-13 04:35am There's the Sacagawea dollar coin... which as many people have wanted gone and forgotten as celebrated.
I don't even think they're minting the Sacagawea coin anymore. I think people collected it and never spent it -- although there was the story of several Scadians who took "goin coins" to Pennsic to spend. They found out quickly why paper won out over coin. A pouch of coins is HEAVY.
I do that to this day, or would if we weren't shut down. :P
I'm not going to any of the big Wars this year, too big a risk. But I'd still love a local event sometime soon. :(
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