JMS: "Reboot the franchise"

FedRebel · Post by **FedRebel** » 2005-06-06 05:07pm

http://trekweb.com/articles/2005/06/06/ ... 8aa3.shtml

Thoughts?

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2005-06-06 05:12pm

Wasn't he already blabbering about that several months ago, or is he just repeating himself for attention?

The Guid · Post by **The Guid** » 2005-06-06 05:17pm

Is it me or does ST need to die for a while now? Like Dr. Who did.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2005-06-06 05:18pm

Well, if he loves the original series, and if he was brought on board, I think it might be the best we could hope for. Better that than to try and carry on with the muddied waters of the TNG era. I just wish that if it does come to pass, that he recognizes and adopts the aesthetics of the movie-era.

I found this tidbit more fascinating, though:

Right now, there are no plans for B5 for film, television, or books, according to the creator.

EDIT: Oh, and I also hope that he recognizes the aesthetics of the older movie era, with the quality bridge, and not the horribly generic bridges of ST5 and (to a lesser degree) ST6.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2005-06-06 05:18pm

And if it comes back, it shouldn't have farting Klingons, like Doctor Who did.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2005-06-06 05:20pm

The Guid wrote:Is it me or does ST need to die for a while now? Like Dr. Who did.

Yes it does. And not 2-3 years like B&B seemed to have been saying, but more like ten. Star Trek needs to be dead until at least 2015 until they even think about bringing it back to television.

The Guid · Post by **The Guid** » 2005-06-06 05:22pm

Stofsk wrote:And if it comes back, it shouldn't have farting Klingons, like Doctor Who did.

At least the Slaveen had a reason for being so ridiculous.

Crazedwraith · Post by **Crazedwraith** » 2005-06-06 05:24pm

Only if they get Bob and Glitch. Sorri bad joke. More seriously though wiping out VOY + ENT can only be good news if if does wipe some decent stuff to.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2005-06-06 05:26pm

The Guid wrote:
Stofsk wrote:And if it comes back, it shouldn't have farting Klingons, like Doctor Who did.
At least the Slaveen had a reason for being so ridiculous.

A ridiculous reason is still ridiculous.

[EDIT] And not much of a reason either, I might add.

In any case, I find it sad and interesting that JMS is hopeful he'll get the job. But he is right, no one currently at the helm of the franchise has any clue as to what ST is about.

[EDIT] Hell, some FANS don't know what ST is about either. I think it's had it's fair chance to shine, time to let it go.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2005-06-06 05:54pm

Stofsk wrote:And if it comes back, it shouldn't have farting Klingons, like Doctor Who did.

Boo Hoo. Dr Who is now, and has always been, aimed at the 10-13 year old audience. Fart jokes work there. Grin. Bear it. Be glad they've put stuff in for the adults. Frankly, I did not find the Raxacoricofallapatorians so bad. If you think they're bad, watch some of the low points of old Dr Who. They do not plumb the depths of say, Destiny of the Daleks, I will then be willing to accept your repentance, when you inevitably realise that they're not so bad, I'll take Raxacoricofallapatorians, with some measure of depth, but some cringeworthy fart jokes, over Movellans. With... With nothing but crap hair cuts.. And verisimiltude obliterating brains-on-their-belts.

In any case, I hope JMS is kept the hell away from ST. He shot his creative wad on B5, and has produced increasingly turgid drivel ever since.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2005-06-06 08:03pm

NecronLord wrote: In any case, I hope JMS is kept the hell away from ST. He shot his creative wad on B5, and has produced increasingly turgid drivel ever since.

I dunno, his recent Marvel stuff has been pretty good.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2005-06-06 09:12pm

Ender wrote:
NecronLord wrote: In any case, I hope JMS is kept the hell away from ST. He shot his creative wad on B5, and has produced increasingly turgid drivel ever since.
I dunno, his recent Marvel stuff has been pretty good.

And what I've seen of Jeremiah was pretty good too.

Nephtys · Post by **Nephtys** » 2005-06-06 10:15pm

NecronLord wrote:In any case, I hope JMS is kept the hell away from ST. He shot his creative wad on B5, and has produced increasingly turgid drivel ever since.

...and this is worse than where ST is headed anyway how? Even at the bottom of JMS's crap pile, if you excuse perhaps LotRangers, it beats Voyager and Enterprise pretty hands down. I'd far, far rather have one more season of some Crusade-analogue than a whole new Trek show pushing on for another six years with a Voyager formula.

Coalition · Post by **Coalition** » 2005-06-06 10:24pm

I vote for giving him 2 years just writing up the story. Give him a few engineers to figure out the basic problems that could exist, and a lot of room.

With ~2 years to work on it, I figure he could design an 8 year arc for a Star Trek series. Get a few good reviewers to spot the holes in it, and that would hook me. Each episode is a story, each season is a story, and the whole is a story.

That would be the way to show Paramount. B&B got up to 7 seasons with DS9 and Voyager, and only 4 seasons with Enterprise. An eight season crowd drawing story, making us ask tough questions, with an involving story.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2005-06-06 10:28pm

Unless JMS reached down into the depths of the 70's-era published fanfiction (read: those godawful books where every other author masturbated furiously to the thought of Vulcan strength and Vulcan mental superiority and Vulcan blah, blah, blah) and plucked out some of the truly heinous plots, if he means what he says when he says he's a fan of the original series, I can't see him doing to Trek what happened to B5; namely, the series spiralling deeper and deeper into "fantasy" (as a genre) storytelling.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2005-06-06 10:30pm

Nephtys wrote:
NecronLord wrote:In any case, I hope JMS is kept the hell away from ST. He shot his creative wad on B5, and has produced increasingly turgid drivel ever since.
...and this is worse than where ST is headed anyway how? Even at the bottom of JMS's crap pile, if you excuse perhaps LotRangers, it beats Voyager and Enterprise pretty hands down. I'd far, far rather have one more season of some Crusade-analogue than a whole new Trek show pushing on for another six years with a Voyager formula.

And I'd rather have something that's, oh I don't know, actually GOOD rather than shit that's merely better.

Thirdfain · Post by **Thirdfain** » 2005-06-06 11:10pm

Come off it, Spanky. JMS has his bad moments, and he has his weaknesses as a writer and director- sometimes glaringly so- but Babylon 5 was probably the best SF story arc show in the last decade, and perhaps the best in the history of television. He's sure as fuck a million times better than anyone Star Trek has ever seen.

Shit? Hell, no. B5 was good TV.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2005-06-06 11:13pm

Shit? Hell, no. B5 was good TV.

On this at least, I can agree. B5 overall was a hell of a lot better than any ST series after TNG (and it even one-uped TNG in terms of overall story, although the Enterprise-D and her crew still hold a special place in my heart.)

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2005-06-06 11:43pm

Thirdfain wrote:Come off it, Spanky. JMS has his bad moments, and he has his weaknesses as a writer and director- sometimes glaringly so- but Babylon 5 was probably the best SF story arc show in the last decade, and perhaps the best in the history of television. He's sure as fuck a million times better than anyone Star Trek has ever seen.

Shit? Hell, no. B5 was good TV.

My comment wasn't directed exclusively towards JMS, but to the Trekker mentality that "any/slightly better Trek is better than no Trek at all," rather than desiring Trek that's actually good rather than being marginally better. Actually, it really had nothing to do with JMS.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2005-06-07 12:13am

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:
Thirdfain wrote:Come off it, Spanky. JMS has his bad moments, and he has his weaknesses as a writer and director- sometimes glaringly so- but Babylon 5 was probably the best SF story arc show in the last decade, and perhaps the best in the history of television. He's sure as fuck a million times better than anyone Star Trek has ever seen.

Shit? Hell, no. B5 was good TV.
My comment wasn't directed exclusively towards JMS, but to the Trekker mentality that "any/slightly better Trek is better than no Trek at all," rather than desiring Trek that's actually good rather than being marginally better. Actually, it really had nothing to do with JMS.

And you'll have to forgive us if we don't immediately read your mind when you quote a post about JMS. My telepathic powers aren't really working that well lately.

As for the future of Trek, yes it should wait until there is actually something with real merit. But Spanky, some of us might not get the show we want. And you're free to not like JMS's work but at least consider that some of us might like that work and thus want to see him take a crack at Star Trek.

And even you have got to admit that his worst works was still heads and shoulders above the average of Enteprise and Voyager.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2005-06-07 12:39am

My problem is that even though JMS' worst may be regarded as superior to the "best" of recent Star Trek, it is still frankly rather mediocre television. And mediocre isn't good enough for me to watch. Therefore I don't think it's worth taking an immediate risk right now or in a couple years to find out what JMS could do with the franchise.

In ten years time, maybe with JMS, maybe someone else, but I would rather give the franchise the time it frankly needs to eventually regain the level of quality it hasn't had since 1991 or earlier. I am personally willing to wait as long as it needs to take to reach such a level in quality.

While I will be honest and state right out that I personally don't think JMS is the right man for the job, what I am and have been saying aren't centered exclusively towards him or his output.

Thirdfain · Post by **Thirdfain** » 2005-06-07 12:41am

Hell, JMS's best work leaves Star Trek's best crying in the dust. JMS's worst isn't as bad as Trek's worst.

Babylon 5 was good television. Hell, if B5 was mediocre, then Star Trek wasn't worth the plastic it was filmed on.

The Grim Squeaker · Post by **The Grim Squeaker** » 2005-06-07 01:59am

Is it me or does ST need to die for a while now?

Actually well need to wait a bit more than a 10 years,
after all ST X is coming out in a few years and considering the escalating level of quality in the past films it should beat out Battlefield: earth for Sci fi of the century

.

Nephtys · Post by **Nephtys** » 2005-06-07 02:01am

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:My problem is that even though JMS' worst may be regarded as superior to the "best" of recent Star Trek, it is still frankly rather mediocre television. And mediocre isn't good enough for me to watch. Therefore I don't think it's worth taking an immediate risk right now or in a couple years to find out what JMS could do with the franchise.

In ten years time, maybe with JMS, maybe someone else, but I would rather give the franchise the time it frankly needs to eventually regain the level of quality it hasn't had since 1991 or earlier. I am personally willing to wait as long as it needs to take to reach such a level in quality.

While I will be honest and state right out that I personally don't think JMS is the right man for the job, what I am and have been saying aren't centered exclusively towards him or his output.

Agreed on all counts here. I love B5 to death, but I don't see JMS as the type for this kinda deal. ST does need a decade long break, and perhaps after other shows succeed, they may figure out why stuff like B5 and SG-1 and BSG are watchable. here's a clue: It's not budgets and endless inconsequencial episodes with enemy-of-the-week +1. So yep, it just needs a total reconstruct.

Soulman · Post by **Soulman** » 2005-06-07 01:51pm

Wait until Stargate finishes and get the Stargate writers and Joss Whedon to do it, then we might get something that is good enough. I don't think JMS is suited to writing a new TOS, something closer to SG-1 and Firefly (in terms of wirting not story)would be the best.