StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Well, the wife is away, and i was bored.... so i went out and plunked down my hard earned cash for the directors cut of The Wrath of Khan. I was pleasantly reminded of why this movie stands second only to Return of the Jedi in the heirarchy of great sci-fi films. Some observations:

The ILM models have such a better look. They have a tangeble feel that you don't get with the over used cgi of today.

Kirste Alley: Greatest. Redshirt. EVER.

Ricardo Montalbahn is one evil sonofabitch. This is what a villian is supposed to be. He has is history and texture and depth! Not a 2-dimensional angry cut-out *cough* shinzon *cough*

DeForest Kelley, i feel, bridges the gap between the current world and the 22nd century fantasy world. He has has warmth and charm, and old world values that you can identify with. That keeps the cast grounded..... there is none of that in TNG, Voyager Enterprise or even the new Trilogy.

The 'you're only as old as you feel' sentiment is nice. As is the interplay between Kirk and Spock at the end of the film... you feel the loss along with Kirk.

Granted there are some plot glitches 'the only ship in the quadrant' bit and the continuity is a tad...shall we say 'bumpy' but i say Harve Bennett and Nicholas Meyer are men of brilliance next to Berman and Bragga.

Yes The Wrath of Kahn is one of the greatest movies in Sci-Fi. It has it on so many levels.

Revenge, anger and one of the most inovative battle sequences ever filmed(in the Mutara Nebula). Also the Death of Spock at the end was just so well done. I mean we all cried along with Kirk during the scene. The truth was it took this movie to get Star trek off the ground as it did not make enough money to justfy continueing from the first movie. TWOK gave star Trek the monatary background and foundation to survive until now. One has to onder how long the money can last before it finally runs out.

Col. Crackpot wrote: snipity snip

So, um, whats in the directors cut thats not in the original. I only have STII in the first edition video.

I've been thinking about this, and Wrath of Kahn is, I believe, the only one of all of the Star Trek films where the villain actually gets his personal revenge, in the end, Kahn causes the death of Spock, Kirk's nearest and dearest, sort of the last harpoon in the side of the white whale thing , pardon the reference, but it's the only film to do it, and is widely hailed as the best of the bunch. Do you think this is because the badguy scores a win even at the cost of his own life, and the film isnt just a happy film of fluffy bunny's when the Federation pulls through again, or is it just superior because it is, if you follow me?

*minor spoiler*
Oh, I suppose you could say that Nemesis had this, but they take that away by bringing in B4 as the pacifier at the end.
*minor spoiler*

Knife wrote:So, um, whats in the directors cut thats not in the original. I only have STII in the first edition video.

Well, the inspection scene is longer, and the engineering cadet (I forget his name) actually gets fleshed out a little. There's more to the scene in sickbay after he dies, too. I think there were a couple of other things. It doesn't really stand out in my memory because the included scenes look like they belong there.

The_Lumberjack wrote:Do you think this is because the badguy scores a win even at the cost of his own life, and the film isnt just a happy film of fluffy bunny's when the Federation pulls through again, or is it just superior because it is, if you follow me?

The movie is very kick-ass on its own, but this helps too. I love to see a movie where the ending isn't happy-happy, but realistic. Yes, you won. But your ship is trashed, your friends are dead, and the survivors aren't the same as they were beforehand. I think the ending was cheapened a bit by Spock coming back though.

they seemed to have tweaked the effects a little. a few scenes are longer and there is an entire disc with interviews, a behid the scenes special on ILM and the making of the film, theatrical trailers, shit like that. I think the cashier at walmart fucked up though, becuase i paid $25 for the movie and a bob marley CD. Seems cheap now that i think about it.

I didn't notice any effects differences, but basically they lengthen some of the scenes, use different cuts of scenes that were already in there (e.g. actor's saying the lines differently) etc.

Cool, I'll have to see about getting it and perhaps III and VI.

The end of TWOK is by far, one of the saddest scenes in movie history.

Aya wrote:The end of TWOK is by far, one of the saddest scenes in movie history.

Shit yeah. Giving Spock such a dignified and meaningful exit was immensely moving.

Does anyone else think that the ending was cheapened, somewhat, by STIII? Although I actually like STIII, I was a little disappointed by it. Still, for an "odd-number" movie it is actually better than the others.

Stofsk wrote:

Aya wrote:The end of TWOK is by far, one of the saddest scenes in movie history.

Shit yeah. Giving Spock such a dignified and meaningful exit was immensely moving.

Does anyone else think that the ending was cheapened, somewhat, by STIII? Although I actually like STIII, I was a little disappointed by it. Still, for an "odd-number" movie it is actually better than the others.

I'll forgive them for Star Trek VI It did cheapen it slightly, but the important thing is that they didnt cheapen it in TWOK, which is what they did with Nemesis, that's why TWOK can stand on its own as well, as it does the personal loss thing and mixed ending very very well.

Aya wrote:The end of TWOK is by far, one of the saddest scenes in movie history.

In the special feature interviews, they reveal that TWOK originally ended with Spock's death. None of the "I feel... young" stuff at the end, none of the Nimoy narration.

It was Harve Bennett talking about it, and the horror that he felt came through the interview... he said people walked out of that preview like they would walk out of a funeral, and that the Star Trek franchise would probably have died if they ended the movie like that.

Personally, I love the interviews. I think they're great.

Uraniun235 wrote:

Aya wrote:The end of TWOK is by far, one of the saddest scenes in movie history.

In the special feature interviews, they reveal that TWOK originally ended with Spock's death. None of the "I feel... young" stuff at the end, none of the Nimoy narration.

It was Harve Bennett talking about it, and the horror that he felt came through the interview... he said people walked out of that preview like they would walk out of a funeral, and that the Star Trek franchise would probably have died if they ended the movie like that.

Personally, I love the interviews. I think they're great.

even that of the bearded wierdo talking about his Eugenics wars books?

Yes all you said and more CC is why I consider ST2 the best of the Trek.

And honestly the riposte between Kirk and Khan was the best of the series. I mean how can you beat:

Kirk: And like any poor marksman, Khan, you...keep...missing...the...target.

Seriously the film had some perfect moments, an ending that was bittersweet, and whole chockful of intelligence(yeah there was some stupid bits but as a whole not nearly as much as many other movies).

Col. Crackpot wrote:even that of the bearded wierdo talking about his Eugenics wars books?

Okay, all but one. I have yet to sit through that interview in it's entirety.

Col. Crackpot wrote:even that of the bearded wierdo talking about his Eugenics wars books?

I watched that one at 6 AM when I had stayed up all night, going through my DVD collection...


Is Meyer's commentary any good?

The dialogue in TWOK was brilliant.

“We were immobilized, Captain Spock said it would be two days!” - Savik
“Come now Savik, you of all people go by the book.” – Kirk
“By the book?” – Savik
“By the book! Regulation 46A, if transmissions are being monitored during battle--“ - Kirk
“No uncoded messages on an open channel. You lied?!?” - Savik
“I exaggerated.” - Spock
“Hours instead of days, now we have minutes instead of hours. What IS working around here?” - Kirk
“Not much admiral, we have partial main power.” - Spock
“That’s it?” - Kirk
“Best we could do in two hours.” – Spock

"Khan you bloodsucker! You're going to have to do your own dirty work now, do you hear me, DO YOU?"
"Kirk...Kirk, you're still alive my old friend"
"STILL, OLD FRIEND! You've managed to kill just about everyone else. But like a poor marksman YOU KEEP MISSING THE TARGET!"
"Perhaps I no longer need to try Admiral."
"Khan...Khan, you've got Genesis, but you don't have me. You're going to kill me Khan. You're going to have to come down here. You're going to HAVE to come down here."
"I've done far worse then kill you. I've hurt you, and I wish to go on hurting you. I shall leave you as you left me, as you left her. Marooned for all eternity in the center of a dead planet. Buried alive... Buried alive."
"KHAN! KHAN!"

Star Trek II wasn't a great Trek movie. It was a great movie, period. Even if you hate Star Trek, TWOK is an undeniably excellent film.

EDIT: You'll notice that Kirk and Khan never appeared on the same set at the same time. They always interacted via viewscreens or communicators. Two of the biggest hams in Hollywood can't be physically in the same location at the same time.

Best 25 bucks I ever spent on a DVD,Besides the set I got from mike.