Page 1 of 1
Was Q stacking the deck?
Posted: 2003-11-03 01:50pm
by Stravo
When Q brought the Enterprise to the attention of the Borg and vice versa, he started to a chain of events that have undoubtably favored the Federation.
The Borg menace started a crash course in new starship designs that weren't essentially luxury liners in space (Galaxies). The Battle of WOlf 359 cinched it and the Federation was given one hell of a wake up call.
We see ship designs like the Akira, Defiant, Steamrunners, Sabers, etc born and we see a militarization of the Federation (see uniform changes, growing number of combat craft) and then the Federation defeats the Borg in First Contact, giving them some self confidence and signalling to the rest of teh AQ that the Federation has undergone a rennaisance. (A sign of the self confidence can be seen in the differences between BOBW and FC. In BOBW the Federation is screaming for help and can't muster more than 39 ships to defend Earth. In FC they meet the cube with an entire fleet and don't ask for help from the Klingons.)
Then comes the Dominion War. The great war machine geared up for the Borg now has the Dominion to deal with and despite initial losses they over come the challenge. Can you imagine how the Dominion War would have gone had the early TNG era Federation faced the Dominion?
With the close of the Dominion War we have a Federation juggernaut in place (much like the position America was in after WWII) and their success seems to be assured into the foreseeable future, all because one ominoptent being who claims to have no interest in the Federation or humanity decided to take the Enterprise for a spin.
Was this part of Q's master plan to stack the deck in the Federation's favor?
Posted: 2003-11-03 01:57pm
by Crazedwraith
Possibly, i think this has been implied in several books.
Q's not Omnisceint though so although he may have meant to give the Feds a "wake up call" we dont know if he intended this to help against the dominion or simply knock them around the head with their own incompetence.
Posted: 2003-11-03 04:28pm
by RedImperator
I don't think Q could be bothered to care about the Federation. What he IS interested in is humans, and so long as the survival and freedom of the human species depends on the survival of the Federation, Q will try to stack the deck for it (assuming Stravo's initial hypothesis is correct). Which brings up an interesting question: if Q is interested in the survival of humanity for whatever purpose he has in mind, would he have directly interceded had the Borg or Dominion been more successful, or would he have decided that if humans couldn't overcome that challenge, then he had misjudged their potential and left humanity to its fate?
Posted: 2003-11-03 04:57pm
by Solauren
That's an interesting point.
Here's another one
Remember when Pichard 'died' and Q said 'and I'm God.'
What is Q was really telling the truth and he's the god from the bible etc and did all that to cause huimanity to go the way it did, and is getting back into it to get them back on track?
Posted: 2003-11-03 07:48pm
by Jason von Evil
Good points, Stravo. Anyways, The Federation will definatly be the uncontested super power of the quadrents. The Klingons (according to Martok in an episode of DS9) are busy licking their wounds after the Dominion War, they lost a great deal of ships and men and will need a few decades to recover. The Romulans are also out of the picture, after the Dominion War and Nemesis. I wouldn't be surprised if the Federation exerts a lot of influence on the Romulans as they replace their senate. They won't be puppets, but the Romulans will definatly be kinder to the Federation.
In the Delta Quadrant, different alien species have undoubtly heard of how a single Federation ship spanked the Borg. If the Feds could reach these aliens, they would probably kiss the Feddies asses.
Anyways, you have to wonder why Q cares so much about humanity.
Posted: 2003-11-03 08:21pm
by Chris OFarrell
Your preaty right on Stravo. Q-Who makes a point of this. That the Federation was getting far to arrogant for where it realy was in the universe. That they were expanding too fast, cocky that they would overcome whatever was out there. To quote from Q-Who:
Q
Oh, you may not trust me, but you
do need me. You're not prepared
for what awaits you.
PICARD
I don't know that we are prepared,
but I do know that we are ready
to confront it.
Q
Really?
PICARD
Absolutely. That's why we are
out here.
Q
Oh, the arrogance.
(to Guinan)
They don't have a clue about
what's "out here".
GUINAN
They will learn -- adapt. That's
their great advantage.
Q
They are moving faster than
expected -- farther than they
should.
PICARD
By whose calculation?
Q
You judge yourselves against the
pitiful adversaries you have so
far encountered -- the Klingons,
the Romulans, are nothing compared
to what's waiting.
(MORE)
Q
(continuing)
Picard, you are about to move into
areas of the galaxy containing
wonders more incredible than you
can possibly imagine... and
terrors to freeze your soul. I
offer myself as guide -- only to
be rejected out-of-hand.
RIKER
I guess we'll just have to get
along the best we can without you.
Q
What justifies this smugness?
PICARD
We're not smug -- nor arrogant.
We are resolute and we are
willing. But more than that we
are determined. Your help is not
required.
Q
Well, let's just see how ready
you are.
GUINAN
Q -- don't do this!
And with a snap of his fingers, Q threw the Enterprise right into the path of the Borg. A species that they would not encounter for some time otherwise, without warning or the knowedlge of them that eventualy resulted in their defeat just short of Earth. If Q had NOT done what he did, the Federation would have been assimilated. To expand on this:
Q
Now where's your smugness -- your
arrogance? Do you still believe
you are prepared for what awaits
you? I tried to tell you but
listening has never been one of
your laudable attributes. It
makes me quite happy to now say
-- I told you so.
WORF
The Borg ship is re-establishing
its tractor beam.
RIKER
Lock on photon torpedoes.
WORF
Yes, sir.
DATA
Without our shields -- at this
range there is a high degree of
probability that a photon
detonation could destroy the
Enterprise.
Riker and Picard exchange looks.
RIKER
Prepare to fire.
Q
I'll be leaving now. You
thought you could handle it -- so
handle it.
PICARD
Q. End this.
Q
What makes you think I am either
inclined or capable to terminate
this encounter?
PICARD
If we all die, here and now -- you
will never be able to gloat. You
wanted to frighten us -- we're
frightened. You wanted to show
that we are inadequate -- for the
moment I will grant that. You
want me to say that I need you.
Right now -- I need you.
We would expect Q to smirk, but he doesn't. He gives
Picard a steady look.
And with a little motion.
76 EXT. SPACE - THE ENTERPRISE (OPTICAL)
With the same explosion of speed which got us here -- the
Enterprise is flung back to where it started.
76A INT. MAIN BRIDGE (OPTICAL)
Picard and the others react to the streaking stars on
the viewscreen as they spin.
76B EXT. SPACE - THE ENTERPRISE (OPTICAL)
comes to a stop.
77 INT. MAIN BRIDGE (OPTICAL)
RED ALERT ends.
RIKER
Position.
WESLEY
Zero-seven-six mark two-
two-five -- back where we
started.
Q
That was a difficult admission.
Another man would be humiliated
to say those words. Another man
would die before asking for help.
Picard gives Q a steady look.
PICARD
I understand what you have done
here Q, but the lesson could
have been learned without the
loss of eighteen members of my
crew.
Q
If you can't take a little bloody
nose -- maybe you had better go
back home and crawl under your
bed. It's not safe out here.
It's wondrous -- with treasures
to satiate desires both subtle
and gross -- but it is not for the
timid.
Q leaves in a Q Flash.
................
GUINAN
Q has set a series of events in
motion. Your contact with the
Borg came long before it should.
When you're ready, it might be
possible to establish a
relationship with them, but now
-- now, you are only raw material
to them. And since they are aware
of your existence...
PICARD
They will be coming.
GUINAN
You can depend on it.
PICARD
Q might have done the right thing
for the wrong reason.
GUINAN
Meaning?
PICARD
Perhaps we needed a good kick in
our complacency to get us ready
for what's ahead.
Posted: 2003-11-03 08:45pm
by Jason von Evil
Wow, talk about haunting. Establish a relationship with the Borg?
Posted: 2003-11-03 09:35pm
by JME2
Yeah, I've made that point at:
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic. ... highlight=
and it will also be brought up in my other story, The Best of Both Worlds.
Posted: 2003-11-03 11:44pm
by Iceberg
" If you can't take a little bloody nose -- maybe you had better go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous -- with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross -- but it is not for the timid." - Q
Dear God, how I wish Star Trek's writers had kept that quote under their noses and foremost in their minds over the following decade and a half...
Posted: 2003-11-03 11:49pm
by Alyeska
Q-Who has got to be one of the best episodes in Trek. Q was written brilliantly. Picard was cowed in a way never before. Riker even became less of an ass.
Posted: 2003-11-04 12:17am
by Chris OFarrell
Iceberg wrote:" If you can't take a little bloody nose -- maybe you had better go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous -- with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross -- but it is not for the timid." - Q
Dear God, how I wish Star Trek's writers had kept that quote under their noses and foremost in their minds over the following decade and a half...
You know whats worse?
Janeways quote from one of the last episodes of Voyager:
(After she lost a crewman who she wasn't able to save)
Chakotay: "The urge to explore is pretty powerful."
Janeway "But it can't justify the loss of lives. Whether it's millions..Or just one."
I sware to God, Kirk, Picard, Sisko, every f*#king starfleet Captian should stone her to death for saying that. That line pissed me of SO much when I heard it I almost hit the TV. Its a betrayal of everything that Starfleet and Star Trek stand for!
Posted: 2003-11-04 12:23am
by Jason von Evil
"The needs of the many outway the needs of the few or the one."
Posted: 2003-11-04 12:36am
by Uraniun235
Iceberg wrote:" If you can't take a little bloody nose -- maybe you had better go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous -- with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross -- but it is not for the timid." - Q
Dear God, how I wish Star Trek's writers had kept that quote under their noses and foremost in their minds over the following decade and a half...
Kirk said it better when he said "Risk is our business."
Posted: 2003-11-04 12:58am
by neoolong
Chris OFarrell wrote:Iceberg wrote:" If you can't take a little bloody nose -- maybe you had better go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous -- with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross -- but it is not for the timid." - Q
Dear God, how I wish Star Trek's writers had kept that quote under their noses and foremost in their minds over the following decade and a half...
You know whats worse?
Janeways quote from one of the last episodes of Voyager:
(After she lost a crewman who she wasn't able to save)
Chakotay: "The urge to explore is pretty powerful."
Janeway "But it can't justify the loss of lives. Whether it's millions..Or just one."
I sware to God, Kirk, Picard, Sisko, every f*#king starfleet Captian should stone her to death for saying that. That line pissed me of SO much when I heard it I almost hit the TV. Its a betrayal of everything that Starfleet and Star Trek stand for!
Did Janeway actually end up getting much from the exploration? It didn't seem like they ended up with that much tangible benefits from going around exploring the Delta Quadrant.