StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Why does he never get prometed? Hes on staff mettings hes seeming head of operations department, they demote Tom and Promote and dont promote Harry at all? In SEVEN years? He has the same position a Data Was on te ent-D and hes an ensign???

Also whats with him Dying all the time? he dies like evry other epidsode.
He also gets the suckiest plot lines even by voyages standards.

Notice how practicaly no one got a promotion on the way home. Realisticaly Kim should have been a LT Commander by the time they got home. The ship should have had no one less then the rank of O4 and there should have been a shitload of O5s and O6s onboard with Janeway being the most senior O6. She might even be forced to call herself a Commodore for her seniority.

Why was a Ensign straight from the Academy a senior officer in the first place?

Crazedwraith wrote:Why does he never get prometed?

It's an awkward situation. If you keep promoting people then everybody would be high-ranking officers and the chain of command gets screwy when everybody is almost captain.

Hes on staff mettings hes seeming head of operations department, they demote Tom and Promote and dont promote Harry at all? In SEVEN years? He has the same position a Data Was on te ent-D and hes an ensign???

This was actually discussed in the show. Janeway and Harry both recognize that he should be a lieutenant or maybe a lt. commander by then.

But due to the situation, nobody really gets promoted.

As for Tom, what else are you going to do with your best pilot? It's not like you can just keep him in the brig the whole time like they did with Brad Dourif's character. Especially since Tom has his name in the credits.

Also whats with him Dying all the time? he dies like evry other epidsode.

Because he touches himself at night.

He also gets the suckiest plot lines even by voyages standards.

Many times. Though he does show that he has some depth. Such as wanting to prove himself by commanding that alien ship.

Alyeska wrote:Notice how practicaly no one got a promotion on the way home. Realisticaly Kim should have been a LT Commander by the time they got home. The ship should have had no one less then the rank of O4 and there should have been a shitload of O5s and O6s onboard with Janeway being the most senior O6. She might even be forced to call herself a Commodore for her seniority.

Realisticlly Hary should have been promoted right in the premiere along with the convict and rebels, he was head of deparment and senior crew member. And on a completely un-related note why does tom have pips instead of the bar-and stipes that the other feild comission officers have?

Crazedwraith wrote:And on a completely un-related note why does tom have pips instead of the bar-and stipes that the other feild comission officers have?

Maybe Tom was the only one to ever be in Starfleet. I think the rest either dropped out of the academy or straight-up joined the Maquis.

Long-shot, but hey.

Tom was in Starfleet. He graduated from the Academy, but was booted out after trying to cover up a mistake he amde that led to the death of three officers. He joined the Maquis to fly, but was captured on his first mission. His bio's at Startrek.com.

The Dark wrote:Tom was in Starfleet. He graduated from the Academy, but was booted out after trying to cover up a mistake he amde that led to the death of three officers. He joined the Maquis to fly, but was captured on his first mission. His bio's at Startrek.com.

Robert McNeill's guest appearance on TNG and his character on Voyager are so much alike that I don't get why they couldn't have just merged them.

They both were excellent pilots.
They both tried to cover up their screw ups.
They were both kicked out of Starfleet.

It wouldn't have been that much of a strecth of the imagination. Hell, they were both played by the same actor!

IIRC, that was the original plan. However I've heard that reusing that character would have involved royalties... someone will have to check the episode listings, but that episode might not have been written by a staff writer.

Grand Admiral Thrawn wrote:Why was a Ensign straight from the Academy a senior officer in the first place?

Voyager's senior staff was killed when the ship was transported to the DQ.

Crazedwraith wrote:Also whats with him Dying all the time? he dies like evry other epidsode.

Well, Voyager can't refill staff like other ships, so they must recycle him over and over, poor bastard, seven years as a reshirt.

Crazedwraith wrote:He also gets the suckiest plot lines even by voyages standards.

I don't think there was much really to do with him, his only decent storyline was the ongoing crush on Seven, which had it's moments.

I'd like to mention I actually met Garret Wang a few weeks ago, VERY cool guy.

Edit: Spelling.

Maybe the writers tiptoed around his character because they weren't sure how to write an Asian guy who doesn't know kung-fu. Voyager is run by a very standard Hollywood PC crowd, after all. So he got killed or mangled regularly, and was always there in major events, but never really had much personality about him.

Darth Wong wrote:Maybe the writers tiptoed around his character because they weren't sure how to write an Asian guy who doesn't know kung-fu. Voyager is run by a very standard Hollywood PC crowd, after all. So he got killed or mangled regularly, and was always there in major events, but never really had much personality about him.

Also, when the series first started being written, Wang went to the writers and said he didn't want to be written as an overly Asian character.

"When the series first started, I told the writers I don't want to be going to the mess and ordering chow mein."
That's along the lines of something I read in an interview with him.

Voyager's senior staff was killed when the ship was transported to the DQ.

I liked those guys in the pilot episode. The first officer was better than Chakotay and the real doctor too was better than the EMH. BTW there was a woman in Tuvoks station in the early episodes ? Who was she and what happened to her later ?

Gandalf wrote:

Darth Wong wrote:Maybe the writers tiptoed around his character because they weren't sure how to write an Asian guy who doesn't know kung-fu. Voyager is run by a very standard Hollywood PC crowd, after all. So he got killed or mangled regularly, and was always there in major events, but never really had much personality about him.

Also, when the series first started being written, Wang went to the writers and said he didn't want to be written as an overly Asian character.

Well, there it is then. Once their standard M.O. of "foreign culture" stereotyping was taken away from them, they didn't know what to do so they just wrote him as a completely flat character.

It would have been more interesting if he'd asked them to make him do the opposite of Asian stereotypes. For example, making him a bit clueless with computers but very good with mechanical things, or making him a bit of a lothario with a weak work ethic. Perhaps make him brash and arrogant rather than quiet and self-effacing. Or better yet, make a recurring theme of disciplinary problems revolving around his personal history of sexually harassing female crewmembers.

Wait, he died? Several times? How is that possible?

Wait, he died? Several times? How is that possible?

I seem to remember Wang asking to not be portrayed as overly Asian. Which brings up interesting possibilities. How strong will Asian identity be for anyone in the future not raised inside an Asian country.

ie) I doubt a 8th or 9th generation "asian" raised in what we know as North America will have much connection to his homeland. It is not like I give a rat's ass about my Irish ancestors. Not to mention the reality that most people after a few generations are very mixed racially speaking.

So, it the background of a character in the future even important? I guess it is determined by the social conditions of the universe the writers have created.

Was that double post some kind of joke of was it truely a mistake?

As far a Ensign Kim goes. the fact that they deside to keep resurecting the character made it so that if anything bad happened to poor Kim you knew he would somehow survive in the end and a least I stoped taking it seriously after the first or second time it happened.

HemlockGrey wrote:Wait, he died? Several times? How is that possible?

He got better.

Multiple timelines, time travel, things like that.

TrailerParkJawa wrote:I seem to remember Wang asking to not be portrayed as overly Asian. Which brings up interesting possibilities. How strong will Asian identity be for anyone in the future not raised inside an Asian country.

It's not.

Asian-American identity is different than Asian identity, though there can be some overlap. But when you get further and further away from coming directly from Asia, you lose how "Asian" you are.

ie) I doubt a 8th or 9th generation "asian" raised in what we know as North America will have much connection to his homeland. It is not like I give a rat's ass about my Irish ancestors. Not to mention the reality that most people after a few generations are very mixed racially speaking.

I'm a first generation, or second generation, it depends on how you calculate it, and I and my friends don't adopt specifically Asian traits into our character. It's not something that really matters anymore. It's not like segregation, self-imposed or not, for our generation really happens anymore. Well, except in some cases in Chinatown.

That far down the line, I think he would consider himself just American without having to preface that with Asian, at least for character.

So, it the background of a character in the future even important? I guess it is determined by the social conditions of the universe the writers have created.

It can be. But I don't think it matters too much in terms of stuff like Asian-American vs. European-American.

neoolong wrote:

HemlockGrey wrote:Wait, he died? Several times? How is that possible?

He got better.

Multiple timelines, time travel, things like that.

Just like someone was turned into a Newt!

A Newt?

I got better!

I seriously stopped feeling for poor old Kim after the fourth of fifth time he died or almost died. Made the show even less beleivable to me. In reality if they were trying to get home they would take As few risks as possible but Janeway seems to get them involved with it seems like every war or scermish in the quadrant.

Kim's rank is kept down because he keeps fucking arround with the holodeck. Every time it messes up and nearly kills someone he's in the thick of it. Maybe the computer has it in for him and they have to keep him a junior officer of the computer will REALLY go after him.

neoolong wrote: It's not.

Asian-American identity is different than Asian identity, though there can be some overlap. But when you get further and further away from coming directly from Asia, you lose how "Asian" you are.

Which is why I might see why Ensign Kim might just be an average "North American" in the show. It would be different if say Ensign Kim was from Inchon or something.

I'm a first generation, or second generation, it depends on how you calculate it, and I and my friends don't adopt specifically Asian traits into our character. It's not something that really matters anymore. It's not like segregation, self-imposed or not, for our generation really happens anymore. Well, except in some cases in Chinatown.

My experience is most people in Chinatowns are hard core immigrant who will never assimilate much. That is today's residents of Chinatown. My friends parents came here in the 60's and 70's some ended up in Chinatowns simply because of social conditions at the times. But all ended up in the burbs pretty quickly.

Your experiences are probably a little different than that of my friends. Heck even birth order makes a difference. Almost every first born I know still speaks a decent amount of Cantonese. But the youngest kids are the weakest.

That far down the line, I think he would consider himself just American without having to preface that with Asian, at least for character.

I agree.

It can be. But I don't think it matters too much in terms of stuff like Asian-American vs. European-American.

I would be interested to see how strong local identities are in Star Trek. Are the States still existing as some sort of political entity. Even if it is a local government of the Federation? Race might be so unimportant in places like the North American continent that it is of little importance by then.

Why does Kim never get promoted? Who knows. Why did they promote Janeway to an Admiral and not execute her? Star Fleet is rather stupid these days.