Ok so Trek toys aren't selling well

[Dark Primus]

http://www.trektoday.com/news/220703_01.shtml

By Caillan
July 22, 2003 - 1:00 PM

The decision of several major toy retailers not to stock Art Asylum's latest range of Star Trek products has prompted a group of fans to mount a campaign to urge the companies to change their minds.

Calling themselves 'A Call to Arms', the fans aim to persuade the companies to carry the new Star Trek figure and toy line, in the fear that without sufficient retail support the production of Trek toys will no longer be financially viable.

The new range, due out at the beginning of August, focuses on the original 'Classic' Star Trek series and is comprised of seven inch figures of Kirk, Spock, McCoy, Uhura and Khan. The fans have contacted five major retailers — Toys 'R' Us, Target, KB Toys, Walmart and Kmart — with phone calls, emails and letters to urge them to stock the Classic figures.

"The targeted stores did at one time or another carry Art Asylum's Trek line in the form of products based on Enterprise," the co-presidents of the campaign, which has marshalled at Art Asylum's online message boards, told TrekToday. "Though the quality of the toys is very high and it is a wonderful product, [the Enterprise toys] ultimately didn't sell as expected."

Besides the characters, the Classic line also includes a type-2 phaser (with a removable type-1 included) and a 16-inch model of the USS Enterprise NCC-1701-A, with light and sound effects. "Not carrying the Enterprise-A is a real shame," said represenatives of 'A Call to Arms', "since not only have fans been waiting for this toy to be made, but it is also the first time this particular ship was immortalized in plastic since South Bend's toy was released in 1979."

Toys 'R' Us, KB Toys and Target passed on carrying this new line in stores, although they sold both the Enterprise and Star Trek Nemesis action figures. "It's a shame they didn't stay with us on this line," Art Asylum vice-president Adam Unger told TrekToday. "We had hoped with the excitement behind the launch of the Classic line we would have maintained their support. I feel bad for the fans. Now they really don't have a mass outlet anymore to build their collections and enjoy the fun of heading to their local store to get the new stuff in person."

Two of the companies, Toys 'R' Us and KB Toys, have instead decided to sell the Classic Trek toys online. John Reilly, director of sales promotion and public relations for KB Toys, explained the company's decision to concentrate on Internet sales. "Art Asylum's Star Trek line will be carried on-line at KBtoys.com (the phaser & Enterprise are currently up as presells). The classic Star Trek figures will be available several weeks from now. In our stores, we did carry the first 3 series of Star Trek figures from Art Asylum but have found that they have enjoyed more success as part of our on-line offering."

Art Asylum acquired the Trek toy license in December, 2001, succeeding the Playmates toy company, which had decided not to renew its contract with Viacom at the end of 1999. "Art Asylum is a relatively small and relatively new toy company," the co-presidents of 'A Call to Arms' said. "They have a staff of about 18 incredibly talented and hard working people. Art Asylum landed the Trek license because they wanted to make a truly unique product, at a quality of which has never before been seen in a Trek toy line. Unfortunately, they are fighting an uphill battle with Trek's fan base diminishing, and Enterprise's poor reception at present. Without major retailer support, people will not be able to easily find Trek products, and have to resort to specialty shops and online venues."

The organisers emphasised the campaign is designed to show support for Art Asylum, and in no way criticises the company's efforts to create Trek toys and figures. "Art Asylum feels that the Classic line will either make or break them. Without major retailer support like Toys 'R' Us, Target and Wal-Mart, [we] cannot see the Classic line reaching a mass market, which could ultimately end up with Art Asylum either giving up the license or closing up shop altogether."

While toys from other genre films such as Star Wars, Harry Potter, Spider-Man and The Lord of the Rings are commonplace in toy outlets, Star Trek figures are somewhat harder to find. "The main reason the major retailers are hesitant to carry Trek products is because they still remember the sorry state of affairs when the last company to produce Trek toys lost the license," the co-presidents of 'A Call to Arms' said. "The old stock would not sell, and stayed on store shelves for years. Major retailers are hesitant to carry Trek because they are afraid of history repeating itself, and getting stuck with product no one wants."

The campaign organisers said that although the disappointing sales of the Enterprise toys mirrored fans' often less-than-enthusiastic attitude to the series, toys based on the original Star Trek should not have the same problem, provided they can reach the fanbase. "There is still a huge interest in Classic Trek toys and products, since it is the most recognizable of all Trek," they said. "That, along with the fact that we're talking about an installed fan base of over 40 years. This would almost ensure a hit for Art Asylum, but only if the people who want it can easily find the products. This is why we need the major retailers to get back on board."

Although the campaign has only received "stock responses" so far from retailers, KB Toys' John Reilly told TrekToday the phone calls and emails hadn't gone unnoticed. "Our buyers are aware of our collector customer's concerns regarding this product line and they continue to monitor this feedback." Toys 'R' Us, Target and Walmart did not respond to TrekToday's request for comment on this issue, although Kmart did say our request was under consideration.

"We have faith that we can turn this around, and ensure that people can get all the Trek they want," the co-presidents of 'A Call to Arms' said. "We should at least have the choice, right?"

To find out more information about 'A Call to Arms', head over to the Art Asylum message board.

Wondering if this is just the first step.

[NecronLord]

I've seen all of these toys. (What?) The reason is, that the people making them, seem to think we're all desperate for three seperate types of Borg Drones. And, yes, the enterprise figures aren't bad AFAIK, it's the show that sucks.

I've started calling these toys the unshiftable stock... The Ent-A however, was sold out within a week.

[neoolong]

The toys themselves are decent, in fact are actually quite well done. The show sucks. And how they were sold sucked. You have part of the main crew in uniform and a couple of aliens. Then you have half of the same crew in away team uniforms with a couple of aliens. Some consistency would have been nice.

[Dark Primus]

To be honest, I can't imagine anyone to buy those toys, really. I'm assuming they are very good eye candy. I used to buy starship models in the past and Star Trek Micro Machines.

[Master of Ossus]

The show is really bad, and I think that they over-estimated the fan base. I don't know of anybody who's a die-hard ENT fan, to the point where they go out and buy the collectibles. All of the previous ST series, including VOY, were able to earn significant sales through such people, but frankly ST is turning into a marketing disaster for Viacom, because they simply haven't put a high-quality product on the screen.

Is anyone reminded of the "Save Nemesis" campaigns, where Trek fans would go out and buy multiple tickets in an effort to raise ticket sales for the film, though?

[Dark Primus]

The show is really bad, and I think that they over-estimated the fan base. I don't know of anybody who's a die-hard ENT fan, to the point where they go out and buy the collectibles. All of the previous ST series, including VOY, were able to earn significant sales through such people, but frankly ST is turning into a marketing disaster for Viacom, because they simply haven't put a high-quality product on the screen.

Do you have any sale figures?

Is anyone reminded of the "Save Nemesis" campaigns, where Trek fans would go out and buy multiple tickets in an effort to raise ticket sales for the film, though?

[Nelson] Ha Ha [/Nelson]

[Stravo]

I've seen the ENT Figures, they look great, good articulation, and molding but they are ALWAYS on the sale rack for 3.99 or 2.99 and they still aren't selling.

[Col. Crackpot]

Is anyone reminded of the "Save Nemesis" campaigns, where Trek fans would go out and buy multiple tickets in an effort to raise ticket sales for the film, though?

otherwise known as the L. Ron Hubbard sales inflation method!

[Master of Ossus]

The show is really bad, and I think that they over-estimated the fan base. I don't know of anybody who's a die-hard ENT fan, to the point where they go out and buy the collectibles. All of the previous ST series, including VOY, were able to earn significant sales through such people, but frankly ST is turning into a marketing disaster for Viacom, because they simply haven't put a high-quality product on the screen.

Do you have any sale figures?

Well, I don't have sales figures on the toys, but the franchise itself is going downhill since the release of VOY, but accelerated during ENT and NEM. ENT was supposed to be the first or second rated sci-fi series on TV when it was released, and it's now in fifth or sixth place (depending on what "sci-fi" is taken to mean). NEM was obviously a BO flop in the US, and VOY never delivered the ratings that the producers had initially been looking for.

[Col. Crackpot]

Well, I don't have sales figures on the toys, but the franchise itself is going downhill since the release of VOY, but accelerated during ENT and NEM. ENT was supposed to be the first or second rated sci-fi series on TV when it was released, and it's now in fifth or sixth place (depending on what "sci-fi" is taken to mean). NEM was obviously a BO flop in the US, and VOY never delivered the ratings that the producers had initially been looking for.

The thing with movies these days is that even the shit can go on to put up very good numbers on the DVD rack. I know Nemesis had a big first week pop on the DVD charts at number 1 selling 1.3 million copies, how has it done after that? In the end that is going to be the deciding factor. If Paramount can scratch out a decent profit on half-assed trek movies on the DVD market, there still is a good chance of us being served more of the same.

[Master of Ossus]

The thing with movies these days is that even the shit can go on to put up very good numbers on the DVD rack. I know Nemesis had a big first week pop on the DVD charts at number 1 selling 1.3 million copies, how has it done after that? In the end that is going to be the deciding factor. If Paramount can scratch out a decent profit on half-assed trek movies on the DVD market, there still is a good chance of us being served more of the same.

"Nemesis" has not done well, following the first week. Like its BO sales, it dropped off almost immediately to the number 4 spot the next week (behind such movies as "The Recruit"), and brought in less than one fourth of the sales in the second week as it had in the first. After that it really fell off, although its DVD sales and rentals did very well compared to the BO take.

[Col. Crackpot]

The thing with movies these days is that even the shit can go on to put up very good numbers on the DVD rack. I know Nemesis had a big first week pop on the DVD charts at number 1 selling 1.3 million copies, how has it done after that? In the end that is going to be the deciding factor. If Paramount can scratch out a decent profit on half-assed trek movies on the DVD market, there still is a good chance of us being served more of the same.

"Nemesis" has not done well, following the first week. Like its BO sales, it dropped off almost immediately to the number 4 spot the next week (behind such movies as "The Recruit"), and brought in less than one fourth of the sales in the second week as it had in the first. After that it really fell off, although its DVD sales and rentals did very well compared to the BO take.

yeah, i looked around a bit and found some older articles. by the end of june DVD rentals alone (excluding dvd sales) grossed in the high $30 million range, nearly 2/3 the total box office gross. That would indicate profitablity. IIRC it cost in the $70 million range to make and promote, so that would indicate that most of the money made on DVD sales is actual profit.

[Sea Skimmer]

yeah, i looked around a bit and found some older articles. by the end of june DVD rentals alone (excluding dvd sales) grossed in the high $30 million range, nearly 2/3 the total box office gross. That would indicate profitablity. IIRC it cost in the $70 million range to make and promote, so that would indicate that most of the money made on DVD sales is actual profit.

I believe it was 70 million to make the movie with another 20 million or so in marketing.

[NecronLord]

I've seen the ENT Figures, they look great, good articulation, and molding but they are ALWAYS on the sale rack for 3.99 or 2.99 and they still aren't selling.

Yup, Now if they made them of B&B, those I would buy. Mr Braga, meet Sauron!

[Joe Momma]

yeah, i looked around a bit and found some older articles. by the end of june DVD rentals alone (excluding dvd sales) grossed in the high $30 million range, nearly 2/3 the total box office gross. That would indicate profitablity. IIRC it cost in the $70 million range to make and promote, so that would indicate that most of the money made on DVD sales is actual profit.

Not necessarily. Considering the cut for the theaters and distribution/promotional costs, a film usually has to make 2.5x its production cost to break even at the box office. The usual production cost I've seen bandied around is between $60-66 mil. (not including promotion costs, which are usually considered in the multiplier above), so it'd need a BO take of at least $150 mill. to break even. Considering that Nemesis made $50-60 mil. including the international BO take, they've got to make another $100 mil. profit on the DVDs before they break even on the production and theater release costs.

I don't know enough about DVD sales to even make an educated guess how much of the sales are profit. Still, I'd take a WAG that DVD sales probably have a higher profit margin than the theaters, seeing as video sales usually bring in more bucks than theater sales and DVDs are even cheaper to make than tapes, IIRC. I imagine they'll eventually make some money, but it'll be a while.

-- Joe Momma

[neoolong]

DVD costs are dependant on the amount of extras that are put on them I would wager.

[Master of Ossus]

I don't know enough about DVD sales to even make an educated guess how much of the sales are profit. Still, I'd take a WAG that DVD sales probably have a higher profit margin than the theaters, seeing as video sales usually bring in more bucks than theater sales and DVDs are even cheaper to make than tapes, IIRC. I imagine they'll eventually make some money, but it'll be a while.

-- Joe Momma

The DVD costs are actually more complicated than that. For "Nemesis," it doesn't seem like they worked too hard on the DVD, so the costs should be fairly negligable, however the costs of packaging, shipping, etc. etc. for the DVD are significant. DVD sales usually only earn about a 15% profit/unit sold, which isn't really enough to offset the huge losses that Viacom already suffered from putting the movie out between Bond and LotR even though it's better than the ticket sales take following the first two or three weeks.

I'm not sure that "Nemesis" will ever make an accounting profit, much less a real one.

[Joe Momma]

Still, I'd take a WAG that DVD sales probably have a higher profit margin than the theaters, seeing as video sales usually bring in more bucks than theater sales and DVDs are even cheaper to make than tapes, IIRC. I imagine they'll eventually make some money, but it'll be a while.

DVD sales usually only earn about a 15% profit/unit sold, which isn't really enough to offset the huge losses that Viacom already suffered from putting the movie out between Bond and LotR even though it's better than the ticket sales take following the first two or three weeks.

Well, that's why I called my speculations a Wild-Assed Guess. That's a lot worse than I thought. Thanks for the info.

I'm not sure that "Nemesis" will ever make an accounting profit, much less a real one.

Now, let's not underestimate the aptitude for mendacious "artistry" of a good accountant. Like Dennis Miller said, there's an accountant that can show you Forrest Gump lost money. OTOH, making Nemesis look profitable might be a bit too much to ask -- they're professionals, not fucking magicians.

-- Joe Momma

[Equinox2003]

I won't say I know anything about the business side of movies, so I
wonder, say Paramount were to continue to make Trek movies, but
sent them straight to home video.... Would this make it more likely
that Paramount could still turn a profit with Trek feature films?

[Master of Ossus]

Now, let's not underestimate the aptitude for mendacious "artistry" of a good accountant. Like Dennis Miller said, there's an accountant that can show you Forrest Gump lost money. OTOH, making Nemesis look profitable might be a bit too much to ask -- they're professionals, not fucking magicians.

-- Joe Momma

Oh, forgive me. I wasn't suggesting that Viacom was necessarily cooking the books, regarding "Nemesis." The reference to real and accounting profits was an economics term. An accounting profit is made when a product (in this case, "Nemesis") makes strong enough revenues to recoup the initial investments made in it, surpassing the "break-even" point. In this case, that appears to be around $85+/-10 million dollars, counting advertising, marketing, production costs, and various expenses in shipping and producing the DVD's.

However, in order to actually make money on the investment, a company must do better than "break even." This is because they could have invested the same amount of money, and the same members of their staff and capital equipment in another venture, instead of making the original product. For example, if I owned a factory then I could use that factory to make cars, or I could allow another company to pay me rent for the factory and allow them to make cars there. Similarly, I could take the money I would have spent making cars and move it into a mutual fund or a bank or just invest it in stocks and bonds. In order for Viacom to make a "real" profit on "Nemesis," they would have had to have made more money on "Nemesis" than they would have if they had used their staff and equipment and spent their money on another project, or several other projects.

Needless to say, Viacom stands no chance of making a real profit on "Nemesis," even if they eventually make an accounting profit on the film.

[Master of Ossus]

I won't say I know anything about the business side of movies, so I
wonder, say Paramount were to continue to make Trek movies, but
sent them straight to home video.... Would this make it more likely
that Paramount could still turn a profit with Trek feature films?

This is a possible course of action for Paramount.

In general, when compared with theatre releases, made-for-TV movies are substantially less expensive, but produce smaller revenues. If you think you can make a really good movie, then you should try to go for the theatrical release to earn superior revenues (and, since your product is strong, you will eventually produce profits), however if you can't make a product strong enough to compete in the Box Office, you make a made-for-TV film. Sometimes, in fact, companies "bail out" after already paying the production costs for a theatrical film by sending it straight to home video. This is a way of cutting their losses on a lousy product, and in fact acknowledges that they made a crappy movie.

In the case of the ST franchise, I find it rather unlikely that they would go for the home markets. They already have television episodes--both new and in syndication--to earn ratings in a very similar market, and there's simply not a big reason to risk more money on a made-for-TV flick if you've already got an audience watching it, anyway. For Viacom, the ST series was supposed to be a low-risk investment, making a little bit of money but doing it fairly certainly. The movies were where the big potential dollars and risks were. Due to the highly disappointing performance of "Nemesis," financially, I would be extremely surprised if Viacom were to continue with the franchise in that direction. I think the closest you'll get may be episodes or "specials" that last longer than the typical one hour, but don't incur the larger production costs.

[Joe Momma]

Now, let's not underestimate the aptitude for mendacious "artistry" of a good accountant

Oh, forgive me. I wasn't suggesting that Viacom was necessarily cooking the books, regarding "Nemesis."

Neither was I, really. I just forgot to add my sarcasm tag.

-- Joe Momma

[Baron Mordo]

I've seen the ENT Figures, they look great, good articulation, and molding but they are ALWAYS on the sale rack for 3.99 or 2.99 and they still aren't selling.

Oooo, good for custom figures, then!

The Classic Trek figures look very nice. I wonder how well they'll do, if at all.

[Darth Wong]

I'll tell you exactly what I said to Rebecca when we were talking through Toys 'R Us and we saw the Enterprise (from ENT) toys on display: "Nice toy; why the hell do we finally get a nice Enterprise toy, but only for this shitty new one from that show that we never watched, and not the original one?"

Her response: "what new show?"

[Uraniun235]

I'll tell you exactly what I said to Rebecca when we were talking through Toys 'R Us and we saw the Enterprise (from ENT) toys on display: "Nice toy; why the hell do we finally get a nice Enterprise toy, but only for this shitty new one from that show that we never watched, and not the original one?"

Her response: "what new show?"

They did make an NCC-1701 toy, seemed fairly decent. Maybe you just missed it? Over the years I got the 1701, the -D, the "Generations" -D with the stupid computer quotes, -E, Warbird, Vor'cha, and the Defiant.

They all had a few sound effects and had the nacelles light up. Is the NX-01 toy really special or is it more of the same?

For "Nemesis," it doesn't seem like they worked too hard on the DVD,

There's a gigantic understatement. My mom mistakenly got the Fullscreen version. I decided to watch it to burn some time. During the battle, when Data says something about some shield arc being low and they cut to a shot of the shield indicators, they cut out the shield arc that Data referred to. They also seriously fucked up the shot of the Enterprise orbiting Romulus.

Effort? Hardly.