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I guess in reagrds to why Nemesis didn't kill Kirk there are several reasons:

1) Nemesis wants to turn Kirk. Remeber he is suffering trhough some severe doubts about his decision prodded to the surface by Ochoa's probing questions. He feels that if he can turn Kirk then he shouldn't feel so bad about giving in to the darkside.

2) Nemesis is conflicted. He is struggling with himself and who he is. I make no bones about the fact that Nemesis could have killed Kirk in the second pass of the lightsabers, he holds the blade to Kirk's throat and there's nothing Kirk can do about it, so if anyone is looking for an answer concerning a Kirk vs. Nemesis debate and who would win, I make my statement then and there.

3) The sadistic side of Nemesis wants Kirk to suffer, note how instead of a simple force choke that could have killed Kirk he opts instead to use the force to pummel him into a bloody pulp. Then uses Force lightning to roast him up real good for good meaure. He is drawing out Kirk's agony partly to make him suffer (as the Emperor chose to make Luke suffer instead of outright killing him) and partly to forestall that final decision he has to make.

"...The boss is impatient and you know how he can get when he adds something to his collection.”

I think people are forgetting this line.

Kivas Fajo?

[Teen Girl Squad]WEIRDED OUT[/TGS]

Seriously, that was the most bizzaro ending ever. I mean...whoa.

That aside, can we plan to see more of the Imperial/Imperium fleet conflicts in the next few chapters? Don't get me wrong, Kirk's whole self-discovery thing kicked ass, but now I'm yearning for a little more epic spin on things. Bring on the Death Star! Bring on the onslaught of Thrawn! And "Grand Admiral" Kittaine, too.

Bizzaro chapter as...not so usual...Starvo.

yes stravo, i accept that his mind was in a struggle, but in the end, as you wrote, he was about to kill Kirk... and then, this wierd people arrive and save them all, thats just not fair... no ofense but im highly sick of books were the heroe gets rescued in the last seconds every damn time... kirk has lifed one time to often IMO...

set this aside, can u answer my question bout Boba Fett?

Great chapter, Stravo, though the last minute rescue of Kirk by the mysterious people is a little weird. I was really expecting Nemesis to turn back into Luke here, he's been under a lot of stress to return to the light for the past couple of chapters, I was expecting the water and the memories to do it. So, what's next? Fleet action? Captain Ocha? Kahn? :trails off almost endlessly, listing the subplots:

BTW, what's with the new avatar? That guy looks familar but I can't quite place him.

Trogdor wrote: BTW, what's with the new avatar? That guy looks familar but I can't quite place him.

He will be soon making an appearance as one of the main characters in my Twilight War stories. Garth of Izar.

Stravo wrote:

Trogdor wrote: BTW, what's with the new avatar? That guy looks familar but I can't quite place him.

He will be soon making an appearance as one of the main characters in my Twilight War stories. Garth of Izar.

kirk's hero? wasn't he insane?

Crazedwraith wrote:

Stravo wrote:

Trogdor wrote: BTW, what's with the new avatar? That guy looks familar but I can't quite place him.

He will be soon making an appearance as one of the main characters in my Twilight War stories. Garth of Izar.

kirk's hero? wasn't he insane?

yes....why yes he is.

Stravo wrote:

Crazedwraith wrote:

Stravo wrote: He will be soon making an appearance as one of the main characters in my Twilight War stories. Garth of Izar.

kirk's hero? wasn't he insane?

yes....why yes he is.

I remember that guy.

Captain_Cyran wrote:

Stravo wrote:

Crazedwraith wrote: kirk's hero? wasn't he insane?

yes....why yes he is.

I remember that guy.

This guy could somehow shapeshift, correct? Turned into Kirk at one point? I know him.

consequences wrote:Kivas Fajo?

Isn't he dead? I can't remember if he was disintigrated in that ep or not.

Stravo wrote: 3) The sadistic side of Nemesis wants Kirk to suffer, note how instead of a simple force choke that could have killed Kirk he opts instead to use the force to pummel him into a bloody pulp. Then uses Force lightning to roast him up real good for good meaure. He is drawing out Kirk's agony partly to make him suffer (as the Emperor chose to make Luke suffer instead of outright killing him) and partly to forestall that final decision he has to make.

This Luke hadn't been fried by the Emperor though, had he?

yes stravo, i accept that his mind was in a struggle, but in the end, as you wrote, he was about to kill Kirk... and then, this wierd people arrive and save them all, thats just not fair... no ofense but im highly sick of books were the heroe gets rescued in the last seconds every damn time... kirk has lifed one time to often IMO...

I was more surprised that he still tried to kill Kirk again. Stravo could have just wrote that Nemesis turned back to the light side and Kirk would have won outright

Stravo wrote:

Trogdor wrote: BTW, what's with the new avatar? That guy looks familar but I can't quite place him.

He will be soon making an appearance as one of the main characters in my Twilight War stories. Garth of Izar.

Now the question is; is he getting introduced via the TNG federation wormhole or via the TOS federation wormhole.

Or neither.

JodoForce wrote:

Stravo wrote: yes stravo, i accept that his mind was in a struggle, but in the end, as you wrote, he was about to kill Kirk... and then, this wierd people arrive and save them all, thats just not fair... no ofense but im highly sick of books were the heroe gets rescued in the last seconds every damn time... kirk has lifed one time to often IMO...

I was more surprised that he still tried to kill Kirk again. Stravo could have just wrote that Nemesis turned back to the light side and Kirk would have won outright

That would been stupid as well

One of the first critiques I've received from SB about this story is that its a Warsie Wankfest. Anyone care to tell me one way or the other if this is a warsie wankfest or slanted towards the wars side?

I'm just curious as I've tried to follow the vs. numbers as they now stand as of ICS and balancing for real drama. I've heard many things but warsie wankfest is a first.

Is it because of SD.Net's warsie bias that it doesn't come off like that to many people here?

Their lack of faith disturbs me.


Ignore them.

Stravo wrote:One of the first critiques I've received from SB about this story is that its a Warsie Wankfest. Anyone care to tell me one way or the other if this is a warsie wankfest or slanted towards the wars side?

I'm just curious as I've tried to follow the vs. numbers as they now stand as of ICS and balancing for real drama. I've heard many things but warsie wankfest is a first.

Is it because of SD.Net's warsie bias that it doesn't come off like that to many people here?

Its kinda complicated. I suspect alot of it has to do with the fact it was initially from here. Basically there was already bad blood between anythig associated with wong and SB, then when ICS came out alot of over exuberent people managed to somehow ram it up the ass and down the throats of alot of people overthere at the same time. Then SD opened up, and alot of people (including a bunch of the more moderae people) left there for here. Then Bobby started winning over some of the idiots over there.

So basically, you probably only heard from the fringers, but the fringers are a bunch of people who just really don't like anything connected with Wars having an upper hand anymore.

It's unguided hate from some of them. Simple as that.

Stravo wrote:One of the first critiques I've received from SB about this story is that its a Warsie Wankfest. Anyone care to tell me one way or the other if this is a warsie wankfest or slanted towards the wars side?

I'm just curious as I've tried to follow the vs. numbers as they now stand as of ICS and balancing for real drama. I've heard many things but warsie wankfest is a first.

Is it because of SD.Net's warsie bias that it doesn't come off like that to many people here?

Uh...wha?

No, seriously...you've portrayed Star Trek in a fantastic light, the fact they(Section 31...hell any of the powers) actually stand up to any ISD is proof of that. And tech is a secondary background object to the story...it's basically screaming at it because it's something to nitpick.

I'd ignore them if all they can do is critize and bitch about numbers while not seeing the drama of the story, they aren't much different then rabid comic fanwhores who don't like when their fave hero/villain gets their ass given to them by a superior opponent and the story justifies it.

Indeed; to complain about numbers and firepower is to miss the entire point of the story. This isn't Portal or Star Destroyer Rampant where the laughable battle sequences are the crux of the plot. The battles aren't even the main focus of Starcrossed (although quite enjoyable nonetheless).

Pay them no heed. They're bitching for the sake of having something to bitch at.

This is the reponse I got when I calmly asked what was the wankfest comment about considering the state of vs. today.

Originally Posted by Stravo
Just out of curiosity, considering the state of the versus debate as it is now with the ICS and other things, how is this tale a warsie wankfest?

Because the ICS IS A WARSIE WAKNFEST!! You missed the debate a while back quite a few people agreed on the fact the numbers in the ICS calcs were biased warsies used examples of when weapons were working at 10% saying that was 100%. Then later we find out were those extra zeros went, and how the Warsies reached those ungodly numbers.

Like I said...if they want to scream and complain numbers while not viewing the story's drama...then they're being the fool.

I mean you asked how is the tale a wankfest...not ICS.

biased warsies used examples of when weapons were working at 10% saying that was 100%.

I do not see how that would lead to inflated numbers

Some SB idiot wrote:Because the ICS IS A WARSIE WAKNFEST!! You missed the debate a while back quite a few people agreed on the fact the numbers in the ICS calcs were biased warsies used examples of when weapons were working at 10% saying that was 100%. Then later we find out were those extra zeros went, and how the Warsies reached those ungodly numbers.

Bahh, they still whining about that? I wonder at what point they will realise that ICS ep2 is canon?

Also "quite a few people agreed" saying that like that makes something fact "..ICS calcs were biased" they are not biased, they are canon. What was this moron injecting that day?

Stravo wrote:One of the first critiques I've received from SB about this story is that its a Warsie Wankfest. Anyone care to tell me one way or the other if this is a warsie wankfest or slanted towards the wars side?

I'm just curious as I've tried to follow the vs. numbers as they now stand as of ICS and balancing for real drama. I've heard many things but warsie wankfest is a first.

Is it because of SD.Net's warsie bias that it doesn't come off like that to many people here?

No no no, you misunderstood me. It wouldnt have mattered to me if it was Nemesis or even Vader who would have died in Kirk's place, im just sic of the "good guys" or the "heroes" been rescued in the last second. take the X-Wing books, everytime Wedge's Squad is almost destroyed, they get saved somehow, or take any other book: the rebellion wins in 80% of them, no matter how bad the odds are. thats why i quite like the New Jedi Order... at least the NR suffers some terrible blows, and the heroes arent untachable anymore(anakin, chewbacca)