Why Janeway became an Admiral

Kitsune · Post by **Kitsune** » 2004-01-03 11:19pm

Grand Admiral Thrawn wrote: Himself? I know Janeway looks bad, but really...

I mean the person she is under would have no power either.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2004-01-04 12:18am

Look at it from another perspective... Picard and Kirk et al had to intentionally avoid Admiral postings. Kirk certainly saw the Admiratly as a form of semi-retirement, because he wanted to be out on the edge DOING things. So maybe SF is top-heavy, in that captains who live for a few years get offered what appear to be largely administrative Admiralties. Large fleets are rare in peacetime SF, but there seem to be a lot of Admirals anyway.

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2004-01-04 05:28am

Superannuation. That's how the Royal Navy cleared out command slots for bright young, up-and-coming officers; slotting the less competent admirals into relatively "safe" positions far from actual fleet command. A programme ideally suited for bureaucratic manipulation and one which doesn't at all contradict the theory that Adm. Paris did some string-pulling on her behalf.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2004-01-04 11:38am

I was watching Nemesis yesterday and from what i can tell she was little more than a mouth piece for SF Command. This seems to be the reason why she was trying to bait Picard.

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2004-01-04 03:40pm

Patrick Degan wrote:Superannuation. That's how the Royal Navy cleared out command slots for bright young, up-and-coming officers; slotting the less competent admirals into relatively "safe" positions far from actual fleet command. A programme ideally suited for bureaucratic manipulation and one which doesn't at all contradict the theory that Adm. Paris did some string-pulling on her behalf.

"Yellowing" Janeway, as it were?

Kitsune · Post by **Kitsune** » 2004-01-04 10:48pm

Lord Pounder wrote:I was watching Nemesis yesterday and from what i can tell she was little more than a mouth piece for SF Command. This seems to be the reason why she was trying to bait Picard.

What exactly did she say?

Crazedwraith · Post by **Crazedwraith** » 2004-01-05 12:41pm

Kitsune wrote:
Lord Pounder wrote:I was watching Nemesis yesterday and from what i can tell she was little more than a mouth piece for SF Command. This seems to be the reason why she was trying to bait Picard.
What exactly did she say?

She said something along the lines of : "the son'a, the borg, the romlulans you always get the easy missions don't you Jean-Luc?"

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2004-01-05 03:45pm

Basically that. Maybe i was reading more into it than there was but she seemed to be saying, HA HA I done more than you ever did. And Picard seemed pissed off at being baited by a Officer with less time on the job.

Anarchist Bunny · Post by **Anarchist Bunny** » 2004-01-05 03:52pm

I thought she was being sarcastic, not trying to put the captain now.

Chris OFarrell · Post by **Chris OFarrell** » 2004-01-06 08:10am

Darth Wong wrote:
Alyeska wrote:Couple things.

First, is Admiral Paris did this, he must be fucking powerful to get Janeway promoted from O6 to O9. A fucking Vice Admiral in an instant.

Second, whats this about Tom loosing several squadmates? This isn't from that TNG episode with Wesley is it? They had the same actor who plays Tom and the original intent was for the same character, but they changed it at the last minute. Are you referring to another incident?
The Nick LeCarno incident is mirrored in Tom Paris' background, in the novel "Mosaic" (which is supposedly canon according to Paramount, although I know that many fans bitterly dispute that).

I'd also say that in the Voyager episode 'Pathfinder', the photo of Tom on Admiral Paris' desk is a shot FROM 'The First Duty' with Nick Locarno. So I think we have an explicate onscreen conformation that they are the same person. Possibly Tom changed his name while at the Accedemy, so as to avoid any possibility of Dad playing favourates? Or other cadets working out the link?

dacis2 · Post by **dacis2** » 2004-01-06 08:17am

Isn't it obvious? They HAD to get her out of the command chair! She can't make that many infractions of the regs without a punishment, and flying a desk is bad.

Metrion Cascade · Post by **Metrion Cascade** » 2004-01-06 08:58am

I always thought the slogan for Starfleet should be "Duty. Honor. Well Meaning Nepotism." Can you say "Wesley Crusher?"

Tsyroc · Post by **Tsyroc** » 2004-01-06 09:52am

Metrion Cascade wrote:I always thought the slogan for Starfleet should be "Duty. Honor. Well Meaning Nepotism." Can you say "Wesley Crusher?"

Good point. For a society supposedly based on everyone trying to better themselves there sure was a lot of string pulling going on by people in high places so some relative or friend of their's could benefit.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2004-01-06 11:09am

Tsyroc wrote:
Metrion Cascade wrote:I always thought the slogan for Starfleet should be "Duty. Honor. Well Meaning Nepotism." Can you say "Wesley Crusher?"

Good point. For a society supposedly based on everyone trying to better themselves there sure was a lot of string pulling going on by people in high places so some relative or friend of their's could benefit.

Hey, they're only human, though they'll deny it in a heartbeat.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » 2004-01-06 01:31pm

Those of you in the workplace are familiar with the Law of Inverse Promotion.

If you're not, its basically this: "Personnel will tend to rise in the ranks of an organization based on the amount of stupidity they possess."

Of course, that means that Janeway should be head of Starfleet Command now.

Iceberg · Post by **Iceberg** » 2004-01-06 03:19pm

Defiant wrote:Those of you in the workplace are familiar with the Law of Inverse Promotion.

If you're not, its basically this: "Personnel will tend to rise in the ranks of an organization based on the amount of stupidity they possess."

Of course, that means that Janeway should be head of Starfleet Command now.

That's a paraphrase of the Peter Principle: "People tend to rise to their level of incompetence."

CDiehl · Post by **CDiehl** » 2004-01-06 04:01pm

Actually, the Peter Principle doesn't seem to have anything to do with Inverse Promotion. The Peter Principle refers to the idea of promoting people out of jobs they are skilled at, until they get stuck in a job they don't do well. Inverse Promotion sounds like something Scott Adams would propose, since it seems to apply most to bureaucracies.

As for Janeway's promotion, it does seem like it was motivated by PR. The fleet wanted a non-military hero they could present to the public, and they were willing to overlook her misdeeds, at least for the short term. She probably got assigned to something where she couldn't screw things up.