Enterprise 301 "The Xindi" *Spoilers*

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2003-09-09 11:58pm

I'm bored and since I just finished watching the new episode I thought I would create a topic and be the first to give my review of it, turn back all ye who wish to avoid spoilers.

OK first off I have to say I thought the episode was a good introduction to the new plotlines, we had a nice introduction to the new set (the Command centre), the space marines (MACO's) and the Xindi, we also get to see minor weird physics that the expanse contains and a mystery about the Xindi, now onto specifics.

The Xindi.

I liked the fact that the Xindi only have one true forehead alien out of the 5 species that make up the Xindi, I especially like the look of the reptilian Xindi and the insectoid Xindi, beyond the aesthetics it seems like the interaction between these various factions (especially the hot headed insects) could provide some interesting story points in the future and may prevent them from becoming a one dimensional foe.

The MACO's.

I think someone over at paramount has been listening, they went out of their ways to showcase that these were not red shirts and actually had something in the way of not only tactics but also equipment, I mean the guy had a sniper rifle!!!!!!, they are definitely a step or two above red shirts (when was the last time you saw red shirts arrive on ropes blasting away with their rifles).
Of course they aren't perfect and I couldn't shake the feeling that the writers were perhaps trying a little too hard to impress but it is a step in the right direction.
My one quibble is with the Reed Vs MACO storyline they seem to be setting up which I think could easily go stale.

The Theme Song.

I preferred the old one and think adding a bit of guitar to make it seem more upbeat is a sign of desperation.

Now onto the things I disliked, Travis got his usual two lines but this is somewhat understandable with the introduction of the new characters and general storyline. By far my biggest gripe is with the Trip-T'pol sexcapades (a slight over exaggeration) with an almost exact replication of Hoshi holding her breast from last seasons opener only now featuring T'pol, this just seemed desperate as did getting T'pol into about 5 different changes of clothing (I'm guessing they heard about the catsuit remarks from the fandom) although I do think lightening T'pol up a little is OK I don't particularly want anything in the way of a "will they won't they" between her and Trip (or even just they will for that matter).

So this is the point I which I should sum up I guess so I will say that it is a solid opener providing a solid base to build upon but there are still a few problems here and there that need to ironed out, especially the desire to appeal to the lowest common denominator.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-09-10 12:45am

Hmmm ... still not hearing anything that piques my interest enough to make me watch this show

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2003-09-10 12:55am

Darth Wong wrote:Hmmm ... still not hearing anything that piques my interest enough to make me watch this show

What T'pol stripping down and get very un-Vulcan like with sighs of pleasure whilst getting a back rub isn't enough for you????

Obviously B&B just can't get anything right

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2003-09-10 02:27am

What..? No instances of T'pol robotically repeating that "The Vulcan Science Directorate has declared that blah blah blah does not exist"?

Howedar · Post by **Howedar** » 2003-09-10 02:46am

I generally don't think of scientists making declarations of fact, but there ya go, thats Star Trek...

Atavarius · Post by **Atavarius** » 2003-09-10 11:47am

I pretty much agree with Darklings assessment of the show. I thought it was pretty good for a modern sci fi show (I don't really acknowledge Ent as Trek). One thing that caught my ear was Culp's character of Major Hayes referring to Reed as Sir. Now assuming Ent is using US military ranks, wouldn't Hayes (Major being the equivalent of Lt. Cmdr.) outrank Reed, or did Reed get promoted and i missed it?(source: here).

Raoul Duke, Jr. · Post by **Raoul Duke, Jr.** » 2003-09-10 01:05pm

Howedar wrote:I generally don't think of scientists making declarations of fact, but there ya go, thats Star Trek...

Come on... Star Trek, famous for -- among other things -- a "counselor" who watches someone throw a hissy fit on the Bridge and says, "I sense that you're upset."

Damn NBC for not taking the first pilot -- you know, the one that was "too cerebral".

Soulman · Post by **Soulman** » 2003-09-10 01:45pm

Atavarius wrote:I pretty much agree with Darklings assessment of the show. I thought it was pretty good for a modern sci fi show (I don't really acknowledge Ent as Trek). One thing that caught my ear was Culp's character of Major Hayes referring to Reed as Sir. Now assuming Ent is using US military ranks, wouldn't Hayes (Major being the equivalent of Lt. Cmdr.) outrank Reed, or did Reed get promoted and i missed it?(source: here).

Might Major Hayes have actually been Captain Hayes? On board ship a anyone who holds the rank of captain but isn't the captain of the vessel is called by the next rank up to avoid confusion. Mind I doubt that the writers would know this...

Raoul Duke, Jr. · Post by **Raoul Duke, Jr.** » 2003-09-10 02:22pm

It's bizarre that Hayes referred to Reed by a military honorific at all, since in "The Expanse Pt. 1", Forrest makes it pretty clear that Starfleet isn't a military organization at all.

Death from the Sea · Post by **Death from the Sea** » 2003-09-10 02:56pm

It could be that Reed's billet is higher than Major Hayes and therefore is higher in the chain of command. Maybe the MACO unit is attached to Reed and his security teams somehow, like the MACO commander reports to Reed who reports to the Captain....

greenmm · Post by **greenmm** » 2003-09-10 03:07pm

Soulman wrote:
Atavarius wrote:I pretty much agree with Darklings assessment of the show. I thought it was pretty good for a modern sci fi show (I don't really acknowledge Ent as Trek). One thing that caught my ear was Culp's character of Major Hayes referring to Reed as Sir. Now assuming Ent is using US military ranks, wouldn't Hayes (Major being the equivalent of Lt. Cmdr.) outrank Reed, or did Reed get promoted and i missed it?(source: here).
Might Major Hayes have actually been Captain Hayes? On board ship a anyone who holds the rank of captain but isn't the captain of the vessel is called by the next rank up to avoid confusion. Mind I doubt that the writers would know this...

Nope. That's done for the naval Captain rank, but the next naval rank up is Commodore (equivalent to a Brigadier), as the naval Captain is equivalent to ground Colonel.

4 best possibilities:

1. Reed was promoted, but they forgot to mention it. Possible, but doubtful, since they made a big deal out of Harry Kim getting promoted IIRC.

2. Hayes was being an asshole, by using an honorific as an insult. Possible, but you only normally find that when you're insulting a superior officer while still remaining technically within regulations, so Reed would still need to be superior in rank.

3. Rank isn't always applicable. For example, enlisted guards can be given the authority to order around flag rank officers in certain circumstances, such as barring said officer's entrance to a classified installation; this normally requires permission from a higher ranking officer. What it could be, however, is that as the Armory Officer (and apparant head weapons guy and head of ship's security), Reed's position could make Hayes have to defer to him in certain situations, even though Hayes' rank puts him technically higher. This is particularly critical, since Reed's position technically comes from Captain Archer, so Hayes would only be able to overrule orders from Reed if Archer gave Hayes permission, or a higher flag officer at Starfleet superseded Archer's commands.

4. B&B follow military protocol as well as they follow continuity.

#3 makes the most sense, but I'm betting it's #4.

Publius · Post by **Publius** » 2003-09-10 05:18pm

The use of "sir" and "Mister" for commissioned officers derives from the fact that all officers were gentlemen (at the least). The quality always addressed one another as "sir", even if the one had a higher social station than the other (cf. the frequent use of "monsieur" in French society). Consequently, especially in the XVIII and XIX centuries, captains could often be found addressing lieutenants as "sir", the superiority of the former notwithstanding.

Publius

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2003-09-10 08:07pm

Reed might have positional authority

Jason von Evil · Post by **Jason von Evil** » 2003-09-10 08:59pm

All I have to say is if Roddenberry were in a grave, he'd be spinning faster than Superman did around Earth in Superman I.

Superman · Post by **Superman** » 2003-09-10 09:06pm

I agree. The only way you can watch this is to try and pretend that it's not Star Trek. Just pretend that it's some kind of half assed sci fi show that bears a slight resemblance to Star Trek. I still say, though, that it's more Trek-like than Voyager was.

Darth Servo · Post by **Darth Servo** » 2003-09-10 09:10pm

[off topic]
Heh, heh, heh

Enterprise 301. Sounds like a business class.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2003-09-10 09:11pm

So thus far do the MACOs profide any new weapons information?

Enigma · Post by **Enigma** » 2003-09-10 09:25pm

Darth Wong wrote:Hmmm ... still not hearing anything that piques my interest enough to make me watch this show

Just watch the it season premier and then decide whether or not it is worth watching the rest.

I liked it, at least there are soldiers that can aim and don't die in the ep. This time around Archer doesn't quibble about morality.

Admiral_K · Post by **Admiral_K** » 2003-09-10 09:30pm

I agree it did seem as though they are trying to address many of the "problems" not only with this series, but trek in General.

You had aliens who were actually alien (not bipends with a different forehead).

You had true soldiers who exhibited some form of military competance, and correct use of weapons.

I personally don't see what the big deal is if they do introduce some "relationship" story lines.

Admiral_K · Post by **Admiral_K** » 2003-09-10 09:30pm

Enigma wrote: I liked it, at least there are soldiers that can aim and don't die in the ep. This time around Archer doesn't quibble about morality.

Yea he seems much more cold hearted these days

TheDarkling · Post by **TheDarkling** » 2003-09-10 09:47pm

I personally don't see what the big deal is if they do introduce some "relationship" story lines.

Unlike many others the idea itself doesn't disagree with me but I don't think they will handle it well and it will simply be used as a vehicle to enable the use of T'pol as a way to boost ratings in that important horny teen demographic.

Atavarius · Post by **Atavarius** » 2003-09-10 10:20pm

Enigma wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:Hmmm ... still not hearing anything that piques my interest enough to make me watch this show
Just watch the it season premier and then decide whether or not it is worth watching the rest.

I liked it, at least there are soldiers that can aim and don't die in the ep. This time around Archer doesn't quibble about morality.

Now it seems to me (and don't jump on me for this because TOS is my favorite of all Trek) that B and B are trying to make Enterprise more like TOS. They've seen that "touchy feely" Trek (VOY and to an extent TNG) takes a back seat to "action" Trek (TOS and to an extent DS9). Thoughts?

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2003-09-10 11:44pm

Darth Wong wrote:Hmmm ... still not hearing anything that piques my interest enough to make me watch this show

I caught the last 4-5 minutes, it was like seeing a characature of everything people mock this show for.

I saw all of Jolene Blalock's titties save for nipples.

The "expanse" reeks of Badlands, it does.

The Xindi bit at the end seemed like more than a coincidental ripoff of the AoTC conferance table on Geonosis...

I was shocked at the un-originality, blatant and contrived semi-nudity, the planet killer/Geonosian ripoff, and I only saw the last few minutes of the fucking thing.

Kerneth · Post by **Kerneth** » 2003-09-10 11:46pm

I enjoyed it. Seeing the soldiers actually blow stuff away with accurate weapons fire was beautiful, as was the one guy who had and used a "scope" on his phaser.

I could've lived without the relationship stuff, but eh, it was inevitable.

Seeing Archer respond to the attack on Earth by deciding to do some seriously unpleasant things to the people responsible, rather than worry about whether their culture may be one that didn't recognize orbital bombardment of a planet as a bad thing and rather considered it a standard greeting, was also pleasant.

TrailerParkJawa · Post by **TrailerParkJawa** » 2003-09-11 12:18am

I saw most of the episode. Missed the first 5 minutes or so.

1) I can do without the conflict between Reed and the MACO Major. They are still using standard cliche's with the ground troops.
a) Enlisted men who are far too old for their rank.
b) Dropping down and firing from ropes.
c) *dangit I cant remember the third one.*

With that said, I think the MACO's have a good chance of being a good addition to the story. The scope with a head shot was a nice surprise.

2) I know most people will not like the T'Pol scene, but frankly I find her attractive so I dont mind. ( Attn Frank Hipper: Tucker takes his shirt off
I think you like him, no?)

3) The dream sequence of Tucker and his sister was something I didnt expect. It was not graphic in the sense that there was gore, but it was more graphic than the sanitized death scenes usually found in modern Trek.

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Enterprise 301 "The Xindi" Spoilers

Enterprise 301 "The Xindi" Spoilers