BREAKING NEWS: FBI RAIDS TRUMP RESIDENCE IN MAR-A-LAGO FOR CLASSIFIED NUCLEAR DOCUMENTS, AMONG OTHERS

[GrosseAdmiralFox]

There aren't enough expletives to describe what is going on here, given this orange man's narcissism and debts...

I'm already hearing the BS that Trump's fanbase are throwing out like demented monkeys...

[wautd]

There aren't enough expletives to describe what is going on here, given this orange man's narcissism and debts...

I'm already hearing the BS that Trump's fanbase are throwing out like demented monkeys...

You can already predict with near certainty that Trump will spin this for political gain, paint himself as a victim and his radical cult following eating it up like candy

[GrosseAdmiralFox]

There aren't enough expletives to describe what is going on here, given this orange man's narcissism and debts...

I'm already hearing the BS that Trump's fanbase are throwing out like demented monkeys...

You can already predict with near certainty that Trump will spin this for political gain, paint himself as a victim and his radical cult following eating it up like candy

I said the same thing, and the funny thing is that to get the warrant, you need a lot of evidence to convince the judge to do so... and the last time things like this were flying around, I remember the judge that signed off on the warrant seeing a room filled with evidence that the FBI had... and that one ended with executions.

[Broomstick]

I have to wonder if the nutjob who showed up at an FBI office in Cincinnati was responding to calls to action in the Rabid Right in response to the Mar-A-Lago search warrant. Dude had body armor, and AR-15, and a nail gun (...wait, a nail gun? WTF?) Of course, showing up like that at an FBI office is just another form of suicide by cop.

[wautd]

There aren't enough expletives to describe what is going on here, given this orange man's narcissism and debts...

I'm already hearing the BS that Trump's fanbase are throwing out like demented monkeys...

You can already predict with near certainty that Trump will spin this for political gain, paint himself as a victim and his radical cult following eating it up like candy

I said the same thing, and the funny thing is that to get the warrant, you need a lot of evidence to convince the judge to do so... and the last time things like this were flying around, I remember the judge that signed off on the warrant seeing a room filled with evidence that the FBI had... and that one ended with executions.

But but but... it's all a giant conspiracy by the same tyrannical deep state that eats babies and gave us COVID (or some other bullshit, batshit insane explanation)

[wautd]

I have to wonder if the nutjob who showed up at an FBI office in Cincinnati was responding to calls to action in the Rabid Right in response to the Mar-A-Lago search warrant.

Don't think that was a coincidence. I read he was also part of the mob that attacked the capitol.

[Tribble]

When Republicans call themselves the “Law and Order” party, that means they want to impose law and order on everyone except themselves.

In their mind, Republicans are doing Gods Work, which makes all of their actions legal. Since the Democrats are evil baby eating Satan worshipers, every thing they do is by definition illegal.

[LadyTevar]

I have to wonder if the nutjob who showed up at an FBI office in Cincinnati was responding to calls to action in the Rabid Right in response to the Mar-A-Lago search warrant.

Don't think that was a coincidence. I read he was also part of the mob that attacked the capitol.

Richard W. Shiffer, according to the Cincinnati paper, was at the Jan 6th riot, but had not been questioned or detained by the police over the Riot (or hadn't yet got that far).

I fully suspect he attacked the FBI building thinking it was going to just like storming the Capitol. I fully believe he thought he was going to be helping Trump's case in some way, thinking that he could somehow force the FBI to return the documents. Or, maybe just thought he'd punish the FBI for the raid.
I'm very glad he didn't have friends storming in with him. I wonder if he even thought to ask for backup, or seriously thought he could do it on his own.

I wonder what his family thinks of him now.

[GrosseAdmiralFox]

I wonder what his family thinks of him now.

Probably praising him, given how these things end up.

Another thing that would raise eyebrows is that Saudi Arabia paid a member of the Trump family a few cold million after some time at a golf course... making the implication that Trump sold those secrets. If this implication is true...

... well, he'll be a new inmate at ADX Florence's Supermax wing for certain.

[LadyTevar]

I wonder what his family thinks of him now.

Probably praising him, given how these things end up.

Another thing that would raise eyebrows is that Saudi Arabia paid a member of the Trump family a few cold million after some time at a golf course... making the implication that Trump sold those secrets. If this implication is true...

... well, he'll be a new inmate at ADX Florence's Supermax wing for certain.

I'm pretty sure that's true.
Whether it can be PROVEN is the question

[Solauren]

It appears they're going for the easiest provable charges.

https://www.reuters.com/legal/what-char ... ket-newtab

In summary - three possible sets of charges.
First one - Unauthorized Possession of National Defense Information
(Does not mention if classified or not)
10 years in prison

Second one - Concealing official US Documents
3 years

Third One - Destroying official US Documents
20 years

With two bits of irony:
#1 - Trump in 2018 signed a change in the law which increased the maximum prison term for individuals convicted of mishandling classified information from one to five years.

#2 - Trump is also claiming the documents they found were declassified. Which, you know, is basically saying he did have them. aka Confession.

[bilateralrope]

It appears they're going for the easiest provable charges.

For now. I'd expect that to change after they go through the seized documents and see what they have.

Though I'm not expecting and indictments until after the midterms. The DOJ is going to want to avoid any accusations of meddling in the election and there doesn't seem to be any reason to rush the charges.

#2 - Trump is also claiming the documents they found were declassified. Which, you know, is basically saying he did have them. aka Confession.

The fun bit is that the laws in question here don't seem to care if the documents were classified. But other laws might. So it's going to get interesting if Trump tries to claim "I declassified them" as a defence in court if there is no record of him doing so before he left office.

[GrosseAdmiralFox]

I'm pretty sure that's true.
Whether it can be PROVEN is the question

You would be surprised, given the scope here. Given that money is involved... it'll be traced... though that's a rabbit hole that's going to be the definition of insanity to dig into...

[Ralin]

https://www.scmp.com/news/world/united- ... one-bidens

Rudy Giuliani: Trump will ‘raid every one of Biden’s houses’ if former president wins 2024 election
Rudy Giuliani, a former New York mayor and ex-personal lawyer to Donald Trump, said the FBI’s search of Trump’s Mar-a-Lago club was a ‘political act’
Giuliani said Trump could use the FBI to retaliate against Joe Biden if he were to head back to the Oval Office

Former New York city mayor Rudy Giuliani earlier this week said Donald Trump would “raid” US President Joe Biden’s homes if he were to win the White House in 2024, with Giuliani, former personal lawyer to Trump, arguing that the FBI’s search of Trump’s Mar-a-Lago club was a “political act.”

Giuliani, a long-time Trump loyalist, told The New York Post that Trump could use the FBI to retaliate against Biden if he were to head back to the Oval Office.

“Breaking into the home of a former president is a political act – particularly since you’re breaking precedent. All of a sudden, you’re the first president of the United States who introduced the banana-republic process of prosecuting your predecessor. We’ve avoided it for 240 years. Trump didn’t do it to Hillary. Ford didn’t do it,” he told the newspaper.

“If Trump gets elected, the first thing he’ll do is raid every one of Biden’s houses,” he added.

When he spoke to the newspaper, Giuliani argued at the time that the search had been conducted to aid the House committee investigating the Capitol riot on January 6, 2021.

However, Friday’s release of the FBI search warrant and property list revealed that agents were looking for documents connected to potential violations of the Espionage Act, which bars the unauthorised removal of defence-related information that could aid a foreign government.

Trump is also being investigated for potential obstruction of justice violations.

As Trump’s former personal lawyer, Giuliani played a pivotal role in the ex-president’s administration – and after Trump left the Oval Office last year.

Giuliani has for years sought to shine a light on the work of the president’s son Hunter Biden, who at one point sat on the board of the Ukrainian natural-gas company Burisma Holdings.

The House in December 2019 voted to charge Trump with abuse of power and obstruction of Congress regarding his alleged efforts to solicit Ukraine’s interference in the 2020 presidential election. However, he was acquitted by the Senate on both articles of impeachment in February 2020.

Giuliani was especially dogged in seeking information about Hunter Biden’s business dealings from a laptop that reportedly belonged to the lawyer and former member of the Amtrak board of directors.

Republicans are angling to investigate Hunter Biden if they capture one or both of chambers of Congress this autumn, even as the Department of Justice continues its investigation of the presidential son. (He could potentially face charges that include tax violations, per The New York Times.)

Giuliani has also been one of the fiercest proponents of Trump’s challenges to the 2020 presidential election.

In Landslide: The Final Days of the Trump Presidency, the writer Michael Wolff detailed how Giuliani reportedly wanted Trump to declare victory just after polls closed in much of the country on election night in November 2020.

“We’ve won! We need to declare victory!” Giuliani told a group at the time that included former White House chief of staff Mark Meadows and former Trump campaign manager Bill Stepien.

“If we don’t say we won, they will steal it from us. Look, we’ve won Michigan!” Giuliani added. (Trump went on to lose Michigan by a three percentage-point margin, coming up short by a little over 150,000 votes.)

[Zwinmar]

And the right wing trump-ettes are screaming for violence, go figure...

[LadyTevar]

Are we surprised that Rudy is trumpeting "Tit for Tat" if Trump wins? That's how the bastards see this.

Gods please have all these idiots thrown in jail, barred from ever being in politics again? And stop any of their cultists from trying to follow in their footsteps.

[Tribble]

Are we surprised that Rudy is trumpeting "Tit for Tat" if Trump wins? That's how the bastards see this.

Gods please have all these idiots thrown in jail, barred from ever being in politics again? And stop any of their cultists from trying to follow in their footsteps.

Democrats are in an impossible position. They are a party that is at least playing lip service to the idea of rule of law and living in a united free and democrat society. Unfortunately, their opposition is a an openly fascist regime which completely disregards those concepts except where they can be manipulated to benefit themselves and/or help them punish their enemies.

Everything the State and the Democrats do to try and contain the situation just reinforces the victimhood narrative that the Republicans are pushing.

How do you peacefully stop a party which is more or less openly dedicated to imprisoning and killing you above all else, laws be damned?

Is that even possible, or is the US inevitably headed for a total fascist takeover and/or civil war?

I know I sound like a broken record, but it doesn't look like things have improved over the past several years. If anything, they have steadily grown worse, Biden's election notwithstanding.

[Gandalf]

Are we surprised that Rudy is trumpeting "Tit for Tat" if Trump wins? That's how the bastards see this.

Indeed. That was the rhetoric when Bush II was in office and there was talk of impeachment.

It's all they have, as they know that they broke the law, and their sole recourse is to make life as unpleasant as possible for those who might hold them accountable.

[Zwinmar]

From what I can see, the asshats are openly screaming for a civil war, never mind they are a bunch of meal team six jackwagons who couldn't run 15 feet without having a heart attack. I have seen war, these dumbasses have no idea what they are asking for; just like Putin thought going into Ukraine they think it will be a cake walk and no one will fight back.

[bilateralrope]

Are we surprised that Rudy is trumpeting "Tit for Tat" if Trump wins? That's how the bastards see this.

Gods please have all these idiots thrown in jail, barred from ever being in politics again? And stop any of their cultists from trying to follow in their footsteps.

Democrats are in an impossible position. They are a party that is at least playing lip service to the idea of rule of law and living in a united free and democrat society. Unfortunately, their opposition is a an openly fascist regime which completely disregards those concepts except where they can be manipulated to benefit themselves and/or help them punish their enemies.

Everything the State and the Democrats do to try and contain the situation just reinforces the victimhood narrative that the Republicans are pushing.

How do you peacefully stop a party which is more or less openly dedicated to imprisoning and killing you above all else, laws be damned?

Is that even possible, or is the US inevitably headed for a total fascist takeover and/or civil war?

I know I sound like a broken record, but it doesn't look like things have improved over the past several years. If anything, they have steadily grown worse, Biden's election notwithstanding.

The best case I can see is publicly punishing Trump to the full extent of the law. Make it clear to anyone who is paying attention exactly what he did and why he's being punished.

Then hope that the people who don't care about the facts are small enough in number to be manageable when they try something.

[Mr Bean]

Are we surprised that Rudy is trumpeting "Tit for Tat" if Trump wins? That's how the bastards see this.

Gods please have all these idiots thrown in jail, barred from ever being in politics again? And stop any of their cultists from trying to follow in their footsteps.

Democrats are in an impossible position. They are a party that is at least playing lip service to the idea of rule of law and living in a united free and democrat society. Unfortunately, their opposition is a an openly fascist regime which completely disregards those concepts except where they can be manipulated to benefit themselves and/or help them punish their enemies.

Everything the State and the Democrats do to try and contain the situation just reinforces the victimhood narrative that the Republicans are pushing.

How do you peacefully stop a party which is more or less openly dedicated to imprisoning and killing you above all else, laws be damned?

Is that even possible, or is the US inevitably headed for a total fascist takeover and/or civil war?

I know I sound like a broken record, but it doesn't look like things have improved over the past several years. If anything, they have steadily grown worse, Biden's election notwithstanding.

The best case I can see is publicly punishing Trump to the full extent of the law. Make it clear to anyone who is paying attention exactly what he did and why he's being punished.

Then hope that the people who don't care about the facts are small enough in number to be manageable when they try something.

The best case in that regard is Trump flips in an effort to reduce his time in jail and that would result in the Republicans dropping him hard.

[Solauren]

Best case (IMHO) - Trump realizes he's in trouble, (and his kids and legacy are in trouble) and flips to reduce jail time/protect his kids, and names names.

Lots of names.

The follow up to this is 'Acting on Information provided by former President Trump, law enforcement...', and alot of people getting rounded up.

That would cause the Republicans like Trump, and their supporters, to turn on each other. Both in terms 'ratting', and their supporters doing their best to derail each other.

[Lost Soal]

Who do you think Trump is going to flip on? He's at the top of the pile, if anything it'll be his kids flipping on him.

[Solauren]

Who do you think Trump is going to flip on? He's at the top of the pile, if anything it'll be his kids flipping on him.

The rest of the 'pile', so to speak. If he's going down, take everyone else but his kids down with him.

[Tribble]

Who do you think Trump is going to flip on? He's at the top of the pile, if anything it'll be his kids flipping on him.

The rest of the 'pile', so to speak. If he's going down, take everyone else but his kids down with him.

When Trump feels like he’s going to lose, he usually flips the table over rather than flip sides.

This is someone whom upon losing the election and court battles encouraged an insurrection to overthrow the legitimately elected government and establish himself as dictator; his only mistakes were not being decisive enough and unwilling to get his hand too dirty by personally leading the crowd.

IMO Trump is more likely to try and start another Civil War than admit defeat. If he’s truly going down he’ll want to take all of America down with him.