Dragons - alive, well and about to roast your arse!

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2002-12-04 02:39pm

A fire breathing dragon lives in my garage

Andrew J. · Post by **Andrew J.** » 2002-12-04 03:07pm

Tsyroc wrote: Komodo Dragons are reptiles. Dinosaurs were dinosaurs not really big reptiles. They may have some reptilian like traits but they also had traits of other modern animals.

Hm? I always thought dinosaurs were reptiles, albeit a kind that has been extinct for millions of years. Komodo dragons are lizards, which are utterly different from dinosaurs.

Majin Gojira · Post by **Majin Gojira** » 2002-12-04 03:53pm

I just saw the pictures of 'pterrosaurs' shot durring the Civil War...

One of them is from thje now defunct show "Freaky Links" - another casualty of Fox's Friday night of Death like "Dark Angel" was.

This guy IS stupid.

Tsyroc · Post by **Tsyroc** » 2002-12-04 05:12pm

Andrew J. wrote:
Tsyroc wrote: Komodo Dragons are reptiles. Dinosaurs were dinosaurs not really big reptiles. They may have some reptilian like traits but they also had traits of other modern animals.
Hm? I always thought dinosaurs were reptiles, albeit a kind that has been extinct for millions of years. Komodo dragons are lizards, which are utterly different from dinosaurs.

Komodo Dragon

Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata
Class: Reptilia
Order: Squamata
Family: Varanidae
Genus: Varanus
Species: komodoensis

http://www.thebigzoo.com/Animals/Komodo_Dragon.asp

Tryannosaurus Rex

Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata (vertebrates)
Class: Archosauria
Subclass: Dinosauria
Infraclass: Theropodia
Order: Coelurosauria
Family: Tyrannosauridae
Genus: Tyrannosaursus
Species: Rex

http://town.morrison.co.us/dinosaur/genera/t-rex.html

If I recall correctly dinosaurs used to be classified with reptiles. Like all science things change and people argue about how they should be.

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2002-12-04 06:26pm

MY EYES! THEY BLEED!

Raoul Duke, Jr. · Post by **Raoul Duke, Jr.** » 2002-12-04 06:35pm

I'm not even going to read it. From the reviews here, I gather it could put what meager intelligence I have left at risk, and I can't afford to lose even one working brain cell. After all, that would leave me at half my already astonishingly limited capacity for reason. LOL!

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2002-12-04 06:45pm

*point to Duke's location* I too am in hell.

Shadow WarChief · Post by **Shadow WarChief** » 2002-12-04 07:00pm

What to do after reading this site

Step 1) Visit an elementary public school. K-5
Step 2) Find some random kid and sit him down in front of you.
Step 3) Then listen to him so that you can actually listen to someone that KNOWS something true about dinosaurs.

XPViking · Post by **XPViking** » 2002-12-04 07:11pm

Hrumph. No mention of my hometown Ogopogo monster. Oh well.

XPViking

edit: I stand corrected! Wheeee!

OTHER MARINE MONSTER SIGHTINGS!
There are so many sightings of different lake monsters from the past, as well as from our modern time, to be seen and read about in books and untold websites; Seadragons like "Nessie", "Chessie", "Champ", "Ogopogo", Memphrémagog, and so many others.

http://www.anzwers.org/free/livedragons/evolutio.htm

Andrew J. · Post by **Andrew J.** » 2002-12-04 07:56pm

Tsyroc wrote:
Andrew J. wrote:
Tsyroc wrote: Komodo Dragons are reptiles. Dinosaurs were dinosaurs not really big reptiles. They may have some reptilian like traits but they also had traits of other modern animals.
Hm? I always thought dinosaurs were reptiles, albeit a kind that has been extinct for millions of years. Komodo dragons are lizards, which are utterly different from dinosaurs.

Komodo Dragon

Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata
Class: Reptilia
Order: Squamata
Family: Varanidae
Genus: Varanus
Species: komodoensis

http://www.thebigzoo.com/Animals/Komodo_Dragon.asp

Tryannosaurus Rex

Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata (vertebrates)
Class: Archosauria
Subclass: Dinosauria
Infraclass: Theropodia
Order: Coelurosauria
Family: Tyrannosauridae
Genus: Tyrannosaursus
Species: Rex

http://town.morrison.co.us/dinosaur/genera/t-rex.html

If I recall correctly dinosaurs used to be classified with reptiles. Like all science things change and people argue about how they should be.

Huh. First I've heard of it.

The Dark · Post by **The Dark** » 2002-12-05 02:27am

innerbrat wrote: Dragons can be no mroe related to dinosaurs than fish - they're not even tetrapods, for Bob's sake!

Wyverns and Wyrms were supposed to be tetrapods (Wyverns with 2 wings and 2 legs, Wyrms four legs and no wings, like Chinese dragons).

Actually, getting away from the stupidity here (hopefully), is there any possibility of there being some sort of plesiosaur survivors in unexplored regions of the oceans? It might be highly implausible, but given that most of our ocean is unexplored and that we do tend to run across surprising "throwbacks" (the coeclanth and a lizard species that has not changed "since the time of the dinosarus," IIRC), could there still be dinosaurs in the oceans?

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2002-12-05 02:35am

The Dark wrote:
innerbrat wrote: Dragons can be no mroe related to dinosaurs than fish - they're not even tetrapods, for Bob's sake!
Wyverns and Wyrms were supposed to be tetrapods (Wyverns with 2 wings and 2 legs, Wyrms four legs and no wings, like Chinese dragons).

Actually, getting away from the stupidity here (hopefully), is there any possibility of there being some sort of plesiosaur survivors in unexplored regions of the oceans? It might be highly implausible, but given that most of our ocean is unexplored and that we do tend to run across surprising "throwbacks" (the coeclanth and a lizard species that has not changed "since the time of the dinosarus," IIRC), could there still be dinosaurs in the oceans?

Cryptozoology is the field of study for this sort of thing. While there are a bunch of quacks, it is a legititmate field of study. It is possible for there to be old species like that still around. Heck, alligators are pretty much prehistoric animals themselves. So it has happened.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2002-12-05 02:40am

The be fair there are some Cryptozoologists that are sane, they mostly concern themselves with the Giant Squid though.

neoolong · Post by **neoolong** » 2002-12-05 02:44am

NecronLord wrote:The be fair there are some Cryptozoologists that are sane, they mostly concern themselves with the Giant Squid though.

I thought that was implied with the legitimate field of study part.

Post by **Edi** » 2002-12-05 04:00am

I don't think there would be anything as big as a Plesiosaur left, certainly not in numbers large enough to sustain a viable population. Some small throwback species are found from time to time, and when you look at crocs and sharks, they're pretty much the same as they were millions of years ago right back to the dinosaur times.

As for the photos on that site, there was maybe one that I couldn't identify as a fake or a mislabeled one of something well known within five seconds. Dumbasses...

Edi

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2002-12-05 08:56am

innerbrat wrote:And the Monster Manual is the definitive work on dinsoaur biology? </sarckyness>

No, it's one of the definitive works on Gibbering Mouther biology.

InnerBrat · Post by **InnerBrat** » 2002-12-05 10:16am

Aaaah, I see.

Darth Yoshi · Post by **Darth Yoshi** » 2002-12-05 11:13am

Andrew J. wrote:
Tsyroc wrote:
Andrew J. wrote: Hm? I always thought dinosaurs were reptiles, albeit a kind that has been extinct for millions of years. Komodo dragons are lizards, which are utterly different from dinosaurs.

Komodo Dragon

Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata
Class: Reptilia
Order: Squamata
Family: Varanidae
Genus: Varanus
Species: komodoensis

http://www.thebigzoo.com/Animals/Komodo_Dragon.asp

Tryannosaurus Rex

Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata (vertebrates)
Class: Archosauria
Subclass: Dinosauria
Infraclass: Theropodia
Order: Coelurosauria
Family: Tyrannosauridae
Genus: Tyrannosaursus
Species: Rex

http://town.morrison.co.us/dinosaur/genera/t-rex.html

If I recall correctly dinosaurs used to be classified with reptiles. Like all science things change and people argue about how they should be.
Huh. First I've heard of it.

I remember reading once that dinosaurs and birds should be put in their own group. Have they done that?

Tsyroc · Post by **Tsyroc** » 2002-12-05 02:56pm

Darth Yoshi wrote: I remember reading once that dinosaurs and birds should be put in their own group. Have they done that?

Birds

Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata
Class: Aves

http://www.thebigzoo.com

It doesn't appear so although I have heard that too. That sort of goes
back to what I was saying about people not always agreeing in science and the claissification of all things biological is one area were you can find lots of opinions. Just look at the dork with the dragons

. Okay, bad example. There are legitamit scientists that disagree and things are contantly being refined.

For instance, the Grizzly Bear (Ursus Arctos horribilis) and the Kodiak Bear(Ursus Arctos middendorffi) used to be considered seperately, but for awhile now they have both been considered subspecies of Brown Bear.

http://www.shadowofthebear.com/shebear.html

InnerBrat · Post by **InnerBrat** » 2002-12-06 04:36am

Trouble is, reptiles are a polyphyletic group (big word, but I am going somewhere with it)

Basically, Birds evolved from dinosaurs, so I think they clearly are dinosaurs - and taxonomy is a silly science anyway.

But - and I might be nitpickingly worng, but this is the gist - crocodiles and alligators are more closely related to dinosaurs than other reptiles, squamata (lizards and snakes) are more closely related to croc/dinosaurs than to tortoises, and tortoises and turtles sit outside.

So, phylogenetically, there is no 'group' that includes modern reptiles but not modern birds. i.e. reptiles do not have a common ancestor unique to the class Reptilia.

So to some defintions, birds are reptiles, but they clearly aren't so that's no good.

Same thing BTW, with fish - modern fish do not have a common ancestor that isn't shared with tetrapods. All other modern vertebrate classes are self-contained (amphibia, mammalis, aves)

Majin Gojira · Post by **Majin Gojira** » 2002-12-06 10:50am

Quite Correct. Turtles and tortises are Anapsids (no holes in the skull to allow muscles to expand when the jaw contracts - the brain is sqeezed when this happens). Lizards and Snakes are Diapsids. Crocodiles and Dinosaurs are both Archosaurs (evolved from Diapsids).
Diapsids have two holes in their skulls to allow muscle expansion. Archosaurs have a few more holes for more muscles to expand into without crushing the brain

Well, something like that, I probably have some terminology wrong.

InnerBrat · Post by **InnerBrat** » 2002-12-06 11:32am

Yeap. That's right, that is. And mammals are descended from synapsids.