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CaptainChewbacca wrote:I do hope we get to see more of the carnage in Detroit. I researched and planned it so well

There's more written and your contribution of course. I'm just kinda blocked on a couple of scenes featuring the LDV. I imagine Stuart has another dose of 'Beezelbub's army meets steel rain' coming first anyway.

Ambassador's Bridge is actually further down the river than I thought, so it'll last a bit longer than Sec. Warner's estimate; eventually though the sub-grade freeways will drain the lava onto its supports.

I don't know if you guys have ever seen Ambassador Bridge, but the two ends are on dirt rises and the supports themselves are in the river. I'm curious myself what effect the lava will have in the river, given that Detroit River is noted for its extremely strong currents (as in, swimming in it should be classified as a suicide attempt if one survives.) People look at the river and they're like, "Oh, must be a calm section, let's go a for a swim." Um, yeah... Bad idea there.

CaptainChewbacca wrote:I do hope we get to see more of the carnage in Detroit. I researched and planned it so well

And you still managed to miss the River Rouge plant

I'm actually upset you destroyed the Connor Ave plant, since that means Viper production is going to be shut down (as well as Dodge's advanced drivetrain development.)

Fyrwulf wrote:I don't know if you guys have ever seen Ambassador Bridge, but the two ends are on dirt rises and the supports themselves are in the river. I'm curious myself what effect the lava will have in the river, given that Detroit River is noted for its extremely strong currents (as in, swimming in it should be classified as a suicide attempt if one survives.) People look at the river and they're like, "Oh, must be a calm section, let's go a for a swim." Um, yeah... Bad idea there.

You'd be surprised at the odd choices people will make when confronted with a flood of lava.

Illuminatus Primus wrote:I wonder how inner city blacks are liking that new cop ROE on those resisting arrest.

If the cops are doing it to actual gangbangers and common thugs, the rest of the neighborhood would probably be all for it.

Those M1117's are preaty awesome, but what about all those zillions of M113s? There are absurd numbers of them lying around in warehouses and depots, so many in fact you could use half of them to restore the other half and still have an absurd number of vehicles ready to rock.

Spare parts are still being made for them -they are still being constructed somewhere in all probability- and the more modern versions have shown to be able to be upgraded with the latest gear quite easily, upto things like Bushmaster cannons off an M2/M3 in fact.

If nothing else, they would make the perfect vehicle for the USV squad and platoon sized units to use as a rapid response unit.

Here's something I've been wondering about.

We've established that in this universe the Biblical account is true insofar as Demons really were a rebellious faction of Angels. So shouldn't they be the same species and look the same? If it was a supernatural cosmology you could write it up to the Fallen Angels being cursed to take grotesque shapes (the usual explanation for why Demons don't resemble Angels), but since in this universe they're basically just plain organic beings like us they should still be the same species and look the same.

You could write it up to divergent evolution brought on by environmental pressures in Hell, but while that might work for "young" Demons it wouldn't work for ones like Abigor that were alive at the time of the revolt. Those should be biologically identical to Angels, but I'm getting the impression of them being "standard" Demons in the story (horns, hooves, no wings etc.). How does that work?

Perhaps it's the way they gain energy?

It's possible that the angels do in fact look like demons, but they disguise themselves in the same manner that succubi do.

Fyrwulf wrote:I don't know if you guys have ever seen Ambassador Bridge, but the two ends are on dirt rises and the supports themselves are in the river. I'm curious myself what effect the lava will have in the river, given that Detroit River is noted for its extremely strong currents (as in, swimming in it should be classified as a suicide attempt if one survives.) People look at the river and they're like, "Oh, must be a calm section, let's go a for a swim." Um, yeah... Bad idea there.

One hell of a lot of steam likely, and if the bridge comes down that blocks the flow of shipping traffic handily from the upper to lower lakes. Swimming the river -- hmm might drown, or definitely WILL be vaporized -- not much of a choice there really
The current does vary, from 1-2 knots in the Belle Isle region, and up to 3-4 knots further down towards Amherstburg. Depending on the number of ships in the area, a lot of swimmers might get picked up, not to mention the large number of small craft that could be used.

Fyrwulf wrote:I don't know if you guys have ever seen Ambassador Bridge, but the two ends are on dirt rises and the supports themselves are in the river. I'm curious myself what effect the lava will have in the river, given that Detroit River is noted for its extremely strong currents (as in, swimming in it should be classified as a suicide attempt if one survives.) People look at the river and they're like, "Oh, must be a calm section, let's go a for a swim." Um, yeah... Bad idea there.

Well, the people who are on the span can escape, certainly, but ultimately the area around the bridge approaches will be engulfed with lava. The supports in the river just mean that everyone on the bridge at the time that the American-side supports are engulfed can still get to the Canadian side long before the bridge collapses, if it does collapse.

NecronLord wrote:Oh dear. Poor Joe Baldrick the plasterer from Dis. About to get hit by a bombing raid.

I hope we use Willy Pete, or at least Napalm. But preferably Willy Pete.

CaptainChewbacca wrote:You'd be surprised at the odd choices people will make when confronted with a flood of lava.

Anybody who's from the area would run for the bridge and hope for the best. Trust me when I say you have a better chance of survival going through gang territory wearing another gang's colors. After all, there's always a chance that you'll just get a beatdown, especially if they don't know you.

I restate: There will be blood, Mr. Fibuli. There will be blood!

First, steel rain. Then lava rain. Then Arclight..... leading up to the Shep doctrine.


There will be blood indeed.

Junghalli wrote:Here's something I've been wondering about.

We've established that in this universe the Biblical account is true insofar as Demons really were a rebellious faction of Angels. So shouldn't they be the same species and look the same? If it was a supernatural cosmology you could write it up to the Fallen Angels being cursed to take grotesque shapes (the usual explanation for why Demons don't resemble Angels), but since in this universe they're basically just plain organic beings like us they should still be the same species and look the same.

You could write it up to divergent evolution brought on by environmental pressures in Hell, but while that might work for "young" Demons it wouldn't work for ones like Abigor that were alive at the time of the revolt. Those should be biologically identical to Angels, but I'm getting the impression of them being "standard" Demons in the story (horns, hooves, no wings etc.). How does that work?

Maybe it's based on the different kinds of soul energy that each side has access to.

Remember that when they first saw Appoloin they mistook him for a baldrick, only realizing that he was an angel when they looked at his corpse up close.

XaLEv wrote:Remember that when they first saw Appoloin they mistook him for a baldrick, only realizing that he was an angel when they looked at his corpse up close.

Because any non-human thing that doesn't die immediately from being shot with small-arms, when they've been busy shooting baldricks (which are non-human things that don't die immediately from smallarms) for a while... well, probably will be initially mistaken for a Baldrick.

Chris OFarrell wrote: Spare parts are still being made for them -they are still being constructed somewhere in all probability- and the more modern versions have shown to be able to be upgraded with the latest gear quite easily, upto things like Bushmaster cannons off an M2/M3 in fact.

Normal M113s are out of production as far as I can tell, but a couple places still make the enlarged Armored Infantry Fighting Vehicle variant, which was privately developed in the 1960s and never used by the US military. The vehicle was intended form the start to accept 1 man turrets or enclosed cupolas mounting machine guns or a 25mm cannon (one Isreali turret has a 30mm + twin Hellfire!). If you really want, a 3in or 90mm gun is no problem for even the stock M113, abet at loss of almost all infantry carrying capability to make room for the ammo load. 160mm mortars have been fitted by the IDF.

If nothing else, they would make the perfect vehicle for the USV squad and platoon sized units to use as a rapid response unit.

Its easier and cheaper to keep wheeled vehicles going if your going to drive on paved roads in 99% of the time, as would be in the case within the lower 48 states. In hell the utility of wheeled armor will depend heavily on the terrain, in the worst of it they wont be able to go more then a few miles without popping every tire on volcanic rocks. Course, unless the M113 can ford lava it wont be going much further.

The Duchess of Zeon wrote:

NecronLord wrote:Oh dear. Poor Joe Baldrick the plasterer from Dis. About to get hit by a bombing raid.

I hope we use Willy Pete, or at least Napalm. But preferably Willy Pete.

I'd want some "cookies" in first to break up structures and have demons running into the streets, then good old willy.

The ADF has a program running to lengthen and re-engine etc our M113s. As usual, it is behind schedule and over budget. Maybe this war will cause some to extract their digits on this program. As a second echelon tracked APC it would be quite suitable.

Karl Rove is an interesting diversion. I don't think Stuart is saying he dislikes Rove in particular, just that he dislikes that sort of political animal that occurs on both sides of politics. If caught at the right moment out of the corner of one's eye they all seem to have lizard type eyes and small sharp teeth that their serpine tongue licks over. The least these people would do for the slightest political advantage is to sell their grannies, pops, children, favourite dogs etc into slavery

Junghalli wrote:You could write it up to divergent evolution brought on by environmental pressures in Hell

We've already seen a subspecies of demon that's half giant snake. That's a hell of a lot of divergent evolution. I have another explanation in mind that may or may not make it into the story at some point.

SeaSkimmer wrote:Course, unless the M113 can ford lava it wont be going much further.

Of course it can! Sparky told me so! Forward the SuperGavins!

Starglider wrote:

SeaSkimmer wrote:Course, unless the M113 can ford lava it wont be going much further.

Of course it can! Sparky told me so! Forward the SuperGavins!

*Snicker*

JBG wrote:Karl Rove is an interesting diversion. I don't think Stuart is saying he dislikes Rove in particular, just that he dislikes that sort of political animal that occurs on both sides of politics. If caught at the right moment out of the corner of one's eye they all seem to have lizard type eyes and small sharp teeth that their serpine tongue licks over. The least these people would do for the slightest political advantage is to sell their grannies, pops, children, favourite dogs etc into slavery

Exactly; there are Karl Rove's on both sides of the political fence (James Carville comes to mind at this point) and they're all equally slimy. Rove happens to be particularly obvious because the party he operates for is in power right now. Rove's particular problem is that he has random malfunctions of the "edit" button between his brain and his mouth. I can assure you that all the politicians in this story (and those who don't appear in it) will look at the Sheffield and Detroit attacks and weigh up the political consequences for the next election. It's just that few of them are dumb enough to admit it.

I think Rove also stands apart because the current administration set something of a high water mark in terms of blurring the distinction between campaigning and governing, which means that people like him have much more power between elections than they should ever really have. Hence, he's become a very prominent political figure (not to mention being involved in some high-level cases such as the Valerie Plame case).

Mind you, FreakHead Carville was pretty prominent during the Clinton years too, but that was mostly because he was right out there doing publicity and interviews with the press. I remember during the 1990s, wondering whether the man ever slept. Rove, on the other hand, became prominent even when trying to avoid the press.

I think this story did not tell us about one thing...is Muhammad considered a true prophet of Yahweh in this story?