[Discussion]Pleb comments in Testing?

[Knife]

I haven't had this many PM's in...well since before RogueIce got a girlfriend.

I've been pondering a better way for the masses to put in their input on Senate threads. I think it's important for the rest of us to be able to easily voice our thoughts, and the current improvised PM system is a pain for both the common folk and the senate folk.

How about a stickied thread in Testing for each Senate discussion thread? Link to the senate thread in the testing thread and vice versa; that way the rest of the board can easily voice an opinion that can just as easily be observed if useful or ignored by the senate if things end up getting out of hand. In testing, such stuff will disappear when it's outlived it's usefulness and it won't clutter the rest of the board.

Presumably there wouldn't be such a thing for explicit voting threads, as (in my mind) the purpose of this is for other folks to express actual ideas or give thoughtful input, not "ban +1".

If you'd post this as a discussion thread (with my name on it is fine) or bring it up with the relevant parties, I'd appreciate it.

Posted without serious comment by this Senator while I chew upon the idea.

[LadyTevar]

That's going to be a lot of stickies. We'd need someone to go in and kill each one as the discussion thread dies.

[Hotfoot]

And we'd have to read testing? Ugh.

[Knife]

That's going to be a lot of stickies. We'd need someone to go in and kill each one as the discussion thread dies.

Still haven't decided how I feel about the subject but in relation you your post, an easy fix might just be one pleb comment sticky that gets purged every ten pages or so.

[Dalton]

I don't know. Some people like to retain anonymity when sending suggestions to the Senate.

[Hotfoot]

I don't know. Some people like to retain anonymity when sending suggestions to the Senate.

Couldn't you do that with Testing? Unless something changed since I last checked, you could post without logging in, right?

[Knife]

I don't know. Some people like to retain anonymity when sending suggestions to the Senate.

Again, to play devils advocate, since it's not my idea; I guess the PM system still works for anonymity, while those who want to voice an opinion, can do so in testing without bugging a Senator.

[Coyote]

It could be like the Rant threads, where it is stickied for a period of time... then cut loose to sink into the morass and be lost when the pertinent subject is voted on and passed.

I like this plan! I'm excited about this plan!

[Surlethe]

I don't know. Some people like to retain anonymity when sending suggestions to the Senate.

Couldn't you do that with Testing? Unless something changed since I last checked, you could post without logging in, right?

No. It's been disabled for nigh on a year now.

My concern with a Testing sticky is that the Testing signal:noise ratio, while still better than other forums', is still very low. The sticky could become a spamfest with very little actual feedback, causing a hardworking Senator to waste his time slogging through it for no rewarding comments.

[Knife]

It could be like the Rant threads, where it is stickied for a period of time... then cut loose to sink into the morass and be lost when the pertinent subject is voted on and passed.

I like this plan! I'm excited about this plan!

There is a very definate, slim chance, we'd survive it.

My concern with a Testing sticky is that the Testing signal:noise ratio, while still better than other forums', is still very low. The sticky could become a spamfest with very little actual feedback, causing a hardworking Senator to waste his time slogging through it for no rewarding comments.

I might be wrong, but the intent I got from the original poster was more a way for plebs to communicate their ire or support for senate threads, rather than direct communication from plebs to Senators via importent threads.

The PM system would still work for actual communication.[/quote]

[Knife]

From a concern citizen;

Not every issue raised in the Senate warrants (or will even necessarily garner) comment and discussion by the general membership.

However, should there be multiple issues going on at the same time which generate considerable discussion, it could easily overload a unified "post all your Senate commentary here" thread into nigh-unreadability.

In my opinion, I think it would be a hell of a lot simpler to simply allow people to create threads on the topic of Senate discussions. Right now, I have the distinct feeling - and I freely admit it may be baseless - that if I were to go into Off-Topic right now and post a thread along the lines of "so what do you guys think about [insert Senate discussion here]?", it would be closed and frowned upon. Just letting people know it's okay to start a thread discussing a topic currently being pondered by the Senate seems to me the simplest way to tackle this issue.

Neither Off-Topic nor Testing are currently so busy that a few extra threads concerning Senate activities are likely to push active threads into page 2 and out of sight, so I don't think there's any real concerns at this point on the impact this will have on ease of browsing. If this should change in the future then the policy can be revised. If people go overboard it can be curbed or even stopped. It seems a harmless enough attempt to me.

[Zaia]

From a concern citizen;

Not every issue raised in the Senate warrants (or will even necessarily garner) comment and discussion by the general membership.

However, should there be multiple issues going on at the same time which generate considerable discussion, it could easily overload a unified "post all your Senate commentary here" thread into nigh-unreadability.

In my opinion, I think it would be a hell of a lot simpler to simply allow people to create threads on the topic of Senate discussions. Right now, I have the distinct feeling - and I freely admit it may be baseless - that if I were to go into Off-Topic right now and post a thread along the lines of "so what do you guys think about [insert Senate discussion here]?", it would be closed and frowned upon. Just letting people know it's okay to start a thread discussing a topic currently being pondered by the Senate seems to me the simplest way to tackle this issue.

Neither Off-Topic nor Testing are currently so busy that a few extra threads concerning Senate activities are likely to push active threads into page 2 and out of sight, so I don't think there's any real concerns at this point on the impact this will have on ease of browsing. If this should change in the future then the policy can be revised. If people go overboard it can be curbed or even stopped. It seems a harmless enough attempt to me.

I think I mostly agree with this, but have a slight reservation about the potential for people to start threads more to whine about being mentioned than to actually contribute meaningfully to the discussions. I would still say I'd be ok with giving it a try, though.

[Coyote]

Using the threads (OT or Testing) for spam or attention-whoring could be met with minor wrist-slappage anyway. Say, using a "Senate Attention" thread for personal wankage could earn a four-month custom title of "Paris Hilton" or something like that.

First thing I could think of for attention-whoring, I'm no necessarily dead-set on that-- a quick grab outta the hat idea.

[Dalton]

Suggestion from Starglider...

Oh and if you'd like I could implement automatic creation and deletion of senate mirror threads in testing as suggested in this senate thread, that should be easy. I'm afraid I can't help with the problem of getting anyone in the senate to pay attention to them though.

[Surlethe]

If Starglider can make it work with the auto-pruner, I'm interested into looking further into the idea of mirroring Senate threads.

[Coyote]

...I'm afraid I can't help with the problem of getting anyone in the senate to pay attention to them though.

I'd recommend a thread title such as "downoadable coupons for FREE BEER" or "Check out these HUGE BOOBS".

Avoid thread titles that discuss Viagra or Nigerian royalty, though.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

We're trying to be as useless as the real thing, but I like the basic idea of letting them comment in some fashion or another. I'm also at least somewhat annoyed with anonymous comments--if you write the Senate in the real world they do a fucking background check on you--since the whole "Senate, calm down" thread got frustrating fast with a bunch of anony's getting posted. It felt like you were debating someone who didn't exist.

[Zaia]

We're trying to be as useless as the real thing, but I like the basic idea of letting them comment in some fashion or another. I'm also at least somewhat annoyed with anonymous comments--if you write the Senate in the real world they do a fucking background check on you--since the whole "Senate, calm down" thread got frustrating fast with a bunch of anony's getting posted. It felt like you were debating someone who didn't exist.

I quite like the fact that people have the option to remain anonymous if they so choose. I think letting people's words stand for themselves is sometimes the best way to consider issues, so what we think of the person who's brought forth the issue is left out of it.

[Frank Hipper]

Some people ( ) think that merely having a senate is too far down the path of democracy for comfort...but plebe input?

If this is being given serious thought, why not just give everyone senator status?



Give everyone a voice and you end up with deafening white noise.

The Senate shall speak and the Plebes shall listen.
Period.

[Dalton]

I think having user input can be beneficial. Why turn away a suggestion just because it was made by a "plebe"?

[fgalkin]

I think having user input can be beneficial. Why turn away a suggestion just because it was made by a "plebe"?

If a plebe has a suggestion, he could do it the old way- PMing a Senator. That way, he will think twice before doing so, because if it's dumb, the Senator will not only decline to pass it on, he will mock the hell out of them for it. Quality control, people. Do you really want to sift through a thread filled with the half-formed brainchildren of the Testing crowd on an ego trip due to their new importance?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[The Duchess of Zeon]

We're trying to be as useless as the real thing, but I like the basic idea of letting them comment in some fashion or another. I'm also at least somewhat annoyed with anonymous comments--if you write the Senate in the real world they do a fucking background check on you--since the whole "Senate, calm down" thread got frustrating fast with a bunch of anony's getting posted. It felt like you were debating someone who didn't exist.

I quite like the fact that people have the option to remain anonymous if they so choose. I think letting people's words stand for themselves is sometimes the best way to consider issues, so what we think of the person who's brought forth the issue is left out of it.

That would be fine if a situation hadn't developed where instead of simply a single comment, the anonymous individuals would then mail in replies to the replies to their original comment, i.e., essentially a debate, but a debate where one part of the arrangement remained anonymous.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

I think having user input can be beneficial. Why turn away a suggestion just because it was made by a "plebe"?

If a plebe has a suggestion, he could do it the old way- PMing a Senator. That way, he will think twice before doing so, because if it's dumb, the Senator will not only decline to pass it on, he will mock the hell out of them for it. Quality control, people. Do you really want to sift through a thread filled with the half-formed brainchildren of the Testing crowd on an ego trip due to their new importance?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

You know, when you put it that way, I get this ugly mental image of the posters of Testing in this Roman style mob, screaming and throwing rocks to intimidate the Senate into allowing inlining of explicit 4chan images or something like that.

[Zaia]

That would be fine if a situation hadn't developed where instead of simply a single comment, the anonymous individuals would then mail in replies to the replies to their original comment, i.e., essentially a debate, but a debate where one part of the arrangement remained anonymous.

*shrugs* Maybe that person had legit points but was afraid you'd turn your nose up and sniff in disapproval at him or her because of who he or she was, instead of what he or she had to say. Because of that possibility, I think it's good that the option to be anonymous exists.

[Knife]

I don't really see it as any sort of Senator/pleb interaction in most cases, rather than letting the public at large discuss the happenings of the senate.

Since it's creation, the Senate forum has been viewable by the public at large for a sense of openess. I see nothing wrong with some one standing on their soap box in a some what structured way, and talking about the happenings of the senate.

Putting it in testing makes clean up easier, or Off topic would seem best. It's not like normal rules of the board would automatically disappear with such an understaking either. Any troll or dumbshit gets out of line and they deal with the Mods.