[Discussion] Longvin and the dishonesty debate
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- Darth Wong
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[Discussion] Longvin and the dishonesty debate
Ladies and gentlemen of the Senate, I present you with Longvin, who is arguing that anything short of an outright lie cannot possibly be considered deceptive or dishonest (hence, he feels that concealing important information about a product before sale is ethical because caveat emptor is an ethical "get out of jail free" card for the seller, not a warning to the buyer):
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=89806
Please read through the whole thread. At one point he even claims that lying is "morally neutral". Does he deserve a title for this? Or more? Quite frankly, his position seems to be so completely immune to evidence or argument that I seriously wonder whether he's deliberately trolling.
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=89806
Please read through the whole thread. At one point he even claims that lying is "morally neutral". Does he deserve a title for this? Or more? Quite frankly, his position seems to be so completely immune to evidence or argument that I seriously wonder whether he's deliberately trolling.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
http://www.stardestroyer.net/Mike/RantMode/Blurbs.html
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
http://www.stardestroyer.net/Mike/RantMode/Blurbs.html
He indeed seems to like the ethical system of 'whats good for me, is best' and clings onto the lie of omission to keep his bankrupt system afloat.
He also seems to either confuse and/or combine ethical and lawful. Whether he does it on purpose or out of ignorance, I don't know.
He also seems to either confuse and/or combine ethical and lawful. Whether he does it on purpose or out of ignorance, I don't know.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong
But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
Not the first time he has resorted to an impenetrable wall of ignorance, lies, distortions, red herrings and strawmen. He's like a poor quality copy of Tharkun, and as such, I don't see any reason why he should be kept around a moment longer than is absolutely necessary.
If we're not banning him outright, then he should be titled something like "Lying Sack of Shit" or similar.
Edi
If we're not banning him outright, then he should be titled something like "Lying Sack of Shit" or similar.
Edi
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Why is it so goddamned hard to get little assholes like you to admit it when you fuck up? Is it pride? What gives you the right to have any pride?
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GOP message? Why don't they just come out of the closet: FASCISTS R' US –Patrick Degan
The GOP has a problem with anyone coming out of the closet. –18-till-I-die
Why is it so goddamned hard to get little assholes like you to admit it when you fuck up? Is it pride? What gives you the right to have any pride?
–Darth Wong to vivftp
GOP message? Why don't they just come out of the closet: FASCISTS R' US –Patrick Degan
The GOP has a problem with anyone coming out of the closet. –18-till-I-die
- Stuart Mackey
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R.U sums our boy up quite well, I think.R.U.Serious wrote:. Like I said, the main problem with arguing with you, is that you don't know or don't care about the definitions and concepts of the things you are arguing about.
I remember arguing with him in some thread over a contention he had that certain methods used by the Nazi's in WW2, and the British during the Boar war {forced labour/concentation camps} was morally ethical in Iraq as a means of supressing the insurgency there. Only he thought it should be done on a nation wide, as in all of the population scale, IIRC.
He should be titled, Morally Bankrupt?, certainly. Given the manner of his 'debate style', in particular, but combined with his dubious ethics and morality, I wonder if he is worth while keeping at all, if all we will get is seven pages of what amounts to junk.
Via money Europe could become political in five years" "... the current communities should be completed by a Finance Common Market which would lead us to European economic unity. Only then would ... the mutual commitments make it fairly easy to produce the political union which is the goal"
Jean Omer Marie Gabriel Monnet
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Jean Omer Marie Gabriel Monnet
--------------
I should point out LongVin has flared up before; the day after Christmas AIDS thread comes to mind, and here's the thread Stuart Mackey referenced, I believe.
A Government founded upon justice, and recognizing the equal rights of all men; claiming higher authority for existence, or sanction for its laws, that nature, reason, and the regularly ascertained will of the people; steadily refusing to put its sword and purse in the service of any religious creed or family is a standing offense to most of the Governments of the world, and to some narrow and bigoted people among ourselves.
F. Douglass
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All that happened pretty early on in his career here too. He has a record of side-stepping questions for which providing answers would demonstrate the non-viability of his position, and attempting to lie to support it. Not to mention I've not ever seen him provide more than token evidence to back up his arguments.Surlethe wrote:I should point out LongVin has flared up before; the day after Christmas AIDS thread comes to mind, and here's the thread Stuart Mackey referenced, I believe.
In short, he's consistently and repeatedly advocated a morally repugnant view that cannot be logically sustained by anyone other than himself and similar "What's good for me and wealthy businessmen should be the ultimate goal of society. Fuck the rest of you useless fuckers" vultures. At least he should be slapped with a WTPF title. Otherwise, there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of reason to keep him around since he always resorts to the same dishonest debating tactics in an attempt to distract us away from his corrupt, irrational bullshit.
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2070s - The Seventy-Niners ... 3500s - Fair as Death ... 4900s - Against Improbable Odds V 1.0
2070s - The Seventy-Niners ... 3500s - Fair as Death ... 4900s - Against Improbable Odds V 1.0
- Ghost Rider
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When a person can so casually say this and not see what is wrong with it?But getting the best price is beneficial to me. Any action I take in any situation(situation below) can have a negative effect on another person. You have to decide whats in my best interests to do.
Definitly at bare minimum a title, but is skirting a great deal of rule breaking with broken record tactics.
MM /CF/WG/BOTM/JL/Original Warsie/ACPATHNTDWATGODW FOREVER!!
Sometimes we can choose the path we follow. Sometimes our choices are made for us. And sometimes we have no choice at all
Saying and doing are chocolate and concrete
Sometimes we can choose the path we follow. Sometimes our choices are made for us. And sometimes we have no choice at all
Saying and doing are chocolate and concrete
- The Yosemite Bear
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"a certain point of veiw" only works for guys named kenobi as to why they had to cut of their best friend's legs, arms and leave them to be consumed by lava.
at least sartre and machevelli goes to the point that if your going to be dishonest at least be honest with your self.
at least sartre and machevelli goes to the point that if your going to be dishonest at least be honest with your self.
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Something like "Ethically Questionable" might be good, or something else that alerts people to his shortcomings. WTPF doesn't really explain why, and it usually tends to be used for racist and sexist trolls.
Possible titles:
Dishonest
Ethically Questionable
Morally Bankrupt
Simple and descriptive.
Possible titles:
Dishonest
Ethically Questionable
Morally Bankrupt
Simple and descriptive.
Something about Libertarianism always bothered me. Then one day, I realized what it was:
Libertarian philosophy can be boiled down to the phrase, "Work Will Make You Free."
In Libertarianism, there is no Government, so the Bosses are free to exploit the Workers.
In Communism, there is no Government, so the Workers are free to exploit the Bosses.
So in Libertarianism, man exploits man, but in Communism, its the other way around!
If all you want to do is have some harmless, mindless fun, go H3RE INST3ADZ0RZ!!
Grrr! Fight my Brute, you pansy!
Libertarian philosophy can be boiled down to the phrase, "Work Will Make You Free."
In Libertarianism, there is no Government, so the Bosses are free to exploit the Workers.
In Communism, there is no Government, so the Workers are free to exploit the Bosses.
So in Libertarianism, man exploits man, but in Communism, its the other way around!
If all you want to do is have some harmless, mindless fun, go H3RE INST3ADZ0RZ!!
Grrr! Fight my Brute, you pansy!
I have received the following suggestion from a board member via private message:
I would like to suggest the title 'Morally Bankrupt Assole.
So he can be the MBA he so desparately wants to be
A Government founded upon justice, and recognizing the equal rights of all men; claiming higher authority for existence, or sanction for its laws, that nature, reason, and the regularly ascertained will of the people; steadily refusing to put its sword and purse in the service of any religious creed or family is a standing offense to most of the Governments of the world, and to some narrow and bigoted people among ourselves.
F. Douglass
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Not too huge to add, but a fun bit nonetheless
Darth Fanboy wrote:REgarding: http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=90036
I think it is worth noting that he has bragged openly about purchasing "Another Hope"
http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=89990
LongVin wrote:I am so ordering that to say I have a illegal book.I would think that the open admission pf purchasing copyright-infringing materials (especially material of obviously shit quality, heh) would speak negatively of him regarding his fate.LongVin wrote:It arrived! I haven't started reading it yet but it has arrived and I am staring at it now as it sits on my desk.
MM /CF/WG/BOTM/JL/Original Warsie/ACPATHNTDWATGODW FOREVER!!
Sometimes we can choose the path we follow. Sometimes our choices are made for us. And sometimes we have no choice at all
Saying and doing are chocolate and concrete
Sometimes we can choose the path we follow. Sometimes our choices are made for us. And sometimes we have no choice at all
Saying and doing are chocolate and concrete
- The Yosemite Bear
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Some shitball fanfic someone was peddleing on amazon.com, hence the illegal book part.The Yosemite Bear wrote:"another hope"?
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong
But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
- The Yosemite Bear
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Hereis the thread about it.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong
But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
I think I should present LongVin's latest response in the thread, elicited after a short series of Socratic questions, as clarification of some consequences of his ethical system:
LongVin wrote:In all honesty probably not. I want to live a long rich full life. Though maybe if my sacrifice was known and public knowledge I would consider it.Surlethe wrote:Okay; let's generalize this, then; suppose you were alive, as you are now, back in 1930. If you die then, the Holocaust will be prevented; if you choose to live, Hitler will go through with the Holocaust. Do you choose to die?
Also if in this scenario I had all the divination of knowing the future I would be apprehension to change the course of history. Though the holacaust being a tragic and unfortunate event it has had a profound effect on the politics of the later half of the 20th century.
A Government founded upon justice, and recognizing the equal rights of all men; claiming higher authority for existence, or sanction for its laws, that nature, reason, and the regularly ascertained will of the people; steadily refusing to put its sword and purse in the service of any religious creed or family is a standing offense to most of the Governments of the world, and to some narrow and bigoted people among ourselves.
F. Douglass