Type I, II, and III civilizations.

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Mr. B
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Type I, II, and III civilizations.

Post by Mr. B » 2002-07-21 01:51pm

Type I Controls the energy resources of an entire planet. This civilisation can control the weather, prevent natural disasters, mine deep into Earth's crust. And has completed exploration of solar system.

Type II A civilization that controls the power of the sun itself. Directly consumes the power ofthe sun to fuek it's machines. Begins colinization of local star systems.

Type III Controls the power of the Entire galaxy. For power they harness the energy of billions of star systems. Has mastered Einsteins equations and can manipulate space time at will.

(From Nikolai Kardashev. taken from the Book by Michio Kaku)

Put your favorite Sci Fi universes in these categories.
Like how Star Wars is a Type III and Star Trek is a type II.
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Post by Admiral Valdemar » 2002-07-21 02:21pm

Type III: Culture, Homomdan, Xeelee, Timelords, Systems Commonwealth, Empire, Yuuzhan Vong, NR.

Type II: UFP, Borg, Voth, Klingons, Romulans, Affront, Chelgrians.

Type I: Sod only knows, us?

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Post by NecronLord » 2002-07-21 02:41pm

I really think people over estimate the Time lords, they only control one planet, Gallifray. At one stage the Daleks had Tardis technology...
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Post by Mr. B » 2002-07-21 02:45pm

We are a Type 0. Sorry to say.
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Post by Admiral Valdemar » 2002-07-21 02:53pm

NecronLord wrote:I really think people over estimate the Time lords, they only control one planet, Gallifray. At one stage the Daleks had Tardis technology...
But when you have the ability to control space-time like they can, who needs more planets? Think of them as the real police of space-time, not those gay 29th C Feds.

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Post by NecronLord » 2002-07-21 03:15pm

True, though they don't actually do much, their non interference policy makes the prime directive look like an incitement to riot.
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Post by Solid Snake » 2002-07-21 08:52pm

Hyperspace was an amazing book. How long do you think it will take for us to reach type I?
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Post by Enlightenment » 2002-07-21 09:57pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote: Type II: UFP
Calling the UFP and the rest of the Trek races type IIs is really pushing it. I did some energy calcs based on the semi-canon fuel requirements for the GCS and the results put the UFP well below the lower limit for a type II civilization. Since the UFP comes within an order of magnitude of all Trek races (with the exception of Q and the Voth), it's reasonable to assume that the rest of the Trek species are stuck at the type I level, too.

Here's a collection of estimates from the last time this came up on SB:

Galactic Empire II-8 / III
Total Anihilation III
Systems Commonwealth II-3
Culture V
Excession VI
United Federation of Planets I-4
Dominion I-5
Borg I-5
Klingons I-3
Romulan Empire I-3
Minbari Federation I-4
Interstellar Alliance I-5
Centauri Empire I-4
Earth Alliance I-3
Narn Republic I-4
Moving Mars VI
Species 8472 II-4+?
Krenim V
Xeelee V
29th century UFP V
Thirdspace aliens IV

NNote that this list is drawn up using the Kardashev-Sagan type scale with additions made for civilizations able to control an entire universe (IV), modify spacetime in a nonlinear fashion (V; think effectors, etc) and alter physical law (VI).
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Re: Type I, II, and III civilizations.

Post by David » 2002-07-21 11:10pm

Mr. B wrote:Type I Controls the energy resources of an entire planet. This civilisation can control the weather, prevent natural disasters, mine deep into Earth's crust. And has completed exploration of solar system.

Type II A civilization that controls the power of the sun itself. Directly consumes the power ofthe sun to fuek it's machines. Begins colinization of local star systems.

Type III Controls the power of the Entire galaxy. For power they harness the energy of billions of star systems. Has mastered Einsteins equations and can manipulate space time at will.

(From Nikolai Kardashev. taken from the Book by Michio Kaku)

Put your favorite Sci Fi universes in these categories.
Like how Star Wars is a Type III and Star Trek is a type II.

No intermediates between 2 and 3? Take for example the aliens of Space: Above and Beyond, they were somewhere in between.

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Post by Mr. B » 2002-07-22 12:01am

SolidSnake wrote: Hyperspace was an amazing book. How long do you think it will take for us to reach type I?
IF we reach type two. We still might kill ourselves off.
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Post by Ladysekhmet » 2002-07-22 01:51am

I'm surprised that no one mentioned the Vorlons or the Shadows in with type III. The Timelords start out pretty menacing, but got wussier as the series progressed. I do think they are type 3 though, since the original question was in regards to technology and not military might.
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Post by Enlightenment » 2002-07-22 02:21am

Ladysekhmet wrote:I'm surprised that no one mentioned the Vorlons or the Shadows in with type III.
The only way the S&V come anywhere near type III is if their planet killers are able to vaporize or completely dissassociate planets. Without the planet killers both civilizations haven't shown enough power to rank any higher than type II _at most._


The B5 EU changes this a bit given that the S&V are, according to a Fiver on SB, able to create and destroy 'small universes.' However this just is so far out to lunch given S&V abilities demonstrated on air that I'm inclined to write off the B5 EU as a fscked up pile of crap and leave it at that.
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Post by Gil Hamilton » 2002-07-22 07:08am

To be honest, I'd classify the Galactic Empire as a Type II Civilization. I mean, they harness the power of suns certainly, but they aren't the galaxy controlling force that Kardashev envisioned. Type III Civilizations are like the Culture and the retired/transcended races in the Uplift books by David Brin. I mean, seriously powerful to the point of rediculousness.

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Post by Gil Hamilton » 2002-07-22 07:11am

Enlightenment wrote:The only way the S&V come anywhere near type III is if their planet killers are able to vaporize or completely dissassociate planets. Without the planet killers both civilizations haven't shown enough power to rank any higher than type II _at most._


The B5 EU changes this a bit given that the S&V are, according to a Fiver on SB, able to create and destroy 'small universes.' However this just is so far out to lunch given S&V abilities demonstrated on air that I'm inclined to write off the B5 EU as a fscked up pile of crap and leave it at that.
Also, they get alot of their uber-powerful visions of the First Ones from novels and such, where the FOs are that insanely powerful. Going purely on the TV series I agree with you, though the Vorlons always seemed to bit more powerful than the Shadows simply because they were that much more mysterious.

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Post by Mr. B » 2002-07-22 01:11pm

Gil Hamilton wrote: To be honest, I'd classify the Galactic Empire as a Type II Civilization. I mean, they harness the power of suns certainly, but they aren't the galaxy controlling force that Kardashev envisioned. Type III Civilizations are like the Culture and the retired/transcended races in the Uplift books by David Brin. I mean, seriously powerful to the point of rediculousness.
But the ranking is based on what is used for energy/power. SD and the DS use power that is more powerful than hundreds of stars, especially the DS.
And they have the ability to travel the galaxy in a week or two, destroy planets and whole systems, and have attempted to search beyond the galaxy.
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Post by ArmorPierce » 2002-07-25 10:43pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote:Type I: Sod only knows, us?
We are not a type I civilization yet. The Confedracy from StarCraft might fit into there bordering on the edge type II.
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Post by Master of Ossus » 2002-07-25 10:48pm

I don't think that the UFP, Borg, or any ST races are to be considered Type II. Remember how surprised all of the Enterprise-D's crew was when they discovered a Dayson sphere?

BTW, they might not even be Type I. I have not seen them control the weather over the whole of earth, before.
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Post by ArmorPierce » 2002-07-25 10:51pm

Master of Ossus wrote:BTW, they might not even be Type I. I have not seen them control the weather over the whole of earth, before.
Yes they are definitely a type I because they are able to contol the weather over the whole Earth. They Might be or border on the edge of a type II civilization because of the space they colonized.
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Post by Solid Snake » 2002-07-25 10:52pm

In the actual book, Hyperspace, Mr. Kaku described the United Federation of planets as a type II civilization. But in a show, i cant remember the title, he described the Galactic Empire as type III! Bwahahahahaha! Trekkies have no escape from the wrath of the Warsies! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
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Post by Mr. B » 2002-07-25 11:47pm

SolidSnake wrote: In the actual book, Hyperspace, Mr. Kaku described the United Federation of planets as a type II civilization. But in a show, i cant remember the title, he described the Galactic Empire as type III! Bwahahahahaha! Trekkies have no escape from the wrath of the Warsies! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
Yes I had forgotten that. And i wonder what rabid trekkies have to think about that. They probably consider ST to be a type III.
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