STGOD 2k8 background thread

Create, read, or participate in text-based RPGs

Moderators: Thanas, Steve

User avatar
Covenant
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4451
Joined: 2006-04-11 07:43am

Post by Covenant »

I don't like the idea of the Emperor being a bloated sack of suck. I'd really prefer for the Emperor itself to be a much less important figure than the Empire itself. I think the idea of a comically worthless leader jives with the idea of a Reich but I don't want us to be some kind of spawn of moronic space Nazi's. The Empire functioned well for a very long time and did a good job at it's grim task despite it's own inherent insanity of purpose, and I don't think this works with a megalomaniac in charge. It'd go off the rails, and become an engine for his own ego gratification. Unless the Emperor has lived for thousands of years (which I would hesitate to say, since it's too 40k) then there's no way for the Empire to have stayed this on-message for that duration without a strong ruling council in charge. This is one instance where I'd prefer the Moffs being in control than the Emperor, for example.

I think it just makes the entire theme weaker if the Empire was hilariously retarded. It should not a bloated child that only oppressed it'd wiser constituent elements. I know everyone wants to be one of the bits of enlightened society, but I think it's a bad idea to make the Imperial leadership foolish. I'd rather have had it been beaten by a powerful and lucky foe than one who was merely not retarded, since it just... seems stupid beyond words otherwise.

An Empire needn't be mentally deficient in order to collapse, afterall. Maybe it just ran into something as strong as itself. That's a better story than another "Vain, Foolish Leader Destroys Massive Empire" dialectic.
User avatar
SirNitram
Rest in Peace, Black Mage
Posts: 28367
Joined: 2002-07-03 04:48pm
Location: Somewhere between nowhere and everywhere

Post by SirNitram »

Why not just take a cue from the real world, and by that, I mean not Nazis?

A powerful central council who gradually moved to 'Interperating The Emperor's Will' as the religious signifigance of the Ruler Of Humanity rose, would inevitably become full of powerbrokers and backstabbers fighting for their own agendas. The Emperor would become a puppet, never seen, never heard. The inspiration is obviously WW2 Era Japan.

Heck, I might decide the Enclave have the Emperor, but of course no one would believe that rumour. The Emperor would have smote them with the fury of ten thousand stars.
Manic Progressive: A liberal who violently swings from anger at politicos to despondency over them.

Out Of Context theatre: Ron Paul has repeatedly said he's not a racist. - Destructinator XIII on why Ron Paul isn't racist.

Shadowy Overlord - BMs/Black Mage Monkey - BOTM/Jetfire - Cybertron's Finest/General Miscreant/ASVS/Supermoderator Emeritus

Debator Classification: Trollhunter
User avatar
Tanasinn
Jedi Council Member
Posts: 1765
Joined: 2007-01-21 10:10pm
Location: Void Zone

Post by Tanasinn »

I'll sketch out a rough timeline, too. Feel free to comment on anything that seems off.

Earlier Times:
-Khan Union civil war
-Khan Union rebuilding, rechristening as "Humanist Union"
-Father's ascendancy to the command of the Union and "birth" into advanced posthuman status

Pre Final War:
-Surge in military buildup, increasing attitudes of xenophobia
-Increasing insulation from the Empire proper
-The death of the last "high general" from the Khan Union civil war; Father left as the soul command figure from that period

Commencement of the Final War:
-Insulation from the Empire hits its peak; open anti-Imperialism begins to appear
-Humanist Union openly offers to accept refugee humans
-Humanist Union augments the Empire with its naval might

Early Final War:
-Open anti-Imperialism grows
-Humanist Union withdraws some formal military support of the Empire

Mid Final War:
-Humanist Union withdraws the majority of its military support from the Empire in favor of fortifying the homeworlds

Late Final War:
-Humanist Union naval vessels openly attack any vulnerable Imperial vessels passing through Union space.
-Alien sapients are forbidden to set foot on Union planets without formal permission (for things such as research populations)

Post Final War:
-Humanist Union formally declares independence
-Humanist Union proceeds on a campaign of denouncing the Empire, its works, and its remaining authority figures
-Humanist Union vows to free oppressed populations from the shackles of petty warlords.
Adrian Laguna
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4736
Joined: 2005-05-18 01:31am

Post by Adrian Laguna »

SirNitram wrote:Why not just take a cue from the real world, and by that, I mean not Nazis?
I understand that the Empire was supposed to be really, really old. Nazis are inherently unstable and not very given to building long-lasting nations.


Anyway, what I'm picturing is that the Empire was run more or less competently. It collapsed because extra-galactic aliens appeared and they blew-up Earth. Imagining what would happen to the British Empire if London was turned into a radioactive crater. All the colonies would naturally become their own nations.
User avatar
Covenant
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4451
Joined: 2006-04-11 07:43am

Post by Covenant »

Adrian Laguna wrote:
SirNitram wrote:Why not just take a cue from the real world, and by that, I mean not Nazis?
I understand that the Empire was supposed to be really, really old. Nazis are inherently unstable and not very given to building long-lasting nations.


Anyway, what I'm picturing is that the Empire was run more or less competently. It collapsed because extra-galactic aliens appeared and they blew-up Earth. Imagining what would happen to the British Empire if London was turned into a radioactive crater. All the colonies would naturally become their own nations.
I think that's healthier, and I like both yours and Nit's take on it, and would agree. It's way too easy to make them look like loons and then write ourselves into it as the only sane elements. However, a lot of the histories we're showing demonstrates a clear misunderstanding on the Empire's part of being able to properly manage their clientele, so to speak. That seems a bit unusual for a force that's lasted so long, despite (probably) growing pressure. It's possible they've only recently gotten oppressive--but wouldn't that make all these longstanding grudges against the Empire misplaced?

I like the idea of a council being more in control than an Emperor. It's just more consistant. Not that the Academy couldn't want to assassinate the Emperor--but for all they know, maybe there isn't one. The Emperor could just be a bigass computer brain built into Fortress Terra and run by the illuminati at the head of the Empire's power structure.
User avatar
Academia Nut
Sith Devotee
Posts: 2598
Joined: 2005-08-23 10:44pm
Location: Edmonton, Alberta

Post by Academia Nut »

Ahem, now for some commentary on the Awesome.

1) While there is a definite gestalt effect, Ruckers are fountains of self-confidence, part of the reason their culture is so damn macho. Unless you have the self-confidence to head-butt the laws of physics, you're just going to go insane from the strain of the power flowing through you. Thus pretty much the only way to make a single Rucker blow up is to have several million regular humans simultaneously all believe at their very cores that he will blow up. If you could somehow do this though, it would be Awesome beyond belief. Of course, you would also have to fight all the other Konige. The end result would probably be to rip a permanent hole in the cosmos where the laws of physics break down completely.

The creation of an Eye of Awesome so to speak. I don't think any of us want that. Well... maybe I do because there is a chance that we'll create this universe's version of Slaanesh, but for the rest of you that's probably a bad thing.

2) The Awesome does not just affect humans, it also causes real physical damage. As in the story, ripping apart the atmosphere and the generation of a plasma glow discharge and bolts of lightning are common effects. And despite all their skill, neither duelist was carrying the biggest amps, like the ones used on starships, which are quite obviously capable of tearing apart other ships.

3) Perceived audience is sometimes as important as an actual one. So a single Rucker against a multitude of Chamarans would probably be screwed anyway due to sheer numbers, but the Rucker's belief of an audience would mitigate it somewhat.

Basically, everyone is more or less on equal footing, but yeah, a fight between a Konige Rucker and a Chamaran Samurai (as a suggestion the actual Japanese for a female member of the warrior caste is "onna bugeisha") would be an incredible sight to see.

Oh, and the actual saying for the Konige is "If one rocks out in the shower, did one really rock out?"
I love learning. Teach me. I will listen.
You know, if Christian dogma included a ten-foot tall Jesus walking around in battle armor and smashing retarded cultists with a gaint mace, I might just convert - Noble Ire on Jesus smashing Scientologists
User avatar
Rogue 9
Scrapping TIEs since 1997
Posts: 18644
Joined: 2003-11-12 01:10pm
Location: Classified
Contact:

Post by Rogue 9 »

You realize that if you actually use amps as your weapons, I for one am going to laugh at you and railgun you apart while your overpowering noise generators fail to generate noise in a vacuum, right?

Anyway, to business:

Earlier Times:
Early colonization: First colony ships launched from Earth. The colony fleet that would eventually land in the Nashtari star cluster is one of several sponsored by the United States and former British Commonwealth powers. Former Eastern Bloc nations and several influential Asian countries launch their own colonial expeditions at roughly the same time.

Worldwide Hegemony: Well after the departure of the colony ships, but while the fleets are still en route, the beginnings of the Empire begin to emerge. The catalyst for the formation of the Empire is the invention of a practical FTL drive by an ideologue scientist named Victor Prokofiev; Prokofiev envisions a grand destiny for the human race among the stars, one far beyond the scope of the original colonial expeditions. A coalition of nations join together to better exploit this new technology and carry humanity across the galaxy; they begin to fall under the sway of corruption and internal infighting on matters unrelated to their star-spanning ambitions.

Empire Established: Military leaders stage a coup using the warships developed to conquer the cosmos; the Empire is born. Imperial vessels move out to colonize inhabitable worlds, starting with the ones targeted by the earlier colony ships. In many cases, the FTL-equipped Imperial ships arrive at their destinations before the massively slower colony fleets.


The Haruhi and Sasaki Heresies.

Pre Final War:
Increasing numbers of Imperial Academy of Science members arrested for heresy.

Commencement of the Final War: Academy plot to overthrow Emperor fails due to Enclave invading.
Enclave invades.

Early Final War:
Academy becomes an enemy of the Empire, members captured/executed/exiled.
Academy springs "heretics" from Imperial prison colony during Empire/Enclave battle.
Academy Vanguard formed.
Haruhi's offer of open military assistance is rejected by the Empire.

Mid Final War:
Sasaki convinces the Canopy Domain to lend a battle fleet to openly assist Enclave operations.
Haruhi authorizes the lending of covert assistance to nearby Imperial worlds in need of it.

Late Final War:
The Eighth Dictate reorganizes into the Consolidated Dominion of Gemude to combat the growing threat of organized marauders from the wilds of space, effectively declaring independence and triggering a wave of open separatist movements across the mid-range colonies.
Haruhi seizes several outer colonies under the cover of "peacekeeping and military assistance purposes," taking full advantage of the chaos provided by the Empire/Enclave conflict and the separatist movements in the middle colonies.

Post Final War:
Last edited by Rogue 9 on 2007-11-23 11:46pm, edited 1 time in total.
It's Rogue, not Rouge!

HAB | KotL | VRWC/ELC/CDA | TRotR | The Anti-Confederate | Sluggite | Gamer | Blogger | Staff Reporter | Student | Musician
User avatar
SirNitram
Rest in Peace, Black Mage
Posts: 28367
Joined: 2002-07-03 04:48pm
Location: Somewhere between nowhere and everywhere

Post by SirNitram »

I do hope that you realize, Rogue, if you do that when he fair and square puts points into amps to use psi-powers through, an Enclave ship is going to simply shred one of your ships by never dropping under cee?

Don't be a dick.
Manic Progressive: A liberal who violently swings from anger at politicos to despondency over them.

Out Of Context theatre: Ron Paul has repeatedly said he's not a racist. - Destructinator XIII on why Ron Paul isn't racist.

Shadowy Overlord - BMs/Black Mage Monkey - BOTM/Jetfire - Cybertron's Finest/General Miscreant/ASVS/Supermoderator Emeritus

Debator Classification: Trollhunter
User avatar
Academia Nut
Sith Devotee
Posts: 2598
Joined: 2005-08-23 10:44pm
Location: Edmonton, Alberta

Post by Academia Nut »

As I have said repeatedly

"Sound does not travel in space, but the Awesome does."

That's pretty much the origin of the Konige, a discussion somewhere on this board months ago about using the "Minmay Tactic" only with Dethklok. I'm a fucking engineer, I know sound doesn't travel in space.
I love learning. Teach me. I will listen.
You know, if Christian dogma included a ten-foot tall Jesus walking around in battle armor and smashing retarded cultists with a gaint mace, I might just convert - Noble Ire on Jesus smashing Scientologists
User avatar
Rogue 9
Scrapping TIEs since 1997
Posts: 18644
Joined: 2003-11-12 01:10pm
Location: Classified
Contact:

Post by Rogue 9 »

From the way he's described his little mumbo-jumbo as working, the target has to believe it could happen for it to work. Being of reasonable intelligence, I should hope ship crews of just about any nation would completely fail to even conceive that amplifiers could work in space, much less go out of their mental way to think of the idea as awesome.
It's Rogue, not Rouge!

HAB | KotL | VRWC/ELC/CDA | TRotR | The Anti-Confederate | Sluggite | Gamer | Blogger | Staff Reporter | Student | Musician
User avatar
SirNitram
Rest in Peace, Black Mage
Posts: 28367
Joined: 2002-07-03 04:48pm
Location: Somewhere between nowhere and everywhere

Post by SirNitram »

Rogue 9 wrote:From the way he's described his little mumbo-jumbo as working, the target has to believe it could happen for it to work. Being of reasonable intelligence, I should hope ship crews of just about any nation would completely fail to even conceive that amplifiers could work in space, much less go out of their mental way to think of the idea as awesome.
If you don't want to play, there's the door. Because being a little annoying fuck for the sole reason of contrarianism and pretending you've got some sort of pedestal to stand on is not going to fly. I'm playing a dead serious nation, but I'm fine with it. Why can't you? Oh yes, you've got a fucking superiority complex. Ram it up your ass, perhaps it'll shake the stick loose.
Manic Progressive: A liberal who violently swings from anger at politicos to despondency over them.

Out Of Context theatre: Ron Paul has repeatedly said he's not a racist. - Destructinator XIII on why Ron Paul isn't racist.

Shadowy Overlord - BMs/Black Mage Monkey - BOTM/Jetfire - Cybertron's Finest/General Miscreant/ASVS/Supermoderator Emeritus

Debator Classification: Trollhunter
User avatar
Rogue 9
Scrapping TIEs since 1997
Posts: 18644
Joined: 2003-11-12 01:10pm
Location: Classified
Contact:

Post by Rogue 9 »

I've got no pedestal to stand on. I dislike the idea because he can essentially do whatever the fuck he wants with it; if the Konige think that assraping whoever they're attacking at the moment with minimal resistance would be Awesome, then it would happen. Since that's doubtlessly what they think, I for one am not going to volunteer to be in the way of it.
It's Rogue, not Rouge!

HAB | KotL | VRWC/ELC/CDA | TRotR | The Anti-Confederate | Sluggite | Gamer | Blogger | Staff Reporter | Student | Musician
User avatar
Academia Nut
Sith Devotee
Posts: 2598
Joined: 2005-08-23 10:44pm
Location: Edmonton, Alberta

Post by Academia Nut »

Actually, the target believing in it was an addition of Covenant's, not my original idea. In space combat imagine a wave of pure force that resonants on a similar frequency to sound audible to human ears that slams into the target and rips it apart at an atomic level. Covenant though the idea of the Awesome was, well, awesome, and so he decided to expand on it and turn it into the Force, something fundamental to humanity, if only fully explored by a few factions. Personally, the target having to believe in it to is probably going a bit too far, but from the beginning the Awesome has been described as just something the Konige do. Whether its psionics or magic or fucking invisible unicorns, it just works, it just does. There was no intention to make it better than standard means, just different.
I love learning. Teach me. I will listen.
You know, if Christian dogma included a ten-foot tall Jesus walking around in battle armor and smashing retarded cultists with a gaint mace, I might just convert - Noble Ire on Jesus smashing Scientologists
User avatar
SirNitram
Rest in Peace, Black Mage
Posts: 28367
Joined: 2002-07-03 04:48pm
Location: Somewhere between nowhere and everywhere

Post by SirNitram »

Rogue 9 wrote:I've got no pedestal to stand on. I dislike the idea because he can essentially do whatever the fuck he wants with it; if the Konige think that assraping whoever they're attacking at the moment with minimal resistance would be Awesome, then it would happen. Since that's doubtlessly what they think, I for one am not going to volunteer to be in the way of it.
Thank you for the Black/White Fallacy, you ignorant little fucktard. Do you want to continue to demonstrate you really are no better than what you accuse(Not, at all, what he is claiming) him of being? Or would you like to grow the fuck up? Because your pedestal is very much there, and you're showing that you're so nearsighted you can't see it. Or beyond your upturned nose.
Manic Progressive: A liberal who violently swings from anger at politicos to despondency over them.

Out Of Context theatre: Ron Paul has repeatedly said he's not a racist. - Destructinator XIII on why Ron Paul isn't racist.

Shadowy Overlord - BMs/Black Mage Monkey - BOTM/Jetfire - Cybertron's Finest/General Miscreant/ASVS/Supermoderator Emeritus

Debator Classification: Trollhunter
User avatar
Covenant
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4451
Joined: 2006-04-11 07:43am

Post by Covenant »

By the way, I made the target's level of belief merely a way to multiply the effects. To simulate the way in which someone could go "no way," and then burst into flames as they're overcome by someone's coolness. I suppose if nobody thought it was Awesome it wouldn't work, but if you think it's awesome then that's always one person. I seriously don't know why people find that so hard to understand, or why it's a point of such contention. Everyone whined for their quantek devices back in the day, and now's not the time to suddenly disblieve psionics.
Rogue 9 wrote:I've got no pedestal to stand on. I dislike the idea because he can essentially do whatever the fuck he wants with it; if the Konige think that assraping whoever they're attacking at the moment with minimal resistance would be Awesome, then it would happen. Since that's doubtlessly what they think, I for one am not going to volunteer to be in the way of it.
Seriously, are you retarded? Since when have psionics been anything other than a weapon or defense equal to the same point cost in railguns or energy shields? If he purchases psi-amps for his vehicles and starships in order to allow them to headbang your vessels to death, how is that any different than someone using psi-amps to mentally shake you to death? And since that's the same in-game effect as shooting cannonballs and lasers at someone, it doesn't matter. If he uses the Awesome to rape you in the ass, I can do the exact same thing, using guns and robots shaped like geometric primitives.

There is no "I Win" dynamic. There is no "You Lose" dynamic. He's explaining how his guys use their 10 point ships to fight your 10 point ships. You buy 10 points of railguns, he buys 10 points of metalheads. Same thing.
User avatar
Academia Nut
Sith Devotee
Posts: 2598
Joined: 2005-08-23 10:44pm
Location: Edmonton, Alberta

Post by Academia Nut »

Okay, here, this is the most Awesome ground force I have written fluff for, just so that you can see that they aren't invincible. Sure, they kick enormous ass, but I'm investing at least 200 points into ground combat, I'm allowed to have kick ass troops.

---

The last of the non-Rücker units that do not involve heavy armour are the Valkyries, an integral part of Könige military actions, such that every ship has at least one team of them, and troop transports and larger ships tend to have multiple teams. Serving a variety of rapid response roles, the Valkyries are used for sudden strikes, the recovery of wounded soldiers, and the capture of valuable goods and people. This is achieved by the fact that the Valkyries are capable of teleportation.

Valkyrie armour is the lightest of the power armours fielded by the Könige, mostly because the primary reason it is powered is because of the weight and energy demands of the equipment used. There are strict mass limits on the teleports, so in order to actually be capable of moving additional mass the weight of the armour is kept as low as possible. In fact, in some aspects Valkyrie armour offers less protection than mosh armour. This is made up for by the fact that Valkyrie armour incorporates stealth systems and holo-projectors so that they are rarely in the place were they appear to be. With the addition of anti-gravity belts that allow for incredible acrobatics, Valkyries are rarely where you think they are. This usually causes enemies to over-estimate their teleporting abilities, and anything that causes paranoia and fear is a good thing.

Valkyries are armed with weaponry optimized for medium intensity close combat, seeing as how they are not frontline troops engaging an enemy at skirmish ranges, but infiltrators and raiders. On one arm they carry an integral, retractable shield with a small energy barrier generator, while on the other they have an integral wrist mounted disc launcher modified for a higher rate of fire. They also carry swords that generate a disruptive energy field capable of slicing through many kinds of physical armour.

The Valkyries are named after the combat drug they take, called Valkyr, which while expensive has a curious effect on the human body. In its initial form, termed Valkyr-α, it acts as a potent stimulant, increasing speed and reaction times while allowing for incredible expenditure of energy by causing additional metabolism, at the cost of increasing body temperature and the production of high levels of metabolic wastes. Far more dangerous is Valkyr-β, caused when Valkyr-α bonds to testosterone in a meta-stable configuration. Valkyr-β causes strange things to happen to the human brain; most notably it generates the capacity for the manipulation of Awesome in individuals who do not have a natural talent for it. With a half-life of approximately thirty minutes after production, it has an extremely high potency, with effects that can last long after the chemical has completely broken down. The danger is three-fold though. The first is that many people who can wield the Awesome naturally suffer from mental breakdowns. The second and third have to do with the breakdown pathways of Valkyr-β. Approximately 99% of the time it will break down into Valkyr-α and estradiol plus some acids, while 1% of the time it will break down into dihydrotestosterone and Valkyr-γ. Valkyr-γ is a ridiculously powerful hallucinogen and stimulant that can easily trigger a psychotic episode if concentrations are high enough, not helped by the fact that dihydrotestosterone is a more powerful androgen than testosterone and can increase aggression levels considerably. Thus, because of the higher concentrations of testosterone in men, the taking of Valkyr is dangerous both long term and short term.

Thus all Valkyries are either physically female or hormonally so as the only way for a man to survive exposure to Valkyr is to be chemically rendered female, an option that is only appealing to transsexuals, especially in the excessively masculine Könige culture. Even if a man somehow managed to survive, large quantities of testosterone would be converted into estradiol, causing effectively the same thing. Even for women though, they are given numerous implants and hooked into their armour for continuous blood filtration and chemical adjustment. The blood filtration also prevents organ damage, especially kidney damage, from the effects of the metabolic increase caused by Valkyr-α.

The reason Valkyr is taken is because the activation of Awesome is necessary for teleportation, and because, curiously enough, Valkyr-α and Valkyr-γ in very small doses has a buffering effect against the disorientation and psychoses caused by repeated teleportation. Valkyrie armour is too small to provide the protective systems used on ships that travel outside of space-time in order to go FTL, so the human brain must endure a brief period of existing outside existence. Thus all three forms must be present in order to teleport successfully, and since Valkyr-α bonds readily to testosterone, consuming it in the process, it must be in excess to the hormone.

Even after all of this, Valkyries can only teleport with the support of a specialized band of Rückers, only between two set points, and at strategically short ranges, typically less than twenty kilometres. Unless the Rücker band is within approximately a hundred metres, Valkyries cannot teleport tactically, as a hundred metres is about the zone around a point that they can selectively appear within. Otherwise they are restricted to teleporting back and forth between the band and their deployment zone. Those who know of this limitation do not let this fact out readily though.

There is some speculation that Valkyr is responsible for the genesis of the Könige, and especially its female-only use may have lead to the legend of the Lady of Awesome. Having been forced to pack up and move due to internal or external conflict more than once, the Könige aren’t quite sure about this, but it makes a nice discussion point at parties, which is to say that proponents for and against the idea like to shoot at each other while exchanging arguments.

---

There. They're fast and agile and like to sow confusion and terror, but their teleportation is limited, if you damage their implants they'll cook to death, and they're no good in a regular fight, their armour and weaponry too light for standard fighting. If you shoot them, they will die. End of story.
I love learning. Teach me. I will listen.
You know, if Christian dogma included a ten-foot tall Jesus walking around in battle armor and smashing retarded cultists with a gaint mace, I might just convert - Noble Ire on Jesus smashing Scientologists
User avatar
Rogue 9
Scrapping TIEs since 1997
Posts: 18644
Joined: 2003-11-12 01:10pm
Location: Classified
Contact:

Post by Rogue 9 »

Covenant wrote:
Rogue 9 wrote:I've got no pedestal to stand on. I dislike the idea because he can essentially do whatever the fuck he wants with it; if the Konige think that assraping whoever they're attacking at the moment with minimal resistance would be Awesome, then it would happen. Since that's doubtlessly what they think, I for one am not going to volunteer to be in the way of it.
Seriously, are you retarded? Since when have psionics been anything other than a weapon or defense equal to the same point cost in railguns or energy shields? If he purchases psi-amps for his vehicles and starships in order to allow them to headbang your vessels to death, how is that any different than someone using psi-amps to mentally shake you to death? And since that's the same in-game effect as shooting cannonballs and lasers at someone, it doesn't matter. If he uses the Awesome to rape you in the ass, I can do the exact same thing, using guns and robots shaped like geometric primitives.

There is no "I Win" dynamic. There is no "You Lose" dynamic. He's explaining how his guys use their 10 point ships to fight your 10 point ships. You buy 10 points of railguns, he buys 10 points of metalheads. Same thing.
I have been run the fuck over in too many games, STGOD and otherwise, by too many fucking undefined magic/psychic/technobabble/better-than-yours-because-I-said-so abilities to sit here and watch another one form before my eyes. If in the end it really is limited to that, then fine, but too often in the past this kind of thing simply hasn't been.
It's Rogue, not Rouge!

HAB | KotL | VRWC/ELC/CDA | TRotR | The Anti-Confederate | Sluggite | Gamer | Blogger | Staff Reporter | Student | Musician
User avatar
Spyder
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4465
Joined: 2002-09-03 03:23am
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Contact:

Post by Spyder »

You could technically buy 10 points of 'fat guy rubbing cream on his nipples' and somehow it's a space based weapon. It wouldn't really affect the outcome of a battle against 10 points of railguns other then how the battle is described.

Hmm...
:D
User avatar
Academia Nut
Sith Devotee
Posts: 2598
Joined: 2005-08-23 10:44pm
Location: Edmonton, Alberta

Post by Academia Nut »

Uggghhhh... now I have an image of a man so fat relativistic railgun rounds bounce harmlessly off his blubber while the sight of him drives reality itself mad.
I love learning. Teach me. I will listen.
You know, if Christian dogma included a ten-foot tall Jesus walking around in battle armor and smashing retarded cultists with a gaint mace, I might just convert - Noble Ire on Jesus smashing Scientologists
User avatar
Covenant
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4451
Joined: 2006-04-11 07:43am

Post by Covenant »

While that may have been the experience in the past, early on in this game's formation we bashed skulls in for some rules. Psionics are going to be a nice 'tech base' but you need psionic equipment to make psionic effects. At the moment, Psions (awesome or not) are merely a different variety of the same actual physical effect you could get with a gun. We already forcibly scrapped someone's use of magic for being too unquantifiable, but Psionics can be tested for and blocked. Really, that's all you gotta worry about. All 'shields' of any sort are assumed to come automatically both in physical and psi shields, so you're covered. This is really just fluff and explination for the source of his stuff.

At worst, you might get humilated in ground combat by a bunch of hard rockers, but we even specified that you can't have infantry of infinite power, so landing a few hordes of guys will be required, regardless of the source of their power.

In fact, the reason I liked the idea of needing a crowd to do things that are Awesome was to impose an in-game reason for why you'd land a zillion groupies for every Awesome fanatic, thus stopping you from dropping one shuttle with 10 pisons worth 100 points each. For it to work via Awesome, you'd still want 900 groupies and minor metalheads to impress with Awesomeness, so any ground attack (even comprised solely of the best psions) would require hordes of crap infantry. It's an autolimiting device.

Nobody's angry at you for wanting to keep the game balanced--but there's a better way to address it, and one of them would be reading up on stuff we already decided.
User avatar
Shinn Langley Soryu
Jedi Council Member
Posts: 1526
Joined: 2006-08-18 11:27pm
Location: COOBIE YOU KNOW WHAT TIME IT IS

Post by Shinn Langley Soryu »

Earlier Times:
  • Early colonization: First colony ships launched from Earth. The colony fleet that would eventually land in the Nashtari star cluster is one of several sponsored by the United States and former British Commonwealth powers. Former Eastern Bloc nations and several influential Asian countries launch their own colonial expeditions at roughly the same time.
  • Worldwide Hegemony: Well after the departure of the colony ships, but while the fleets are still en route, the beginnings of the Empire begin to emerge. The catalyst for the formation of the Empire is the invention of a practical FTL drive by an ideologue scientist named Victor Prokofiev; Prokofiev envisions a grand destiny for the human race among the stars, one far beyond the scope of the original colonial expeditions. A coalition of nations join together to better exploit this new technology and carry humanity across the galaxy; they begin to fall under the sway of corruption and internal infighting on matters unrelated to their star-spanning ambitions.
  • Empire Established: Military leaders stage a coup using the warships developed to conquer the cosmos; the Empire is born. Imperial vessels move out to colonize inhabitable worlds, starting with the ones targeted by the earlier colony ships. In many cases, the FTL-equipped Imperial ships arrive at their destinations before the massively slower colony fleets.
  • Sometime between the establishment of the Empire and the pre-Final War era: The Haruhi and Sasaki Heresies.
  • Sometime between the establishment of the Empire and the pre-Final War era: Khan Union civil war and reorganization as the "Humanist Union"; Father's ascendancy to Union leadership and rebirth as an advanced posthuman.
Pre Final War:
  • Increasing numbers of Imperial Academy of Science members arrested for heresy.
  • Surge in Humanist Union military buildup and increased xenophobia and isolationism from the rest of the Terran Empire.
  • Death of the last high general from the Khan Union civil war, leaving Father as the sole surviving command figure from that period.
Commencement of the Final War:
  • Academy plot to overthrow Emperor fails due to Enclave invading.
  • Enclave invades.
  • Humanist Union isolationism hits its peak, with the first traces of open anti-Imperialism appearing.
  • Humanist Union openly offers to accept refugee humans and lends military assistance to the Empire.
Early Final War:
  • Academy becomes an enemy of the Empire, members captured/executed/exiled.
  • Academy springs "heretics" from Imperial prison colony during Empire/Enclave battle.
  • Academy Vanguard formed.
  • Haruhi's offer of open military assistance is rejected by the Empire.
  • Open anti-Empire sentiment within the Humanist Union grows, resulting in the withdrawal of some formal military support from the Empire.
Mid Final War:
  • Sasaki convinces the Canopy Domain to lend several battle fleets to openly assist Enclave operations.
  • Haruhi authorizes the lending of covert military assistance to nearby Imperial worlds in need of it.
  • The Humanist Union withdraws most of its military support from the Empire in favor of fortifying its home territories.
Late Final War:
  • The Eighth Dictate reorganizes into the Consolidated Dominion of Gemude to combat the growing threat of organized marauders from the wilds of space, effectively declaring independence and triggering a wave of open separatist movements across the mid-range colonies.
  • Haruhi seizes several outer colonies under the cover of "peacekeeping and military assistance purposes," taking full advantage of the chaos provided by the Empire/Enclave conflict and the separatist movements in the middle colonies.
  • Humanist Union Navy ships start attacking vulnerable Imperial vessels passing through Union space.
  • Alien sapients are blocked from setting foot on Humanist Union territories without formal permission (ex. research populations).
Post Final War:
  • The Humanist Union formally declares independence and starts a campaign to denounce the Empire, its works, and its remaining authority figures, vowing to free oppressed populations from the shackles of petty warlords.
I ship Eino Ilmari Juutilainen x Lydia V. Litvyak.

Image
ImageImageImage
Phantasee: Don't be a dick.
Stofsk: What are you, his mother?
The Yosemite Bear: Obviously, which means that he's grounded, and that she needs to go back to sucking Mr. Coffee's cock.

"d-did... did this thread just turn into Thanas/PeZook slash fiction?" - Ilya Muromets[/size]
User avatar
Spyder
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4465
Joined: 2002-09-03 03:23am
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Contact:

Post by Spyder »

I'm wondering if we should make it mandatory for each nation to have a dark side. Every nation has something or someone in it that twists its principles in a way that would cause widespread suffering if left unchecked.
:D
User avatar
Covenant
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4451
Joined: 2006-04-11 07:43am

Post by Covenant »

Spyder wrote:I'm wondering if we should make it mandatory for each nation to have a dark side. Every nation has something or someone in it that twists its principles in a way that would cause widespread suffering if left unchecked.
It'd be pleasent, though I haven't seen anyone who is all good yet.
User avatar
Academia Nut
Sith Devotee
Posts: 2598
Joined: 2005-08-23 10:44pm
Location: Edmonton, Alberta

Post by Academia Nut »

I think only Nephtys, Hawkwings, and Noble Ire have relatively sane nations, although I'm sure they could at least pick "hubris" as a flaw.

Me, well, you know my dark side(s), so I'll throw out my light side:

Honour.

Honour is all that binds the chaotic Konige together. If you can earn their respect and deal with them on honourable grounds, then they are willing to listen to reason. True, they have their own rationality, but they are not unthinking brutes. They might be sneaky and devious at times, but that is only with unhonourable currs. If you have their respect, then they can be talked too diplomatic.

Of course, you pretty much have to head-butt them to earn their respect.
I love learning. Teach me. I will listen.
You know, if Christian dogma included a ten-foot tall Jesus walking around in battle armor and smashing retarded cultists with a gaint mace, I might just convert - Noble Ire on Jesus smashing Scientologists
User avatar
Spyder
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4465
Joined: 2002-09-03 03:23am
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Contact:

Post by Spyder »

This is taking shape nicely.

Earlier Times:
  • Early colonization: First colony ships launched from Earth. The colony fleet that would eventually land in the Nashtari star cluster is one of several sponsored by the United States and former British Commonwealth powers. Former Eastern Bloc nations and several influential Asian countries launch their own colonial expeditions at roughly the same time.
  • Worldwide Hegemony: Well after the departure of the colony ships, but while the fleets are still en route, the beginnings of the Empire begin to emerge. The catalyst for the formation of the Empire is the invention of a practical FTL drive by an ideologue scientist named Victor Prokofiev; Prokofiev envisions a grand destiny for the human race among the stars, one far beyond the scope of the original colonial expeditions. A coalition of nations join together to better exploit this new technology and carry humanity across the galaxy; they begin to fall under the sway of corruption and internal infighting on matters unrelated to their star-spanning ambitions.
  • Empire Established: Military leaders stage a coup using the warships developed to conquer the cosmos; the Empire is born. Imperial vessels move out to colonize inhabitable worlds, starting with the ones targeted by the earlier colony ships. In many cases, the FTL-equipped Imperial ships arrive at their destinations before the massively slower colony fleets.
  • Sometime between the establishment of the Empire and the pre-Final War era: The Haruhi and Sasaki Heresies.
  • Sometime between the establishment of the Empire and the pre-Final War era: Khan Union civil war and reorganization as the "Humanist Union"; Father's ascendancy to Union leadership and rebirth as an advanced posthuman.
  • Imperial Academy of Science founded, uniting many major universities and research institutions. The Academy provided the Empire with a stream of scientific advancement and a means of keeping tabs on (and punishing) heretical thoughts and ideas common among academics.
Pre Final War:
  • Increasing numbers of Imperial Academy of Science members arrested for heresy.
  • Surge in Humanist Union military buildup and increased xenophobia and isolationism from the rest of the Terran Empire.
  • Death of the last high general from the Khan Union civil war, leaving Father as the sole surviving command figure from that period.
Commencement of the Final War:
  • Academy plot to overthrow Emperor fails due to Enclave invading.
  • Enclave invades.
  • Humanist Union isolationism hits its peak, with the first traces of open anti-Imperialism appearing.
  • Humanist Union openly offers to accept refugee humans and lends military assistance to the Empire.
Early Final War:
  • Academy becomes an enemy of the Empire, members captured/executed/exiled.
  • Academy springs "heretics" from Imperial prison colony during Empire/Enclave battle.
  • Academy Vanguard formed.
  • Haruhi's offer of open military assistance is rejected by the Empire.
  • Open anti-Empire sentiment within the Humanist Union grows, resulting in the withdrawal of some formal military support from the Empire.
Mid Final War:
  • Sasaki convinces the Canopy Domain to lend several battle fleets to openly assist Enclave operations.
  • Haruhi authorizes the lending of covert military assistance to nearby Imperial worlds in need of it.
  • The Humanist Union withdraws most of its military support from the Empire in favor of fortifying its home territories.
Late Final War:
  • The Eighth Dictate reorganizes into the Consolidated Dominion of Gemude to combat the growing threat of organized marauders from the wilds of space, effectively declaring independence and triggering a wave of open separatist movements across the mid-range colonies.
  • Haruhi seizes several outer colonies under the cover of "peacekeeping and military assistance purposes," taking full advantage of the chaos provided by the Empire/Enclave conflict and the separatist movements in the middle colonies.
  • The Academy Vanguard, after noting various powers attempting to carve out their own little empires, begins supplying random colonial militia with alien technology, including small arms and planetary guns. There's widespread confusion as various colonies resist seizure.
  • Humanist Union Navy ships start attacking vulnerable Imperial vessels passing through Union space.
  • Alien sapients are blocked from setting foot on Humanist Union territories without formal permission (ex. research populations).
Post Final War:
  • The Humanist Union formally declares independence and starts a campaign to denounce the Empire, its works, and its remaining authority figures, vowing to free oppressed populations from the shackles of petty warlords.
Last edited by Spyder on 2007-11-24 01:43am, edited 1 time in total.
:D
Post Reply