Ep7 Reviews (Spoilers)

[AniThyng]

I'm sure kasdan of all people knows star wars... :*D

[Patroklos]

I guess blowing up Hosnian Prime would exceed the Alderannian death toll?

Who cares? Nobody in the movie did. Not event he people who did it apparently.

[Sgt_Artyom]

Another nitpick that I am surprised nobody has pointed out, but does the "new" TIE Fighter design not bother anyone? From ANH to ROTJ, we saw a progression from the TIE Fighter to the TIE Interceptor, which is backed up by a ton of supporting literature in the EU that the TIE Interceptor was the clearly superior design. And now, we're back to a "new" design based on the inferior TIE Fighter design? This fucking makes no sense!!!

It's apparently a special forces variant of the TIE fighter.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE/sf_s ... ty_fighter

Also, why would they care at all about what happened in the EU? None of that's canon anymore so they can do whatever the hell they want.

Star Destroyer's look different now as well, should we be enraged about that too?

Clearly you did not pay attention in ROTJ there were TIE Interceptors were on screen.

I know that. Please tell me however, where in ROTJ did ANYONE mention that it was obviously superior? When did anyone even mention the damn things name?

They didn't. Any other information we have on the interceptor comes from the EU, making the point you're trying to make entirely moot as that's all no longer canon.

[Darmalus]

It was... a movie.

As I noticed in the new Star Trek films, there is no sense of scale or impact. Planets die willy-nilly and meaninglessly, there's no sense of traveling any distance (hyperdrive seems to have become a teleporter) and Ray had a 3 movie character arc in about 10 minutes screen time and frankly what the hell is Luke gonna teach her? She seems to know all this Jedi shit already. Kylo Ren as a villain was completely underwhelming, hard to care about the character's struggles when the bad guy is weaker than them.

On the plus side, the acting was miles ahead of the prequels, even if in the end I feel that even at their worst Episodes 1, 2 and 3 were more Star Wars-y than episode 7.

[Lord Revan]

Did Phasma do anything impressive in the movie or any of the trailers ?

Or is she just being hyped up based on her appearance ?

Just appearance. She struts across the battlefield in chrome armor and that's about it. Also because she's female. I don't think they even took her helmet off during the movie...

nope she didn't and based on some of her lines it's highly atypical for First Order Stormtroopers to remove their helmets while on duty, though Phasma seems to be a special case when it comes to Stormtroopers having a name instead of just a service number and non-standard armor.

I suspect that she might be daughter of one the founders of the First Orders it would explain how she had a name while it's implied that most stormtroopers have only their service numbers (it's outright stated to be the case for Finn) and that she has an armor that stands out from the masses.

I wonder if the First Order consists of the combination of the most fanatic military personal and the most corrupt politicians of the Galactic Empire.

[Borgholio]

I wonder if the First Order consists of the combination of the most fanatic military personal and the most corrupt politicians of the Galactic Empire.

Makes sense actually. Child kidnapping, forced indoctrination since day one of their lives, no names only serial numbers, willful genocide, mass murder...

They could probably be considered the ISIS of the SW galaxy.

[Grumman]

1. I was out shopping for some charity gifts today. For the longest time my go to for these were the small $10 dollar star wars lego kits because I could get a lot of bang for my buck for more kids that way and kids love anything lego or starwars. When I came across the new star wars kits I was stuck by how much I wanted to buy them for myself (and eventually will). I have been a fan of OT sets for a long time but the prequel stuff never interested me in the slightest. This reinforces my original judgment that they got the broad strokes right regarding setting, feel and imagery even if the the movie as a whole is a jumbled mess. I still want to be immersed in this version's world.

I was not impressed by what I saw in the way of toys. Certainly the department store I was in was partly to blame for that, as their range for the 6" and 12" lines only had a single character each (Kylo Ren and Finn respectively), but also because all the other action figures were either Hero Mashers or done in the old Kenner style with only five points of articulation. Even the 31" toys - an action figure almost a meter tall and they're still too stingy to give it elbows. And why does Greedo, AKA the worst bounty hunter in the galaxy, get one?

[AniThyng]

Did Phasma do anything impressive in the movie or any of the trailers ?

Or is she just being hyped up based on her appearance ?

Just appearance. She struts across the battlefield in chrome armor and that's about it. Also because she's female. I don't think they even took her helmet off during the movie...

nope she didn't and based on some of her lines it's highly atypical for First Order Stormtroopers to remove their helmets while on duty, though Phasma seems to be a special case when it comes to Stormtroopers having a name instead of just a service number and non-standard armor.

I suspect that she might be daughter of one the founders of the First Orders it would explain how she had a name while it's implied that most stormtroopers have only their service numbers (it's outright stated to be the case for Finn) and that she has an armor that stands out from the masses.

I wonder if the First Order consists of the combination of the most fanatic military personal and the most corrupt politicians of the Galactic Empire.

Based on the visual dictionary, the rank and file are the children of those imperials. It's not perfect but the supplementary material patches up quite a few plot holes, and makes the star destroyer pretty awesome...

And yeah the resistance is effectively leia's PMC and the NR is too busy patching together the galaxy/petty politics to care what the rump empire is up to in the unknown regions.

[Lord Revan]

I wonder if the First Order consists of the combination of the most fanatic military personal and the most corrupt politicians of the Galactic Empire.

Makes sense actually. Child kidnapping, forced indoctrination since day one of their lives, no names only serial numbers, willful genocide, mass murder...

They could probably be considered the ISIS of the SW galaxy.

philosofically I suppose so, though the First Order seems to have more true military power then ISIS.

[Patroklos]

I was not impressed by what I saw in the way of toys. Certainly the department store I was in was partly to blame for that, as their range for the 6" and 12" lines only had a single character each (Kylo Ren and Finn respectively), but also because all the other action figures were either Hero Mashers or done in the old Kenner style with only five points of articulation. Even the 31" toys - an action figure almost a meter tall and they're still too stingy to give it elbows. And why does Greedo, AKA the worst bounty hunter in the galaxy, get one?

I am only a fan of the legos as far as SW toys go so I can't speak to the other sorts. Specifically what I liked about the new sets was in the case of Reys land speeder there was a door that had an in vehicle engine to highlight the tinkering aspects and for all the ones I examined there was a distinct lack of unique set specific pieces, rather relying on basic blocks which is always a plus in my book.

I think the main point is that I have a lot of problems with the movies as I have obviously expressed here, but I still have a positive view of the franchise at the moment which was NOT what happened when I watch TPM or its follow ons. That means the movie did something right.

[Terralthra]

And don't get me started on Han's hyperdrive-past-shields-manuever.

This was a big one for me. Does this mean you can just strap a hyperdrive to the biggest warhead you can find and aim it at targets? Basically, if the Falcon had been one giant bomb (with sufficient power) targeted at the X-wing target, would it have worked? Yeah it's dangerous but that's what droid pilots are for.

We've never seen what happens if a vessel in hyperspace emerges inside another object. It might crash, it might explode, it might cease to exist, it might simply not come out of hyperspace at all. You're making assumptions about what might happen.

The hyperdrive/planetary shield bypass probably isn't used in previous movies because it's suicidal. The Falcon nearly crash-lands trying it, and that was with the width of an atmosphere between the shield and the surface. The DSII shield was presumably much closer to the Death Star, and they weren't trying to land on it.

Fair enough for the DS2 explanation, but it does not explain other uses like getting past planetary shields, i.e. why bother with bombardment when you can zip past the shields? Suicidal maybe, but that's also saying you need numbers to pull off a low prob event.

See above.

Finn is not the only non-Force-sensitive to wield a lightsabre in the Star Wars canon. General Grievous, in particular, is shown to not only be quite capable of using lightsabres, but a very dangerous opponent. Pre Vizsla uses one as well, and holds his own in duels (he loses, but he does hold his own). Cad Bane uses one as well.

In other words, don't throw stones about a lack of proofreading or attention paid to the past when it's clear that you are bringing massive preconceptions and blinders.

Sorry, but the CGI animated series is not at the same level of cannonicity as the 6 movies (and yes, I don't give a fuck about what Lucas thinks the cannonicity order should be, no way are the TV series equally cannon as the movies - I subscribe to the original cannon order established by the online community decades before Lucas messed up his shit. Basically movies > novelization of movies > tv series / novelization of closely-related material to the movie > other EU). In any case, Pre Vizsla has Wankalorian influence (from other EU) from the Traviss bitch and I discount that. I admit Cad Bane had not occurred to me, mostly because I have lower standards for the TV series. As for Grievous (which is the only true cannon at the same level as the 6 movies that I consider) good call on that, but I can see how being a cyborg his hands could have been optimized for lightsaber combat.

If you make up your own system of prioritizing canon materials, you don't get to then yell at other people for "ignoring history". You made a shit argument that's easily disproven with multiple examples, and your argument is also based on assumptions that have no basis in any of the movies (lightsabre blades having no mass/inertia is a hypothesis based on precisely zero evidence from any of the movies or TV shows).

I'm going to side with the folks who think that Kylo Ren is a half-baked jedi apprentice turned dark jedi. Sometimes they make him powerful (as with his mind reading and stopping blaster bolts), but when it comes to lightsaber fights he's a bit pathetic - Rey eventually kicked his ass despite zero training with a lightsaber, and even Finn didn't just get killed immediately.

He was also fighting (significantly) wounded.

All those other nonforce lighsaber users had not just picked up a light saber for the fist time hours before. They are irrelevant.

What makes a lightsabre so different from any other melee weapon? Please use canon sources.

[Patroklos]

What makes a lightsabre so different from any other melee weapon? Please use canon sources.

Besides the mass less plasma blade that cuts/burns through durasteel, you are really asking what makes a
Spoiler

different from a



different from a



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different from a



different from a



different from a



different from a



different from a



different from a

and why those differences matter regarding using one qualifying you to use the other? Is that the question you wanted to ask?

[Kojiro]

We've never seen what happens if a vessel in hyperspace emerges inside another object. It might crash, it might explode, it might cease to exist, it might simply not come out of hyperspace at all. You're making assumptions about what might happen.

Who said anything about inside the other object? I'm talking about a droid/guided warhead dropping out of hyperspace inside the planetary shield, then impacting, instead of pulling up like Han does.

I mean, the whole reason Han even has lead the assault is because of the planetary shield right? If the shield can be penetrated by going in at lightspeed, why not sub the Falcon for warheads and just impact on the thermal regulator? Am I remembering the scene wrong?

[Borgholio]

Am I remembering the scene wrong?

No you're not, but Han mentioned something special about the shield...something about phasing. I don't recall exactly what he said but I interpreted that to mean there was something special about this shield that set it apart from other forms of planetary shields.

Wait a minute. The Starkiller's beam weapon is a hyperspace weapon, right? That could explain why the shield can't be allowed to block anything traveling at lightspeed. It would block their own weapon.

[Lord Revan]

Am I remembering the scene wrong?

No you're not, but Han mentioned something special about the shield...something about phasing. I don't recall exactly what he said but I interpreted that to mean there was something special about this shield that set it apart from other forms of planetary shields.

Wait a minute. The Starkiller's beam weapon is a hyperspace weapon, right? That could explain why the shield can't be allowed to block anything traveling at lightspeed. It would block their own weapon.

that kind of makes sense.

[GuppyShark]

Regarding X-wing spread vs TIEs:

Curtis Saxton covered this extensively back in the day. The radiator argument is nonsense - the energy levels both starfighters exhibit renders any possible radiator effect meaningless.

Simply put, the TIE is able to accomplish what the X-wing does in a small cross section because it is the state of the art military space superiority fighter. The X-wing is the best available craft that an illegal resistance outfit can put together.

[Adam Reynolds]

Was there any indication as to why R2 suddenly reactivated in the ending? It seemed like a Dues Ex Machina. Almost literally.

We've never seen what happens if a vessel in hyperspace emerges inside another object. It might crash, it might explode, it might cease to exist, it might simply not come out of hyperspace at all. You're making assumptions about what might happen.

Who said anything about inside the other object? I'm talking about a droid/guided warhead dropping out of hyperspace inside the planetary shield, then impacting, instead of pulling up like Han does.

I mean, the whole reason Han even has lead the assault is because of the planetary shield right? If the shield can be penetrated by going in at lightspeed, why not sub the Falcon for warheads and just impact on the thermal regulator? Am I remembering the scene wrong?

That bit was exactly like the upgrade to the transporter in Star Trek. They came up with a way to let the tech solve their short term story problem without ever considering the long term consequences. Abrams has issues with worldbuilding when it comes to issues like this.

Though the rationalization of it blocking its own weapon makes sense, it does not make sense that they would have this setting active at all times. This isn't like an exhaust port that presumably always needs to be open. Ships don't open docking bay shields unless they are launching fighters.

[Mange]

Where are the fucking capital ships on both side?

I am ok with the idea of keeping this movie simple to prove to us that JJ can make an entertaining movie, but lots of plot stuff needs to be addressed in the next movie. What is the overall political situation of the galaxy? What happened to Coruscant? What was the New Republic like and how badly was it hurt by the Starkiller attack? Is the First Order what's left of the old Empire or is it a splinter faction, similar to how the Resistance is a splinter of the NR?

Those two aspects (the absence of capital ships and the political situation) made me confused when I watched the movie. In addition to what I, as well as others (such as Vympel's excellent post) as written earlier, the SW.com Databank elaborates a bit further (summary below).

Following the Battle of Jakku about a year after the Battle of Endor, a peace treaty, the Galactic Concordance, was signed between the New Republic and the Empire. Following the treaty, the Republic demilitarized. Leia Organa protested but was sidelined, and instead formed what is specified as being a private military force, the Resistance which receives funding and ships from a few senators. The First Order formed in the Unknown Regions (sigh).

I have ordered, but not yet received, the new ICS, but from what I've learned, the Resistance doesn't have capital ships. Presumably, the Republic doesn't have anyone either. Apparently, the Republic and First Order has had some contact, as the Republic views the new class of Star Destroyers (twice the size of an ISD), as a treaty violation. The First Order doesn't have an abundance of resources (then why not channel the resources there are into building more capital ships as the Republic doesn't seem to have any).

A little more exposition could've been helpful.

[Lord Revan]

Where are the fucking capital ships on both side?

I am ok with the idea of keeping this movie simple to prove to us that JJ can make an entertaining movie, but lots of plot stuff needs to be addressed in the next movie. What is the overall political situation of the galaxy? What happened to Coruscant? What was the New Republic like and how badly was it hurt by the Starkiller attack? Is the First Order what's left of the old Empire or is it a splinter faction, similar to how the Resistance is a splinter of the NR?

Those two aspects (the absence of capital ships and the political situation) made me confused when I watched the movie. In addition to what I, as well as others (such as Vympel's excellent post) as written earlier, the SW.com Databank elaborates a bit further (summary below).

Following the Battle of Jakku about a year after the Battle of Endor, a peace treaty, the Galactic Concordance, was signed between the New Republic and the Empire. Following the treaty, the Republic demilitarized. Leia Organa protested but was sidelined, and instead formed what is specified as being a private military force, the Resistance which receives funding and ships from a few senators. The First Order formed in the Unknown Regions (sigh).

I have ordered, but not yet received, the new ICS, but from what I've learned, the Resistance doesn't have capital ships. Presumably, the Republic doesn't have anyone either. Apparently, the Republic and First Order has had some contact, as the Republic views the new class of Star Destroyers (twice the size of an ISD), as a treaty violation. The First Order doesn't have an abundance of resources (then why not channel the resources there are into building more capital ships as the Republic doesn't seem to have any).

A little more exposition could've been helpful.

true I suppose but there's always the balance to keep in the story, after all those that obsess over the details like where the capital ships are make a very small group of people and most people probably won't even notice it.

[Vympel]

I have ordered, but not yet received, the new ICS, but from what I've learned, the Resistance doesn't have capital ships. Presumably, the Republic doesn't have anyone either. Apparently, the Republic and First Order has had some contact, as the Republic views the new class of Star Destroyers (twice the size of an ISD), as a treaty violation. The First Order doesn't have an abundance of resources (then why not channel the resources there are into building more capital ships as the Republic doesn't seem to have any).

They must've had some what with the reference to the New Republic's "cherished fleet" by Hux. The Resurgent-class Star Destroyer we see in the film is insane - in addition to its size (some 2.9km to be more exact) it has apparently 'over 3,000' turbolasers and ion cannons. It'll be intersting to see how many there are in Episode 8. Or if they 'go big or go home' and given Kylo Ren a new SSD.

[Noble713]

Most of my thoughts mirror other posts here. Overall good characters, good emotion. Great scenes with real outdoor sets, etc. I have the same questions about the galactic political situation/origins of Snoke/etc. and the same irritations with little things (planets seen exploding at light-year distances in real-time, the entire rationale of not being able to use Luke's map when the portion they have is ~10% of the WHOLE DAMN GALAXY, Phasma not doing much of anything, etc...).

Another nitpick that I am surprised nobody has pointed out, but does the "new" TIE Fighter design not bother anyone? From ANH to ROTJ, we saw a progression from the TIE Fighter to the TIE Interceptor, which is backed up by a ton of supporting literature in the EU that the TIE Interceptor was the clearly superior design. And now, we're back to a "new" design based on the inferior TIE Fighter design? This fucking makes no sense!!!

Think of it like Kalashnikovs: despite the existence of the 5.45mm AK-74/AK-103/etc.., there's a lot of companies that have made modernized 7.62mm AK-47's, partly due to the huge proliferation of the weapon and its ammunition. While the Empire built TIE Interceptors in vast numbers, the numbers of TIE Fighters is even more vast, so access to things like spare parts is greater. So I can see the rationale behind taking the ubiquitous TIE Fighter, adding a Weapons Officer and some sort of rear-firing laser cannon, upgrading the engines to handle the extra mass (Poe was surprised/impressed with the craft's speed when he flew it during their escape)....and you end up with a craft that is still competitive with the modernized X-Wings while possibly costing less to maintain than a TIE Interceptor and is more tactically flexible.

Speaking of weapon systems.....while I want to complain about "Sigh...yet ANOTHER Death Star movie plot?"......it makes sense. Death Stars are kinda like the nuclear weapons of Star Wars. They built a small one (fission bombs), then a bigger one (fission-induced fusion bombs), and now a long-ranged one (nuke-tipped ICBMs). Rogue States are constantly trying to gain nuclear tech, often leading to strike fighters from their antagonists paying them a visit. Sound familiar? With a tech that is proven to upset the balance of power so thoroughly, why would you NOT keep trying to employ it? The only major disappointment is that the First Order's idiot engineers took a step backwards in terms of the survivability of their design. And how the hell did the Resistance pinpoint a weak spot so quickly? Yes, Finn was stationed on Starkiller Base but he was the damn JANITOR (apparently), and he didn't bring a full technical readout of the station with him.

Did anyone else notice the cameo by Iko Uwais and Yayan Ruhian from "The Raid"? If I'm not mistaken, they were leading the 2nd group of mercenaries that boarded Han's freighter.

My question is why only X-wings.

Isn't The Resistance basically Leia's private army? Maybe she can't afford/couldn't get authorization for B-Wings and Y-Wings?

The first order bridge seemed to be the white guys hang out. Just some thing that jumped out at me while in/theatre.

No, the First Order definitely had some minority bridge crew on Starkiller Base, and a few senior-looking military commanders were behind Hux when he gave his speech.

[Vympel]

There were also female regular stormtroopers (and obviously Captain Phasma)

[AndroAsc]

Snoke does bear more than a passing physical resemblance to Gollum, though Serkis doesn't sound very much like Smeagol this time.

Surprised that Hux got away.

I guess blowing up Hosnian Prime would exceed the Alderannian death toll?

Makes you now wonder if this is ANH for the next generation, why did they not cut to a scene to luke in exile and show him in pain, like a thousand voices cried out to him (or something, I am rusty with Obi-wan's line when Alderaan blew up).

[Lord Revan]

Makes you now wonder if this is ANH for the next generation, why did they not cut to a scene to luke in exile and show him in pain, like a thousand voices cried out to him (or something, I am rusty with Obi-wan's line when Alderaan blew up).

good part of the movie there's a mystery as to what happend to luke and if he's still alive, while we gets hints even at the end we still don't got the full picture.

to show when the planets blow up would reveal that he's alive and well too soon.

after all this movie isn't a shot for shot remake but rather takes inspiration from the old trilogy.

[AndroAsc]

Where are the fucking capital ships on both side?

I am ok with the idea of keeping this movie simple to prove to us that JJ can make an entertaining movie, but lots of plot stuff needs to be addressed in the next movie. What is the overall political situation of the galaxy? What happened to Coruscant? What was the New Republic like and how badly was it hurt by the Starkiller attack? Is the First Order what's left of the old Empire or is it a splinter faction, similar to how the Resistance is a splinter of the NR?

Those two aspects (the absence of capital ships and the political situation) made me confused when I watched the movie. In addition to what I, as well as others (such as Vympel's excellent post) as written earlier, the SW.com Databank elaborates a bit further (summary below).

Following the Battle of Jakku about a year after the Battle of Endor, a peace treaty, the Galactic Concordance, was signed between the New Republic and the Empire. Following the treaty, the Republic demilitarized. Leia Organa protested but was sidelined, and instead formed what is specified as being a private military force, the Resistance which receives funding and ships from a few senators. The First Order formed in the Unknown Regions (sigh).

I have ordered, but not yet received, the new ICS, but from what I've learned, the Resistance doesn't have capital ships. Presumably, the Republic doesn't have anyone either. Apparently, the Republic and First Order has had some contact, as the Republic views the new class of Star Destroyers (twice the size of an ISD), as a treaty violation. The First Order doesn't have an abundance of resources (then why not channel the resources there are into building more capital ships as the Republic doesn't seem to have any).

A little more exposition could've been helpful.

WHAT THE FUCK NO CAPITAL SHIPS? WHO THE FUCK CAME UP WITH THAT IDEA? THAT IDIOT SHOULD BE SHOT ON SIGHT!!!

And what is there to "demilitarize" a year after the Battle of Endor? We know the Rebel Alliance threw almost everything they had in ROTJ, so their fleet numbers were a few hundred cap ships max (if you include offscreen cap ships that did not make it in time). And you want to demilitarize fromm that? That's like saying that the US demilitarize to a single cruiser as the entire fucking navy and one squadron of aircraft after the cold war.

PURE FUCKING STUPIDITY. If this is going to be the case I am going to ignore the entire ST. Going down this route is immensely worse than the PT. Fucking EU was even better for all its lame-assness.

Was Curtis Saxton consulted in this ICS? Fucktards! This is what happens when you let a fucking Trekkie JJ asshole take the lead.