Yuzzhan Vong vs. the Imperium of Man

SF: discuss futuristic sci-fi series, ideas, and crossovers.

Moderator: NecronLord

User avatar
Wanderer
Jedi Master
Posts: 1195
Joined: 2006-02-21 07:02pm
Location: Freedom
Contact:

Yuzzhan Vong vs. the Imperium of Man

Post by Wanderer » 2006-02-27 11:45am

No quarter, they bash each other untill only one remains standing. The other foes have all coveniently died off due to (technobabble) so its just these two.
Amateurs study Logistics, Professionals study Economics.
Dale Cozort (slightly out of context quote)

User avatar
Gunhead
Jedi Council Member
Posts: 1671
Joined: 2004-11-15 08:08am

Post by Gunhead » 2006-02-27 11:55am

You're pitting SW biowank against an empire that has millions of soldiers at his disposal, and has no problem sending them against heretical xenos. Even if the kill ratio is something like 100:1 in favor of the xenos...

I haven't read a thing about the yzzhan wong (and have no intention of doing so). But from what I have gathered from other SD members, the only place where YV might hold a tactical edge is space. Even there I'd say strategical edge goes to IOM.

In short, YV gets stomped like a bug.

-Gunhead
"In the absence of orders, go find something and kill it."
-Generalfeldmarschall Erwin Rommel

"And if you don't wanna feel like a putz
Collect the clues and connect the dots
You'll see the pattern that is bursting your bubble, and it's Bad" -The Hives

User avatar
K. A. Pital
Glamorous Commie
Posts: 20776
Joined: 2003-02-26 11:39am
Location: Elysium

Post by K. A. Pital » 2006-02-27 11:59am

God, what a slaughter. :shock: Emperor of Man shall be pleased.
Lì ci sono chiese, macerie, moschee e questure, lì frontiere, prezzi inaccessibile e freddure
Lì paludi, minacce, cecchini coi fucili, documenti, file notturne e clandestini
Qui incontri, lotte, passi sincronizzati, colori, capannelli non autorizzati,
Uccelli migratori, reti, informazioni, piazze di Tutti i like pazze di passioni...

...La tranquillità è importante ma la libertà è tutto!
Assalti Frontali

User avatar
Shroom Man 777
FUCKING DICK-STABBER!
Posts: 21163
Joined: 2003-05-11 08:39am
Location: Bleeding breasts and stabbing dicks since 2003
Contact:

Post by Shroom Man 777 » 2006-02-27 12:08pm

If the Vong can hold their own against the SW powers, then I guess that gives them the speed advantage. Hyperdrive >>>> Warp travel.
Image "DO YOU WORSHIP HOMOSEXUALS?" - Curtis Saxton (source)
shroom is a lovely boy and i wont hear a bad word against him - LUSY-CHAN!
Shit! Man, I didn't think of that! It took Shroom to properly interpret the screams of dying people :D - PeZook
Shroom, I read out the stuff you write about us. You are an endless supply of morale down here. :p - an OWS street medic
Pink Sugar Heart Attack!

User avatar
Elheru Aran
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 12833
Joined: 2004-03-04 01:15am
Location: Georgia

Post by Elheru Aran » 2006-02-27 12:11pm

Shroom Man 777 wrote:If the Vong can hold their own against the SW powers, then I guess that gives them the speed advantage. Hyperdrive >>>> Warp travel.
Problem is their biowank tech. The Imperium is *quite* familar with that, having gone up against the Tyranids. And compared to the Nids, the Vong go down *hard*. It doesn't help that their warriors are of the charge-stupidly-into-melee-combat sort... chainblades'll make short work of them. I'm guessing a good-sized group of Guard could settle their hash... Marines would be overkill. :twisted:
It's a strange world. Let's keep it that way.

User avatar
Wanderer
Jedi Master
Posts: 1195
Joined: 2006-02-21 07:02pm
Location: Freedom
Contact:

Post by Wanderer » 2006-02-27 12:16pm

Gunhead wrote:You're pitting SW biowank against an empire that has millions of soldiers at his disposal, and has no problem sending them against heretical xenos. Even if the kill ratio is something like 100:1 in favor of the xenos...

I haven't read a thing about the yzzhan wong (and have no intention of doing so). But from what I have gathered from other SD members, the only place where YV might hold a tactical edge is space. Even there I'd say strategical edge goes to IOM.

In short, YV gets stomped like a bug.

-Gunhead
Would the IOM be able to counter the gravity manipulating Dovin Basals?
They gave even the powerful weapons of Star Wars pause. The question then becomes, can they fire fast enough to wear the Dovin Basals down?

Ground, I can see the Imperium having "Fun" :twisted: with their weapons. But Space I'm not so sure about.
Amateurs study Logistics, Professionals study Economics.
Dale Cozort (slightly out of context quote)

User avatar
Brother-Captain Gaius
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 6859
Joined: 2002-10-22 12:00am
Location: \m/

Post by Brother-Captain Gaius » 2006-02-27 12:30pm

I'd like to see a dovin basal absorb a nova cannon round.
Agitated asshole | (Ex)40K Nut | Metalhead
The vision never dies; life's a never-ending wheel
1337 posts as of 16:34 GMT-7 June 2nd, 2003

"'He or she' is an agenderphobic microaggression, Sharon. You are a bigot." ― Randy Marsh

User avatar
Wanderer
Jedi Master
Posts: 1195
Joined: 2006-02-21 07:02pm
Location: Freedom
Contact:

Post by Wanderer » 2006-02-27 12:39pm

Brother-Captain Gaius wrote:I'd like to see a dovin basal absorb a nova cannon round.
Those are rare. But, I see your point. Still it will take thirty minutes to reload if Execution Hour or Warriors of Ultramar (I forget which and will have to dig it up) are any guide.
Amateurs study Logistics, Professionals study Economics.
Dale Cozort (slightly out of context quote)

User avatar
Kuja
The Dark Messenger
Posts: 19322
Joined: 2002-07-11 12:05am
Location: AZ
Contact:

Post by Kuja » 2006-02-27 12:40pm

The Imperium wouldn't treat the Vong with kid gloves the way the New Republic did. They'd hit as hard as they could right from the beginning, preventing the Vong from securing a foothold in the galaxy the way they did in SW.
Image
JADAFETWA

User avatar
Lancer
Sith Marauder
Posts: 3957
Joined: 2003-12-17 06:06pm
Location: Maryland
Contact:

Post by Lancer » 2006-02-27 12:41pm

Wanderer wrote:
Gunhead wrote:You're pitting SW biowank against an empire that has millions of soldiers at his disposal, and has no problem sending them against heretical xenos. Even if the kill ratio is something like 100:1 in favor of the xenos...

I haven't read a thing about the yzzhan wong (and have no intention of doing so). But from what I have gathered from other SD members, the only place where YV might hold a tactical edge is space. Even there I'd say strategical edge goes to IOM.

In short, YV gets stomped like a bug.

-Gunhead
Would the IOM be able to counter the gravity manipulating Dovin Basals?
They gave even the powerful weapons of Star Wars pause. The question then becomes, can they fire fast enough to wear the Dovin Basals down?

Ground, I can see the Imperium having "Fun" :twisted: with their weapons. But Space I'm not so sure about.
IoM firepower comes in the form of sheer volume of fire. I'd like to see a Dovin Basal stop a wall of plasma comming from an IoM warships broadside or blasts from the primary laser lances.

User avatar
Lord Zentei
Space Elf Psyker
Posts: 8742
Joined: 2004-11-22 02:49am
Location: Ulthwé Craftworld, plotting the downfall of the Imperium.

Post by Lord Zentei » 2006-02-27 12:42pm

The strategic advantage would lie with the Vong, not the IoM, due to Hyperdrive being orders of magnitude faster than Warp travel. This means that they could strike when and where they pleased: they would choose the battlesites, not the Imperium. Moreover, SW firepower and sublight accelleration is greater than that of the 40K-verse.

The main issue is numbers, how much the Vong possess. If all other opponents magically disappear, huge resources previoulsy held up would be made available to the Imperium. The fact that the IoM has dealt with "biowank" before means little, moreso since they have no real hope of victory against the Tyranids.
CotK <mew> | HAB | JL | MM | TTC | Cybertron

TAX THE CHURCHES! - Lord Zentei TTC Supreme Grand Prophet

And the LORD said, Let there be Bosons! Yea and let there be Bosoms too!
I'd rather be the great great grandson of a demon ninja than some jackass who grew potatos. -- Covenant
Dead cows don't fart. -- CJvR
...and I like strudel! :mrgreen: -- Asuka

User avatar
Wanderer
Jedi Master
Posts: 1195
Joined: 2006-02-21 07:02pm
Location: Freedom
Contact:

Post by Wanderer » 2006-02-27 01:06pm

I can't seem to find Execution Hour, does someone have the qoute on Nova cannon reload time. I recall it being 30 minutes with a well trained crew. Further, isn't it aimed with simple optics? Its been awhile since I looked at the fluff. I'v been reading DOW:Ascension lately.
Amateurs study Logistics, Professionals study Economics.
Dale Cozort (slightly out of context quote)

Murazor
Jedi Council Member
Posts: 2424
Joined: 2003-12-10 05:29am

Post by Murazor » 2006-02-27 01:13pm

Lord Zentei wrote:The main issue is numbers, how much the Vong possess. If all other opponents magically disappear, huge resources previoulsy held up would be made available to the Imperium. The fact that the IoM has dealt with "biowank" before means little, moreso since they have no real hope of victory against the Tyranids.
The destruction of the competition benefits the Vong more than the Imperium. They can modify planets for the production of bioships in a matter of months, while the Imperium will not have much time to build new infrastructure. The past experience of the Imperium against the Tyranids does grant them a serious advantage, however, the ability to use their nasty biological weapons to wipe Vongified planets and ground troops.

User avatar
K. A. Pital
Glamorous Commie
Posts: 20776
Joined: 2003-02-26 11:39am
Location: Elysium

Post by K. A. Pital » 2006-02-27 01:16pm

On the ground, the Vong go down real hard.
In space, they go down hard too. The Imperium is not the NR; it will use all power at it's disposal and sterilize worlds at whim.
Even if the Vong secure some sort of "victory", local or global, over the IoM, this victory shall be phyrric.
Oh, and the Vong don't really posess innumerable hordes, it's just that the NR is a pale shadow of the Empire and is always perplexed with some notions of morality when a galaxy-scale war is taking place. One use of the Centerpoint station battered the Vong fleet quite a bit; the difference is, the IoM in place of NR wouldn't give a fuck about it's own ships blown up, or any allies slain, or world murdered. Their resource supremacy is waay over the top for the Vong.
Lì ci sono chiese, macerie, moschee e questure, lì frontiere, prezzi inaccessibile e freddure
Lì paludi, minacce, cecchini coi fucili, documenti, file notturne e clandestini
Qui incontri, lotte, passi sincronizzati, colori, capannelli non autorizzati,
Uccelli migratori, reti, informazioni, piazze di Tutti i like pazze di passioni...

...La tranquillità è importante ma la libertà è tutto!
Assalti Frontali

User avatar
NecronLord
Harbinger of Doom
Harbinger of Doom
Posts: 27242
Joined: 2002-07-07 06:30am
Location: The Lost City

Post by NecronLord » 2006-02-27 01:32pm

Stas Bush wrote:Their resource supremacy is waay over the top for the Vong.
Got numbers?

Old Republic: 50 million inhabited worlds.
Imperium: 2 million, tops.
Superior Moderator - BotB - HAB [Drill Instructor]-Writer- Stardestroyer.net's resident Star-God.
"We believe in the systematic understanding of the physical world through observation and experimentation, argument and debate and most of all freedom of will." ~ Stargate: The Ark of Truth

User avatar
LapsedPacifist
Jedi Knight
Posts: 608
Joined: 2004-01-30 12:06pm
Location: WestCoast N. America

Post by LapsedPacifist » 2006-02-27 01:35pm

Wanderer wrote:I can't seem to find Execution Hour, does someone have the qoute on Nova cannon reload time. I recall it being 30 minutes with a well trained crew. Further, isn't it aimed with simple optics? Its been awhile since I looked at the fluff. I'v been reading DOW:Ascension lately.
I don't think that the Macharius from Execution Hour had a nova cannon. It was primarily torp/batteries/Bombers. Warriors of Ultramar definately had one, and I think that you might be right about the reload time being 30 minutes. Of course WoU also had the nova cannon being aimed by a guy with a telescope which annoys me to no end.

LP
Ogrek is beyond strategy.

<- Avatar from Dr. Roy's List of Stomatopods for the Aquarium

User avatar
NecronLord
Harbinger of Doom
Harbinger of Doom
Posts: 27242
Joined: 2002-07-07 06:30am
Location: The Lost City

Post by NecronLord » 2006-02-27 01:37pm

LapsedPacifist wrote:WoU also had the nova cannon being aimed by a guy with a telescope which annoys me to no end.
That appears somewhere else too. A powerful telescope plugs into a special bionic eye. Of course, eventaually, all spaceguns are going to be aimed via some sort of telescope. :wink:
Superior Moderator - BotB - HAB [Drill Instructor]-Writer- Stardestroyer.net's resident Star-God.
"We believe in the systematic understanding of the physical world through observation and experimentation, argument and debate and most of all freedom of will." ~ Stargate: The Ark of Truth

User avatar
LapsedPacifist
Jedi Knight
Posts: 608
Joined: 2004-01-30 12:06pm
Location: WestCoast N. America

Post by LapsedPacifist » 2006-02-27 01:39pm

NecronLord wrote:. Of course, eventaually, all spaceguns are going to be aimed via some sort of telescope. :wink:
I hadn't thought of it that way. I had the impression of a guy standing there with an eyepiece ala Master and Commander and that's probably not the case.

LP
Ogrek is beyond strategy.

<- Avatar from Dr. Roy's List of Stomatopods for the Aquarium

User avatar
NecronLord
Harbinger of Doom
Harbinger of Doom
Posts: 27242
Joined: 2002-07-07 06:30am
Location: The Lost City

Post by NecronLord » 2006-02-27 02:13pm

LapsedPacifist wrote:I hadn't thought of it that way. I had the impression of a guy standing there with an eyepiece ala Master and Commander and that's probably not the case.

LP
Well, I recall another description of the master gunner putting his special eye to the nova cannon's sight, a big brass telescope, and getting all kinds of HUD data.

It's logical that you'd need a big 'scope, because ultimately, you've got to gather sufficient light to analyse.
Superior Moderator - BotB - HAB [Drill Instructor]-Writer- Stardestroyer.net's resident Star-God.
"We believe in the systematic understanding of the physical world through observation and experimentation, argument and debate and most of all freedom of will." ~ Stargate: The Ark of Truth

User avatar
Wanderer
Jedi Master
Posts: 1195
Joined: 2006-02-21 07:02pm
Location: Freedom
Contact:

Post by Wanderer » 2006-02-27 02:25pm

I'm surprised noone brought out Alpha Class Psykers yet or something along that line.
Amateurs study Logistics, Professionals study Economics.
Dale Cozort (slightly out of context quote)

User avatar
Gunhead
Jedi Council Member
Posts: 1671
Joined: 2004-11-15 08:08am

Post by Gunhead » 2006-02-27 02:51pm

Wanderer wrote:I'm surprised noone brought out Alpha Class Psykers yet or something along that line.
It's still sort of under debate would they need to. I'd like to know how many ships did YV have at the beginning of their campaign. I've been under the impression that the IOM actually has lots of ships, they're just spread really thin.

YV needs to find a planet(s) that are suitable to their needs, and have to be able to hold them against IOM long enough to consolidate their gains.
In fact they have to do this with their space assets, because once the IOM ground force drop on their heads the ground fight is over.

It would be interesting to know how would the warp be affected as there is no chaos/necrons/whatnot.

-Gunhead
"In the absence of orders, go find something and kill it."
-Generalfeldmarschall Erwin Rommel

"And if you don't wanna feel like a putz
Collect the clues and connect the dots
You'll see the pattern that is bursting your bubble, and it's Bad" -The Hives

User avatar
NecronLord
Harbinger of Doom
Harbinger of Doom
Posts: 27242
Joined: 2002-07-07 06:30am
Location: The Lost City

Post by NecronLord » 2006-02-27 02:53pm

Wanderer wrote:I'm surprised noone brought out Alpha Class Psykers yet or something along that line.
The Imperium has very few that can be used.
Superior Moderator - BotB - HAB [Drill Instructor]-Writer- Stardestroyer.net's resident Star-God.
"We believe in the systematic understanding of the physical world through observation and experimentation, argument and debate and most of all freedom of will." ~ Stargate: The Ark of Truth

User avatar
Surlethe
HATES GRADING
Posts: 12262
Joined: 2004-12-29 03:41pm

Post by Surlethe » 2006-02-27 02:56pm

What's the initial strategic balance? Do both sides start with an equal planetary base, or do the Yuuzhan Vong have to fly worldships into the 40K galaxy and start from scratch like they did in NJO?
Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp! Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me. I lift my lamp beside the golden door!

User avatar
Wanderer
Jedi Master
Posts: 1195
Joined: 2006-02-21 07:02pm
Location: Freedom
Contact:

Post by Wanderer » 2006-02-27 02:57pm

Gunhead wrote:
YV needs to find a planet(s) that are suitable to their needs, and have to be able to hold them against IOM long enough to consolidate their gains.
In fact they have to do this with their space assets, because once the IOM ground force drop on their heads the ground fight is over.

-Gunhead
Considering the vastness of space, that should be easy. As for IOM fleet numbers, I believe Andy Chambers gave a High End of 375,000, but someone else will have to provide the direct qoute. My book base for 40K is small :( , though I am trying to build it up.
Amateurs study Logistics, Professionals study Economics.
Dale Cozort (slightly out of context quote)

User avatar
Wanderer
Jedi Master
Posts: 1195
Joined: 2006-02-21 07:02pm
Location: Freedom
Contact:

Post by Wanderer » 2006-02-27 03:02pm

Surlethe wrote:What's the initial strategic balance? Do both sides start with an equal planetary base, or do the Yuuzhan Vong have to fly worldships into the 40K galaxy and start from scratch like they did in NJO?
The Vong are moving in, so they have to nab a world. As for the Imperium, the Eye of Terror, Maelstrom, Storm of the Emperor's Wrath, and misc. Warp Storms are gone. So they can finally get a good sense of whats going on without all that interference and move with unprecedented speed and force.

Before anyone asks where I sent everyone else. I sent them to Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy :twisted:
Amateurs study Logistics, Professionals study Economics.
Dale Cozort (slightly out of context quote)

Post Reply