Reimagining the 1701

Jon · Post by **Jon** » 2006-12-27 10:40am

Has this been posted up?

http://www.gabekoerner.com/SOTL_Reimagined.jpg

It's an idea of what the Enterprise could look like if given a 21st Century stylization overhaul- perhaps a hint of something we could see in Trek XI? Anyway, this isn't an official image, just this guys personal musings I guess but nice to look at none-the-less. If Trek XI did something like this, what do you think would be the overall reaction.

On the model itself, I don't know if it is something about the mesh but looking at the layout of the windows, the ship seems much larger than the original 1701? Still, ignoring that my main point is discuss this kind of design overhaul. Is it too NX-01?

Other images including updated shuttlecraft etc:

http://gabekoerner.com/ent/entview_back.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/entview_bottom.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/entview_front.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/entview_side.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/entview_top.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/entview_persp1.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/entview_persp2.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/entview_persp3.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/entview_persp4.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/entview_persp5.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/render00.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/enterprise_0000.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/ent1.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/shuttle1.jpg
http://gabekoerner.com/ent/shuttle2.jpg

Bounty · Post by **Bounty** » 2006-12-27 10:42am

On the model itself, I don't know if it is something about the mesh but looking at the layout of the windows, the ship seems much larger than the original 1701? Still, ignoring that my main point is discuss this kind of design overhaul. Is it too NX-01?

Yes, it's a lot bigger. He made a size comparison with the E-Nil and she's about a third of her size.

I posted this in a Testing thread some time ago. Didn't think it needed it's own thread, since this is essentially fan art with an nBSG flavor...still, it's very good fanart. I can appreciate the skill that went into it, but I don't think it has enough of an identity of it's own.

ETA: you linked to the size comp yourself, you idiot

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2006-12-27 10:46am

It's more like what the Enteprise-D should have been. I don't know if I'd like an attempt to "stylise" the original ship. It does look good on its own merits, though.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2006-12-27 10:47am

On the model itself, I don't know if it is something about the mesh but looking at the layout of the windows, the ship seems much larger than the original 1701?

If it is, the torpedo tubes seem a bit oversized.

Also, the paneling seems a bit excessive, as I recall Andrew Probert's rant on the issue with regard to the Ent-D:

Andrew Probert wrote:One of the arguments is that (relatively) giant Starships look like toys if you can't see the panels & plates which our 20th century eyes are used to seeing. It was necessary, therefore, to indicate a 'paneled' surface all over the ship. The gaps between those panels scaled out to some 4 inches wide and 10 inches deep on the movie Enterprise, with my Next Generation ship getting hit much worse. That ship was 12 times the mass of Enterprise-A and close to a half mile in length (actually 7.27 football fields), meaning you would have to be a mile away to comfortably view it in it's entirety. It would, at that distance, look TOTALLY smooth (check an airliner from only 50 feet and you'll see what I mean) however, after I left the show, they remodeled it with alternating panels 18 scale inches high, and more, to satisfy some need to "break up the surface" of a historically smooth ship.

Bounty · Post by **Bounty** » 2006-12-27 10:49am

It's more like what the Enteprise-D should have been.

What, a regression to open panelling and exposed equipment with zero design evolution?

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2006-12-27 10:53am

Ah, I see the size comparison was in there.

Also, the shuttlebay seems absurdly tall now.

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2006-12-27 10:54am

Bounty wrote:
It's more like what the Enteprise-D should have been.
What, a regression to open panelling and exposed equipment with zero design evolution?

Why reinvent the wheel if you don't have to? "Design evolution" in engineering is not an exercise in making everything pretty.

Jon · Post by **Jon** » 2006-12-27 10:57am

Bounty wrote:
ETA: you linked to the size comp yourself, you idiot

I wasnt sure if that was supposed to be a direct scaling

But hmm, interesting indeed.

Death from the Sea · Post by **Death from the Sea** » 2006-12-27 11:09am

everything else aside, the deflector dish looks alot like it came from a BORG ship for some reason to me...

Soontir C'boath · Post by **Soontir C'boath** » 2006-12-27 12:09pm

Death from the Sea wrote:everything else aside, the deflector dish looks alot like it came from a BORG ship for some reason to me...

Maybe you're thinking weirdly from the E-E's dish.

I like it. Looks like it was built to last for millenniums.

General Zod · Post by **General Zod** » 2006-12-27 12:57pm

With the sole exception of the deflector dish, I like the new design. It would be pretty kickass if something like this were to be made available as say, a mod for a game or such.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2006-12-27 01:49pm

Oh my God, how...

I don't know...

I'm going to need some time to form a proper reaction.

Soontir C'boath · Post by **Soontir C'boath** » 2006-12-27 02:00pm

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:Oh my God, how... I don't know... I'm going to need some time to form a proper reaction.

Well for starters, is it a good or a bad reaction?

Skylon · Post by **Skylon** » 2006-12-27 02:21pm

Meh. Just looks like the TOS 1701 melded with the film version. I'm not too impressed.

1701 was reimagined to perfection for the TOS films IMHO.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2006-12-27 02:24pm

Soontir C'boath wrote:
Spanky The Dolphin wrote:Oh my God, how... I don't know... I'm going to need some time to form a proper reaction.
Well for starters, is it a good or a bad reaction?

Well, bad: from the window scaling, it's WAY too fucking big; good: at least it isn't some total amateur piece of shit.

I think a lot of the detailing makes the proportions go all out of whack: some things look too big while others look too small in relation to each other. It's all over the place.

And it isn't so much nBSG but ENT; I figured that would be at least obvious to someone like Bounty for God's sake.

With that said, though, I think it's at least a pretty good interpretation of ENT's aesthetics transposed to TOS' stylings.

The original TOS version is still ten-thousand percent better.

Tsyroc · Post by **Tsyroc** » 2006-12-27 03:27pm

I agree with Spanky that it looks like it was heavilly influenced by the Nx Enterprise from Enterprise.

It does have a few elements that remind me of the E-E though.

I think it looks pretty good in general and works well as a retcon to tie TOS with Enterprise a little better by way of ship design aesthetics.

===
On the render photo I got a small kick out of noticing the port and starboard indicator lights. A nice traditional sailing feature.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2006-12-27 03:48pm

I'm not sure I care for the nacelles apparent reference to NX-01, although just doing away with the exposed blue-glowies would probably make it look good to me.

Tsyroc wrote:On the render photo I got a small kick out of noticing the port and starboard indicator lights. A nice traditional sailing feature.

Those were present on the original Enterprise.

EDIT:

Skylon wrote:1701 was reimagined to perfection for the TOS films IMHO.

Skylon nailed it on the head here.

It's a fun 'what-if' concept, and if we ever have neoTOS inflicted on us I wouldn't mind seeing that as the model used, but I wouldn't ever want to see it presented as Shatner-Kirk's U.S.S. Enterprise.

EDIT2: The more I think about it, the more I think that isn't a "scale representation", because the Ent-refit doesn't look big enough; it should be bigger than the original.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2006-12-27 04:08pm

Even ignoring the "scaling" image (which I think is maybe simply a design comparison), just look at the size of the windows compared to those on the TOS and Refit versions. This thing is easily made to be about twice the size of either originals.

Bounty · Post by **Bounty** » 2006-12-27 04:35pm

On the render photo I got a small kick out of noticing the port and starboard indicator lights. A nice traditional sailing feature.

The NX (and a few other ENT vessels) had the same indicators.

And it isn't so much nBSG but ENT; I figured that would be at least obvious to someone like Bounty for God's sake.

You know, I honestly didn't see that. I think it's the blue-ish colouring and dark lighting that tricked me

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2006-12-27 04:38pm

Patrick Degan wrote:
Bounty wrote:
It's more like what the Enteprise-D should have been.
What, a regression to open panelling and exposed equipment with zero design evolution?
Why reinvent the wheel if you don't have to? "Design evolution" in engineering is not an exercise in making everything pretty.

Just because TOS was good doesn't mean it should've been impossible to make a successor distinct. I agree TNG was botched but the-same-ship-all-over-again a couple hundred years later just defies any attempt to draw distinction and automatically sets a successor to be unoriginal and derivative, rather than a logical stand-alone successor.

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2006-12-27 05:05pm

I like it as an original design, but I don't know how I feel about it as a replacement E-nil. "Trials and Tribble-ations" and "In a Mirror, Darkly" showed that the original Matt Jefferies design (interior and exterior) can look awful pretty when done in modern effects.

brianeyci · Post by **brianeyci** » 2006-12-27 05:15pm

Well I'm generally not a purist, and I like reimagined ships. But a reimagined Constitution is not sexy at all. Mostly because the "unfinished" bare metal look. Enterprise (the series) should've had unfinished ships, these kind of designs, and Akiraprise was kind of like that. But Kirk's time, the ships should be fully painted. The vibe I'm getting of it is unfortunately like an unfinished basement with concrete cinder blocks

. Either that, or a spartan feel, the thing's built for war like the Sovereign, and I don't like that.

Vanas · Post by **Vanas** » 2006-12-27 05:27pm

brianeyci has a point there. The design would probably be better for a re-imagined ISS Enterprise rather than the somewhat less militarised Federation. Give it a whiteish paintjob and you might just get a USS Enterprise.

I quite like the design myself, but I can't really see it in the series.

SCVN 2812 · Post by **SCVN 2812** » 2006-12-27 05:32pm

Aesthetically speaking, the sensor dish, especially the projection more or less completely fails to fit the ship. The Enterprise E's dish would fit nicely into that slot I think and still fit the overall look of the ship. Let's face it, even if it is realistic, having a giant satellite dish strapped to the front of your ship just doesn't look as cool as it used to.

General Zod · Post by **General Zod** » 2006-12-27 05:36pm

Vanas wrote:brianeyci has a point there. The design would probably be better for a re-imagined ISS Enterprise rather than the somewhat less militarised Federation. Give it a whiteish paintjob and you might just get a USS Enterprise.

I quite like the design myself, but I can't really see it in the series.

I dunno, The Original Series always prortrayed Starfleet as the military arm of the Federation. So giving the Enterprise nil a more Spartan feel than the other Enterprises somewhat makes sense.