Trump threatens to shut down social media platforms after Twitter tags his posts as misinformation.

N&P: Discuss governments, nations, politics and recent related news here.

Moderators: Alyrium Denryle, Edi, K. A. Pital

User avatar
Broomstick
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 27004
Joined: 2004-01-02 07:04pm
Location: Industrial armpit of the US Midwest
Contact:

Re: Trump threatens to shut down social media platforms after Twitter tags his posts as misinformation.

Post by Broomstick » 2020-05-30 04:44pm

Fact checking is determining whether or not a statement is congruent with actual reality. It shouldn't be political, even if in today's USA it has become politicized.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. - John F. Kennedy

Sam Vimes Theory of Economic Injustice

User avatar
Jub
Sith Marauder
Posts: 3916
Joined: 2012-08-06 07:58pm
Location: British Columbia, Canada

Re: Trump threatens to shut down social media platforms after Twitter tags his posts as misinformation.

Post by Jub » 2020-05-30 05:09pm

Broomstick wrote:
2020-05-30 04:44pm
Fact checking is determining whether or not a statement is congruent with actual reality. It shouldn't be political, even if in today's USA it has become politicized.
That's fine for things that have a clear cut yes or no answer, but what about things which are more shades of grey or open to interpretation? Or even for things that are clear cut, which posters do you focus on if you can't catch everything, do you remove the messages or affix a warning to them, how much do you bend to the laws of a given nation when it comes to censoring messages? It's all political when you dig down into it.

User avatar
Broomstick
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 27004
Joined: 2004-01-02 07:04pm
Location: Industrial armpit of the US Midwest
Contact:

Re: Trump threatens to shut down social media platforms after Twitter tags his posts as misinformation.

Post by Broomstick » 2020-05-30 05:23pm

When a political official claim he never said something he did (as an example I just pulled out of my ass) and there is video of him saying exactly that, that qualifies as a fact-check.

Sure, some things are opinion. Others are very much fact. Facts can be fact-checked. Opinions and "shades of grey" would not apply. Did I really need to explain this to you?
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. - John F. Kennedy

Sam Vimes Theory of Economic Injustice

bilateralrope
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4447
Joined: 2005-06-25 06:50pm
Location: New Zealand

Re: Trump threatens to shut down social media platforms after Twitter tags his posts as misinformation.

Post by bilateralrope » 2020-05-30 05:30pm

Jub wrote:
2020-05-30 05:09pm
That's fine for things that have a clear cut yes or no answer, but what about things which are more shades of grey or open to interpretation? Or even for things that are clear cut, which posters do you focus on if you can't catch everything, do you remove the messages or affix a warning to them, how much do you bend to the laws of a given nation when it comes to censoring messages? It's all political when you dig down into it.
Have any social media platforms been fact checking anything that falls into those problematic areas ?

User avatar
Jub
Sith Marauder
Posts: 3916
Joined: 2012-08-06 07:58pm
Location: British Columbia, Canada

Re: Trump threatens to shut down social media platforms after Twitter tags his posts as misinformation.

Post by Jub » 2020-05-30 05:38pm

bilateralrope wrote:
2020-05-30 05:30pm
Have any social media platforms been fact checking anything that falls into those problematic areas ?
Google does things like changing how borders are shown depending on where you use their maps service from, Twitter blocks Nazi content for its German users, Facebook colludes to get Trump elected. Tell me these things aren't political.

bilateralrope
Sith Marauder
Posts: 4447
Joined: 2005-06-25 06:50pm
Location: New Zealand

Re: Trump threatens to shut down social media platforms after Twitter tags his posts as misinformation.

Post by bilateralrope » 2020-05-30 05:53pm

Jub wrote:
2020-05-30 05:38pm
bilateralrope wrote:
2020-05-30 05:30pm
Have any social media platforms been fact checking anything that falls into those problematic areas ?
Google does things like changing how borders are shown depending on where you use their maps service from,

That doesn't sound like a fact check because there is no user post to fact check.
Twitter blocks Nazi content for its German users,
That's blocking content. Not fact checking it. Also, isn't that a matter of German law, not Twitters decision ?
Facebook colludes to get Trump elected. Tell me these things aren't political.
Did Facebook's collusion include any fact checking ?

User avatar
Jub
Sith Marauder
Posts: 3916
Joined: 2012-08-06 07:58pm
Location: British Columbia, Canada

Re: Trump threatens to shut down social media platforms after Twitter tags his posts as misinformation.

Post by Jub » 2020-05-30 06:07pm

bilateralrope wrote:
2020-05-30 05:53pm
That doesn't sound like a fact check because there is no user post to fact check.
Borders and disputes about borders are things that exist and changing how you display cold hard facts.
That's blocking content. Not fact checking it. Also, isn't that a matter of German law, not Twitters decision ?
How do you know something that isn't completely overt is a Nazi post without fact-checking it?
Did Facebook's collusion include any fact checking ?
It involved the opposite in many cases. Though how would one fact check posts about 'crooked Hilary's emails' or 'Hilary's a warmonger' type articles anyway?

-----

Beyond all of this, what they do or don't investigate is a choice that can be political, choosing to remove a post versus flagging it can be political, what is and isn't a falsehood is political. For an example of the last point, one of these is a lie and the others are a grey area:

Post 1: "I never said that."

Post 2: "I don't recall having said that."

Post 3: "That's was taken out of context."

These could all be lies but only one is strictly cut and dry without room for interpretation. Once interpretation comes in so too does politics.

User avatar
Broomstick
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 27004
Joined: 2004-01-02 07:04pm
Location: Industrial armpit of the US Midwest
Contact:

Re: Trump threatens to shut down social media platforms after Twitter tags his posts as misinformation.

Post by Broomstick » 2020-05-30 07:20pm

And yet....

Post 1: "I never said that" - look to see if there are any posts/videos showing the opposite

Post 2: "I don't recall having said that" - well, OK, someone's memory might be faulty but you can still establish whether or not they actually said something, whether they recall it or not.

Post 3: "That was taken out of context" - OK, provide the context and let the reader/viewer decide.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. - John F. Kennedy

Sam Vimes Theory of Economic Injustice

User avatar
Jub
Sith Marauder
Posts: 3916
Joined: 2012-08-06 07:58pm
Location: British Columbia, Canada

Re: Trump threatens to shut down social media platforms after Twitter tags his posts as misinformation.

Post by Jub » 2020-05-30 07:55pm

Broomstick wrote:
2020-05-30 07:20pm
And yet....

Post 1: "I never said that" - look to see if there are any posts/videos showing the opposite
The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
Post 2: "I don't recall having said that" - well, OK, someone's memory might be faulty but you can still establish whether or not they actually said something, whether they recall it or not.
Is this the duty of social media? Should this apply to just politicians or to all public figures? Does it apply to things said off the record or only to official statements?
Post 3: "That was taken out of context" - OK, provide the context and let the reader/viewer decide.
How much on each side of a quote establishes context; is there an established metric for that?

Post Reply