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 Post subject: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 01:17pm 

I managed to secure a {slightly, barely} early copy of Revan in the wee hours of the morning, and I'm just now putting it down for a breather. Overall, my impression of the book is that it's a decent read, especially as far as Star Wars is concerned. Karpyshyn is a moderately talented storyteller who is skilled with pacing and fight scenes. He remains firmly beneath the likes of Stover and Luceno, and I'd personally put him on par with the likes of Zahn, Denning, and Traviss in the low-mid-tier of Star Wars authors.

The Plagueis excerpt alone was worth the purchase and even in four pages one can see the wide gulf between Luceno and Karpyshyn as writers. Palpatine is chilling and it is implied that he .

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 06:05pm 

Oh boy, you're in for it now. You put Travis and Zahn on the same level.

I'll probably check out the Plagueis novel. I like Luceno's work, and more on Palpatine and his master will be interesting.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 07:01pm 

Controversial as hell, I know.
But the truth is that Zahn never really astounded me as a novelist. He had some great ideas, but rampant minimalism and authorial vanity kept me from enjoying his works completely. But I do recognize and respect him for his contributions to the EU.



Yeah, Luceno does a great job with Sidious. The first four pages paint him as a very chilling figure.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 07:25pm 

Zahn is strongest at characterization, suspense, and political intrigue I think. But he seems to be generally very well respected by the fans.

Not sure what you mean by "authorial vanity...".

I wouldn't say he's that minimalist, in any case. Maybe when he wrote The Thrawn Trilogy, but he also used 25,000 as the number of Imperial Star Destroyers, which isn't too bad when compared to Travis and her three million clones.

Going to be good to know more about Palpatine and the Sith. I remember the bits of Dark Lord where Luceno delved into Sith teachings and Palpatine's mindset. Very intriguing. I'd like some more of that.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 07:48pm 

there are some spoilers on amazon. The most I gathered was that plageius was a banker of some kind and that he focused more on financial matters and scientific research than palpy. The advance word is highly positive so it's on the list.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 08:20pm 

I saw excerpts from the Revan novel that . I'm annoyed because it doesn't seem to be anything more than a cheap tie-in to the upcoming MMORPG.

As for the Plagueis novel, I just wish it had stayed cancelled. The story basically has to revolve around the relationship with Palpatine, and I just don't think his backstory can really be fleshed out in any satisfactory way.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 09:12pm 

The retcon argument is horsecrap from a whiny fanboy.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 09:39pm 

I find his interpretation of Thrawn and his abilities to border on the ridiculous.



I'm not sure where the retcon stuff came from, but

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 09:58pm 

I'm never going to read this novel so could somebody give me a summary as to what happens? In particular to the Exile since KotOR 2 rocked and KotOR 1 can go get fucked.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 10:22pm 

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 10:26pm 

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 10:29pm 

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 10:57pm 

I personally always thought Thrawn's ability to perform tactical master-strokes by analyzing people's art is partly a mask for other, more conventional forms of research. Thrawn's the sort of person who would take misdirection to that high a level- deliberately misleading people about how he makes his decisions.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 11:04pm 

What you're saying is a charismatic rationalization of what I believe to be an incredibly dumb plot device involving an otherwise great character. I'd vote for that retcon.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 11:15pm 

and "Vaner" shan (revan's son) is a politician. Weird.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 11:20pm 

That kid's name is testament to Karpyshyn's abilities as a writer. Behold and be amazed.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 11:26pm 

Frankly, since Thrawn seemed like a pretty damn good tactician without screwing around with artwork, I don't think that it's a critical plot device. He likes art, he studies his enemies closely and tries to defeat them. So far, so sensible.

Part of his study involves art, and he claims that doing this helps him to understand his enemies... so what? I don't let it worry me too much.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 11:30pm 

at least Vaner's spawn have more creative names (Bress and Ressa). For some reason I thought Revan would have a daughter.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 11:33pm 

If you assume that literally all Thrawn is doing is spending time in an art gallery of his enemies then yes it sounds and looks like a dumb plot device. But if you read between the lines and don't take Thrawn as one hundred percent literally true it becomes clear that what Thrawn was doing was combing deep psychological profiles, SIGINT, ELINT and HUMINT and using art as a framing device for his decision making and explanation of his plans to subordinates. Art is his hobby and no one can bullshit better than a post modernist art critic on how a bunch of trashcan lids duck taped together under a raincoat describes mans struggle with humanity in a urban setting compared to his yearning for an agrarian back to roots spiritualism.

It's the difference between reading Heir to the Empire in 1993 when I was only 11 years old VS re-reading it when I was twenty three and being able to grasp the nuances that skipped right over my head at that age.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 11:44pm 

That sounds even worse. The danger of Nihilus' power was that his hunger threatened to destroy everything, so that either requires redefining the nature of the power, or it's just a case of silly one-upmanship.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-15 11:48pm 

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-16 12:49am 

Notably, the fact that Zahn's work typically has such nuances, while still being basically comprehensible, is one of the things that makes people respect him. If you look at what he's saying and think about it, it makes more sense, not less. That's the mark of a good author.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-22 12:50am 

For a full recap

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-22 02:22am 

People who like Zahn generally like him for his writing style and stories... the theme and the flavor. people who hate him hate him because they find he is too minimalist for their tastes (like 25,000 Star destroyers.) ya can't really compare the two though.

 Post subject: Re: Revan novel & Plagueis excerpt SPOILERS

Posted: 2011-11-22 06:13pm 

25,000 Star Destroyers really isn't that minimalist. Certainly not in the same league as 3 million clones, or even Zahns' early concept of 200 outdated cruisers being a major factor in the Galactic Civil War.