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Mammoth Mk III VS Baneblade

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SpaceMarine93
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 01:30pm 

Jedi Knight


Joined: 2011-05-03 05:15am
Posts: 585
Location: Continent of Mu
There had been so many VS. debates between various science fiction, but I rarely seen anything concerning fights between individual units from different settings and factions. So here's one to add to the variety.

Based upon their specifications: armaments, firepower, speed, armor, etc, which of these tanks, fully upgraded, would win out in a one on one fight:

The Mammoth Mk III Tank of the GDI, deployed during the Third Tiberium War, from Command and Conquer 3: Tiberium Wars?

(Plus adaptive armor and railguns upgrades)

Image

Or the Baneblade Super-Heavy battle tank, used by the Imperial Guards of the Imperium of Man, from Warhammer 40000?

(Lucius Pattern, Mark IV, fully upgraded with Hunter-killer Missile, Improved Comms, Minesweeper, pintle-mounted Heavy Stubber/Storm Bolter, Searchlight and Smoke Launchers.)

Image
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KhorneFlakes
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 02:07pm 

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Joined: 2011-04-23 12:27pm
Posts: 371
Location: Australia, QLD
How about option C: A giant penis monster comes and fucks Indrick Boreale 32190589039435's face so hard it explodes, and rabid spagetthi from a Nurglite kitchen devours his corpse. Shortly after, a homicidal shade of the color purple comes and gets into a fight with all of the abve, including Sphess Merheen Number's corpse.

Meanwhile, Kharn comes and kills the occupants of both tanks and uses the Mammoth to try out his new Baneblade. He proceeds to kick ass and get bitches afterwards.
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Lord Revan
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 02:15pm 

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Do we got any idea what kind of damage either of those can inflict (outside of game play obviously)?
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SpaceMarine93
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 02:23pm 

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Joined: 2011-05-03 05:15am
Posts: 585
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KhorneFlakes wrote:
How about option C: A giant penis monster comes and fucks Indrick Boreale 32190589039435's face so hard it explodes, and rabid spagetthi from a Nurglite kitchen devours his corpse. Shortly after, a homicidal shade of the color purple comes and gets into a fight with all of the abve, including Sphess Merheen Number's corpse.

Meanwhile, Kharn comes and kills the occupants of both tanks and uses the Mammoth to try out his new Baneblade. He proceeds to kick ass and get bitches afterwards.


Just exactly what's wrong with me asking these questions?
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KhorneFlakes
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 02:40pm 

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Joined: 2011-04-23 12:27pm
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Location: Australia, QLD
You ask stupid questions. You overreact to just about everything. You hyperventilate, like in that other thread involving banks, and shouted something along the lines of "GET THE SUPREME COURT IN HERE AIQBFIOUAFB!" when it didn't really warrant.

All that seems to pour out of your mouth is stupidity. I'm sorry mang, but it's true.

And don't even apologize. Don't even cry. Just...please. Just shut the fuck up and don't say anything. That way you won't say any other stupid shit.
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Lord Revan
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 03:19pm 

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Tbh I think this just needs a tad more useble figures and it could be nice vs argument (both tanks are on the super heavy weight class of their respective franchices)
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SpaceMarine93
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 04:06pm 

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Joined: 2011-05-03 05:15am
Posts: 585
Location: Continent of Mu
KhorneFlakes wrote:
You ask stupid questions. You overreact to just about everything. You hyperventilate, like in that other thread involving banks, and shouted something along the lines of "GET THE SUPREME COURT IN HERE AIQBFIOUAFB!" when it didn't really warrant.

All that seems to pour out of your mouth is stupidity. I'm sorry mang, but it's true.

And don't even apologize. Don't even cry. Just...please. Just shut the fuck up and don't say anything. That way you won't say any other stupid shit.


A part of me wants to make some kind of rebuttal, feel angry, insulted and hurt. But I won't do it, if not for decency and respect for fellow forum posters. I will not defend the way I acted in some of my posts. No retort, no justification, no excuses, no anger, no self-righteousness. I have problems with making my points, and if it offends people on certain levels I will take criticisms of me into consideration and be more careful next time I make a statement about any topic

As a matter of fact, I think I would take KhorneFlake's criticism to my comments in the forum and stick it in my signature, just to remind myself not to act like an idiot.

I got a lot of flak over the years with many people calling me the worse excuse of a Human being, many of which I felt are disproportionate for the perceived offense, and I am certainly determined not to become one.

Lord Revan wrote:
Tbh I think this just needs a tad more useble figures and it could be nice vs argument (both tanks are on the super heavy weight class of their respective franchices)


I can't find technical specifications for the Mammoth Mark III tank anywhere, unfortunately, other than that I found in the Command and Conquer wikia:

http://cnc.wikia.com/wiki/Mammoth_Mk._III

Quote:

Overview:

The Mammoth tank is designed with long-range operations in harsh environments in mind. For this purpose, apart from twin cannons, it is covered in thick, hexagonal armour. The vehicle is designed to incorporate an organic engineer crew to maintain it in the field. They could independently repair the vehicle to 50% effectiveness.

Technical specifications:

It has a distinctive H shape that comes from General Combat Hull, Inc.'s patented multiple quad drive tread system, originally developed for the Bull tank. Each tread has two independent high-torque HTSC (High Temperature Super Conductor, a material widely used in the Mammoth's systems) electromagnetic motors. The main power source are dual Mil-Spec CVJF (Combat Vehicle Jet Fuel) ducted turbine generators. This combination gives the Mammoth speed, durability, maneuverability and IR (heat signature) reduction.

Armament:

The tank is equipped with dual 150-mm cannons on the turret (which can be later upgraded to railguns) and comes, in the vein of earlier models, with two 4.75-inch missile pods specially designed to attack infantry and aircraft.

Upgrades:

Mammoth Mk. III with railguns: An upgrade replacing the cannon with railguns became available prior to the Third Tiberium War, and vehicles continued to be retrofitted right through to the end of that conflict. Additional upgrade options dating to pre-TW2 years include adaptive armor and railgun accelerators; these were mostly found in Mammoths employed by the Steel Talons experimental combat technology division.


Nothing is mentioned about things such as size, weight, power generation etc. and little information armor thickness/material, speed, range of weapons etc.

The Baneblade on the other hand have a detailed specification. This is just for the Lucius pattern from Lexicanum dot com:

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Baneblade#.T8kb_tV8Dvk

Quote:
Technical Specifications:

Vehicle Name: Baneblade
Main Armament: Battle Cannon, Demolisher Cannon
Secondary Armament: Autocannon, 2 Lascannons, 6 Heavy Bolters
Forge World of Origin: Lucius
Known Patterns: I-IV
Traverse: 360 degrees and 6 degrees
Elevation: From -2 to 28 degrees
Crew: Commander, Driver, 3 Gunners, 3 Loaders, Comms-Operator, Engineer
Powerplant: LC503 v18 p4 multi-fuel
Main Ammunition: 22 rounds and 18 rounds
Secondary Ammunition: 300 rounds and 4000 rounds
Weight:319 tonnes
Length: 13.5m
Ground Clearance: 1.2m Hull: 190mm
Max Speed - on road 25kph
Max Speed - off road: 18kph
Tranport Capacity: None
Firing Ports: n/a
Access Points: n/a

Armour specifics:

Width: 8.4m
Height: 6.3m
Superstructure: 210mm
Gun Mantlet: 180mm
Vehicle Designation: 0427-658-0435-BB018
Turret: 220mm
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Connor MacLeod
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 05:56pm 

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Joined: 2002-08-01 05:03pm
Posts: 14053
Dude, can you sound any more.. pompous? I mean I know its me saying this and compared to some I'm totally way too serious about this shit, but really... lighten up?

You'd have a way easier time here if you just didn't keep trying so hard to be 'thoughtful' or something. People judge you by how you act, not the things you do to impress them.
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SpaceMarine93
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 06:10pm 

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Joined: 2011-05-03 05:15am
Posts: 585
Location: Continent of Mu
Connor MacLeod wrote:
Dude, can you sound any more.. pompous? I mean I know its me saying this and compared to some I'm totally way too serious about this shit, but really... lighten up?

You'd have a way easier time here if you just didn't keep trying so hard to be 'thoughtful' or something. People judge you by how you act, not the things you do to impress them.


Why do I keep screwing up in everything...
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Purple
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 06:22pm 

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Joined: 2010-04-20 08:31am
Posts: 2338
Location: In a purple cube orbiting this planet. Hijacking satellites for an internet connection.
SpaceMarine93 wrote:
Connor MacLeod wrote:
Dude, can you sound any more.. pompous? I mean I know its me saying this and compared to some I'm totally way too serious about this shit, but really... lighten up?

You'd have a way easier time here if you just didn't keep trying so hard to be 'thoughtful' or something. People judge you by how you act, not the things you do to impress them.


Why do I keep screwing up in everything...

Because you try too hard... Or rather because you try. Period. Or as Yoda put it. Do or do not. Do not try.
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SpaceMarine93
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 06:28pm 

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Joined: 2011-05-03 05:15am
Posts: 585
Location: Continent of Mu
Alright, returning to topic at hand - Baneblade VS Mammoth Mark III, both fully upgraded, which one would win?
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Purple
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 06:47pm 

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Joined: 2010-04-20 08:31am
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Location: In a purple cube orbiting this planet. Hijacking satellites for an internet connection.
Well, one of them is a really large tank. Think something like the Panzer VIII Maus but actually not sucking. The other is a mobile fortress of doom that can and often does take on titans and entire enemy armor formations. Being the closest thing to a titan you can get without attaching feet.
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Darth Fanboy
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 10:15pm 

DUH! WINNING!


Joined: 2002-09-20 05:25am
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Location: Mars, where I am a totally bitchin' rockstar.
Purple wrote:
Because you try too hard... Or rather because you try. Period. Or as Yoda put it. Do or do not. Do not try.


Pot calling the kettle purple.
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Ahriman238
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 10:30pm 

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Joined: 2011-04-22 11:04pm
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Location: Ocularis Terribus.
Don't know a lot about command and conquer, but if we treat the railguns like the Tau version... the "Mammoth" is roadkill.
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Lord Revan
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 11:02pm 

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Joined: 2004-05-20 02:23pm
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Ahriman238 wrote:
Don't know a lot about command and conquer, but if we treat the railguns like the Tau version... the "Mammoth" is roadkill.

Tbh that might not be fair towards the Mammoth, it should win or loose by it's own merits not by what assumptions we make about it. sadly no-one given any indication on what kind of damage either of those involved can inflict.

I mean what does "battlecannon" really mean, based on the info given we know nothing about the calibre (or firepower for that matter).

While it's most likely that Baneblade will be the victor, we cannot call it certain until we get something we can compare.
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Stark
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 11:03pm 

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Joined: 2002-07-03 09:56pm
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Location: Brisbane, Australia
Can we add a Hildolfr for lols?

Image

Bigger than a Baneblade but with sportscar agility? How can you go wrong. Poor old Mammoths.
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madd0ct0r
PostPosted: 2012-06-01 11:30pm 

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Joined: 2008-03-14 07:47am
Posts: 3337
holy shit there's some uneccesary bad vibes in this thread.

ok, if the baneblade was a stormsowrd titan hunter variant, then yeah, definetly a bit one sided.

The MIII is almost certainly faster (can it outpace an infantry man?) and may or may not be longer ranged.

Are there any examples of the MIII firing upon a quantifiable target - a house or concrete bridge ?
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Irbis
PostPosted: 2012-06-02 09:54am 

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Joined: 2011-07-15 05:31pm
Posts: 1517
Purple wrote:
Well, one of them is a really large tank. Think something like the Panzer VIII Maus but actually not sucking. The other is a mobile fortress of doom that can and often does take on titans and entire enemy armor formations. Being the closest thing to a titan you can get without attaching feet.

Technically, that honor belongs to Leviathan/Colossus super-heavy assault transports, both Warhound class Titan sized, or Capitol Imperialis mobile fortress, easily rivaling Reavers/Warlords :P
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Meest
PostPosted: 2012-06-03 05:09am 

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Joined: 2003-11-18 04:04am
Posts: 1384
Location: Toronto
Promethium vs combat jet fuel, fight! Even the massive plasma gun Baneblade variant uses the multi-fuel power plant and that has to produce enough to bust Titan void shields. No idea how it does that with a chemical fuel, they only mention capacitors or fuel cells to hold the main gun charge. Would think they could squeeze a fusion plant in there since Baneblades are reasonably rare. No idea on the Mammoth, size estimates? What units are they expected to take on?
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Stark
PostPosted: 2012-06-03 05:14am 

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Hildolfr uses ultracompact Minkovsky-Ionescu fusion powerplants. That's how it can do 220kmh and handbrake turns!
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Ahriman238
PostPosted: 2012-06-03 04:58pm 

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Joined: 2011-04-22 11:04pm
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Well, I went through youtube looking for something quantifiable on the Mammoth, and I've got nothing. There was an FPS game, Renegade, where a the player can take control of a Mammoth in one mission and can one-shot helicopters and light tanks, and that's the closest I have.

Revan is correct, we should judge the tank on it's own merits. Does anyone have a workable idea for doing so?
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Stark
PostPosted: 2012-06-03 05:28pm 

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Well, does it have first shot accuracy at 20 kilometres, side skirts immune to 120mm and the ability for accurate fire while reversing at 100kmh over uneven terrain?
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Ahriman238
PostPosted: 2012-06-03 05:34pm 

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Survery says... unlikely, maybe and no.
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Lord Revan
PostPosted: 2012-06-03 06:12pm 

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Ahriman238 wrote:
Well, I went through youtube looking for something quantifiable on the Mammoth, and I've got nothing. There was an FPS game, Renegade, where a the player can take control of a Mammoth in one mission and can one-shot helicopters and light tanks, and that's the closest I have.

Revan is correct, we should judge the tank on it's own merits. Does anyone have a workable idea for doing so?

Renegade's Mammoth is the mark I so it doesn't give us all that much anyways and Stark is that wank-a-tank of yours anywhere within a lightyear's range of being official or is it just overwanked fanwork.
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Stark
PostPosted: 2012-06-03 06:33pm 

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Dude the Hildolfr is the Ferrari supertank scifi always needed, and not yet another huge slow bullet sponge. It's designed to fight really agile targets in a high jamming environment, and while it's obviously not very resource efficient and probably has ridiculous maintenance requirements and tiny ammo stowage, it's more interesting than a mammoth.

I mean it has it's own digger arms to brace it when firing or to emplace with only the 33cm exposed. I can post a hilarious video of it sniping guys at 20 klicks and avoiding counter battery fire with reverse zoom and ridiculous turns once I get home.
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