Captain America SPOILERS!

[Ahriman238]

So far Cap's grossed $170 million. It's budget was... $140 million. 30 million is a modest gain for a movie. Albeit I'd love to make that kind of 'modest' profit.

[neoolong]

Divide that $170M by two and you'll get closer to what the film's revenue is up to this point. The theaters get about half of the Box Office gross. You also need to throw in marketing costs since the $140M was the production budget.

[Simon_Jester]

Really, I think the industry is suffering from Comic Book Movie Overload- between this, X-Men First Class, Thor, and Green Lantern, all coming out in a span of about two months, it's just too much, and they're eating into each other's profit margins.

[Ted C]

Which raises an interesting point, besides Earth and Asgard, none of the Nine Realms are much fun to visit.

The residents of Alfheim might object to that.

As might the residents of Vanaheim, land of the Vanir, and Nidavellir, Land of the dwarves.

[Havok]

another old Hero the Red Tornado who was also a robot/android.

Red tornado is a charcter from DC not marvel.

HA HA!! FUCKING NOOB!!

[Havok]

It's not surprising that Cap has tailed off harder than Thor did. It has far more competition and is not going to draw as well overseas as it is decidedly Amercian-centric.
Of course it is has only been released for 14 full days. Thor made it's money over the course of 12 weeks. Shit, Thor is still in about 190 theaters according to Box Office Mojo.

[lordofchange13]

Really GOOD MOVIE!! the characters weir very real to me, red skull was UBER bad ass,and captain American didn't look like a retard with his final costume design. I also really liked the instances with the Fallout tech, really makes you believe that Thor and the Hulk could exist in this universe.

[Ahriman238]

Which raises an interesting point, besides Earth and Asgard, none of the Nine Realms are much fun to visit.

The residents of Alfheim might object to that.

As might the residents of Vanaheim, land of the Vanir, and Nidavellir, Land of the dwarves.

Fair enough. Retracted. I was thinking more in terms of Niffleheim, Svartheim, Jotunheim, and Hel. I don't think I've ever seen Vanaheim, being a pretty sporadic reader of Thor, except in the backstory of the Executioner.

[Faqa]

Just got back from seeing it. Very deep, meaningful movie.

I've got a slight theory - now granted, I may just be reading into random things here. It is subtle. But there's a certain... pattern to some events. A pattern that, given ponderous thought and proper interpretation might lead to a small far-fetched idea that can barely been seen in the movie.

In essence, some of Hugo Weaving's acting here leads me to believe he might be.... a bad guy. No, really.

In all seriousness, Red Skull was THE most over-the-top villain I have seen in a movie since... forever. Half the budget of the film had to be the set replacements for Weaving to chew on. Not to mention the ridiculous black-and-red outfits. Not that that's necessarily bad in a movie titled "Captain America". But that really does count as a point all on it's own.

Captain America's character actually was well-built - he could easily be a generic hero, but the movie goes out of it's way to not only distinguish him from such but also to show the audience what makes this little wimp so special.

The action scenes were EXCELLENT - blatant, on-screen violence, with the good Captain kicking ass in a satisfying fashion. I'm a bit disappointed in the final showdown between him and Skull (not least Skull's random Raiders Of The Lost Ark-style disappearance), but in light of most the other fight scenes, it gets a pass.

As for building the Marvel-verse, I'm no comic book nerd, but I think Howard Stark bore enough of a personal and physical resemblance to Tony Stark to make the reference worth it. And the Nick Fury setup at the end.... well, it worked better than his appearance in IM2, for what that is worth. Beyond that, the movie could really have just ended with Cap waking up without losing too much.

A minor complaint - the way the film utterly devalued any fighting that did not involve punching the shit out of things was a bit annoying. By this I mean Rogers' outright statement that it would be a failure for him as a man to not serve as a direct combat soldier. It's not every movie that goes out of it's way to make this particular point.

[Zor]

In regards to his disapperence, i think that he will be back for the avengers. My money is that he was sucked into Asgard.

Anyway, saw the movie twice (once by myself, once with a lady) and it is a very good film.

Zor

[LadyTevar]

FAQA:

While they could have shown Cap and the Howlin' Commandos taking out a Hydra base, I think the montage of combat worked far better. There were just too many bases to take out, and it would have added at least an hour to the run-time even for one base. Scenes outside a base were shown to be weapons fire, satchel charges, and other common soldier tricks but once Cap was inside a base or the Hydra goons were in melee range, it was hand-to-hand and that was that.

Sidenote: I find it interesting that Red Skull simply saw Cap on the monitor screen, and gave up the factory. "Our soldiers are outmatched", so destroy the base and retreat to one of the undiscovered bases? Was he scared, or did the Red Skull base his decision on what he knew he himself could do?

[Faqa]

While they could have shown Cap and the Howlin' Commandos taking out a Hydra base, I think the montage of combat worked far better. There were just too many bases to take out, and it would have added at least an hour to the run-time even for one base. Scenes outside a base were shown to be weapons fire, satchel charges, and other common soldier tricks but once Cap was inside a base or the Hydra goons were in melee range, it was hand-to-hand and that was that.

Oh, I'm fine with that.

My problem is earlier in the film - when he's trying every depot in the area to get in. And, when told he can contribute in a non-combat fashion, treats the idea with contempt.

And the way the film continues, it never does anything to disavow this idea - Steve Rogers was a pussy until and unless he was able to undertake combat operations. Hell, the film stops short of outright condemning the fact that the U.S govt DARED to think the man might be more useful as propaganda. Or as a lab rat to potentially unlock the serum for everybody.

Obviously, there wouldn't have been a movie if they'd gone that route, but the movie goes out of it's way to show contempt for the very idea. That's slightly annoying.

Sidenote: I find it interesting that Red Skull simply saw Cap on the monitor screen, and gave up the factory. "Our soldiers are outmatched", so destroy the base and retreat to one of the undiscovered bases? Was he scared, or did the Red Skull base his decision on what he knew he himself could do?

I'm not sure he was scared so much as wasn't ready - all his toys were in plain sight, and the prisoners were fleeing. Even if he can kill Cap, a prisoner might get away with Hydra tech, which puts him in a much worse position. Better to blow it all up and face the Captain later, on his own terms.

I think that's exactly why he did pause to face Cap - his ego wouldn't allow him to look as though he were personally running away.

[Big Orange]

but did anybody else notice that the tracked vehicles parked near that armoured car that gets stolen in the prison break look like a post-war West German APC whose name escapes me? If I'm right, that has to be the cleverest Easter Egg in film for years.

One of the HYDRA vehicles looked like the Wiesel 1, a modern tankette in the German military that can be air dropped. The main HYDRA vehicle that gets the most screen time and seems to essentially be HYDRA's standard AFV is a four wheeled armoured car that vaguely resembled the Puma SD.KFV. 234 (which had six wheels). That HYDRA tank that was a mobile building could've looked more like the E-100 (it kinda seems a more plausible super tank than the more cartoonish Ratte).

I like this movie and give it a score of 8/10 - it felt a lot like Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow, but with more teeth and also a better executed GI Joe: The Rise of Cobra (the blue neon lit corridors of the HYDRA fortress were strikingly similiar to the blue neon lit corridors of the MARS fortress, etc).

[Simon_Jester]

Oh, I'm fine with that.

My problem is earlier in the film - when he's trying every depot in the area to get in. And, when told he can contribute in a non-combat fashion, treats the idea with contempt.

And the way the film continues, it never does anything to disavow this idea - Steve Rogers was a pussy until and unless he was able to undertake combat operations. Hell, the film stops short of outright condemning the fact that the U.S govt DARED to think the man might be more useful as propaganda. Or as a lab rat to potentially unlock the serum for everybody.

Obviously, there wouldn't have been a movie if they'd gone that route, but the movie goes out of it's way to show contempt for the very idea. That's slightly annoying.

A minor complaint - the way the film utterly devalued any fighting that did not involve punching the shit out of things was a bit annoying. By this I mean Rogers' outright statement that it would be a failure for him as a man to not serve as a direct combat soldier. It's not every movie that goes out of it's way to make this particular point.

It's not so much that this is Official Truth as that that is how Steve Rogers sees the world. He is simply not content to be doing anything other than risking his life against the common enemy. If he thought that way, he'd have signed up for a job filling shells on an assembly line at home rather than repeatedly trying to get his personal 4F butt into the Army.

There's something about the man that drives him to take risks, even huge ones, if he sees a reason to do so. Indeed, you can make a case for this being a character defect- under some conditions he'd rather sacrifice his own life than stop and reconsider whether he needs to do it at all, witness his crash landing of the HYDRA bomber.

[Big Orange]

Steve Rodgers showed more bravery and improvisation than all the other top US Military applicants combined when he leapt on top of that grenade, thinking it was live, and that singled him out for selection there and then. If that other ostensibly better candidate was selected to be Captain America they would've got a harder to control muscle headed asshole that wouldn't have used his powers selflessly like Steve Rodgers did.

[FSTargetDrone]

Saw the movie last night. Despite a problem with the 3D making the image almost stutter at times, I enjoyed it a lot.

Well like I said, it looks like they have been avoiding reminding people of the Hulk

There was one little bit, remember the vials of Caps blood being pulled out? That was the stuff used to power up Blonksy.

From The Incredible Hulk... General Ross goes into a cold storage room and pulls a cover off a nitrogen-filled storage cylinder. He looks at the data plate:



He opens the cylinder and draws out a vial of the serum:



Did anyone else catch what Johann Schmidt said about Hilter, “And the Fuhrer digs for trinkets in the desert...” presumably referencing Raiders of the Lost Ark.

[Big Orange]

I really dig the art direction to this movie and here's a concept art book published by Marvel, The Art of Captain America - The First Avenger. I liked the designs for the HYDRA soldats (but they could've more resembled the Jin Roh) and the corporate emblem for 1930s/1940s era Stark Industries reminded me of the art deco graphic designs from the BioShock series.

[Ahriman238]

Sidenote: I find it interesting that Red Skull simply saw Cap on the monitor screen, and gave up the factory. "Our soldiers are outmatched", so destroy the base and retreat to one of the undiscovered bases? Was he scared, or did the Red Skull base his decision on what he knew he himself could do?

He seemd fairly calm about Cap being in the base, even as he started the self-destruct. My guess is he knew what Cap could do, because it's what he could do. Then again, about a minute of watching the monitors should have told him that his security could not handle Cap.

Sidenote to the Sidenote: I just realized, HYDRA had security video cameras, with live feed to the control room, in the 1940's. Now that I think of it, I believe the security cameras showed in color too, I remember seeing the shield in color on the screen.

I may mock the HYDRA goons for being blind enough not to notice a man sorta-but-not-really sneaking around in BRIGHT PRIMARY COLORS! But I have to admit, once the escape started and the alarm was raised, the HYDRA goons reacted with admirable speed and professionalism. Anyone know if there are any around today? Half-decent minions are hard to find.

[Simon_Jester]

Steve Rodgers showed more bravery and improvisation than all the other top US Military applicants combined when he leapt on top of that grenade, thinking it was live, and that singled him out for selection there and then. If that other ostensibly better candidate was selected to be Captain America they would've got a harder to control muscle headed asshole that wouldn't have used his powers selflessly like Steve Rodgers did.

I'm not criticizing the man- but it is arguably a weakness in the character, an inherent one in the paladin archetype when you think about it, that he prefers bravery to improvisation.

He doesn't think with his muscles, but he does think with his guts a lot.

[Big Orange]

Steve Rodgers showed more bravery and improvisation than all the other top US Military applicants combined when he leapt on top of that grenade, thinking it was live, and that singled him out for selection there and then. If that other ostensibly better candidate was selected to be Captain America they would've got a harder to control muscle headed asshole that wouldn't have used his powers selflessly like Steve Rodgers did.

I'm not criticizing the man- but it is arguably a weakness in the character, an inherent one in the paladin archetype when you think about it, that he prefers bravery to improvisation.

He doesn't think with his muscles, but he does think with his guts a lot.

I find him to an incredibly uncynical and naive guy, even before his transformation. And even after being turned into a superhuman he still gets pushed around a lot like a circus curiosity, wearing a costume that makes him look like a twat, before stamping off to fight HYDRA.

Anyway the HYDRA wing reminds me a lot of the Luftwaffe wing from Raiders of the Lost Ark (early Ronn Cobb concept art):





Both the HYDRA and Raider wings are more fantastical versions of the real life prototype, the Horten Ho 229.

And this movie even has a direct homage to the burly Luftwaffe mechanic getting chewed up by a propeller in Raiders of the Lost Ark.

[Ahriman238]

Looks like the money to Cap is trailing off, $285 million, of which about $157 mil is domestic. I have to say, I'm a bit suprised the movie is doing so well internationally.

[Simon_Jester]

I'm not criticizing the man- but it is arguably a weakness in the character, an inherent one in the paladin archetype when you think about it, that he prefers bravery to improvisation.

He doesn't think with his muscles, but he does think with his guts a lot.

I find him to an incredibly uncynical and naive guy, even before his transformation. And even after being turned into a superhuman he still gets pushed around a lot like a circus curiosity, wearing a costume that makes him look like a twat, before stamping off to fight HYDRA.

I don't disagree. He's uncynical and in some ways naive- or so principled it comes across as naivete among people who take for granted that the world doesn't, can't work that way.

The man thinks with his guts.

Anyway the HYDRA wing reminds me a lot of the Luftwaffe wing from Raiders of the Lost Ark (early Ronn Cobb concept art):





Both the HYDRA and Raider wings are more fantastical versions of the real life prototype, the Horten Ho 229...

Heh. What it ought to remind you of is the YB-35 or YB-49. Jack Northrop's designs bear a much stronger resemblance to a huge multi-engine intercontinental flying wing than does the Go-229.

Eh, never mind, I'm being pedantic.

[AniThyng]

Looks like the money to Cap is trailing off, $285 million, of which about $157 mil is domestic. I have to say, I'm a bit suprised the movie is doing so well internationally.

Ehh, America rah rah stuff is fine when it's in good fun, and not shoved down at the end of a trade sanction or a smart bomb