Dooku: Jedi Lost

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FaxModem1
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Dooku: Jedi Lost

Post by FaxModem1 » 2019-08-13 08:12pm

So I got this on Audible, and it's an interesting listen. The framing device is Asajj Ventress on a mission for Dooku, and reading up on Dooku's past through his correspondence, private journal, and other things. It's an interesting perspective on his character, where you wonder just how much of what Dooku shows is because of presentation, and how much of it is actually him.

Interesting sidenote about the galaxy at large:
Serenno, Dooku's homeworld, shows how droids were affecting the economy. Basically, every job by the lower class was being done cheaper by droids bought by the Count of Serenno(Dooku's father), leaving a LOT of unemployed people who were also kept under control by security droids, also bought by the Count of Serenno. The Senate wasn't informed because this whole affair was kept secret from them, so that they didn't know how badly things were going there.

It does make me wonder how this isn't more of a constant thing in the Star Wars galaxy. Perhaps there were jobs that droids weren't allowed to do on most worlds?
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Re: Dooku: Jedi Lost

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-08-13 08:21pm

FaxModem1 wrote:
2019-08-13 08:12pm
So I got this on Audible, and it's an interesting listen. The framing device is Asajj Ventress on a mission for Dooku, and reading up on Dooku's past through his correspondence, private journal, and other things. It's an interesting perspective on his character, where you wonder just how much of what Dooku shows is because of presentation, and how much of it is actually him.

Interesting sidenote about the galaxy at large:
Serenno, Dooku's homeworld, shows how droids were affecting the economy. Basically, every job by the lower class was being done cheaper by droids bought by the Count of Serenno(Dooku's father), leaving a LOT of unemployed people who were also kept under control by security droids, also bought by the Count of Serenno. The Senate wasn't informed because this whole affair was kept secret from them, so that they didn't know how badly things were going there.

It does make me wonder how this isn't more of a constant thing in the Star Wars galaxy. Perhaps there were jobs that droids weren't allowed to do on most worlds?
My guess is that's the case, if they had to fly below the Senate's radar. There are probably regulations to keep most of the population from being out of work.
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Re: Dooku: Jedi Lost

Post by FaxModem1 » 2019-08-14 03:40am

A big theme of the book is seeing Dooku's general dissatisfaction with how things are run in the Republic, and the Jedi Order.

For instance, seeing the Jedi Order hide scandals, and their seeming irrelevance in the galaxy as a whole, only being comparable to famous actors in what they're doing, as they're rather tied down by what they're allowed to do by the Senate, which is making them very in-effective in doing anything. Open black markets on Coruscant, the very same planet as the Jedi Order, is pretty much considered "Not the Jedi's business". Their policies on families also allows for blackmail.

For the Republic Senate: in Chapter 22, for instance, he has an audience with the Senate to try and divert Core World defense funding to the outer sectors for protection of their trade routes. The Core Worlds vote that down, showing that the Senate is rather focused on Core World interests as opposed to the galaxy as a whole. The Republic was pretty much not giving a crap for anyone who wasn't one of the elites.
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Re: Dooku: Jedi Lost

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2019-08-14 03:46am

FaxModem1 wrote:
2019-08-14 03:40am
A big theme of the book is seeing Dooku's general dissatisfaction with how things are run in the Republic, and the Jedi Order.

For instance, seeing the Jedi Order hide scandals, and their seeming irrelevance in the galaxy as a whole, only being comparable to famous actors in what they're doing, as they're rather tied down by what they're allowed to do by the Senate, which is making them very in-effective in doing anything. Open black markets on Coruscant, the very same planet as the Jedi Order, is pretty much considered "Not the Jedi's business". Their policies on families also allows for blackmail.

For the Republic Senate: in Chapter 22, for instance, he has an audience with the Senate to try and divert Core World defense funding to the outer sectors for protection of their trade routes. The Core Worlds vote that down, showing that the Senate is rather focused on Core World interests as opposed to the galaxy as a whole. The Republic was pretty much not giving a crap for anyone who wasn't one of the elites.
That's a lot more sympathetic than some of his prior characterizations would suggest. For example, the RotS novelization, as I recall, basically portrayed him as a psychopath who divided other sapient beings into two categories: obstacles to be destroyed, and chess pieces to be used.
"I know its easy to be defeatist here because nothing has seemingly reigned Trump in so far. But I will say this: every asshole succeeds until finally, they don't. Again, 18 months before he resigned, Nixon had a sky-high approval rating of 67%. Harvey Weinstein was winning Oscars until one day, he definitely wasn't."-John Oliver

"Trump admirers like @TuckerCarlson describe themselves as "nationalist." But their nationalism attaches not to the multiracial American nation... but to a multinational white race with a capital in Moscow"-David Frum

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Re: Dooku: Jedi Lost

Post by NeoGoomba » 2019-08-14 09:31am

FaxModem1 wrote:
2019-08-13 08:12pm
So I got this on Audible, and it's an interesting listen. The framing device is Asajj Ventress on a mission for Dooku, and reading up on Dooku's past through his correspondence, private journal, and other things. It's an interesting perspective on his character, where you wonder just how much of what Dooku shows is because of presentation, and how much of it is actually him.

Interesting sidenote about the galaxy at large:
Serenno, Dooku's homeworld, shows how droids were affecting the economy. Basically, every job by the lower class was being done cheaper by droids bought by the Count of Serenno(Dooku's father), leaving a LOT of unemployed people who were also kept under control by security droids, also bought by the Count of Serenno. The Senate wasn't informed because this whole affair was kept secret from them, so that they didn't know how badly things were going there.

It does make me wonder how this isn't more of a constant thing in the Star Wars galaxy. Perhaps there were jobs that droids weren't allowed to do on most worlds?
How did the population of Serenno live under these conditions? Were they in squalor and Hoover-villes? Were they afforded something like Basic from The Expanse series which guaranteed them at least the bare essentials for living?
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Re: Dooku: Jedi Lost

Post by Elheru Aran » 2019-08-14 09:53am

The Romulan Republic wrote:
2019-08-14 03:46am
FaxModem1 wrote:
2019-08-14 03:40am
A big theme of the book is seeing Dooku's general dissatisfaction with how things are run in the Republic, and the Jedi Order.

For instance, seeing the Jedi Order hide scandals, and their seeming irrelevance in the galaxy as a whole, only being comparable to famous actors in what they're doing, as they're rather tied down by what they're allowed to do by the Senate, which is making them very in-effective in doing anything. Open black markets on Coruscant, the very same planet as the Jedi Order, is pretty much considered "Not the Jedi's business". Their policies on families also allows for blackmail.

For the Republic Senate: in Chapter 22, for instance, he has an audience with the Senate to try and divert Core World defense funding to the outer sectors for protection of their trade routes. The Core Worlds vote that down, showing that the Senate is rather focused on Core World interests as opposed to the galaxy as a whole. The Republic was pretty much not giving a crap for anyone who wasn't one of the elites.
That's a lot more sympathetic than some of his prior characterizations would suggest. For example, the RotS novelization, as I recall, basically portrayed him as a psychopath who divided other sapient beings into two categories: obstacles to be destroyed, and chess pieces to be used.
Not necessarily incompatible. You can be a psychopath and still make arguments for protecting populations that you aren't interested in because of pure utility-- perhaps they form an asset that contributes to your interests, perhaps it's part of a scheme to make yourself look better, whatever.

Of course it's hardly the first time characters have been depicted differently depending on who's writing it...
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Re: Dooku: Jedi Lost

Post by ray245 » 2019-08-23 12:35pm

Or chuck it up to the influence of the dark side corrupting him.
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Re: Dooku: Jedi Lost

Post by Lord Revan » 2019-08-23 12:51pm

ray245 wrote:
2019-08-23 12:35pm
Or chuck it up to the influence of the dark side corrupting him.
Or a bit of collum A and a bit of collum B, maybe Dooku always had psychopathic tendencies which he was able to mask while a Jedi Master, which becomes full on psychopathy when he embraces the Dark Side.

IIRC that's how the dark side was depicted in the OT and the legendaries, it doesn't outright give you new negative traits, but it does empower your pre-existing negative traits in a way that makes the person almost become a parody of themselves.

EDIT:Lets take my namesake for example, everything we learn of "Revan" pre-fall says he was compassionate man who truly cared for plight of the outerrim when the Mandalorians attacked. Darth Revan on the other hand was not really this, even if he "cared" for the Republic in his own twisted way.
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Re: Dooku: Jedi Lost

Post by Adam Reynolds » 2019-08-25 02:55pm

Lord Revan wrote:
2019-08-23 12:51pm
Or a bit of collum A and a bit of collum B, maybe Dooku always had psychopathic tendencies which he was able to mask while a Jedi Master, which becomes full on psychopathy when he embraces the Dark Side.

IIRC that's how the dark side was depicted in the OT and the legendaries, it doesn't outright give you new negative traits, but it does empower your pre-existing negative traits in a way that makes the person almost become a parody of themselves.
That does lead to an interesting question. Could a sociopath successfully become a Jedi?

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Re: Dooku: Jedi Lost

Post by FaxModem1 » 2019-09-02 08:43am

NeoGoomba wrote:
2019-08-14 09:31am
FaxModem1 wrote:
2019-08-13 08:12pm
So I got this on Audible, and it's an interesting listen. The framing device is Asajj Ventress on a mission for Dooku, and reading up on Dooku's past through his correspondence, private journal, and other things. It's an interesting perspective on his character, where you wonder just how much of what Dooku shows is because of presentation, and how much of it is actually him.

Interesting sidenote about the galaxy at large:
Serenno, Dooku's homeworld, shows how droids were affecting the economy. Basically, every job by the lower class was being done cheaper by droids bought by the Count of Serenno(Dooku's father), leaving a LOT of unemployed people who were also kept under control by security droids, also bought by the Count of Serenno. The Senate wasn't informed because this whole affair was kept secret from them, so that they didn't know how badly things were going there.

It does make me wonder how this isn't more of a constant thing in the Star Wars galaxy. Perhaps there were jobs that droids weren't allowed to do on most worlds?
How did the population of Serenno live under these conditions? Were they in squalor and Hoover-villes? Were they afforded something like Basic from The Expanse series which guaranteed them at least the bare essentials for living?
Serenno is pretty much a Star Wars version of Victorian Britain. Lots of squalor and strife while there's a booming economy due to industry. Crime and such is becoming a bigger problem, but that's why there are more security droids bought, to deal with said problems. There are just some parts of the planet that the rich just don't go to. Later on in the book, while attending a funeral, the Count of Serenno faces a riot, which leads to the droids being called in, and well, the problems of said society get shown for the entire galaxy become plain to see.

SPOILERS:

Dooku solves this at the end of the book by leaving the Jedi Order, with finding a newfound source of extremely expensive material that is being mined by said mining droids, and uses it to rebuild Serenno's economy towards helping the populace, making Serenno a stronger player, and to separate it from Republic policies, since the majority of the book is seeing him being rather dissatisfied with how they do things.

So, yeah, imagine Hoovervilles, squalors, and ghettos while the planet's economy, and more importantly, the noble families, does okay solely due to automation.
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