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 Post subject: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 04:04am 

Hey everyone, for my birthday I'm getting parts to build my own computer, complete with monitor and speakers as well as a keyboard and mouse. I've made sure to get the correct parts for the motherboard as well as the processor, RAM and graphics card, that'll fit the mother board. I've already ordered an anti-static kit as well as some computer tools from amazon. Could any of you give me some good tips on how to go about setting up my computer when I get the parts?

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 08:51am 

A real no brainer is to make sure your power supply is up to the task. High end graphics cards require high peak currents so make sure your power unit can supply that. Read the manuals first. Install the processor on the motherboard before putting it in the case, it's usually simpler that way. Have the memory and all other cards installed before plugging everything in, this way you can run the cables around everything and not have them get stuck behind your graphics card for example. Make sure your wiring doesn't interfere with cooling fans. My usual build order is: Install / replace power unit, install processor to the motherboard, install motherboard, put in memory cards and graphics card, plug everything in. Depending what kind of a case you have, it can be easier to install the hard drives before putting in the graphics card or even before installing the motherboard.

-Gunhead

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 09:07am 

Any decent screwdriver will do the job. Just make sure you get one without a magnetic end. Anti static sets are good but frankly, I've built lots of computers and grounding myself by touching something like a radiator once in a while has always worked for me.

Other than that, follow the manual, try to tidy up the cables as much as you can and leave some breathing room for your hard disk. If you got decent components, assembly will be easy - it's the cheap cases that require some fiddling.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 09:33am 

I ran into a snag when I bought my new graphics card. The cooling shroud was so big I had to remove my 3.5" HD rack to fit it. No big deal really but just shows you have to be prepared to improvise. No my case isn't the cheapest out there, just showing a bit of age.

-Gunhead

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 12:38pm 

Oh and I think I've got a good enough power supply; a 1200 watt power supply will be more than enough. Oh and to clarify here are the parts that I'm getting.

Case: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6531504&CatId=1509
Motherboard: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=353599&Sku=G452-0144
Processor Cooler: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=7335485&csid=_25
Processor: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1154261&CatId=6988
Power Supply: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6391024&CatId=5115
DVD/Blueray Drive:http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=752604&CatId=3636
RAM Cards: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1586691
Video Card:http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1440023&CatId=3669
Hard Drive: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6076939
Monitor: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6659197&CatId=5469
Speakers: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=4545422&pagenumber=1&RSort=1
Keyboard: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1284197&CatId=3463
Mouse: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=7104130&CatId=1285

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 01:01pm 

Since you're getting a new power unit and it's a good one you need not worry. But wattage isn't everything hence my caution to check the amperage it can handle too. My old power unit could produce enough watts for my system but couldn't handle the peak amperage my new video card needed.

If you have a friend who knows his way around PCs, get him to help. Extra pair of hands is usually a good thing provided the control unit knows what to do with them.

-Gunhead

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 05:51pm 

Your computer seems to be a case of macho building.

Forget the 1200W PSU, you're not building a vacuum cleaner. 800W will suffice and even that is an overkill with only a single HDD. Saved money spend on an i7, or at least an i5 2400+. You also don't need an Z68 mobo if you don't plan on using the i5 onboard video card. Z67 also gives you a mobile multiplier. Also, 21,5 inch monitor is sort of a bottleneck here. Get at least 23 inches 16:9, with an IPS matrix (don't worry about the lag, 5 ms vs 8 ms isn't noticeable but you will at least get a decent blackness out of your matrix).

And if I were you I would aim much higher in regards to speakers. Get at least a 2+1 system, they aren't pricey but the increase in sound quality is noticeable. From what I gather these are only 2 speakers without a subwoofer.

Also, if you are feeling adventorous, I would suggest custom cooling of the GPU. The whole point of liquid cooling (apart from OCing) is to reduce noise. You will not notice any difference since twin fans on that GPU will make your machine loud. I have no idea if liquid cooled GPU exist (they probably do), but if you are not getting one, then you are wasting the money on liquid CPU cooling.

Oh, and don't overclock. EVER. Your machine will be able to run anything 1920x1080 16xAA FXAA SSAO stuff without any hitches. No point of reducing hardware life for a few FRAPS frames which you won't ever notice.

Enjoy. And if you have any questions, feel free.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 06:20pm 

Why are you getting a 1200 watt power supply, a Z68 motherboard, 16 gig of ram, a water cooler, and yet going with a processor below the 2500k?

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 06:43pm 

Well the 1200 watt power supply will help me if I need to upgrade my computer and it's efficent. The z68 Motherboard is the latest one, the water cooler will help with the cooling of the processor and I got that much ram because it was cheap. As for the processor, same reason as the ram it's cheap and I do plan to upgrade my computer some time in the future, which where the 1200 watt power supply will give me a lot of head room for future upgrades.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 08:22pm 

The only possible argument for a 1200 watt PSU (outside of a server) is wanting to run 3 or more GPUs in Crossfire/SLI. Personally I have a 1000W PSU and a 1200W PSU ganged together powering four GTX580s, two AMD 6970s and two 6-core Xeons. However 4 or more GPUs is completely pointless for normal gaming and even 3-way setups are only relevant if you have three or more 1080p or better monitors. Practically the most you might want to do with this is add a second GTX 570 and that is not going to take the power draw over 800 watts.



Yes it's almost always worth spending more on the monitor and I would recommend 2560 x 1440 if at all possible, prices are coming down and it's a significant upgrade over 1080p.



In fact they look completely worthless. For gaming there is no substitute for a home cinema grade sound system. Obviously you can add this later.



They do but almost all of them don't come with a pump/resevoir/radiator, you have to buy those seperately.

Finally, unless you are running serious productivity apps (e.g. heavy video editing) you will get far more benefit out of an SSD than you will out of 16GB of RAM. I suggest you drop to 8GB (the most any current game will use) and add an SSD, which will very noticably improve boot and application launch times.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 09:06pm 

@Starglider

I might upgrade to an SSD some time later but not now mainly because I don't mind waiting a bit for my programs to load, I'm kind of patient like that. I might get it later to increase the boot time of the OS, but that'll be a bit more down the line. and I don't think I'll be able to fit a home cinema grade sound system in my room because my room is too small to fit one in.
And the reason that I'm getting a 1200 watt power supply is because it operates at very high efficiency at the mid range of it's voltage which is about 90% or so.

And even then if I have more than one HDD and use a RAID-0 on them, they would be as fast as an SSD.

And the reason I'm getting 16 GB of RAM is because I want to have more than enough RAM for both the operating system and the games that I'll run on it.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-27 10:22pm 

...So then you're twice as likely to lose your data to drive failure?

Look man, listen to the pros -- 4 GB is plenty for this, 8 GB is just plain overkill. Really, you're better off spending that money on a faster CPU (maybe) or an SSD(probably better) out of the box. Because at this point, the hard drive is going to be what's slowing you down, not running low on memory.

Why say "I can upgrade later" when you can upgrade what matters right now? Or are you just trying to cover for the fact that you already ordered it and don't need advice anymore?

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 12:30am 

Proper bookshelf speakers or nearfield monitors will beat the pants off of any "computer speaker". You can get a nice little Class T amp off Parts Express for not too much money (relative to your budget).


You still don't need that much power. How much are you going to save compared to a lesser one that still is pretty good?


RAID-0 is stupid outside very specific cases, and it won't get you the far superior latency of an SSD.


8GB is presently enough, especially as most games are limited to 2-4GB process space.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 12:41am 

RAM is cheap though, and not the biggest problem with his setup. Honestly I think a more pressing issue is he should ditch the power supply and go for a 600W one, especially with that GPU, and also for the love of god ditch the water cooler.

The savings he can get from those two alone would allow him to get an i5 2500K or even an i7 2600K. Maybe squeeze an SSD in there as well.

BTW, I hear you want a 1200W PSU for 'future expansion'. I never got the logic of this. If you want to do 'future expansion', why don't you buy a new PSU when you need to expand? A lot of people have already told you that your PSU is overkill. Even for dual-GPU SLI setups, 1200W is still overkill. Don't fall into the trap of thinking MOAR IS BETTAH.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 02:18am 

The big reason why I got that particular power supply is because it is very efficient at around 85 to 90%, mainly because less energy will be lost as heat and it will be less of a drain on the electricity. as seen in this http://www.plugloadsolutions.com/psu_reports/CORSAIR_CMPSU-1200AX_ECOS%202088_1200W_Report.pdf

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 02:47am 

Yes, because you will be seeing better results with 1 percent points of difference lol

http://plugloadsolutions.com/80PlusPowe ... =25&type=2

Actually, according to your own website an 850W (CMPSU-850AX) is better than your 1200 in regards to pure statistics. Which in your case are really irrelevant.

The funny thing about hardware these days is that if you are not planning on running a 3D MAX rendering rig or do very complex MathCad calculations, you don't really need that much power below the hood. My machine is by all means ancient: an E5300, GF9800GT and 2GB Ram. And Im still able to run games on high settings in 1080 resolution. Yesterday I finished playing Syndicate on high and in 1080 resolution A few days ago I switched to a 23 inch IPS screen and I really recommend you do too - the difference in both quality and overall experience is just something. Of course Im not recommending you build a rig like mine, but there are lots of stuff you can save money on and spend that on components that really make a difference. An SSD for your system disk is an excellent idea, as is getting a better CPU for less RAM and a slightly weaker PSU.

There are people here that make a living out of this stuff and they are not giving their advice just to make you downgrade your computer so you won't have as powerful machine & thereforz sux0rz at Modern Warfare 8 Of course it's totally up to you, but if you came here for advice then at least consider what the ppl have to say

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 02:50am 

I have a SeaSonic S12D-850, and it's more than enough for my current setup. It's also up there in efficiency (link is for M12D-850, identical to mine, only modular). I have an Asus P8P67 Deluxe mobo, i7-2600k (OC to 4.3 GHz), 16GB of RAM (that exact kit, in fact, of which I've never seen more than half used, but hey it was cheap), a GTX 560 Ti, two SATA3 hard drives, and a Cooler Master ATCS 840 case with more fans than I know what to do with. Even with that, I've never approached a full load on my PSU, and I could probably easily add another 560 Ti if I really wanted. Ditch the water cooling, you don't need it with Sandy Bridge unless you're doing some crazy overclocking. I have a Zalman CNPS9900MAX cooling my CPU, and even overclocked as it is, it idles at around 30°C, and under load it tops out in the upper 40s/lower 50s. I can barely hear the thing, too. The only time I can hear more than a whisper coming from my PC is when I play a game and the fan on the video card spins up. Even then, it's maybe 10dB louder than when idle.

In short, ditch the water cooling and the 1200 W PSU for a quiet air cooler and an 800-ish W PSU, get a less overpriced mouse and keyboard, get 8GB of RAM, and use your savings to get a better processor, monitor, and speakers.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 03:47am 

Well, thing of it is I already ordered the parts a good two days ago. I was more looking into what to install first on my case as well as whether to put in the motherboard first in the case or install the processor on the motherboard first then put it in to the case.

Yeah sorry about that guys, and Well, I guess I'll have to work with what I've ordered. But I'll keep your advice in mind when setting it up and probably upgrade the processor and monitor, though for the monitor I don't have that much room to work with, I only have like 21 inches of height to work with on my desk before there's a shelf. And I'll get an SSD sometime later in the computer's lifespan.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 05:58am 

I recently put together my computer a week ago, so here's a few things I noticed:

-putting a computer together from scratch, if you haven't done it before, is a FUCKING PAIN IN THE ASS. Especially cable management, good god. Actually I am p. sure that it's a huge pain in the ass whether or not you've done it before or a hundred times.

-that said, it isn't too hard. If you're worried about screwing up, just go slow, have a secondary computer connected to the internet so you can check and recheck how-to guides as you go (I consulted several ars technica video how-to guides during the build) and talk to people over IM if you have experienced friends who can give you tips about stuff.

-have a workbench or table in an area that isn't carpeted or frequented by small furry animals. You have an anti-static wrist band but you should also still rely on location as well. As for tools, all you need is a screwdriver really and in my case I had two, one with a fat handle and a smaller precision one I could manoeuvre into narrow gaps. Have plenty of light too like a lamp you can set up to shine into the case.

-other guys have already said it, but put your cpu into your m/b before you install it in the case. I'd go one step further and intall the ram as well, which is what I did. Prepare yourself for taking a lot of time, especially if you're doing this for the first time. Mine took all night basically and that was just to put everything together and power on to see if I had done it right. I spent another night doing cable management.

-here's a breakdown of what parts I installed in what order: cpu and ram into the m/b, then installed the m/b into the case; psu next, then hdds and any optical drives which are then connected to both the power supply and the m/b; connect all fans and stuff like the power/reset and front usb stuff; video card is last, because my video card is this big fat monster of a thing (it's a GTX570 but it's the one with the gigantic heatsink and two fans by ASUS; it's bigger than your card).

-you also got a water cooling solution so I don't know anything about when to put that in. You should have just stuck with the case fans or get extra ones than bothered with it and save yourself some money, but if the parts have already been bought then well, good luck installing it then. I can't help you there. Just read the instructions that come with it and you should be fine. Some instructions though were drawn by people who don't bother giving a better view of what you need to do. (in my case I had trouble figuring out how to install my card holder thingy that came with my case)

Good luck!

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 06:33am 

Here's how I do it.

1) Unpack the mobo, put it on a flat and grounded surface. Ground yourself or wear an anti static kit.

2) Install the processor, the cooling paste and cooling. I however have no idea how to proceed in your case of liquid cooling. This is the most stressful moment - there is usually some trial and error involved to make all the bits click together. Be patient and consult the motheboard manual. Also, don't overdo the cooling paste. A very thin layer is enough, just to make sure that both surfaces are connected.

3) install the RAM chips.

4) Install the motherboard into the case. Attach all the case cables (PWR switch, LED's, reset switch etc.) to the mobo.

5) Install the DVD drive and the hard disk. Use 4 screws, leave breathing room for the hard disk.

6) Install the PSU, plug the PSU into the motherboard.

7) Install the GPU and any other extension cables you might have left.

And I disagree that it's a pain in the ass. If you are doing it for the first time, just be extra careful and consult the manuals. I built my first computer without any external help. Took me some time though, because back in the day of Socket A CPU's installing the cooling was a pain in the ass and you constantly worried about breaking the mobo in half because you had to apply so much power to make the clips go where they should.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 08:31am 

Cable management is just political whitewash for cruelty to cables, mine are always free-range ethically farmed cables. One of the nice things about full water cooling (CPUs + GPUs + motherboard + RAM) is not having to care much about case airflow.

Seriously though a waterblock is just a lightweight heatsink with hoses attached. Since you have a sealed system you'll want to install that into the case first, then the motherboard, then the heatsink onto the CPU. Check the instructions to see if it needs bolts or brackets put in before you screw the motherboard down.

The utility of those small sealed WC units is somewhat limited; you can overclock a little more and it's nice not having a heavy lump of an air cooler hanging off the motherboard, blocking airflow and cables. I would recommend them to people who would otherwise buy a ridiculous towering kilo-of-solid-copper type air cooler. However they compare very poorly to a full water cooling system in terms of noise reduction and total cooling performance.



If you hate the idea of running just two HDs in RAID-0 I can only imagine what you'd think of me running four SSDs in RAID-0.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 12:52pm 

True, it's not as important, but not everything that gets hot is on a waterblock or is in optimal position to have one. My old Koolance rig still had plenty of fans, primarily to keep the case pressurized. Looking back, I'm doubtful it was worth the money, but it was a fun experience.

I don't know how much RAID-0 will help with SSDs, but I do know two 80GBs in a hardware RAID-0 setup cut my BF2 load times by about 1/3. SSD load-times are already disgustingly fast. My 1TB drive recently died, so I replaced it with an SSD for the OS and the load-fest known as SWTOR and another 1TB drive for everything else. W7 boots in 15 seconds and SWTOR load times are almost half of what they were with a 7200 drive. Still considering that RAM drive though considering how much data transferring SWTOR does constantly. I'm almost convinced it ate my old 1TB drive.

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-28 03:09pm 

Shouldn't you just get more RAM and see if Windows is smart enough to figure out what to cache?


Well, you probably can use the IOPS (I've considered RAID-10 for work purposes, which IIRC is just as fast). You are not the normal use case!

For that matter, why not get one of those disgustingly expensive FusionIO PCIe SSDs?

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-29 03:00am 

Because all the PCIe slots are being used by GPUs

 Post subject: Re: Any tips on building a computer?

Posted: 2012-02-29 12:13pm 

Obviously you need some of these