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World of Tanks

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Mr Bean
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-03 07:30pm 

Lord of Irony


Joined: 2002-07-04 08:36am
Posts: 20838
The Ha-go was pulled at some point because they did want to make a Tier 0 tank. Which is what the Ha-go might have ended up as. The turret rotation of super heavy, the firing rate of a TD, the penetration of an HE shell, the damage of a AT rifle and the speed of a medium with the armor of an artillery piece.

And if you want to go for extra historical accuracy suckage you can't load the gun and turn the turret at the same time because the two things interfere with each other.
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Simon_Jester
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-03 07:31pm 

Emperor's Hand


Joined: 2009-05-23 07:29pm
Posts: 20989
Darth Wong wrote:
If one really wants to enjoy the T1 experience, he can always get the M6 from the Jumbo Sherman: the M6 is so similar to the T1 that it is visually almost indistinguishable, even at close range.
Arguably true.

Although honestly, I think the T1 was tolerable when I played it and would be more fun now that the matchmaker isn't treating it as "equal" to a KV armed with the 107mm gun.

Maybe we just enjoy different things.
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xthetenth
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-03 10:33pm 

Jedi Master


Joined: 2010-02-20 01:45am
Posts: 1166
The T1 heavy is a different tank from what would be expected from it given its tier and size class status. It sucks to play as a heavy, it rocks to kill mediums with. It accelerates better than an M4 with the last engine. The M6 also misses the absolute best bit of the T1 experience, which is bullying everything but the heavies in a tier V game. Also, not going through the T1 means you get to drive an M6 with a 76mm and none of the engines which is truly painful. When it can accelerate well it's not that bad. It's just a tank that's good at a non-obvious specialty and isn't the easiest thing in the world to drive without skills that are usually picked up later, but shouldn't be that hard with a bit of advice. The Jumbo is a really good tank from what I hear, and since you can get into the T20 and M6 from it you could do some crossgrind shenanigans by using the T20 to grind the 90mm for the M6.
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Zinegata
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-03 10:40pm 

Jedi Council Member


Joined: 2010-06-21 09:04am
Posts: 2259
The T1 desperately needs a good gun though, especially because it will be facing higher tier tanks quite often and the 76mm just doesn't cut it for a tank that's not really all that nimble enough to flank.
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xthetenth
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-04 03:09am 

Jedi Master


Joined: 2010-02-20 01:45am
Posts: 1166
If the T1 does, then so does the M4 since the latter's slower accelerating and doesn't have as many HP. The 76mm is plenty sufficient for most tier sixes, the 3601 is the main exception that isn't a lumbering slug of a heavy or an M6.
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Zinegata
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-04 04:13am 

Jedi Council Member


Joined: 2010-06-21 09:04am
Posts: 2259
xthetenth wrote:
If the T1 does, then so does the M4 since the latter's slower accelerating and doesn't have as many HP. The 76mm is plenty sufficient for most tier sixes, the 3601 is the main exception that isn't a lumbering slug of a heavy or an M6.


I play the M4 with the 105mm gun, which I generally consider to be a superior weapon to the 76mm unless I'm in a very fast and nimble chassis like the Easy 8.
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AniThyng
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-04 06:26am 

Jedi Council Member


Joined: 2003-09-08 12:47pm
Posts: 1902
Location: Took an arrow in the knee.
I've got to choose now between the E8 and the E2. I've got a PzIII that I use as a premium xp grinding tank (It's also really fun to use especially if I'm in the top half of the Match Maker), and a VK3601 I'm using only because I need to grind to the Tiger which is my ultimate objective.

I get the impression that the E2 is like the VK3601 in that it's almost a Heavy, but the gun is much weaker, so perhaps I would be better off getting the E8 and playing it like the PzIII? Or like the M4, just that it's faster. Is that correct?
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PeZook
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-04 06:45am 

Emperor's Hand


Joined: 2002-07-18 06:08pm
Posts: 13236
Location: Poland
I got both. I think I'm enjoying the Jumbo slightly more, because it's deceptive :P

As in...sometimes I think people don't pay attention to the type and just treat you like a dinky medium they can bully.

Then you pump them full of 105s. Doesn't happen often, but it's delicious.
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Hawkwings
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-04 01:06pm 

Sith Devotee


Joined: 2005-01-28 10:30pm
Posts: 3372
Location: USC, LA, CA
I play the Jumbo with the second turret and the top 76mm gun. I find that I don't need the side of turret armor anyways and the increased refire rate is awesome to have. With a good building to use and judicious tracking, I can take KV-3s with the thing no problem. And if you're top tier, go have fun! This thing will get you steel walls like crazy.
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PeZook
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-04 01:42pm 

Emperor's Hand


Joined: 2002-07-18 06:08pm
Posts: 13236
Location: Poland
Well, just today I used a Jumbo, smart cover and some creative dancing to duke it out with a KV-3, a Stug III, an M4, a Panther and a VK3601.

I died, of course, but I held them all up for three minutes and took the Stug and M4 with me, along with a careless Priest that exposed itself.

Of course, that KV-3 and Panther were meek and incompetent, but hell, not MY problem :P
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Zinegata
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-04 09:11pm 

Jedi Council Member


Joined: 2010-06-21 09:04am
Posts: 2259
I'm really liking the improved reload time on the M103's new gun.

Last night I tried to turn the tide in Westfield and charged the enemy's main body, managing to get behind them. I destroyed a T29, shot a Ferdinand nearly to death, before finally getting ass-flanked by a Tiger II. I was down to about 10 HP when I realized that I had flanked an Ausf B in the open at 9% life.

Quick turn of the turret. Rapid aim and reload. BLAM.

We didn't win, but it was so sweet taking down that Ausf B as a final "Taking you with me!" shot.
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Zinegata
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-04 09:41pm 

Jedi Council Member


Joined: 2010-06-21 09:04am
Posts: 2259
AniThyng wrote:
I've got to choose now between the E8 and the E2. I've got a PzIII that I use as a premium xp grinding tank (It's also really fun to use especially if I'm in the top half of the Match Maker), and a VK3601 I'm using only because I need to grind to the Tiger which is my ultimate objective.

I get the impression that the E2 is like the VK3601 in that it's almost a Heavy, but the gun is much weaker, so perhaps I would be better off getting the E8 and playing it like the PzIII? Or like the M4, just that it's faster. Is that correct?


The Easy 8 is considerably more nimble than the M4 for me. It's fast but not as fast as the true lights, but its agility really lets it get in and out of a jam,

The E2 is more or less what you said it is, except I'd say it seems to have better armor (more bounces) whereas the VK3601H is truly a generalist.

I would get the E8 or E2 depending on which line you want to pursue.
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xthetenth
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-04 10:58pm 

Jedi Master


Joined: 2010-02-20 01:45am
Posts: 1166
I've bounced T34 rounds off a jumbo. That's the one exception to my philosophy of armor usefulness being incredibly limited and speed being the better bet. The E2 can straight up tank things. Plus it doesn't move badly for what a fat pig it is.
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Darth Wong
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 09:30am 

Sith Lord


Joined: 2002-07-03 12:25am
Posts: 70016
Location: Toronto, Canada
I think it's a matter of balance, rather than saying that armour is better than speed or vice versa. The T95 is heavily armoured but too damned slow, but the French tanks tend to be fast and made of paper. The lightly armoured "all offense, no defense" tanks are good at scouting and scoring ninja kills, but they're not so good at holding up an enemy offensive or blocking a chokepoint. The heavily armoured juggernaut tanks are the opposite. Usually, when you look up at the scoreboard and notice that some guy has 6 kills, his choice of tank is somewhere in-between those extremes.
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Skywalker_T-65
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 11:08am 

Jedi Council Member


Joined: 2011-08-26 03:53pm
Posts: 2097
Location: Bridge of Battleship SDFS Missouri
The only time I've gotten 6 kills was with a BT-2 of all things. But the most common tank I've seen get that many (in the Tier 1-5 matches I'm in at the moment) tends to be a PzIV or a Sherman of some variety. And depending on the map, the Heavy's sometimes pull it off.
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Zinegata
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 11:47am 

Jedi Council Member


Joined: 2010-06-21 09:04am
Posts: 2259
It depends, but in higher tiers and against more experienced opponents I tend to agree that armor tends to be less important than being nimble enough not to get hit at all. Experienced players will tend to know how to properly aim for the weakspots of enemy tanks, and clan players with a steady supply of gold will further augment that advantage by using gold ammo which generally has superior penetration.
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xthetenth
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 01:05pm 

Jedi Master


Joined: 2010-02-20 01:45am
Posts: 1166
Darth Wong wrote:
I think it's a matter of balance, rather than saying that armour is better than speed or vice versa. The T95 is heavily armoured but too damned slow, but the French tanks tend to be fast and made of paper. The lightly armoured "all offense, no defense" tanks are good at scouting and scoring ninja kills, but they're not so good at holding up an enemy offensive or blocking a chokepoint. The heavily armoured juggernaut tanks are the opposite. Usually, when you look up at the scoreboard and notice that some guy has 6 kills, his choice of tank is somewhere in-between those extremes.


My stats tend to strongly agree with that. I have Bölter's medals in the following tanks:
Type 59 (4x, but more than twice as many battles to do it as I have in anything else)
4502 A (3x, also pretty much my favorite tank in the game and a perfect example of my preference for more agile tanks, I prefer this to the King Tiger by a lot)
T-44 (2x, slightly bouncy but mostly just relies on being very fast, accurate, aiming fast and accelerating well to avoid trouble)
T110 (2x, think one's really in the T30, but the 110's one of my favorite tanks because it's fast and has really good front armor, which makes it the best of both worlds)
T34 (2x, the old T34 that didn't have armor worth much but has a really good gun)
Pershing (2x, one of the best defensive mediums simply because it has a really good turret and can get in hills great which means great hull down opportunities)
one in the IS-4, IS-3, T29, T-50-2, AMX 50 120 and E75, pretty much a grab bag.

The T-50-2, AMX 50 120, T34 and T-44 are the only tanks out of all of those I'd describe as really lightly armored all offense tanks, and the E75 is the only defensive juggernaut on the list. 12 in the rounded tanks compared to 7 in the extremes, and calling the T34 all offense is a bit of a stretch considering how well it hulls down. Even more interestingly, except the T-44, all the tanks I've got 8 kills in a round in are well rounded. I have gotten 9 in the T49, but that's probably the best low armor speed defense tank in the game, since it's got a tiny turret, the US gun depression and a good sniping gun for its tier so it can easily use camo as its armor but it can also rush in and take serious advantage of enemy weaknesses. That ability to really shine when aggression and caution are needed is pretty much unique and awesome. There's also a Sherman in that list, but that's just what happens when you connect with every 105mm shot you take in a tier 5 game, so I'm calling that and the Tetrarch luck. That's four well rounded tanks versus two all speed tanks and no real juggernauts.

Other than the 4502 B, which has the great virtue of being one of those tanks that can really reliably sit there and take everything thrown its way (which I'd generally shove down the main resistance's throat while my allies flank hammered them), all my best tanks are mobile until the E75 at 898 average xp a round. I've got a few tanks on there with strong armor and a few that just rely on mobility but I find that the faster tanks reliably perform better for me. Well, those and the T30, but 750 damage shells carry a lot of weight when telling folks to go away, and the turret gives it enough maneuverability to get a bunch of shells on target.

Oh, and Zine, clan players that can chuck gold with any consistency for reasons other than being rich are very rare. I'd say that maybe -G- members and possibly SGLE members can do it more than once in a long while for laughs. SSGS held a stupid amount of Russia for a long while and we weren't able to give everyone premium let alone give gold for pubbing. It's really just being able to pick out weak spots.
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Skywalker_T-65
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 01:18pm 

Jedi Council Member


Joined: 2011-08-26 03:53pm
Posts: 2097
Location: Bridge of Battleship SDFS Missouri
Well, I'm starting to like the Lee more. It can't be reliably hurt by most T4 or lower tanks and can punch through the armor of heavier ones. The fact its an oversized TD took some getting used to, but I much prefer it to the other T4's I have (namely the A-20 and AMX 40).

Oh, and if anyone wants to platoon, I have the Lee, a PzIII, a Premium Stuart, and the A-20. I'm normally on from 6:00pm to 9:00pm CST (which should be 7-10 EST right?).

EDIT: Oh, and I have the same username. So if SkywalkerT-65 is on, its me.

Last edited by Skywalker_T-65 on 2012-07-05 01:20pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Nephtys
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 01:19pm 

Sith Acolyte


Joined: 2005-04-02 11:54pm
Posts: 6019
Location: South Cali... where life is cheap!
I'd dare to say the ideals are not at 0 to 100 in either direction (speed and armor), nor in the center, but somewhere between those. A perfectly balanced tank has no strengths, which effectively makes the armor useless, and the speed not good enough to matter. A strong armament is important in both cases, but the armored tank needs a stronger one, as it tends to have less option to how it's fighting.

Generally though, for any tank that can move faster than a slug's pace and with reasonable gun depression, the best armor is not to get hit. Even one unfortunate track loss from a glancing shot could lead to arty annihilating you a second later. This is why the french lights/meds and M18 Hellcat are so deadly, they can pick where they want to fight, take up a good position where you won't beat them, and unload.

My Boelers are split between fast moving opportunist vehicles (IE, American Mediums and French Lights) and juggernauts that can hold up a flank solo. Probably the best example of this is the beloved T29, with it's utterly invulnerable turret and divine gun depression. Half the maps have a hill that lets it destroy anything that approaches.

For all it's worth, I think the E8 has more 'influence' to a game, than the E2 Jumbo, as far as the M4s are concerned. On paper, I think the E2 looks more attractive, but the slight extra maneuverability and speed of the Easy 8 lets it be in the right spot, avoiding being hit in the first place. The E2's armor is decent in front, but it can be penetrated by weapons found at Tier 6 and above. That's the problem with armor. Either you have none, or too much. Somewhere in the middle may as well be none half the time, but without the perks of being fast.
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xthetenth
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 05:02pm 

Jedi Master


Joined: 2010-02-20 01:45am
Posts: 1166
I usually agree with this, most of my favorite tanks are fast and pack a punch with an accurate and fast aiming gun so I can get in, do some damage and get out before people shoot me in the face. However, the Maus is one of my favorite tanks just because if you're good you can totally dictate a fight and laugh at people who try to shoot you, and the AMX 50 B is one of my least favorite because it wants to be a fast tank but it isn't quite fast enough to do most fast tank things and usually ends up support sniping or something else supportive that isn't what a tier ten heavy needs to be in a pub. It's one of those tanks that has a little bit of the other and it really changes things, like the E-75 and its monster acceleration really helping it be awesome rather than a 4502 with a center turret and a bigger lower glacis.
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Skywalker_T-65
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 07:12pm 

Jedi Council Member


Joined: 2011-08-26 03:53pm
Posts: 2097
Location: Bridge of Battleship SDFS Missouri
Well, I'm getting on now...how does one actually join a platoon though? I haven't done it before, so if I see any SDN players on I wouldn't know how to join them...any help is appreciated.
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xthetenth
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 10:49pm 

Jedi Master


Joined: 2010-02-20 01:45am
Posts: 1166
There's a button in the lower right hand that'll flash yellow if someone sends you an invite. If you want to look for SDN guys, use the contacts button.
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Skywalker_T-65
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 10:59pm 

Jedi Council Member


Joined: 2011-08-26 03:53pm
Posts: 2097
Location: Bridge of Battleship SDFS Missouri
Yeah, I figured it out thanks to help from Scottish Ninja. Had a few battles with him, and then Sorchus and Xess.
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xthetenth
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-05 11:36pm 

Jedi Master


Joined: 2010-02-20 01:45am
Posts: 1166
Awesome. If I weren't grinding my Panther and 13 90 right now I'd probably have been offering too.
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PeZook
 Post subject: Re: World of Tanks
PostPosted: 2012-07-07 09:33am 

Emperor's Hand


Joined: 2002-07-18 06:08pm
Posts: 13236
Location: Poland
So, I got back into the game a couple days ago, and apparently I have a Mastery Badge, II Class in my Easy 8.

But I thought I kind of sucked in that tank? :D
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