Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by bilateralrope »

whackadoodle wrote: 2020-08-22 11:23pm I'm almost of the opinion that this message board is nothing but Russian bots. I do know that it was invaded by "Correct The Record" in 2016. Somebody claimed to be an old member, and was allowed to create a new account. It only commented on a thread if it involved the 2016 U.S. election and "misinformation" about Hillary Clinton. You dumb fuckers thought it was it was the real deal, even though it only entered the fray when it involved the 2016 U.S. Presidential election, spouting talking points from the "I'm with Her" campaign.
Why don't you just name the poster you're talking about ?

The obvious answer is that you know how devastating it would be to your claims.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by FaxModem1 »

Different city, same tactics:

Grubstreet
Video Appears to Show Cops Swarming and Forcibly Arresting Activist Cooks in Kenosha
By Chris Crowley

Last night, the Seattle no-charge kitchen Riot Kitchen — which was started to feed protesters, activists, and anyone in need — posted footage from Kenosha, Wisconsin, showing what it says is its bus crew being “kidnapped by feds in unmarked vans.” In the video, police can be seen pointing guns at the car and handcuffing the individuals, before driving off with them. Newsweek shares that the detainment reportedly took place around 7:30 p.m., after the city’s 7 p.m. curfew, but no other individuals in the video were detained.

Riot Kitchen had traveled to the city to feed people during the ongoing protests there over the police shooting of Jacob Blake, who was shot at nearly point-blank range seven times in the back by Kenosha police officer Rusten Sheskey. The shooting, which occurred in front of three of Blake’s four children, has reportedly left the 29 year-old paralyzed from the waist down.

In an attempt to quash the Black Lives Matter protests that have erupted around the country this summer, Donald Trump has sent federal officers to various cities including Portland, Oregon. Reports of protesters allegedly being kidnapped into unmarked vans have been shared, most notably in Portland. In New York, NYPD officers were filmed dragging a protest leader into an unmarked van, Gothamist reported. During the height of the BLM protests earlier this summer, incidents of police attacking medics, destroying equipment, and other acts of aggression have been recorded around the country. The Portland collective Riot Ribs — which dissolved on July 27, succeeded by Revolution Ribs — was subject to teargassing and raids while serving food to protesters and those in need.
Video in link. People are blackbagged in America.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Formless »

Hopefully the ACLU adds defendants from Kenosha to their lawsuit against the Trump administration for their behavior in Portland, and gets Chad Wolf thrown out of his illegally obtained office.

What we really need is legislation rolling back the power of the Department of Homeland Security. Really, we've needed that for some time now (edit: even Richard A. Clark thinks so! And he used to be on the National Security Council!), but this is no longer about demilitarizing/defunding/disestablishing local police departments. The problem goes right to the top.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Formless »

Oh, and by the way, about that court order telling the DHS to stop attacking reporters or else have their qualified immunity stripped? They kept attacking reporters in Portland:
Newsweek wrote:Portland Federal Agents Still Attacking Journalists, Legal Observers Despite Court Order

By Khaleda Rahman On 7/29/20 at 11:24 AM EDT
Federal agents in Portland are violating a court order barring attacks on journalists and legal observers documenting protests in the city, the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) of Oregon said.

Last week, U.S. District Judge Michael Simon ordered agents to stop targeting legal observers and journalists at protests in Portland in response to a class-action lawsuit filed by the ACLU.

The lawsuit said federal agents have fired tear gas, pepper spray, rubber bullets and thrown flash bangs directly at both journalists and legal observers documenting the ongoing protests against police brutality and racism in Oregon's largest city.

On Tuesday, the ACLU asked a federal court to sanction and hold in contempt federal agents with the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) and the U.S. Marshals Service for continuing such attacks in defiance of the court order.According to a motion filed in the court, federal agents began violating the order within hours of it being issued on July 23 and "have continued to do so every night since."

In the early hours of July 24, a federal agent shot Oregon Public Broadcasting (OPB) reporter Jonathan Levinson with a less-lethal munition as he was photographing federal officers, the ACLU said."One agent was standing on a platform near the north side of SW 3rd Avenue," Levinson said in a declaration to the court.

"I was trying to take a photograph, but I had trouble focusing through my fence. As I looked from him to my lens and back at him, I saw him raise his weapon, deliberately point it at me, and fire several rounds. My camera and lens were splattered with paint."

Levinson said he was wearing his press badge and a helmet that says "PRESS" in large letters at the time.

"Levinson was clearly marked as press and no protesters were near him when he was shot," the ACLU said in a news release.

That same night, federal agents also fired less-lethal munitions at another OPB reporter, Rebecca Ellis.

Kathryn Elsesser, a freelance photographer on assignment for news agency Agence France-Presse, said she was attacked while standing alone near the edge of the park where protests had been taking place in the early hours of July 25. She was wearing a press pass and a helmet with "PRESS" written on it.

"I was clearly marked as a member of the press and was standing by myself," Elsesser said. "Suddenly, without warning or reason, I felt a hard, searing, burning pain in the back of my arm.

"A federal agent had shot me from across the street with some type of bullet. I met multiple other photojournalists that night who were similarly attacked despite being clearly labeled as press."

Federal agents also deliberately sprayed mace into the faces of multiple clearly-marked legal observers at point-blank range, the ACLU said.

They also shot a legal observer directly in her chest with a rubber bullet from four feet away—an incident that was captured on video. The footage shows that "she was not threatening federal property, interfering with law enforcement, or even talking to the agent who shot her," the motion said.

The ACLU also urged the court to have each federal agent who violated the court order to be identified, personally appear, and be banned from engaging in armed operations in Portland.

Acting Homeland Security Secretary Chad Wolf and Acting Deputy Secretary Ken Cuccinelli should also be ordered to personally appear before the court to "show cause why they should not be sanctioned for failure to comply" with the order, the motion added.

"This administration claims to be defending the federal courthouse, but won't obey the orders coming out of it," Kelly Simon, the interim legal director of the ACLU of Oregon, said. "What purpose are these agents actually serving then?"
Frankly its a shame that no one posted this article a month ago when it was first published by the media, but late or not its still relevant. THIS is the importance of having every officer wear personally identifying information, because when they do something illegal and don't have such information on hand, that's what we call "plausible deniability", which means they don't get charged with the crime that video evidence shows they committed. Its not enough to have a court order saying they can't do such and such without losing their qualified immunity, either they need to wear a badge and badge number, or their SUPERVISORS need to be charged with conspiracy. Or better yet, whoever dispatched them needs to go to prison for a very long time, and I don't care what law puts them there. If we as a society truly value free speech as much as we say we do, then we need to punish those at the top who violate it every bit as ferociously as those who commit treason.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Eulogy »

At this point there's small difference between the thuggish pigs and the treasonous pigs, given the many many horrors they perpetuate against US citizens, so the courts may as well lock them up and throw away the key.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Civil War Man »

Formless wrote: 2020-08-27 05:37pmWhat we really need is legislation rolling back the power of the Department of Homeland Security. Really, we've needed that for some time now (edit: even Richard A. Clark thinks so! And he used to be on the National Security Council!), but this is no longer about demilitarizing/defunding/disestablishing local police departments. The problem goes right to the top.
Honestly, what we really need is the complete dismantling of the DHS, with its components either returned to their original agencies or, for the ones that are completely unsalvageable, dissolved in their entirety. I haven't always been as far to the left as I am now, but even back when it was founded I could smell the stink of fascism all over that whole department. The name was a dead giveaway.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by whackadoodle »

Formless wrote: 2020-08-23 11:07pm Hey, fucktard, are you going to give the evidence that was called for by multiple people on the last two pages or not? Because you are being called a troll for not following the most fundamental rule of debate, not for being a right wing fucknut. The bullshit that is dribbling from your mouth right now isn't convincing me you aren't a troll, just the opposite. Speaking as a russian bot to a Republican bot, it sure looks like all you want is to piss people off.
What evidence do you want? Stinger? NSA and CIA infiltration of Google, Faceborg, every digital center on the planet?
I'm not going to imply that you are just that fucking stupid.* I'm all nice and shit that way.

Evidence requested by multiple gullible idiots? Sure, I'll refute it, if you remind me of their questions.

Correct The Record Guy? He participated in the "Hillary is all things to all people" bullshit. Can't remember his nick, but it was one that belonged to a member that hadn't participated for years, and then was now "member who hasn't participated for years #2". The best part, the avatar it picked - State portrait of Jerry Brown. That's what tipped me off. Day after the 2016 election, that motherfucker was smoke.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by whackadoodle »

Dalton wrote: 2020-08-26 02:40pm Evidently he will not produce this evidence.
He will not divide us...blah blah blah.

What evidence do you want? Digital signatures? Proof that will indict people, vs shit that everyone knows as common sense?
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Ralin »

What the fuck are you talking about?
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Formless »

The fucktard was asked to give evidence that the protestors in Portland used and were caught with IEDs made using fireworks, among other crimes he claimed they did, and he still has not provided evidence for these claims. Now he's changing the subject and pretending that I was asking for evidence that this forum was infiltrated by what the fuck ever conspiracy he thinks we're going to fall for (as if anyone cares enough about SDN to bother!), but the claims can be found earlier in the thread, and the calls for evidence are there with full context if you are really interested. The thing is, its been almost a month since the last time anyone posted in this thread, and more than a month since he spouted his original bullshit. I have no interest in his drive by trolling. However, if he wants to continue trolling, he can certainly put up or shut up about the conspiracy crap too. After all, if he's too chickenshit to name the people he's accusing, then he's just trolling and hoping the moderators forget what he was talking about because its been a month.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by bilateralrope »

whackadoodle wrote: 2020-09-19 09:17pm Correct The Record Guy? He participated in the "Hillary is all things to all people" bullshit. Can't remember his nick, but it was one that belonged to a member that hadn't participated for years, and then was now "member who hasn't participated for years #2". The best part, the avatar it picked - State portrait of Jerry Brown. That's what tipped me off. Day after the 2016 election, that motherfucker was smoke.
Then you can go back into that thread and go tell us his name. Should be easy enough for you to do since you remember what he said. Just a link to the thread and a copy paste of enough of the post that I can use ctrl-f to find it would be sufficient for me to find the name.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Dalton »

whackadoodle wrote: 2020-09-19 09:37pm
Dalton wrote: 2020-08-26 02:40pm Evidently he will not produce this evidence.
He will not divide us...blah blah blah.

What evidence do you want? Digital signatures? Proof that will indict people, vs shit that everyone knows as common sense?
Ok just get the fuck out. Prick.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by loomer »

"Doctors keep their scalpels and other instruments handy, for emergencies. Keep your philosophy ready too—ready to understand heaven and earth. In everything you do, even the smallest thing, remember the chain that links them. Nothing earthly succeeds by ignoring heaven, nothing heavenly by ignoring the earth." M.A.A.A
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Solauren »

Hexite is a material from Fortnite

The chemical in question is actually "hexachloroethane", and is accepted as being a carcinogen.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexachloroethane

So, in short - the chemical has been identified as cancer-causing nerve agent.


Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't that violate numerous international laws?
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Bedlam »

A huge number of chemicals are cancer causing, Wood, paper smoke and car exhaust, cigarettes and vapes included. What punishment would you suggest for any of the protestors who drove to the protest, set anything on fire or smoked? Should they he held in violation of international law?

Hexachloroethane is not considered a nerve agent, you don't drop dead after a few seconds, it's not nice stuff and is being phased out for the damage it causes but the same can be said for huge numbers of chemicals used everywhere in everyday life.

Plus most international laws against the use of chemicals weapons actually only specify you cannot use them in war against an enemy there are large loopholes when it comes to using it against your own people.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by madd0ct0r »

I wonder why they started using it?

Either they were worried protesters had countered the "mainstream" teargasses (that the smoke moves differently" line in the article, or the perception it's "stronger stuff" )

Or they've used up their stocks and this company had a load to sell cheap after the military stopped using it.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Raw Shark »

Or C) For the Eviluz. "You wanna defund the police? Have some cancer, bitches!"

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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

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The most striking effects of zinc chloride toxicity in the street — vomiting, burning skin, coughing — are only the first onslaught of a chronic, unpredictable respiratory condition that can cause severe liver damage, fatigue, weight loss, and anorexia, in addition to difficulty breathing.
I'm going to have to go with C. "We can't shoot you, so we'll just go for 'see ya later' effects, instead."
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Formless »

The only hope at this point is that once the regime changes, Biden will clean house on these assholes and bring appropriate charges against them. Next best thing is that the civil suits by BLM (and related organizations) and the state will go through the federal courts and bring Trump's people to justice that way. After that the only things I can think of that will bring justice will be changes in legislation that prevent the manufacture of these weapons at all. That or a revolution.

I am not hopeful for most of these things to happen. Perhaps the civil suits, but civil suits are insufficient to bring justice for criminal actions by a government.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Broomstick »

Given the past track record of the US Federal government to throw safety to the winds, the best I can hope for is a cessation of use. I don't expect the culprits to be brought to justice, although I'd be thrilled to be wrong on that point.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by bilateralrope »

“It’s a chemical reaction in a can,” says Simonis. “The zinc chloride is an intentional product of the grenade’s design.” The Material Safety Data Sheet supplied by Safariland, however, doesn’t mention zinc chloride at all.
How convenient that the regime forces can claim that they didn't know about the zinc chloride. That they can put all the blame on the company for not telling them exactly what kind of chemical they were purchasing.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by loomer »

Solauren wrote: 2020-12-08 10:18am Hexite is a material from Fortnite

The chemical in question is actually "hexachloroethane", and is accepted as being a carcinogen.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexachloroethane

So, in short - the chemical has been identified as cancer-causing nerve agent.


Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't that violate numerous international laws?
When one intends to correct someone, it's usually best to be correct. Hexite is a common name for zinc chloride smoke - the mysterious green gas - in military applications. And to boot, from what google suggests, 'Hexite' is not in Fortnite at all, but No Mans Sky. Maybe spend a few seconds on there yourself before you rush to correct others.

The carcinogenic properties of hexachloroethane are not especially concerning, and it is not a nerve agent. Its use does not violate any major international law that I'm aware of except possibly some standards around enviroonmental contamination. Nor does the use of zinc chloride smoke - the actual reason they deploy hexachloroethane cans - violate the major international treaties on chemical weapons, as it is not a nerve agent, blister agent, etc, and was not provably deployed with the intent to cause injury or fatality primarily through its toxic nature. And, as Bedlam notes, the use of chemical agents in a civil disturbance is rather less illegal (not entirely legal, but not as heavily restricted) than in an international or even internal war.

Personally, I suspect part of their use was for the terror effect of 'mysterious clouds of green gas that don't behave like tear gas'. Tear gas's psychological effect was waning so something new and scary to incite panic and break the line would naturally appeal to the jackboots.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by Beowulf »

loomer wrote: 2020-12-08 09:18pm Hexite is a common name for zinc chloride smoke - the mysterious green gas - in military applications.
When one intends to correct someone, it's usually best to be correct. Zinc chloride smoke is white, sometimes gray. We still don't know what the mysterious green gas is, though it's possible it's another type of smoke grenade. The manufacturer makes other types of grenades that aren't zinc chloride based, that are colored, including green.
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Re: Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

Post by loomer »

Beowulf wrote: 2020-12-09 12:24am
loomer wrote: 2020-12-08 09:18pm Hexite is a common name for zinc chloride smoke - the mysterious green gas - in military applications.
When one intends to correct someone, it's usually best to be correct. Zinc chloride smoke is white, sometimes gray. We still don't know what the mysterious green gas is, though it's possible it's another type of smoke grenade. The manufacturer makes other types of grenades that aren't zinc chloride based, that are colored, including green.
I'm going to go with Dr. Simonis on this one, sorry. The additional chlorine produced by the reaction likely gave the gas the green tint, but it was primarily composed of zinc chloride from the evidence.
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