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Lonestar wrote:

Shinn Langley Soryu wrote:Alright, since Siege already bought two of Lonestar's Scorpènes, I'd like to buy the other two for the same price that Siege paid for his.

The remaining two are not available at the moment...waiting for the remainder of my ordered SSNs to come online.

Unless you want to offer a better deal than Siege got...

How long will it take for the rest of your Astutes to be commissioned? I'm willing to wait if need be.

Lonestar wrote:Presumably his exiles would actually have air cover.

But who is to say the troops won't have S-300 and Tunguska's... after all in this world those are already becoming legacy systems for me

Stas Bush wrote:

Lonestar wrote:Presumably his exiles would actually have air cover.

But who is to say the troops won't have S-300 and Tunguska's... after all in this world those are already becoming legacy systems for me

You have to launch your revolution first for it to matter, and we'd intervene then.

And where did Wilkens indicate he'd go with some lame-assed "exile army" anyway? My intention, and probably his as well, would be actual troops from our countries as peacekeepers. Since PeZook is talking about inciting a revolution, not some "the Caymans are magically socialist and buddy-buddy with the SNC overnight" thing.

Well, "overnight" might not be it, but then, clamping down on a small revolution like a ton of bricks doesn't sound terribly rational unless you know the SNC will be behind it in some future. Hell, the US massively deliberated before even trying something half-assed like Bay of the Pigs, and that with Cuba, which went from "uh, revolution" to "Soviet Glorious Brotherhood!" in a matter of months!

To be honest, what Wilkens said is making me rethink the idea, or change it from RAR REVOLUTION to "Hey, politics FTW!"

Sheming in the background is a possibility until we can really work out a unified approach to the Cayman "problem"

Master_Baerne wrote:Since the official name is "Frequesque" now, and we all use "Goddamn F-ing Continent" anyway, presumably we could change the official name and then use the former one as slang? I like this plan...

As far as I'm concerned the name is "Frequesue", not "Frequesque", and I'm sticking to it, dammit .

PS: And the proper name for that big-ass continent to the north is "Messica" not that lame-o "Messamerica" .

Stas Bush wrote:Well, "overnight" might not be it, but then, clamping down on a small revolution like a ton of bricks doesn't sound terribly rational unless you know the SNC will be behind it in some future. Hell, the US massively deliberated before even trying something half-assed like Bay of the Pigs, and that with Cuba, which went from "uh, revolution" to "Soviet Glorious Brotherhood!" in a matter of months!

Wilkens gave what I thought to be pretty good reasons for why he'd take notice of any such thing.

PeZook wrote:To be honest, what Wilkens said is making me rethink the idea, or change it from RAR REVOLUTION to "Hey, politics FTW!"

Um...how? Looking at the write-up I don't see their government getting overly eager to be super-best-friends with the commies and socialists. Especially not with the CSR having a bit of a "shoot first, ask questions later" approach to those who get them mad. The SNC would hardly leave them be, and the CPC would lose their power. They wouldn't want that. Leaving some kind of overthrow as the only option that I can see.

And that, of course, leads to Wilkonian intervention, and probably the Shinra Republic and Tian Xia as well (to back up our ally, and hey it's almost on our doorstep too). And if there's a hint of them going socialist/commie I can see the IRT taking an active hand in things, since they probably get along well enough with their Corporatocracy. Far more than they would some theoretical "yay socialist brotherhood!" government, regardless of how it came about.

For socialism to even crop up in the Caymans, they would have to be large dissatisfied elements in the Caymans. Also, it will take years for something of serious magnitude to rock the government and coerce them into going socialist, given they are hard core corporatists.

Jesus christ, who says anything about turning them socialist? (okay, apart from Shady, but he doesn't count )

Even the CSR would be satisfied with a government that is simply friendly to the SNC, and by "politics FTW" I meant covert funding and messing around with internal corporate politics without going into full-on armed insurgency mode.

PeZook wrote:Jesus christ, who says anything about turning them socialist? (okay, apart from Shady, but he doesn't count )

Maybe you should just not let him talk?

PeZook wrote:Even the CSR would be satisfied with a government that is simply friendly to the SNC, and by "politics FTW" I meant covert funding and messing around with internal corporate politics without going into full-on armed insurgency mode.

I suppose it depends on how friendly you want them to be. Seeing as how the IRT is right next door and pretty much the ideological opposite of the SNC, there's probably a limit to how friendly they'd tolerate a fellow corporate state getting with you dirty socialists.

Not everyone in the SNC are socialist; and there's a lot a new junta, even if it isn't socialist, could benefit from SNC ties I mean, USSR supported India, Iran, Iraq, various dudes at various times and cared little.

Stas Bush wrote:Not everyone in the SNC are socialist; and there's a lot a new junta, even if it isn't socialist, could benefit from SNC ties I mean, USSR supported India, Iran, Iraq, various dudes at various times and cared little.

Compared to the IRT, we're all dirty commies

Well yeah, but that's the IRT. I thought the MESS doesn't look on phong too kindly, but then, who knows, who knows...

Czech's attempted re-write of the Caymans didn't quite work well from what I saw, if only because it'd be ludicrous to think that his long vicious war between the CRA and a monarchial government would've gone without attracting Wilkonian and Tonkinese response. When I gave info on them I tried to do a government that reflected the overwhelming Tonkinese and Wilkonian influence that would naturally occur without some weird "corporation in direct legal control" thing.

I also had the Cayman Communists outlawed due to their provoking an outbreak of violence in 2003 in-universe, but that won't stop the CSR I'm sure.


And while I'm here, I'll confess that I've thought about trying to come back, but after Norse's hamhanded attempt to come back to the game I thought it would be ungraceful and undiginified to turn a 180 and just proclaim my return. I'm therefore desiring of your opinions before making any such decision.

Technically, you never made an in-universe post about what happened to your leader? I mean, there's nothing to stop you from "returning to politics".

Norseman's case is different. In his case, his country got wiped out.

Stas Bush wrote:Well yeah, but that's the IRT. I thought the MESS doesn't look on phong too kindly, but then, who knows, who knows...

The MESS as a whole maybe not, but so far as Wilkonia, the Shinra Republic and Tian Xia are concerned the IRT is in our neighborhood. So them getting overly agitated at some other country also in our neighborhood is something we wouldn't just ignore and say "oh well those silly Tonkinites" and ignore it. Peace in our backyard is a good thing, after all.

Plus as Wilkens outlined, at least for him, the Caymans is sort of a neutral point for him and the IRT to conduct business and whatnot. So I don't think he'd be interested in losing that if some situation were to cause strife with the IRT in the Caymans.

I suppose it boils down to the MESS nations in the area are probably more tolerant of the Caymans getting friendly with the SNC up to a point. It is still our area of influence though so there is doubtless a line we wouldn't want to see crossed. The IRT, on the other hand, probably has a lower threshold. And since it's all in our backyard so to speak, and we have to live with the IRT as our neighbor, we wouldn't want to see the status quo upset too much. So it's a bit of a balancing act, really.

Stas Bush wrote:Not everyone in the SNC are socialist; and there's a lot a new junta, even if it isn't socialist, could benefit from SNC ties I mean, USSR supported India, Iran, Iraq, various dudes at various times and cared little.

Well let's face it: the CSR is and we all know the major power of the SNC is the Crimsons.

But like I said, how the local four Imperiums react to any potential SNC friendship the Caymans develop (assuming they do; I wouldn't be surprised if they see the SNC as mostly the Crimson Star Republic and its three smaller states that aren't as important) all depends on just what friendship this entails...and how much influence the SNC expects to have in the region.

Steve wrote:And while I'm here, I'll confess that I've thought about trying to come back, but after Norse's hamhanded attempt to come back to the game I thought it would be ungraceful and undiginified to turn a 180 and just proclaim my return. I'm therefore desiring of your opinions before making any such decision.

I wouldn't mind your triumphant return, in fact I'm all for it. I think the main issue with Norse's return was that his nation had just suffered two catastrophic bio-attacks; to claim 'teehee, I survived!' after that grated on people's nerves, particularly considering the whole clusterfuck with Shep leaving and so on. But Cascadia never had that problem, so why not come back to the game if you want to?

RogueIce wrote:Well let's face it: the CSR is and we all know the major power of the SNC is the Crimsons.

Well, you blew my cards dude

Though, considering the CSR wasn't even able to thoroughly press Byzantium out of the MESS (with the consensus of the remaining 2 members behind it!), I doubt we're really that uniform.

P.S. Cascadia never left, didn't it? Steve didn't make "I leave and fuck you posts", like Norse and Shep did? Then he can come back and be welcome, in fact he never left.

Stas Bush wrote:

RogueIce wrote:Well let's face it: the CSR is and we all know the major power of the SNC is the Crimsons.

Well, you blew my cards dude

Though, considering the CSR wasn't even able to thoroughly press Byzantium out of the MESS (with the consensus of the remaining 2 members behind it!), I doubt we're really that uniform.

True, but we are talking perceptions, as well. Plus there have been the times you acted unilaterally and quite heavy handed, so I'm sure you can see why we'd be hesitent to have that at out doorstep. And why smaller nations (such as the Caymans) would be wary.

But the balance of power of the SNC is rather lopsided with the CSR at the top, you must admit.

As for Byzantium, foreign policy-wise they seem to be going more SNC anyway. Mostly just taking advantage of MESS R&D out of their membership than anything else lately.

I believe my approach was to lament that I had acted deceptively toward Shep in trying to keep him from launching the bioattack on Norse, trying to buy time if you will for Norse to quit as he'd mentioned he was going to do, and then to say I was quitting. In a couple further posts I tried to give recommendations to the players on how to handle Skimmer's departure and gave general directives for how Cascadia would act to the immediate bio-attack crisis.

C'mon back, Steve. I, too, had a hiatus around that time but, what the hell, the water's fine.

Ultimately, it was Shep's utter and complete asshollery which led to the Pathogen Wars. Deception had little to do with it.

PeZook wrote:Ultimately, it was Shep's utter and complete asshollery which led to the Pathogen Wars. Deception had little to do with it.

Shep would have done it with or without anyone's help anyhow.

Fingolfin_Noldor wrote: Shep would have done it with or without anyone's help anyhow.

Yeah, exactly my point. So Steve doesn't really have anything to lament about...

EDIT: On another note, the capsule goes round and round, round and round, round and round...