The Dark Knight (GODDAMN SPOILERS)

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2008-07-23 12:02am

Guardsman Bass wrote:That's part of it. Notice how he was laughing his ass off when Batman nearly knocked him off that tower near the end, only to catch him just before hitting the ground? He doesn't go out of his way to get himself killed, but he doesn't really seem bothered by it either.

He was laughing because he made Batman break his one rule; he won by pushing people to do extreme things, just as his plan with the ferries. Once he realised Batman wouldn't kill him, he 'thinks you and I will be doing this forever'.

ray245 · Post by **ray245** » 2008-07-23 12:16am

By the way, during the joker 'social experiment' , if you are one of the passengers onboard the ship, would you blow the other ship up?

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2008-07-23 12:19am

ray245 wrote:By the way, during the joker 'social experiment' , if you are one of the passengers onboard the ship, would you blow the other ship up?

Just stop.

Schuyler Colfax · Post by **Schuyler Colfax** » 2008-07-23 01:01am

Stark wrote:
ray245 wrote:By the way, during the joker 'social experiment' , if you are one of the passengers onboard the ship, would you blow the other ship up?
Just stop.

At least he didn't make a thread out of it.

The Wench · Post by **The Wench** » 2008-07-23 12:29pm

hongi wrote:
Galvatron wrote:
Vympel wrote: Can't take him seriously looking at him in the face. The unnecessary put-on throaty voice doesn't help. The actual suit itself is cool, I like it a lot.
I get the feeling that, in-universe, the batvoice is due to some gadget under the mask that he uses to both disguise his real voice and to make himself sound scarier to thugs. Why else would he talk that way in private with people who know his secret identity?
I remember in Batman Begins there was a scene where Bruce is getting fitted out with his suit and I remember him putting what looked like a mike/some sort of chip inside his headpiece. Did I imagine it?

No, but that's just a microphone to overhear conversations. I don't think it's something to change his voice. That would just be silly. He talks that way to people who know he's the bat because that's who he really is. Wayne is the mask. They're just setting up the differences between these two people in one body by attempting to give them distinct voices and insinuating Batman is the predominant one, but Bale isn't as great as someone like Kevin Conroy at getting those across...so it comes out funny. His lisp doesn't help either.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2008-07-23 01:55pm

I was going to make a crack about the silly aspects of superhero movies in general, and then I remembered that the movie which won the Best Picture Academy Award last year was about a psycho who ran around killing people with a fucking compressed-air cylinder.

Ericxihn · Post by **Ericxihn** » 2008-07-23 01:57pm

The Wench wrote:
No, but that's just a microphone to overhear conversations. I don't think it's something to change his voice. That would just be silly. He talks that way to people who know he's the bat because that's who he really is. Wayne is the mask. They're just setting up the differences between these two people in one body by attempting to give them distinct voices and insinuating Batman is the predominant one, but Bale isn't as great as someone like Kevin Conroy at getting those across...so it comes out funny. His lisp doesn't help either.

Or he just doesn't want people to recognize his voice.

Wayne's the mask and Batman's the real person in the comics, but in the Nolan movies, both are masks and the real Bruce Wayne is hidden somewhere else.

Darmalus · Post by **Darmalus** » 2008-07-23 02:05pm

Darth Wong wrote:I was going to make a crack about the silly aspects of superhero movies in general, and then I remembered that the movie which won the Best Picture Academy Award last year was about a psycho who ran around killing people with a fucking compressed-air cylinder.

What movie was this?

General Zod · Post by **General Zod** » 2008-07-23 02:12pm

Darmalus wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:I was going to make a crack about the silly aspects of superhero movies in general, and then I remembered that the movie which won the Best Picture Academy Award last year was about a psycho who ran around killing people with a fucking compressed-air cylinder.
What movie was this?

A 30 second Google search shows "The Departed" is the name of the movie.

Gaidin · Post by **Gaidin** » 2008-07-23 02:30pm

General Zod wrote:
Darmalus wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:I was going to make a crack about the silly aspects of superhero movies in general, and then I remembered that the movie which won the Best Picture Academy Award last year was about a psycho who ran around killing people with a fucking compressed-air cylinder.
What movie was this?
A 30 second Google search shows "The Departed" is the name of the movie.

Thought it was No Country for Old Men.... o_O

General Zod · Post by **General Zod** » 2008-07-23 02:36pm

Gaidin wrote:
A 30 second Google search shows "The Departed" is the name of the movie.

Thought it was No Country for Old Men.... o_O[/quote]

Hrmm, then my source got its information wrong. Oh well.

The Wench · Post by **The Wench** » 2008-07-23 03:03pm

Ericxihn wrote:
The Wench wrote:
No, but that's just a microphone to overhear conversations. I don't think it's something to change his voice. That would just be silly. He talks that way to people who know he's the bat because that's who he really is. Wayne is the mask. They're just setting up the differences between these two people in one body by attempting to give them distinct voices and insinuating Batman is the predominant one, but Bale isn't as great as someone like Kevin Conroy at getting those across...so it comes out funny. His lisp doesn't help either.
Or he just doesn't want people to recognize his voice.

Wayne's the mask and Batman's the real person in the comics, but in the Nolan movies, both are masks and the real Bruce Wayne is hidden somewhere else.

What suggests Nolan is straying from that original 'comic' dynamic in the first place? I guess I didn't see anything that insinuated Nolan thought there was a third piece of Bruce/Batman not present already in the other two fragments of his personality and that he was attempting to flesh that out.

General Zod · Post by **General Zod** » 2008-07-23 03:10pm

The Wench wrote: What suggests Nolan is straying from that original 'comic' dynamic in the first place? I guess I didn't see anything that insinuated Nolan thought there was a third piece of Bruce/Batman not present already in the other two fragments of his personality and that he was attempting to flesh that out.

The whole "I'm really Batman and Bruce Wayne is the mask" thing doesn't happen until much later in the comics iirc. Since the new movies are depicting Batman just starting out, it's fairly safe to say he hasn't reached that level of development yet.

Havok · Post by **Havok** » 2008-07-23 03:17pm

General Zod wrote:
The Wench wrote: What suggests Nolan is straying from that original 'comic' dynamic in the first place? I guess I didn't see anything that insinuated Nolan thought there was a third piece of Bruce/Batman not present already in the other two fragments of his personality and that he was attempting to flesh that out.
The whole "I'm really Batman and Bruce Wayne is the mask" thing doesn't happen until much later in the comics iirc. Since the new movies are depicting Batman just starting out, it's fairly safe to say he hasn't reached that level of development yet.

No. They had a very specific scene in Batman Begins where they address this. It is Rachel that comments the the mask is Wayne and Batman has become the true face.

General Zod · Post by **General Zod** » 2008-07-23 03:27pm

havokeff wrote: No. They had a very specific scene in Batman Begins where they address this. It is Rachel that comments the the mask is Wayne and Batman has become the true face.

I might have missed that, but it still seems that the voice changing thing is being read into far too much.

Havok · Post by **Havok** » 2008-07-23 04:12pm

General Zod wrote:
havokeff wrote: No. They had a very specific scene in Batman Begins where they address this. It is Rachel that comments the the mask is Wayne and Batman has become the true face.
I might have missed that, but it still seems that the voice changing thing is being read into far too much.

I concur. I also don't remember it being THAT bad in the first movie. As soon as SOMEONE gets me my copy of the movie, I can watch and confirm.

The Wench · Post by **The Wench** » 2008-07-23 04:47pm

havokeff wrote:
General Zod wrote:
havokeff wrote: No. They had a very specific scene in Batman Begins where they address this. It is Rachel that comments the the mask is Wayne and Batman has become the true face.
I might have missed that, but it still seems that the voice changing thing is being read into far too much.
I concur. I also don't remember it being THAT bad in the first movie. As soon as SOMEONE gets me my copy of the movie, I can watch and confirm.

Maybe if someone got me that little Joker statuette that I fell in love with the other day...SOMEONE would go do that

.

I'm going to agree, but in the end, his voice changing thing didn't bother me all that much. I always thought it was just a given he was gonna' do something like that. I just find Bale's way of talking sort of amusing...

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2008-07-23 04:49pm

In the Nolanverse, he spends 15 years finding himself and turning his body into a weapon. Then, he has to come back and act like a billionaire playboy. Its pretty obvious to me who's real.

Battlehymn Republic · Post by **Battlehymn Republic** » 2008-07-23 05:22pm

Darth Wong wrote:I was going to make a crack about the silly aspects of superhero movies in general, and then I remembered that the movie which won the Best Picture Academy Award last year was about a psycho who ran around killing people with a fucking compressed-air cylinder.

I look forward to your opinions on the (alleged) realism, if any, of The Dark Knight.

Jim Raynor · Post by **Jim Raynor** » 2008-07-23 07:24pm

I don't know what's up with Bale's Batman voice. He's GREAT at voicing Batman when he's angry. The guy is like a snarling beast, just barely holding his destructive rage in check (that was in fact the way Bale described it, IIRC). But when he's a calm Batman, he just puts on a scratchy smoker's voice. While I consider the Nolan/Bale Batman to be overall the best portrayal of the character, the animated Kevin Conroy version (which I also love overall) has him completely beat when it comes to voice.

Jack Bauer · Post by **Jack Bauer** » 2008-07-23 08:40pm

You know the more I think about it, Galvy's idea about combining Selena and Talia is sounding better and better.

The Selena Kyle / Catwoman character would provide the necessary romantic tension, but the Talia / League of Shadows connection provides more dramatic "umph".

Besides, it'll be a nice twist for the Great Detective to figure out.

Jim Raynor · Post by **Jim Raynor** » 2008-07-23 09:39pm

The more I think about it, the better the League of Shadows seems to fit for the third movie. Their disappearance after Batman Begins is a massive plothole. According to Ra's Al Ghul, they had infiltrated every level of Gotham's infrastructure. Imagine if Al Qaeda got WMD, and had taken over New York City. That's how big a threat they are. Fuck the mob, if I were Nolanverse Batman I would be spending every waking moment trying to hunt down and destroy the remnants of the League.

A resurgent League of Shadows could be a big enough threat that the third movie doesn't look pathetic after Ra's Al Ghul and the Joker. Batman could save Gotham once more, and the people could recognize him for that. It would end the trilogy on an exciting and positive note.

Even ignoring the comic purism perspective, merging Catwoman and Talia could be problematic. Rachel's body isn't even cold yet (figuratively), and Bruce finds AND loses another lover? As great a movie as TDK is, it's a huge downer and Batman's very effectiveness as a force for change is called into question. I think people weren't too put off by that partially because they knew there would be an inevitable third movie. If Catwoman is in the movie and is reformed by the end, or is at least affected positively by Batman, that could leave viewers with a sense of hope and the idea that Batman really is making a difference. Or, Catwoman could be left out entirely and Talia could be played as a pure femme fatale that Bruce never gets that attached to, so that her downfall wouldn't be as negative and depressing.

Havok · Post by **Havok** » 2008-07-23 11:44pm

Holy shit. Bale's Batman voice in Begins is NOWHERE near as gruff as it is in TDK, at least when he is just talking and not threating criminals, but even then it's not as bad. And actually, I might like Katie Holmes better then Maggie Gyllenhall.

wautd · Post by **wautd** » 2008-07-24 04:34am

Ok, saw it last night. I missed the part between where the Joker talks to Harvey Dent in the clinic untill the Joker blows up the hospital (I had to take a leak real bad). What did I miss? Anything important?

Pulp Hero · Post by **Pulp Hero** » 2008-07-24 08:51am

If you saw the talk, not much. If you missed the talk, then it was the Joker convincing Dent to be an "agent of chaos" because the world was unfair.