StarDestroyer.Net BBS

In Dwarf Fortress, the game is designed to end when you did to a certain point in the mountain. You receive a message saying "No one knows what become of xxx fortresss. Some say they dug too deeply and awoke an evil unlike any others," or something to that effect.

So, we may infer that the secret of Palelabor could be some superbeast that the demons unearthed when mining (perhaps in Tartarus) that they managed to imprison somehow. Now, perhaps, they will release it, hoping it will destroy the humans utterly.

Kinda like a Balrog, only scarier?

It's Godzilla!

Alferd Packer wrote:In Dwarf Fortress, the game is designed to end when you did to a certain point in the mountain. You receive a message saying "No one knows what become of xxx fortresss. Some say they dug too deeply and awoke an evil unlike any others," or something to that effect.

So, we may infer that the secret of Palelabor could be some superbeast that the demons unearthed when mining (perhaps in Tartarus) that they managed to imprison somehow. Now, perhaps, they will release it, hoping it will destroy the humans utterly.

If the demons imprisoned such a creature, it can't be THAT threatening to the humans. Besides, it ignores the possiblity that the creature won't soon die anyway when fighting the humans, or that it won't turn on them.

In that case, I'd be right.

For those not initiated into the secret cult of dwarven engineering; Palelabor is a reference to the legendary, not to mention highly entertaining, exploits of MRDOD last year.

Belial is rapidly earning a place in my book as the real villain here. He's got everythign a proper villain needs: a supervillain lair in Tartarus, huge numbers of potentially expendable mooks now that he's claimed Asmodeus' holdings, and more plots and superweapons than you can shake a stick at.

Too bad the humans are proving a bit too effective in crushing the baldricks; if Belial entertained the notion that he could surrender he'd probably do it right away, though he likely wouldn't last long anyway in human custody after Detroit and Sheffield.

Wait, so they're going to start covering the Earth in lava?!

Eulogy wrote:Wait, so they're going to start covering the Earth in lava?!

Belial already tried permaflooding earth with lava, but the physics engine just isn't co-operating.

Palelabor was actually foreshadowed way back in chapter 42.

So we're back to "unleash Nightmare Fuel on the humans", then.

Belail had better be prepared to be disappointed.

Starglider wrote:

Eulogy wrote:Wait, so they're going to start covering the Earth in lava?!

Belial already tried permaflooding earth with lava, but the physics engine just isn't co-operating.

Palelabor was actually foreshadowed way back in chapter 42.

Okay, you'll have to point a bit closer. What're we supposed to have seen?

CaptainChewbacca wrote:

Starglider wrote:

Eulogy wrote:Wait, so they're going to start covering the Earth in lava?!

Belial already tried permaflooding earth with lava, but the physics engine just isn't co-operating.

Palelabor was actually foreshadowed way back in chapter 42.

Okay, you'll have to point a bit closer. What're we supposed to have seen?

I think it's demons with Iron, but I could be wrong.

This caused a minor stir in the court. One of the great armored demons spoke; “Human, do you know the secret of this alchemy? Could you transform plain molten iron into the enchanted iron?”

James gulped. “Perhaps, m'lord, it being the case that I was a foreman at the Bessemer works before the Great War... I would have to see your furnaces...”

As his words trailed off the great antlered demon on the throne spoke in a thundering voice. “I am sure that Baron Trajakrithoth's question was purely hypothetical. Our lord Satan has decreed that hell does not need iron and that no demon shall attempt to make weapons from it. Our furnaces smelt bronze, brass, copper, silver and gold, no iron.” Those words did not seem to be directed at the human, but the next ones were. “Now, what of this 'Sheffield'? It has many furnaces, many forges?”

The Russian lieutnant with an uncanny surname is well-written (Edovin is a Russian surname, albeit a rare one).

MariusRoi, if you're right about Demons using the dead humans to supply them with tech expertise, that could pose a problem of great proportions.

Also, the Demons are not very smart (they should have picked dead people with the most recent combat knowledge of course, there must be plenty)... but that's common for them.

Stas Bush wrote:The Russian lieutnant with an uncanny surname is well-written (Edovin is a Russian surname, albeit a rare one).

MariusRoi, if you're right about Demons using the dead humans to supply them with tech expertise, that could pose a problem of great proportions.

Not really. The vast majority of people don't know shit, even today (remember: Hell gets people from everywhere, not concentrated good pickings from high-tech industrial areas). Worse yet, without any kind of supporting infrastructure, they can't make a damned thing. Even making a simple 15th century muzzle-loading cannon would be impossible without metallurgy that's beyond the baldricks' capabilities.

Darth Wong wrote:

Stas Bush wrote:The Russian lieutnant with an uncanny surname is well-written (Edovin is a Russian surname, albeit a rare one).

MariusRoi, if you're right about Demons using the dead humans to supply them with tech expertise, that could pose a problem of great proportions.

Not really. The vast majority of people don't know shit, even today (remember: Hell gets people from everywhere, not concentrated good pickings from high-tech industrial areas). Worse yet, without any kind of supporting infrastructure, they can't make a damned thing. Even making a simple 15th century muzzle-loading cannon would be impossible without metallurgy that's beyond the baldricks' capabilities.

And it's made even more impossible by Satan's banning of ironworking.

Remeber whatever one trick pony Belial is based on demon levels of warfare. It might be uncontrollable, unstoppable against Demon-forces, he's not seen a nuke yet nor an Arch-Light Strike.

Mr Bean wrote:Remeber whatever one trick pony Belial is based on demon levels of warfare. It might be uncontrollable, unstoppable against Demon-forces, he's not seen a nuke yet nor an Arch-Light Strike.

But that's not really the problem. The military outcome of this war hasn't ever really been in doubt since about the beginning; the question has been more along the lines of how much its going to cost the humans to win the war. Whatever trick Belial has up his sleeve is definitely going to reap at least some tally of human lives if it gets used.

Stas Bush wrote:(they should have picked dead people with the most recent combat knowledge of course, there must be plenty)

Part of the problem I think is that the PFLH and various Earth military performers of CSAR, such as the United States Marines who rescued Lt. Edovin, are directly targeting this would-be capability.

Darth Wong wrote:

Stas Bush wrote:The Russian lieutnant with an uncanny surname is well-written ;) (Edovin is a Russian surname, albeit a rare one).

MariusRoi, if you're right about Demons using the dead humans to supply them with tech expertise, that could pose a problem of great proportions.

Not really. The vast majority of people don't know shit, even today (remember: Hell gets people from everywhere, not concentrated good pickings from high-tech industrial areas). Worse yet, without any kind of supporting infrastructure, they can't make a damned thing. Even making a simple 15th century muzzle-loading cannon would be impossible without metallurgy that's beyond the baldricks' capabilities.

Actually, cannons can be built from bronze and wrought iron. And one might even be able to survive firing them, and fire them more than once if one keeps the bore diameter small, and the mass of shot thrown on the light side (like small cannon found on 15th and 16th century shipwrecks.) If he's got forges deep underground, he might be able to better control for dust and other particulate matter. It won't be at all pleasant, or safe to work in these forges, but I imagine the concept of "OSHA" is utterly alien to baldricks.

And given demonic sensitivity to iron, even a muzzle-loading cannon discharging iron shot ought to be a devastating anti-demon weapon. Disproportionately so from the perspective of the baldricks.

All right, I'm betting a virtual beer on the following:

This secret weapon is a rolling armored fortress that looks something like the Davinci turtle concept. It is armored with iron or possibly crude steel. Armament is cannons as described above, plus some facility to collect, concentrate, and discharge electric energy from many demons and naga. Motive power provided by demons (or some equivalent of a draft animal) either turning a crank connected to wheels or treads, or walking directly on the ground and pushing (under cover, of course).

There may also be some kind of flamethrower system, possibly replicated from the biological ones of the Harpies.

I suspect that it's large enough to do some damage to human forces (and would be almost unstoppable against normal baldrick forces), but could be taken out with airstrikes relatively easily.

Darth Wong wrote:

Stas Bush wrote:The Russian lieutnant with an uncanny surname is well-written ;) (Edovin is a Russian surname, albeit a rare one).

MariusRoi, if you're right about Demons using the dead humans to supply them with tech expertise, that could pose a problem of great proportions.

Not really. The vast majority of people don't know shit, even today (remember: Hell gets people from everywhere, not concentrated good pickings from high-tech industrial areas). Worse yet, without any kind of supporting infrastructure, they can't make a damned thing. Even making a simple 15th century muzzle-loading cannon would be impossible without metallurgy that's beyond the baldricks' capabilities.

Well, it depends on how good their bronze casting is. 15th century cannon "worked" insomuch as they tolerated an incredibly high fail-rate, and they could probably be duplicated in the Hellenistic era, or even Shang era China, which had excellent bronzeworking knowledge. But as for Baldricks? We haven't seen their forges, so I can't say.

I don't really expect to see Belial pulling out cannons and muskets and the like, simply because he knows quite well what Human hardware can accomplish, and if he's the one with the secrets of Palelabor, then he'd know damned well that that wouldn't help. What I'd be more worried about are First War-era soul-based weaponry of some kind, at least as the demons understand the concept. To a demon, a crude cannon isn't superior to a lightning discharge, ergo that's not a direction I would expect to see their development taking them when they're in the middle of a war with their own kin. We did, however, see Uriel do some seriously screwed-up shit in Africa a ways back, and since baldricks and percies are form the same root origin, the capabilities are at least theoretically there for the development of some similar capability.

Nice work, Stu. I do like that first scene and it does make me wonder about whether the dead can now eat without having to worry about things like too much salt and cholesterol?

So once again the baldricks have been shown what happens when a Bronze Age Army fights a modern one. I wish them luck in finding any weaknesses that they can exploit.

JN1 wrote:Nice work, Stu. I do like that first scene and it does make me wonder about whether the dead can now eat without having to worry about things like too much salt and cholesterol?

Some of the dead "survived" being burned in a lake of lava for years. I can't believe that heart disease would do them in.

So there is an upside to being dead then.
The various burger chains may be setting up there soon, methinks.

SCRawl wrote:

JN1 wrote:Nice work, Stu. I do like that first scene and it does make me wonder about whether the dead can now eat without having to worry about things like too much salt and cholesterol?

Some of the dead "survived" being burned in a lake of lava for years. I can't believe that heart disease would do them in.

Yeah, there appears to be a healthy status-quo that the dead trend towards when their bodies are damaged. I don't think we've stumbled across anyone grossly overweight in Hell, as an example. I bet that the dead can't get drunk or high, either, because their bodies neutralize the agents of damage too quickly. Or, perhaps, they can become intoxicated, but only by taking in an overdose-level of the drug or drink.

Another question is, if the dead can eat and drink, do they also perform the normal eliminatory functions? I would think yes, but then again, the same mechanism that heals their bodies might also eliminate the food before it has a chance to be pooped out.