More Trektardism

lord Martiya · Post by **lord Martiya** » 2007-09-19 03:08am

Catholic priests?

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2007-09-19 03:16am

PeZook wrote:If this debate is so important for them that they will lie their asses off in order to "win", I wonder what sociopathic, egoistic little shits they are in real life.

Do you want a real answer? They're almost certainly losers: failures and social outcasts with little else in their lives to look forward to. Look at Darkstar, who has no real education, no qualifications, no girlfriend, and no future. Why do you think he's so gung-ho about this, and will do anything to convince himself that he's winning? It's his escape from the reality of his life. In real-life, he's a loser. But in his Internet fantasy life, he is a brave, principled leader of a coalition of the willing, standing up against a horde of evil "Warsies" who are out to perpetuate a terrible fraud upon an unsuspecting public.

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2007-09-19 03:38am

Darth Wong wrote: Do you want a real answer? They're almost certainly losers: failures and social outcasts with little else in their lives to look forward to. Look at Darkstar, who has no real education, no qualifications, no girlfriend, and no future. Why do you think he's so gung-ho about this, and will do anything to convince himself that he's winning? It's his escape from the reality of his life. In real-life, he's a loser. But in his Internet fantasy life, he is a brave, principled leader of a coalition of the willing, standing up against a horde of evil "Warsies" who are out to perpetuate a terrible fraud upon an unsuspecting public.

Heh. Perpetual RPG geek syndrome, it would seem. Should've been quite obvious

EnterpriseSovereign · Post by **EnterpriseSovereign** » 2007-09-19 09:29am

PeZook wrote:
Darth Wong wrote: Do you want a real answer? They're almost certainly losers: failures and social outcasts with little else in their lives to look forward to. Look at Darkstar, who has no real education, no qualifications, no girlfriend, and no future. Why do you think he's so gung-ho about this, and will do anything to convince himself that he's winning? It's his escape from the reality of his life. In real-life, he's a loser. But in his Internet fantasy life, he is a brave, principled leader of a coalition of the willing, standing up against a horde of evil "Warsies" who are out to perpetuate a terrible fraud upon an unsuspecting public.
Heh. Perpetual RPG geek syndrome, it would seem. Should've been quite obvious

Yeah, just remember Jay's claim that he was in the first tank division to roll into Baghdad during the first Gulf War

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2007-09-19 09:34am

EnterpriseSovereign wrote: Yeah, just remember Jay's claim that he was in the first tank division to roll into Baghdad during the first Gulf War

Huh? Whoa...where'd he claim that? Did he actually expect to get away with such an obvious fucking lie.

EnterpriseSovereign · Post by **EnterpriseSovereign** » 2007-09-19 09:58am

PeZook wrote:
EnterpriseSovereign wrote: Yeah, just remember Jay's claim that he was in the first tank division to roll into Baghdad during the first Gulf War
Huh? Whoa...where'd he claim that? Did he actually expect to get away with such an obvious fucking lie.

Somewhere on ST.com on a thread long-deleted. Of course when challenged on it, this is what he said:

No I said I was attached to the 1st Armored Division, get it right moron! And I notice how you have never proved me wrong, have you???? Coward.

He uses it to claim having been in the military and that it makes him an expert on military tactics even though he demonstrates a complete lack of such knowledge

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2007-09-19 10:08am

EnterpriseSovereign wrote: He uses it to claim having been in the military and that it makes him an expert on military tactics even though he demonstrates a complete lack of such knowledge

You know, this is typical. IIRC, we've discussed why American kiddies like to pretend they are/were soldiers in another thread, but what's funny is how transparent they are. They should realize it's obvious that every Internet loser couldn't possibly have been a part of the US Army (or better yet, Special Forces! Hooah!), so this particular tactic lost weight years ago.

Aratech · Post by **Aratech** » 2007-09-19 10:10am

PeZook wrote:
EnterpriseSovereign wrote: He uses it to claim having been in the military and that it makes him an expert on military tactics even though he demonstrates a complete lack of such knowledge
You know, this is typical. IIRC, we've discussed why American kiddies like to pretend they are/were soldiers in another thread, but what's funny is how transparent they are. They should realize it's obvious that every Internet loser couldn't possibly have been a part of the US Army (or better yet, Special Forces! Hooah!), so this particular tactic lost weight years ago.

Indeed. And as an American who has had several family members in the navy (though I myself was turned down

) I find it insulting.

Jark · Post by **Jark** » 2007-09-19 01:24pm

I had some free time, so I made a couple of additions to the picture I created earlier. Before it only had the Death Star 1 & 2, and a Borg cube. It now also has a Federation Starbase 74 type station whose dimensions I got off the net, a Super Star Destroyer, and the technology on the face of the Borg transwarp hub seen in Voyagers finale. I scaled the transwarp hub technology on the assumption that the largest of the entrances would be just big enough for a Borg cube to pass through.

Here's a link to it, and I'd appreaciate any comments

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/5568 ... sonyc6.jpg

Bounty · Post by **Bounty** » 2007-09-19 01:26pm

The big number for the DSII is 900, not 800km.

Jark · Post by **Jark** » 2007-09-19 01:40pm

Bounty wrote:The big number for the DSII is 900, not 800km.

Really? I'm not sure where I got 800km from.

Here's a new picture with the 900km figure

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/6517 ... sonau6.png

Ritterin Sophia · Post by **Ritterin Sophia** » 2007-09-19 02:25pm

Man, Aratech, you really need to be more on the ball, if I hadn't been trying to get a rile out of Asimov, we would've never got to see his say gravity isn't dependent on mass.

OmegaGuy · Post by **OmegaGuy** » 2007-09-19 02:35pm

I have to admit, that transwarp hub is nifty looking

Jark · Post by **Jark** » 2007-09-19 02:38pm

OmegaGuy wrote:I have to admit, that transwarp hub is nifty looking

I was hoping to try and work out the size of that massive sphere the technology was attached to, but I haven't figured out how to do that yet. I'll look into it, but I don't think we know if it's something the Borg constructed or what it's really composed of. Eye-balling it, it does look to be in the same ballpark as the Death Star 2 for size.

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2007-09-19 02:45pm

OmegaGuy wrote:I have to admit, that transwarp hub is nifty looking

So do chandeliers. It looks about as delicate too.

Jark · Post by **Jark** » 2007-09-19 02:56pm

I worked out a way to get the total size of the transwarp hub sphere, so I've incorporated it into the main drawing

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/4669 ... soniq1.png

OmegaGuy · Post by **OmegaGuy** » 2007-09-19 02:56pm

Isolder74 wrote:
OmegaGuy wrote:I have to admit, that transwarp hub is nifty looking
So do chandeliers. It looks about as delicate too.

I know. I just think it was a neat design.

Peptuck · Post by **Peptuck** » 2007-09-19 05:38pm

The guy who apparently runs Starfleetjedi.com has shown up in the thread now. Maybe we can get someone worth debating with now.

He posted this in response to me mocking him about his site's statement that a Trek phaser rifle has the same level of firepower as an AT-STs weapons:

What can an AT-ST's fire obliterate?

We see it pretty clearly in the movie (see here for the page examining AT-ST fire.[/url] Which, now that you mention it, could be prettied up a little. Thanks.)

So, to describe the event: A small tree is exploded by fire from an AT-ST. Note that the trunk is not burnt; it merely is burst by vaporizing water. Energy of this event: 1-10 megajoules, depending on how big the tree is. You can see the image on the link I provided.

It's actually fairly generous to say that this is "on par" with the destructive effects of Star Trek hand weapons, which have been seen vaporizing individual humanoids on higher settings, or cubic meters of rock. You can see one particularly destructive hand phaser shot here.

So....many....errors.

Chardok · Post by **Chardok** » 2007-09-19 05:42pm

Oh. My. God. I just read from page...I dunno 60 on....I wish I could just isolate the exchanges between our Servo and Jay...that shit is 1000% Gold.

Darth Servo · Post by **Darth Servo** » 2007-09-19 06:44pm

Peptuck wrote:The guy who apparently runs Starfleetjedi.com has shown up in the thread now. Maybe we can get someone worth debating with now.

He posted this in response to me mocking him about his site's statement that a Trek phaser rifle has the same level of firepower as an AT-STs weapons:

What can an AT-ST's fire obliterate?

We see it pretty clearly in the movie (see here for the page examining AT-ST fire.[/url] Which, now that you mention it, could be prettied up a little. Thanks.)

So, to describe the event: A small tree is exploded by fire from an AT-ST. Note that the trunk is not burnt; it merely is burst by vaporizing water. Energy of this event: 1-10 megajoules, depending on how big the tree is. You can see the image on the link I provided.

It's actually fairly generous to say that this is "on par" with the destructive effects of Star Trek hand weapons, which have been seen vaporizing individual humanoids on higher settings, or cubic meters of rock. You can see one particularly destructive hand phaser shot here.
So....many....errors.

The fact that he still thinks phasers vaporize anything proves we're dealing with a moron.

Darth Servo · Post by **Darth Servo** » 2007-09-19 07:07pm

Oh damn:

JMSpock wrote:They are not lower limits. Both situations are quite incompatible with a 900 km DS2, as high as the margin of error is (345 +/- 100 km is very inaccurate, but has a lower limit of 245, and an upper limit of 445.)

Both, however, are compatible with each other, as well as the quite specific canon description of the second Death Star as twice the size of the first.

You're not representing it accurately at all. If anyone doubts me, see Saxton's page. Seriously. Right here. That's a table summarizing all the sources he mentions in the SWTC regarding Death Star sizes... they are exactly as I have represented them

I see you're so stupid you don't even know what '>' means.

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2007-09-19 07:16pm

PeZook wrote:Heh. Perpetual RPG geek syndrome, it would seem. Should've been quite obvious

"Don't come in here agreeing with my arguments as I stand here, the last bastion and sole defender of them, and then question the manner in which I provide them."

Yes, he actually said this. Link

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2007-09-19 07:27pm

Darth Servo wrote:Oh damn:

JMSpock wrote:They are not lower limits. Both situations are quite incompatible with a 900 km DS2, as high as the margin of error is (345 +/- 100 km is very inaccurate, but has a lower limit of 245, and an upper limit of 445.)

Both, however, are compatible with each other, as well as the quite specific canon description of the second Death Star as twice the size of the first.

You're not representing it accurately at all. If anyone doubts me, see Saxton's page. Seriously. Right here. That's a table summarizing all the sources he mentions in the SWTC regarding Death Star sizes... they are exactly as I have represented them
I see you're so stupid you don't even know what '>' means.

Amazing how these fucking idiots cling to the novelizations, and ignore onscreen evidence when it suits them. "Twice the size" may have been in an early draft of the script the author got, but let's ignore the statements the people actually creating the scene say, along with the finished product.

Starglider · Post by **Starglider** » 2007-09-19 09:44pm

Why does the SW.com databank have the DS1 at 120km and the DS2 at 160km if the later is really supposed to be >900km?. Does any official material directly support this figure?

Ryan Thunder · Post by **Ryan Thunder** » 2007-09-19 09:48pm

Yes. The movies.

Through scaling from various shots of it over Endor, we can determine that its on the order of 800 km in diameter.