Something big

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Esquire
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Re: Something big

Post by Esquire » 2018-11-01 02:21am

Snazzy as always - but I wonder, how intense can their forward firepower get? :D
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Re: Something big

Post by Abacus » 2018-11-01 09:38am

Me likey.
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Re: Something big

Post by STONEhenl » 2018-11-02 06:10pm

I made a murderwedge size comparison:

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Re: Something big

Post by Crossroads Inc. » 2018-11-04 11:37pm

It LOOKS nice, but needs some context as it were, a Grid to measure against or the meters listed for each ship.
That said kudos in general for the work.
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Re: Something big

Post by Esquire » 2018-11-05 01:57am

I'll add that the way the names and pictures are laid out makes it really hard to match the one to the other. Still, a very nice compilation.
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Re: Something big

Post by Abacus » 2018-11-05 09:46am

Not a bad attempt. A good one, even. I'm sure that, when things are slow, Ansel will get around to making an official version; for his own sanity as much as for any of ours.
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Re: Something big

Post by fractalsponge1 » 2018-11-05 10:33am

Abacus wrote:
2018-11-05 09:46am
Not a bad attempt. A good one, even. I'm sure that, when things are slow, Ansel will get around to making an official version; for his own sanity as much as for any of ours.
I have an 8k one with almost every capital ship on it but I keep adding ships and re-rendering and re-mastering old ones and so I just don't have the energy to keep it up to date. At the same time my OCD refuses to call it done until it is up to date. There, you see my problem.

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Re: Something big

Post by Galvatron » 2018-11-05 09:56pm

That comparison chart could also use an Executor so we can really gauge the size of the bigger ships.

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Re: Something big

Post by Abacus » 2018-11-06 09:25am

fractalsponge1 wrote:
2018-11-05 10:33am
Abacus wrote:
2018-11-05 09:46am
Not a bad attempt. A good one, even. I'm sure that, when things are slow, Ansel will get around to making an official version; for his own sanity as much as for any of ours.
I have an 8k one with almost every capital ship on it but I keep adding ships and re-rendering and re-mastering old ones and so I just don't have the energy to keep it up to date. At the same time my OCD refuses to call it done until it is up to date. There, you see my problem.
Indeed. I can only nod in sympathy and pass on your personal favorite spirit to drink down while enacting said updates.
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Re: Something big

Post by fractalsponge1 » 2018-11-09 01:57am


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Re: Something big

Post by Esquire » 2018-11-09 08:47pm

I'm curious, are light weapons gun crew stationed inside the turrets, or are they controlled from positions inside the hull?
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Re: Something big

Post by Commander Veers » 2018-11-12 11:05am

So much detail added... Do these reduxes add a lot of vertices/triangles/whatever they're called? I.e. does it increase by an order of magnitude or something? Your computer is both very blessed to have these ships on it and very unfortunate to have to render them all lol.

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Re: Something big

Post by fractalsponge1 » 2018-11-19 12:06am

Next scout update:

https://www.artstation.com/artwork/qAQ9GR
Esquire wrote:
2018-11-09 08:47pm
I'm curious, are light weapons gun crew stationed inside the turrets, or are they controlled from positions inside the hull?
I expect they would be remotely controlled for the most part.

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Re: Something big

Post by PhoenixKnig » 2018-11-19 09:36pm

Looks great and almost finished
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Re: Something big

Post by fractalsponge1 » 2018-11-27 11:01am

Scout finished: https://www.artstation.com/artwork/zADRY4

Calling it Lightskimmer

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Re: Something big

Post by Ender » 2018-11-27 08:02pm

fractalsponge1 wrote:
2018-11-27 11:01am
Scout finished: https://www.artstation.com/artwork/zADRY4

Calling it Lightskimmer
Very nice. That ship (and really all those old 90s comics in general) just had such a distinct art style. Much better that Jan Duursema and her tracing promo shots and stills in the clone wars comics of the aughts.

I'm curious, do you have volumes for the models you've made? Like how many cubic meters they would be; iirc most ISDs are ~10^8 m^c I'd be interested in all, but particularly in the smaller ships you've done - the corvette, dreadnaught, etc.
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Re: Something big

Post by fractalsponge1 » 2018-11-28 05:20pm

Ender wrote:
2018-11-27 08:02pm
fractalsponge1 wrote:
2018-11-27 11:01am
Scout finished: https://www.artstation.com/artwork/zADRY4

Calling it Lightskimmer
Very nice. That ship (and really all those old 90s comics in general) just had such a distinct art style. Much better that Jan Duursema and her tracing promo shots and stills in the clone wars comics of the aughts.

I'm curious, do you have volumes for the models you've made? Like how many cubic meters they would be; iirc most ISDs are ~10^8 m^c I'd be interested in all, but particularly in the smaller ships you've done - the corvette, dreadnaught, etc.
On a very basic level. The measurement tools that I know about in the software don't really take into account any overlapping objects, instead just summing them. Most accurate measurements would require making the models all "water-tight" as single continuous objects and I just don't have the patience for that. If you want specific ships I can fuse enough basic shapes together to get down to a reasonable approximation of main hull volume down to maybe a few thousand m3 without too much trouble. Any particular ones you want measured?

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Re: Something big

Post by Ender » 2018-11-29 10:24pm

fractalsponge1 wrote:
2018-11-28 05:20pm
Ender wrote:
2018-11-27 08:02pm
fractalsponge1 wrote:
2018-11-27 11:01am
Scout finished: https://www.artstation.com/artwork/zADRY4

Calling it Lightskimmer
Very nice. That ship (and really all those old 90s comics in general) just had such a distinct art style. Much better that Jan Duursema and her tracing promo shots and stills in the clone wars comics of the aughts.

I'm curious, do you have volumes for the models you've made? Like how many cubic meters they would be; iirc most ISDs are ~10^8 m^c I'd be interested in all, but particularly in the smaller ships you've done - the corvette, dreadnaught, etc.
On a very basic level. The measurement tools that I know about in the software don't really take into account any overlapping objects, instead just summing them. Most accurate measurements would require making the models all "water-tight" as single continuous objects and I just don't have the patience for that. If you want specific ships I can fuse enough basic shapes together to get down to a reasonable approximation of main hull volume down to maybe a few thousand m3 without too much trouble. Any particular ones you want measured?
Oh if it would require extra work don't bother. I was mainly just looking for another way to estimate mass - before I moved on the big thing I had been working on was the logistics and expenditures of wars in SW since that shapes strategies and what kind of politics, society, and fleets you would have. Problem is with the high power and high acceleration you end up with caps on mass, which leaves you with a very limited peak power window. Has all sorts of broader implications.

Though tumbling onto this thread and thinking about the old stuff I used to work on got me digging through my email archive. A fair amount of correspondence and notes from the old brain trust in the late 90s and early aughts; things that never made it to publication; tidbits written in that got axed by later projects, etc. For example the Mandator was originally supposed to be 13.5 km long and do 6e27 watts, the 6km Procutator have a sustainable firepower of 7e26 watts. But then Revenge of the Sith came about and those got cut and the estimates downgraded. So it goes.

I could post highlights here if you are interested. Some of the stuff addresses topics that aren't in your design notes (eg sensors), others would potentially augment what you have there (eg how a higher power:mass ratio means a proportionately worse operating time), and some would let you take what you have and flesh them out more (eg how with cross section and peak power you can get theoretical max airspeed). But I also don't want to turn your thread into a case of "well I think the order of battle should be this and designs like that because of how we interpreted these bits of former canon 20 years ago".

Let me know! Again, love your work.
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Re: Something big

Post by PhoenixKnig » 2018-11-29 11:20pm

Ender wrote:
2018-11-29 10:24pm
fractalsponge1 wrote:
2018-11-28 05:20pm
Ender wrote:
2018-11-27 08:02pm


Very nice. That ship (and really all those old 90s comics in general) just had such a distinct art style. Much better that Jan Duursema and her tracing promo shots and stills in the clone wars comics of the aughts.

I'm curious, do you have volumes for the models you've made? Like how many cubic meters they would be; iirc most ISDs are ~10^8 m^c I'd be interested in all, but particularly in the smaller ships you've done - the corvette, dreadnaught, etc.
On a very basic level. The measurement tools that I know about in the software don't really take into account any overlapping objects, instead just summing them. Most accurate measurements would require making the models all "water-tight" as single continuous objects and I just don't have the patience for that. If you want specific ships I can fuse enough basic shapes together to get down to a reasonable approximation of main hull volume down to maybe a few thousand m3 without too much trouble. Any particular ones you want measured?
Oh if it would require extra work don't bother. I was mainly just looking for another way to estimate mass - before I moved on the big thing I had been working on was the logistics and expenditures of wars in SW since that shapes strategies and what kind of politics, society, and fleets you would have. Problem is with the high power and high acceleration you end up with caps on mass, which leaves you with a very limited peak power window. Has all sorts of broader implications.

Though tumbling onto this thread and thinking about the old stuff I used to work on got me digging through my email archive. A fair amount of correspondence and notes from the old brain trust in the late 90s and early aughts; things that never made it to publication; tidbits written in that got axed by later projects, etc. For example the Mandator was originally supposed to be 13.5 km long and do 6e27 watts, the 6km Procutator have a sustainable firepower of 7e26 watts. But then Revenge of the Sith came about and those got cut and the estimates downgraded. So it goes.

I could post highlights here if you are interested. Some of the stuff addresses topics that aren't in your design notes (eg sensors), others would potentially augment what you have there (eg how a higher power:mass ratio means a proportionately worse operating time), and some would let you take what you have and flesh them out more (eg how with cross section and peak power you can get theoretical max airspeed). But I also don't want to turn your thread into a case of "well I think the order of battle should be this and designs like that because of how we interpreted these bits of former canon 20 years ago".

Let me know! Again, love your work.
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Re: Something big

Post by PhoenixKnig » 2018-11-29 11:21pm

You could make a new thread and post a link here
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Re: Something big

Post by fractalsponge1 » 2018-11-30 12:47am

Ender wrote:
2018-11-29 10:24pm
fractalsponge1 wrote:
2018-11-28 05:20pm
Ender wrote:
2018-11-27 08:02pm


Very nice. That ship (and really all those old 90s comics in general) just had such a distinct art style. Much better that Jan Duursema and her tracing promo shots and stills in the clone wars comics of the aughts.

I'm curious, do you have volumes for the models you've made? Like how many cubic meters they would be; iirc most ISDs are ~10^8 m^c I'd be interested in all, but particularly in the smaller ships you've done - the corvette, dreadnaught, etc.
On a very basic level. The measurement tools that I know about in the software don't really take into account any overlapping objects, instead just summing them. Most accurate measurements would require making the models all "water-tight" as single continuous objects and I just don't have the patience for that. If you want specific ships I can fuse enough basic shapes together to get down to a reasonable approximation of main hull volume down to maybe a few thousand m3 without too much trouble. Any particular ones you want measured?
Oh if it would require extra work don't bother. I was mainly just looking for another way to estimate mass - before I moved on the big thing I had been working on was the logistics and expenditures of wars in SW since that shapes strategies and what kind of politics, society, and fleets you would have. Problem is with the high power and high acceleration you end up with caps on mass, which leaves you with a very limited peak power window. Has all sorts of broader implications.

Though tumbling onto this thread and thinking about the old stuff I used to work on got me digging through my email archive. A fair amount of correspondence and notes from the old brain trust in the late 90s and early aughts; things that never made it to publication; tidbits written in that got axed by later projects, etc. For example the Mandator was originally supposed to be 13.5 km long and do 6e27 watts, the 6km Procutator have a sustainable firepower of 7e26 watts. But then Revenge of the Sith came about and those got cut and the estimates downgraded. So it goes.

I could post highlights here if you are interested. Some of the stuff addresses topics that aren't in your design notes (eg sensors), others would potentially augment what you have there (eg how a higher power:mass ratio means a proportionately worse operating time), and some would let you take what you have and flesh them out more (eg how with cross section and peak power you can get theoretical max airspeed). But I also don't want to turn your thread into a case of "well I think the order of battle should be this and designs like that because of how we interpreted these bits of former canon 20 years ago".

Let me know! Again, love your work.
I'd love to see this stuff either way (this thread or a new one)!

My personal betting is that if we have to accept Mandator II at 8km and 7.7e26 (not super happy with this but ICS is ICS), a hypothetical Mandator III (which I fought for), is 12km and on the order of 1.5e27. I'd guess Executor is 2-3e27 and I designed Assertor at 4e27. On that basis, estimating Eclipse at 1-2e28. This all assumes ISD at 1e25, which I'm increasingly considering a bit of an underestimate.

I try not to dabble in hypothetical details of sensors too much - not quite sure how to scale them or their effects and capabilities except to build space for them. More aesthetic than technical.

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Re: Something big

Post by Ender » 2018-11-30 11:15pm

fractalsponge1 wrote:
2018-11-30 12:47am
Ender wrote:
2018-11-29 10:24pm
fractalsponge1 wrote:
2018-11-28 05:20pm


On a very basic level. The measurement tools that I know about in the software don't really take into account any overlapping objects, instead just summing them. Most accurate measurements would require making the models all "water-tight" as single continuous objects and I just don't have the patience for that. If you want specific ships I can fuse enough basic shapes together to get down to a reasonable approximation of main hull volume down to maybe a few thousand m3 without too much trouble. Any particular ones you want measured?
Oh if it would require extra work don't bother. I was mainly just looking for another way to estimate mass - before I moved on the big thing I had been working on was the logistics and expenditures of wars in SW since that shapes strategies and what kind of politics, society, and fleets you would have. Problem is with the high power and high acceleration you end up with caps on mass, which leaves you with a very limited peak power window. Has all sorts of broader implications.

Though tumbling onto this thread and thinking about the old stuff I used to work on got me digging through my email archive. A fair amount of correspondence and notes from the old brain trust in the late 90s and early aughts; things that never made it to publication; tidbits written in that got axed by later projects, etc. For example the Mandator was originally supposed to be 13.5 km long and do 6e27 watts, the 6km Procutator have a sustainable firepower of 7e26 watts. But then Revenge of the Sith came about and those got cut and the estimates downgraded. So it goes.

I could post highlights here if you are interested. Some of the stuff addresses topics that aren't in your design notes (eg sensors), others would potentially augment what you have there (eg how a higher power:mass ratio means a proportionately worse operating time), and some would let you take what you have and flesh them out more (eg how with cross section and peak power you can get theoretical max airspeed). But I also don't want to turn your thread into a case of "well I think the order of battle should be this and designs like that because of how we interpreted these bits of former canon 20 years ago".

Let me know! Again, love your work.
I'd love to see this stuff either way (this thread or a new one)!

My personal betting is that if we have to accept Mandator II at 8km and 7.7e26 (not super happy with this but ICS is ICS), a hypothetical Mandator III (which I fought for), is 12km and on the order of 1.5e27. I'd guess Executor is 2-3e27 and I designed Assertor at 4e27. On that basis, estimating Eclipse at 1-2e28. This all assumes ISD at 1e25, which I'm increasingly considering a bit of an underestimate.

I try not to dabble in hypothetical details of sensors too much - not quite sure how to scale them or their effects and capabilities except to build space for them. More aesthetic than technical.
Well I'm going on vacation tomorrow, I'll see about going through them all and pulling out and summarizing relevant bits.
بيرني كان سيفوز
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Nuclear Navy Warwolf
*
in omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro
*
ipsa scientia potestas est

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Re: Something big

Post by PhoenixKnig » 2018-12-01 04:02am

No rush
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Re: Something big

Post by fractalsponge1 » 2018-12-01 12:13pm

Well, here's my take on the Lancer.

I begrudge it its traditional "Frigate" rating - after all it's not even 2/3 the volume of a Vigil. But anyway. I tried to keep the traditional design cues, but tweaked the profile line to make it look less like a sex toy. The gun positions are provisional, but there are supposed to be 20 of them (only could ever find 18 on the old schematics, so improvised the last two). Mix of quadruple close-in defense lasers and paired light turbolaser/long-barrel laser cannon - make it more a useful small warship than just an antifighter platform.

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