Spoiler
BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
Moderator: Thanas
- Ariphaos
- Jedi Council Member
- Posts: 1739
- Joined: 2005-10-21 02:48am
- Location: Twin Cities, MN, USA
- Contact:
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
Bean, my reference was the thought I got at the beginning. It's still close enough in overall context, and contrary to what the hype was ("The ending is like nothing you've ever seen in a game before!" ...), other games have done this sort of theme before. Regardless
Spoiler
Spoiler
Give fire to a man, and he will be warm for a day.
Set him on fire, and he will be warm for life.
Set him on fire, and he will be warm for life.
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
Xeriar wrote:Bean, my reference was the thought I got at the beginning. It's still close enough in overall context, and contrary to what the hype was ("The ending is like nothing you've ever seen in a game before!" ...), other games have done this sort of theme before. Regardless
Spoiler
See not exactly Spoiler
"A cult is a religion with no political power." -Tom Wolfe
Pardon me for sounding like a dick, but I'm playing the tiniest violin in the world right now-Dalton
- Ariphaos
- Jedi Council Member
- Posts: 1739
- Joined: 2005-10-21 02:48am
- Location: Twin Cities, MN, USA
- Contact:
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
Spoiler
Give fire to a man, and he will be warm for a day.
Set him on fire, and he will be warm for life.
Set him on fire, and he will be warm for life.
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
Oh really? SpoilerXeriar wrote:Spoiler
"A cult is a religion with no political power." -Tom Wolfe
Pardon me for sounding like a dick, but I'm playing the tiniest violin in the world right now-Dalton
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
Spoiler
Actually, if you want to see a better game, look at Singularity. It actually gets away with a time loop story, giving you interesting ending options. And it's not so smug and pretentious about it's own plot. But I guess there wasn't a forbes journalist on station when Singularity came out. It's a hands-down better game in almost every aspect.
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
Not writing a good multiverse wasn't the core of my problems with the story.
I think the problems are actually fairly numerous.
Spoiler
I think the problems are actually fairly numerous.
Spoiler
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
As long as you were talking about a world where rail remains the primary mode of transportation and not just "lol, cars without steering wheels", I reckon that could work.Tolya wrote:It's like that: you can concoct a world in which there are cars but they only drive in a straight line. Which isn't a smart variation of our world, it is just plain stupid, because the whole point of having a car is being able to choose and alter your travelling direction.
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
My point is that nonsensical pretentious bullshit like that breaks the suspension of disbelief, which is perhaps one of the worst offences you can commit upon a narrative. It can be retarded or stupid, no big harm in that, as long as it's internally coherent.
- tezunegari
- Jedi Knight
- Posts: 693
- Joined: 2008-11-13 12:44pm
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
A theory about the ending:
Spoiler
"Bring your thousands, I have my axe."
"Bring your cannons, I have my armor."
"Bring your mighty... I am my own champion."
Cue Unit-01 ramming half the Lance of Longinus down Adam's head and a bemused Gendo, "Wrong end, son."
"Bring your cannons, I have my armor."
"Bring your mighty... I am my own champion."
Cue Unit-01 ramming half the Lance of Longinus down Adam's head and a bemused Gendo, "Wrong end, son."
Ikari Gendo, NGE Fanfiction "Standing Tall"
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
It's also a grandfather paradox*.
Which was new.
In 1943.
Maybe.
There should be a law about using time travel in fiction, if you've ended up with a grandfather paradox, especially as the resolution of your tale, you should be forced to go back in time and call yourself a dumbass.
*Spoiler
The thing about the grandfather paradox is that it's so old and oft seen that unless you have a really new take on it and deliberately acknowledge its presence it's just a sloppy plot hole that will annoy audiences that think about your fiction for more than two seconds in a row.
Which was new.
In 1943.
Maybe.
There should be a law about using time travel in fiction, if you've ended up with a grandfather paradox, especially as the resolution of your tale, you should be forced to go back in time and call yourself a dumbass.
*Spoiler
The thing about the grandfather paradox is that it's so old and oft seen that unless you have a really new take on it and deliberately acknowledge its presence it's just a sloppy plot hole that will annoy audiences that think about your fiction for more than two seconds in a row.
- FaxModem1
- Emperor's Hand
- Posts: 7700
- Joined: 2002-10-30 06:40pm
- Location: In a dark reflection of a better world
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
So, what's the point of the choices, the bird and the cage, the baseball, etc. It it all supposed to show that later on they all mean nothing because the game....I mean reality railroads you into doing things?
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
It means there are choices along the way, but minus true divergent points your path is fixed.FaxModem1 wrote:So, what's the point of the choices, the bird and the cage, the baseball, etc. It it all supposed to show that later on they all mean nothing because the game....I mean reality railroads you into doing things?
"A cult is a religion with no political power." -Tom Wolfe
Pardon me for sounding like a dick, but I'm playing the tiniest violin in the world right now-Dalton
- Guardsman Bass
- Cowardly Codfish
- Posts: 9281
- Joined: 2002-07-07 12:01am
- Location: Beneath the Deepest Sea
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
Spoiler
“It is possible to commit no mistakes and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life.”
-Jean-Luc Picard
"Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them."
-Margaret Atwood
-Jean-Luc Picard
"Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them."
-Margaret Atwood
- EnterpriseSovereign
- Sith Marauder
- Posts: 4261
- Joined: 2006-05-12 12:19pm
- Location: Spacedock
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
I played it through, and I found it was ok but I didn't enjoy the gameplay as much as the first two Bioshocks. Indeed pretty much as soon as I was done with infinite I played through 2 again and found it more enjoyable. And not just because I used the wiki to get the most out of the ADAM I collected either. Who knows, maybe if I play through Infinite again I might find it more fun
- Starglider
- Miles Dyson
- Posts: 8709
- Joined: 2007-04-05 09:44pm
- Location: Isle of Dogs
- Contact:
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
I thought this game was excellent, very well made in all regards. I played through it twice; 'Hard' was actually rather easy (as per Bioshock tradition) but 1999 mode was pleasantly challenging. Definitely the best game of the series in gameplay, writing and setting design - largely due to being free of annoying bullshit detracting from the experience in the first two games. Criticising for lack of gameplay innovation seems unfair - it had the skylines and tear mechanics, on top of the usual Bioshock magic/gunplay combination and weapon variety. The enemies were more inventive than the previous two games as well. Yes the writing came a bit unhinged at the end, but I forgive that for being generally ambitious and interesting. Plus the game is just outright beautiful, even moreso than Bulletstorm. Overall, a very pleasant surprise after Bioshock 2.
It contrasted sharply with another shooter I picked up around the same time (it finally got cheap enough); Halo 4. Now that really is a completely unoriginal and unintentive piece of crap (no mecha suit sequences do not count as an evolution over Halo 3). Totally linear, completely uninteractive environment, zero interesting characters (not even Cortanna any more), zero interesting dialog. Some nice art in the 'matte painting backdrop' sense but boring contrived gameplay areas devoid of anything that brings the environment to life. Finally, the exact same ultra-low-lethality gameplay Halo 1 presented. Completed it out of stubbornness but won't be bothering with the series again.
It contrasted sharply with another shooter I picked up around the same time (it finally got cheap enough); Halo 4. Now that really is a completely unoriginal and unintentive piece of crap (no mecha suit sequences do not count as an evolution over Halo 3). Totally linear, completely uninteractive environment, zero interesting characters (not even Cortanna any more), zero interesting dialog. Some nice art in the 'matte painting backdrop' sense but boring contrived gameplay areas devoid of anything that brings the environment to life. Finally, the exact same ultra-low-lethality gameplay Halo 1 presented. Completed it out of stubbornness but won't be bothering with the series again.
- Nephtys
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 6227
- Joined: 2005-04-02 10:54pm
- Location: South Cali... where life is cheap!
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
I found them actually more of an inversion of the standard 'you can choose your way!' game feature blurb that ends up not really being true. It's a 'You can choose your own way! Only not at all, it's deliberately inconsequential'. It messed with my expectations of what is currently 'standard' design, by highlighting how little choice your character has in any of the game's affairs.FaxModem1 wrote:So, what's the point of the choices, the bird and the cage, the baseball, etc. It it all supposed to show that later on they all mean nothing because the game....I mean reality railroads you into doing things?
So yeah. It's to highlight how totally railroaded you are. And not just from a 'we can't design an open ended game' way, but the 'the story is railroading you' way.
- Terralthra
- Requiescat in Pace
- Posts: 4741
- Joined: 2007-10-05 09:55pm
- Location: San Francisco, California, United States
Re: BioShock Infinite - Airships and Racism
The main story of BioShock 2 isn't nearly as good as the Minerva's Den DLC, though I may be a bit biased. Much more interesting story, new weapon/plasmid/tonics/etc., and generally more fun, for me. Did you try that one?Starglider wrote:Overall, a very pleasant surprise after Bioshock 2.