Balrog wrote:The Nazgûl do have Fell Beasts they fly into battle on. They've been mentioned riding on them in all three books (at least 2 of them )
Target practice for .50cal guns.
Real easy to aim one while being carried by the talons of a giant eagle.
"This cult of special forces is as sensible as to form a Royal Corps of Tree Climbers and say that no soldier who does not wear its green hat with a bunch of oak leaves stuck in it should be expected to climb a tree"
— Field Marshal William Slim 1956
Balrog wrote:The Nazgûl do have Fell Beasts they fly into battle on. They've been mentioned riding on them in all three books (at least 2 of them )
Target practice for .50cal guns.
Real easy to aim one while being carried by the talons of a giant eagle.
Though given they have to close to point black range to harm you....its likely to be amusing....
"Prodesse Non Nocere." "It's all about popularity really, if your invisible friend that tells you to invade places is called Napoleon, you're a loony, if he's called Jesus then you're the president." "I'd drive more people insane, but I'd have to double back and pick them up first..." "All it takes for bullshit to thrive is for rational men to do nothing." - Kevin Farrell, B.A. Journalism. BOTM - EBC - Horseman - G&C - Vampire
Enforcer Talen wrote:the eagles. that's brilliant. they fought in the war - I think they may send 3 eagles as preemptive strike.
In the book they consider giving the Eagles the ring to carry to Mt. Doom but rejected it because they be too easily spotted and stopped.
in what chapter? I have no memory of that.
and also, who will stop them? the nazgul who dont have wings?
Its in the Council of Elrond.
As for what could stop them, its unlikely the Eagles could manage the thermals over the main vent, so they'd need to land and enter the cracks of doom on the ground, Saruon would have a huge swarm of troops and archers waiting.
"This cult of special forces is as sensible as to form a Royal Corps of Tree Climbers and say that no soldier who does not wear its green hat with a bunch of oak leaves stuck in it should be expected to climb a tree"
— Field Marshal William Slim 1956
the nazgul dont get flyers till 20 yrs after we arrive. Im saying we move within the first five. no fliers to worry about.
and, how will sauron move troops that quickly? three eagles flying into mordor - why would he notice them? he doesnt even notice the two hobbits, and he's had two more decades to build up his forces.
fly in, land on the volcano, and someone walks in and throws the ring in. preferably 3 someones, so they can keep an eye on each other.
This day is Fantastic!
Myers Briggs: ENTJ
Political Compass: -3/-6 DOOMerWoW
"I really hate it when the guy you were pegging as Mr. Worst Case starts saying, "Oh, I was wrong, it's going to be much worse." " - Adrian Laguna
the nazgul dont get flyers till 20 yrs after we arrive. Im saying we move within the first five. no fliers to worry about.
and, how will sauron move troops that quickly? three eagles flying into mordor - why would he notice them? he doesnt even notice the two hobbits, and he's had two more decades to build up his forces.
fly in, land on the volcano, and someone walks in and throws the ring in. preferably 3 someones, so they can keep an eye on each other.
This day is Fantastic!
Myers Briggs: ENTJ
Political Compass: -3/-6 DOOMerWoW
"I really hate it when the guy you were pegging as Mr. Worst Case starts saying, "Oh, I was wrong, it's going to be much worse." " - Adrian Laguna
also, its in the eagles best interest to knock of sauron, and we can easily pay them hundreds of sheep or cows as danger pay. while we are training the troops, we're gaining territory with the agro military plan.
This day is Fantastic!
Myers Briggs: ENTJ
Political Compass: -3/-6 DOOMerWoW
"I really hate it when the guy you were pegging as Mr. Worst Case starts saying, "Oh, I was wrong, it's going to be much worse." " - Adrian Laguna
Enforcer Talen wrote:the nazgul dont get flyers till 20 yrs after we arrive. Im saying we move within the first five. no fliers to worry about.
and, how will sauron move troops that quickly? three eagles flying into mordor - why would he notice them? he doesnt even notice the two hobbits, and he's had two more decades to build up his forces.
Why do older radar stations easy pick out a F-16 at 25K, but miss the F-111 flying a 200 down a valley? Simple, ground clutter. It's far easier to look around the horizon then it is to pick up a couple people down on the ground.
fly in, land on the volcano, and someone walks in and throws the ring in. preferably 3 someones, so they can keep an eye on each other.
Might work, but then again the Eagles might say fuck it, drop you to your death and go steal some sheep like they always have. Heck, how do we even reach the Eagles to ask them for help?
"This cult of special forces is as sensible as to form a Royal Corps of Tree Climbers and say that no soldier who does not wear its green hat with a bunch of oak leaves stuck in it should be expected to climb a tree"
— Field Marshal William Slim 1956
I think the Zeppelin is the best bet, if we can manage to build it. It can fly higher than enemy artillery can go, and if the Nazghul do get their wings before they're supposed to, 6 men with assault rifles on board the thing could easily knock all of them down.
Damien Sorresso
"Ever see what them computa bitchez do to numbas? It ain't natural. Numbas ain't supposed to be code, they supposed to quantify shit."
- The Onion
Darth Wong wrote:
Target practice for .50cal guns.
I think we already went over that Wong
They were just asking if the Nazgûl had flying beasts.
And I was just reiterating that it doesn't matter. Or perhaps that was too complicated for you?
And I was simply answering a question, not making a point already discussed about 20-pages back.
Pretty quick, that Wong is
'Ai! ai!' wailed Legolas. 'A Balrog! A Balrog is come!'
Gimli stared with wide eyes. 'Durin's Bane!' he cried, and letting his axe fall he covered his face.
'A Balrog,' muttered Gandalf. 'Now I understand.' He faltered and leaned heavily on his staff. 'What an evil fortune! And I am already weary.'
- J.R.R Tolkien, The Fellowship of the Ring
Durandal wrote:I think the Zeppelin is the best bet, if we can manage to build it. It can fly higher than enemy artillery can go, and if the Nazghul do get their wings before they're supposed to, 6 men with assault rifles on board the thing could easily knock all of them down.
The Zeppelin idea, however, does hinge on a lot of aluminum. I suppose that if bamboo and artisans familiar with the material's properties were available, the skeleton of a very small Zeppelin could be made of bamboo, but otherwise aluminum seems like the only choice. Which brings up the problem of acquiring that much aluminum and turning it into structural members for a Zeppelin. Even if the base has a supremely well stocked machine shop, the only ready source of aluminum would be the HMMWV fleet.
Balrog wrote:And I was simply answering a question, not making a point already discussed about 20-pages back.
Pretty quick, that Wong is
Ahh, so you evaluate someone's intelligence based on the fact that he makes a point twice because he thinks it bears repeating? Interesting criteria, dumb-fuck.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
Patrick Ogaard wrote:
The Zeppelin idea, however, does hinge on a lot of aluminum. I suppose that if bamboo and artisans familiar with the material's properties were available, the skeleton of a very small Zeppelin could be made of bamboo, but otherwise aluminum seems like the only choice. Which brings up the problem of acquiring that much aluminum and turning it into structural members for a Zeppelin. Even if the base has a supremely well stocked machine shop, the only ready source of aluminum would be the HMMWV fleet.
Now, if you were to build a blimp...
Aluminium would be the first choice if we could get it....and bamboo would I suppose be an option...but there is a material in middle earth that might suit our needs for a project like this....mithril....it is mentioned as being extremely strong and very light. The two main qualities we'd be looking for....though as its highly sought after obtaining it might be problamatic....
"Prodesse Non Nocere." "It's all about popularity really, if your invisible friend that tells you to invade places is called Napoleon, you're a loony, if he's called Jesus then you're the president." "I'd drive more people insane, but I'd have to double back and pick them up first..." "All it takes for bullshit to thrive is for rational men to do nothing." - Kevin Farrell, B.A. Journalism. BOTM - EBC - Horseman - G&C - Vampire
Patrick Ogaard wrote:
The Zeppelin idea, however, does hinge on a lot of aluminum. I suppose that if bamboo and artisans familiar with the material's properties were available, the skeleton of a very small Zeppelin could be made of bamboo, but otherwise aluminum seems like the only choice. Which brings up the problem of acquiring that much aluminum and turning it into structural members for a Zeppelin. Even if the base has a supremely well stocked machine shop, the only ready source of aluminum would be the HMMWV fleet.
Now, if you were to build a blimp...
Aluminium would be the first choice if we could get it....and bamboo would I suppose be an option...but there is a material in middle earth that might suit our needs for a project like this....mithril....it is mentioned as being extremely strong and very light. The two main qualities we'd be looking for....though as its highly sought after obtaining it might be problamatic....
Its far to rare and expensive. Hell, there may no even be enough left outside of Mordor to build a large enough Zeppelin.
"This cult of special forces is as sensible as to form a Royal Corps of Tree Climbers and say that no soldier who does not wear its green hat with a bunch of oak leaves stuck in it should be expected to climb a tree"
— Field Marshal William Slim 1956
[quote="Sea Skimmer]
Its far to rare and expensive. Hell, there may no even be enough left outside of Mordor to build a large enough Zeppelin.[/quote]
Yeah, it'd be a pain in the ass to get anywhere near the amound we'd need....
Ah, 'tis a shame....
Also, a little plug...anyone else intrested in being in the fic I'm working on let me know...
"Prodesse Non Nocere." "It's all about popularity really, if your invisible friend that tells you to invade places is called Napoleon, you're a loony, if he's called Jesus then you're the president." "I'd drive more people insane, but I'd have to double back and pick them up first..." "All it takes for bullshit to thrive is for rational men to do nothing." - Kevin Farrell, B.A. Journalism. BOTM - EBC - Horseman - G&C - Vampire
Actually, a Schutte-Lanz pattern dirigable could be built out of plywood. Count Zeppelin wasn't the only German into building rigid airships, and SLs were combat-worthy in the Great War.
http://www.worldwar1.com/arms/zepp011.jpg - There's a picture of a Schutte-Lanz built dirigable. The Schutte-Lanz company was actually responsible for some of the late war design improvements (I have a book on the development of military airships in the Great War), and though they were generally slower and the plywood frame did have disadvantages, it was definitely workable.
So if you want an airship we can probably do one.
The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth. -- Wikipedia's No Original Research policy page.
The Duchess of Zeon wrote:Actually, a Schutte-Lanz pattern dirigable could be built out of plywood. Count Zeppelin wasn't the only German into building rigid airships, and SLs were combat-worthy in the Great War.
http://www.worldwar1.com/arms/zepp011.jpg - There's a picture of a Schutte-Lanz built dirigable. The Schutte-Lanz company was actually responsible for some of the late war design improvements (I have a book on the development of military airships in the Great War), and though they were generally slower and the plywood frame did have disadvantages, it was definitely workable.
So if you want an airship we can probably do one.
Well, since the Romans made their standard infantry shields out of what was effectively plywood, that technology is not out of reach. That is, as opposed to building a large-scale hydroelectric plant and then figuring out where usable deposits of bauxite are, and doing all the other stuff needed to churn out decent masses of aluminum.
Plywood it is, then. The hydrogen would make the machines flammable in any event, so adding some mildly flammable plywood is probably not an issue.
- There's a page with more information. Basically, we'd need to solve the glue problem if we wanted reliable over-water operation, though I should note that the German Army used them just fine, and they were employed safely in several, though not frequent, raids against England.
The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth. -- Wikipedia's No Original Research policy page.