Eh, didn't see the poem. I did get to see the inaguration before work. He had a good speech, and seeing the first president I was able to vote for, (and the first black president of the United States) take the oath of office was a powerful moment for me, minor hiccups or no.

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"These are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others."

-Groucho Marx

Um... yes, potentially so. Being of the "civil rights era" or a "blues song" doesn't give it a pass you know.


I wouldn't say grievously offensive, let's not blow this out of proportion here, but yeah, it was dwelling on stereotypes.

And I'm far from the only one here who's mentioned the issue.


Well, I'm "white as the driven snow" and I did take offense.


Oh, please - everyone else is getting mellow or getting ahead or not having to give back but white people have to be instructed to do what's right? You don't see anything the least off about that? Everyone else is OK, but white folks have to change. Right, right, because all the ills of the world are the white man's fault and the rest of the rainbow would be just fine if they all just disappeared or something.

Not to mention that the original lyrics of "Black, Brown, and White" referred to a double standard where a person of mixed race was considered OK (that's the "brown") but someone "black" was still barred from admittance, from service, from jobs. Gee.... inaugaurating a person of mixed race... hmmm.....You don't think that might have been a slam at Obama for not being "black enough"?

Here, by the way, are the original lyrics from the 1951 recording:

THAT song is not offensive, it's just describing an offensive situation. However, I found the manner in which it was woven into the benediction to be offensive. Again, it was everyone is OK but we're gonna ask God to change the white man 'cause the white man need changing! Gets back to the idea that only white people can be racist and it's impossible for "people of color" to be racially prejudiced.

Those "old lions" of the Civil Rights Movement have been harping about how Obama isn't really black or he's not black enough since he started outdoing Hilary in the polls. Sure, they got an African-American in the Oval Office but he's not their black man and they don't consider him one of them. How much do you want to bet they'll still be saying it 4 years from now, if not actually accusing him of being a traitor of some sort? Some of those "old lions" don't want equality, they want retribution.

I'm pretty sure that the 1951 was a rerelease, as Broonzy was more of a Swing era or Depression era performer. But I could be wrong, I favor the likes of Miles Davis, John Coltrane, and Bunny Berigan myself so I'm not real knowledgeable.

Anyway, a review of those lyrics notes that only 2 of the 5 lines are even tangentially represented. I find it unlikely it was an intentional reference, and much more likely it was a coincidence that he used the same words in a simple rhyme. It isn't like he was trying to use "orange" here.

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Nuclear Navy Warwolf
*
in omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro
*
ipsa scientia potestas est

Obama has retaken the oath, according to MSNBC. There's no article yet.

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"No matter how big a guy might be, Nicky would take him on. You beat Nicky with fists, he comes back with a bat. You beat him with a knife, he comes back with a gun. And if you beat him with a gun, you better kill him, because he'll keep comin' back and back until one of you is dead." - Sam Rothstein, Casino

"You know, Sung Tizzoo! The Chinese Prince Matchabelli!" - Paulie "Walnuts" Gualtieri

Of course it doesn't. However, this is a pretty low standard for "race baiting".

I wasn't addressing you individually. I'm assuming that's what you meant and you weren't making an appeal to popularity there.

Yes, plainly you did. However, I don't find your reasons very convincing.

Or, in the context of a prayer in which Lowry asks God to "help us to make choices on the side of love, not hate; on the side of inclusion, not exclusion; tolerance, not intolerance" and "help us to hold on to the spirit of fellowship and the oneness of our family", he was referring specifically to the problem of racism. Now, yes, I am completely aware that racial prejudice is a universal American phenomenon. Every race and ethnic group has its individuals who hate members or some or all of the other races and ethnic groups. That said, institutional racism and white privilege are problems for which white people have the lion's share of the responsibility, because President Obama withstanding, institutional power in this society is overwhelmingly concentrated in white hands. And institutional racism is a far bigger problem for most minorities than any individual racist.

Um...no? First of all, your interpretation of the song is completely wrong. Being mixed race wasn't "OK"--the rule was "just one drop", as in "just one drop of black blood is enough to make you black". If you were mixed-race, you were black, and you "got on back" along with everyone else. The "brown" may have referred to Hispanics, or possibly all other non-whites, who, in the Jim Crow era, had it pretty shitty, but not as bad as blacks. Second, even if that was what the song meant, the idea that Lowry included it because he thinks Obama isn't black enough is completely ridiculous, given 1) it doesn't make the least bit of sense in the context of the prayer, 2) the fact that there isn't a whisper of evidence Lowry ever believed Obama isn't black enough, and 3) all the "not black enough" nonsense is completely overblown to begin with, a fact I will address momentarily.

<snip song lyrics>

There is nothing anywhere in Lowery's remarks to indicate he believes only white people can be racist. You're reading that in there, based on a single line in a prayer which earlier called upon "us" to be more tolerant, with no distinction made between races. At any rate, individual racism isn't the problem, and Lowery is smart enough to know that. You can have systemic, institutional racism in an organization without any single individual within it actually being racist.

Who are these "old lions"? When did they say this? The source for the "not black enough" hoo-ha was a column in Salon by Debra Dickerson, in which she argued Obama wasn't really "black" because in America, "black" refers specifically to native-born African Americans whose ancestors were slaves, not recent African immigrants or their descendants (note that his being mixed-race is not part of the equation; she writes that some blacks worry he might deny being black because of his white mother, but not that he isn't black because he's mixed race). To my knowledge, nobody in the old guard civil rights establishment publicly agreed with Dickerson. The whole thing was a tempest in a teapot. It was probably brought up by more white reporters than actual black people.

Anyway, after all this, having reviewed the benediction and the crowd reaction, I think Lowery was riffing on the song more than anything else--the tone doesn't match the rest of the prayer, and he was obviously pleased when he got a laugh from the crowd. Doesn't mean he wasn't kidding on the square, so to speak, but I think people are getting way too worked up over a joke.

So you think it's a coincidence that, of all the words he could have chosen that rhyme with "black", "brown", and "white", he picked "back", "around", and used the specific phrases "get back" and "stick around"? He added "yellow" and "red", probably to be inclusive, and obviously changed up the lyrics somewhat, but if he didn't actually mean to quote Big Bill Broonzy, it wasn't a coincidence, it was a fucking miracle.

Retarded submission to the wingnuts but meh.

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"I put no stock in religion. By the word religion I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called the will of god. I have seen too much religion in the eyes of too many murderers. Holiness is in right action, and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves, and goodness. "
-Kingdom of Heaven

I also mentioned something about not blowing it out of proportion or getting carried away. I found it offensive, but not HUGELY offensive.


OK, we can have a different opinion, right?


Well, yes, I understand that - as I woman I face quite a bit of sexism which is a similar phenomena.


It wasn't just a mix of black and what that was disapproved of - there were states where any interracial crossing was illegal, be that white/black, white/Asian, black/Asian, whatever.


There was also a difference between the dark skinned black and the "high yellow" light skin blacks, many of whom could and did pass as white or at least as something that didn't have black in the background.


I disagree - individual racists can be quite horrible and damaging. I've encountered company owners who were racist and either refused to hire X group or, if they did, fired them for manufactured reasons shortly afterward. Refusing to hire and/or putting the black mark of "fired for cause" on someone's record unquestionably IS damaging. Individual racists help maintain institutional racism and indeed it's hard to see how institutional racism could endure long term without the individual racists.


'Scuze me, I was going off the scuttlebut in the neighborhood where I live and comments made outside the local polling place, not something I never read (or even heard of) in Salon. Yes, there's the "his ancestors weren't slaves" angle but also "his mom was white and he was raised by white grandparents" (similar to the rationale for keeping black children in foster care rather than be adopted by parents who just happen to be white) and "he sounds too white".

Then there's the crap Jesse Jackson, Sr. was heard to say (and captured) about cutting Obama's balls off - well, yeah, Jackson ran for PotUS in the past but no one took him seriously and there's some jealousy issues there.


It is entirely possible that he meant it as a joke but people didn't take it that way. However, white people who have a slip of the lip or say a joke in bad taste get pickets and lose their jobs and are verbally dragged through the mud. He shouldn't get a pass because he's black. He may not have intended to offend but if he did perhaps he should say "I didn't intend to offend and I'm sorry if I did so" just like a white man would be called upon to do.

I want to know what was in the note that Bush left on the Oval office desk for Obama to read.

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ASVS('97)/SDN('03)

"It was all Dick's fault."

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What a vivid imagination my brother has. At age five, he was able to deduce, through careful observation of the neighbours, that babies were brought not by the stork but rather by the midwife. In her satchel.
—Mycroft Holmes The Private Life Of Sherlock Holmes (1970)

People pray so that God won't crush them like bugs.
—Dr. Gregory House

Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
—The Doctor "Terror Of The Zygons" (1975)

I personally also took offense (as mentioned earlier, but like Broomstick wasn't overly bent out of shape about it) and what you posted is part of the reason why. Do I necessarily disagree with what you've just stated? No, not at all. However, there are a fair number (I have no idea if there is even an accurate number to be found) of white people that are not necessarily racist, and have no control over the color of their own skin and others actions due to it. Yet all white people, wrt the statement made, get lumped together as some sort of universal mindset. We wouldn't accept a logical argument with this premise, what is different here?

Essentially, imo he segregated a whole bunch of different skin colors and said "several of you are okay, but one of you needs some work". I find the comment to be rather divisive on a day that many of us, regardless of skin color, were trying to celebrate. No one here should be made accountable for the actions of others for reasons outside their control. I don't know much about you personally, but I wouldn't presume that you speak for every member of the various classes you belong to.

I would have been very hard for Taney to author Plessy v. Ferguson, as he died 28 years before Plessy even boarded the railroad car. He was the source of the court's opinion in the Dred Scott case, though.

I think it's more of a: "Oh, no. There will be none of that BS going around here!"

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Not an armored Jigglypuff

"I salute your genetic superiority, now Get off my planet!!" -- Adam Stiener, 1st Somerset Strikers

For clarification, the poem closing prayer/Benediction was delivered by Rev. Joseph Lowry, who had two different rhyming portions. One was "God of our weary years, God of our silent tears", which was part of a 1960's civil rights song called "Lift Every Voice and Sing":

Found here



The whole song:



He also had this rhyming portion (from the same blog):



That was NOT part of a old march (AFAIK) or song, it was just something he put in there. It is somewhat annoying, because a huge number of white people voted for Obama (indeed, we are not yet at the point where anyone could get elected without white votes)-- and, of course, without Obama up there in the first place, he'd not be there delivering these words.

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People debate against me, to help me.

Still having a huge problem with reflex posting. Got to think twice before posting a reply and creating a thread

IIRC the BBC said that other presidents that flubbed the oath in the past had also retaken the oath in private.

Well, think of it this way-- he basically said "someday, all you white folks out there will learn to become decent human beings".

What if a white presidential candidtae was being sworn in, and he hand-picked a white preacher to come up and give a prayer, and that white preacher said "someday, all you black people out there will get jobs and stay out of prison".

"How does 'My Pet Goat' end?"

Frankly what Lowery said struck me more as an expression of hope that the moment of equality between all skin colors was close at hand, than as some sort of race-baiting. Of course I'm not from the USA so I may be missing some cultural sensitivity thing here, but I kind of doubt it was the reverend's intention to divide on the eve of the Obama inauguration.

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SDN World 2: The North Frequesuan Trust
SDN World 3: The Sultanate of Egypt
SDN World 4: The United Solarian Sovereignty

There'll be a bodycount, we're gonna watch it rise
The folks at CNN, they won't believe their eyes

I agree in that I doubt he was trying to intentionally divide or insult; it's just that he kinda did without thinking. Part of the problem with prejudice in general is the things done out of ignorance, after all.

I thought it was a funny, silly little poem, wasn't aware that I as a white person should have been offended in some way.

If anyone was going to find a reason to be offended at the benediction, they could do better than suggesting implied racism. I thought it was frustratingly juvenile and base for such an august event, and even then I wasn't offended, merely baffled and disappointed.

Personally, I cringed when I heard that part of the benediction. Not because of what he said, but the fact that he had to bring such distinct race mentioning into his speech.

I wasn't aware that anyone stated you had to be offended by it. Not everyone was. That's not the point.

To be quite honest, I didn't have any problem with the benediction. As sensitive a subject as it is, racial division is still a significant problem in the United States, and I don't see why one should refrain from mentioning it, even on such a momentous occasion. The issue could, perhaps, have been treated more carefully, but I'd rather see a tactless sign that the new administration is willing to acknowledge racial issues than evidence that its going to turn a blind eye to them. Besides, a modicum of humor is rarely detrimental to any situation, even ones of extreme import.

It should be noted that I'm speaking as a white man, and can't speak for any other part of the benediction that some might have found offensive. The "white" bit didn't bother me, and I think calling it "race-baiting" implies malice or ignorance on the orator's part unjustly.

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The Rift
Stanislav Petrov- The man who saved the world
Hugh Thompson Jr.- A True American Hero
"In the unlikely story that is America, there has never been anything false about hope." - President Barack Obama
"May fortune favor you, for your goals are the goals of the world." - Ancient Chall valediction

I cringed when Aretha Franklin sung. That was not exactly pleasing to my ear. I realize they probably needed someone with a powerful voice, but it was a bit... much. The quartet's performance was much easier on the ear (actually, it was a live performance augmented by a recording, as it was too cold for the instruments to stay in tune).