Death of the American Icon: A Homicide Investigation

[Ai Phling Pu]

It occurs to me that there used to be certain things that were uniquely American. Things that defined Americans anywhere we were or whatever we were doing. There used to be American Icons.

John Wayne
Lucky Strikes
Corvettes
Pabst Blue Ribbon
Baseball
Rock 'n' Roll
Yankee Dogs
The Pledge of Allegiance

These things are being murdered one by one. The Pledge of Allegiance, while not the main focus of this thread, is an example.

While it is illegal to make any kind of reference to Christianity in public schools, a school in San Diego, California has been encouraging students to wear Muslim robes, adopt Muslim names, quote the Koran and go on a "pilgrimage".

Ask yourself: Why are we letting traditional American icons be distorted and destroyed to make room for the icons of those who wish us harm?

[David]

If this is another thread about the Pledge, it'll probably be lock. There have been about four others about this already

[Sam Or I]

I have always been more of a Mustang fan but the 2002 Corvette Z06 is pretty Bad Ass, able to beat cars that cost about 3 times as much. But I here what your saying, American culture is being torn down and consider not politically correct. Being a Man and doing manly things is considered almost bad now a days. Anything that does have the fluffy feel good feeling is looked down upon in the way the American culture is going. I personally think we as a society has become too sensitive.

[Wicked Pilot]

These things are being murdered one by one. The Pledge of Allegiance, while not the main focus of this thread, is an example.

While it is illegal to make any kind of reference to Christianity in public schools, a school in San Diego, California has been encouraging students to wear Muslim robes, adopt Muslim names, quote the Koran and go on a "pilgrimage".

Ask yourself: Why are we letting traditional American icons be distorted and destroyed to make room for the icons of those who wish us harm?

And out of the water jumps a...

Red Herring!


The Ca school district is currently being sued for this shameless indoctrination, just as they would if they were pushing any other religion.

Jesus man, learn to think before you type.

[IDMR]

Thread moved. Ai Phling Pu, you will note that despite your belief to the contrary, the Science and Logic forum is not analogous to the Politics and Religion forum.

[Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi]

It's not the government that's doing it. It's a small minority of liberal Left Coast hypocrites that are against all the good stuff this nation reprsents.

[David]

*chorkle*



I knew it.

[Pablo Sanchez]

Thread moved. Ai Phling Pu, you will note that despite your belief to the contrary, the Science and Logic forum is not analogous to the Politics and Religion forum.

Thank you for foisting this on me.

Hitlerite.

[David]

MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Dalton]

Thread moved. Ai Phling Pu, you will note that despite your belief to the contrary, the Science and Logic forum is not analogous to the Politics and Religion forum.

Thank you for foisting this on me.

Hitlerite.

Us, you tool!

[MKSheppard]

Thank you for foisting this on me.

Hitlerite.

GUNNERY SERGEANT HARTMANN MODE

Who said that? Who the fuck said that? Who's the slimy
communist shit twinkle-toed ******* who just signed his
own death warrant?

Gotta love R. Lee Ermery and his greatest creation,
with a quotable line for every situation.

[IDMR]

Thread moved. Ai Phling Pu, you will note that despite your belief to the contrary, the Science and Logic forum is not analogous to the Politics and Religion forum.

Thank you for foisting this on me.

Hitlerite.

::bows::

You are much too kind.

[Pablo Sanchez]

Us, you tool!

Well, sorry. Just forgot about you, because you hardly ever post here. *sniffle* You just don't appreciate these boards.

[EmperorChrostas the Cruel]

What we are seeing, is the legacy of the '60s. When it became fashionable to "examine ALL of societies long held, cherished beliefs". This somehow morphed into "discard all of societies old ideas."
Some good ideas, discarded by the new left:
Man/Woman heterosexual marriage, as the ideal (NOT only) way to raise a family.
Note: ideals are to be worked for, but there isn't anything wrong with not achieving them, provided you TRY. Obviously this option is not open to the homosexuals, or single parents, who must work with what they have/are. Don't confuse good with ideal.
Men and women have more differences in their nature than a simple x/y chromosome.(VIVA La difference!)
The two sexes don't need each other, to round out each other, like a left and right hand. (Which hand is "better"?)
Self esteem is less important than self control, and self respect. (criminals, to a man have high self esteem)
Myths:
Human nature is neither good or bad, morals values, and actions determine your "goodness". (You are what you say and do, not what you think) Would you rather be around a person that is hateful and crazy inside, but is so terrified of "Hell" that they never misbehave or acts rude,(HOW would you know if not telepathic)or someone who is well meaning but acts destructively? The liberal myth, is that your motive, not your achievements are important.(The road to hell is paved with good intentions.)
People are inherently good, so when they do do evil, it is because they had an outside influence that "overcame" their innate goodness. (poverty causes crime, not a value system) Look into history, as the great depression had the highest level of poverty, and one of the lowest crime rates in US history. It's the values stupid.
All cultures and economic system are equal, in both morality, and productivity. This is so stupid. Aztecs, (Open up your heart and let the sun shine in!) the Taliban, and some other cultures are better off gone from the planet.
Communism, is so much more fair and productive than Capitalism. BS! (look around the world.)Gross national product is DIRECTLY linked to personal and economic freedom, the very antithesis of communism.

In short the baby has been thrown out with the bath water.

Some of the ideas discarded WERE bad ones. Like racism, and sexism. There are more, but they are off my topic. I am discussing the lost good, not the lost bad. The 60s did hew away a LOT of dead wood, but the pruning was too harsh.

It is now the height of fashion, to claim that all ways of being and doing are all equally valid. Anything traditional is to be discarded, nothing is sacred. Animals are the legal equal to people.

The people who learned these ideas in the 60s are now in the age group where they are in power. They smugly sneer at those who hold to the truths that have stood up to the tests of time. They use these obviously untrue oddball notions and their belief in them, as proof of their intellectual "superiority". When asked to examine the results of there belief system, in the REAL world, they resort to saying their ideas were good, the people implementing them were at fault. "People are just not 'good' enough to make communism(fascism, theocracies, ect...) work, so we need to change human nature."Resident Commie" is a classic example. We are just not as "smart", or "aware" or "enlightened" as they are. You will see this constantly in the theme of their posts.
Why not use what works? That is not fair, as failure is possible.
Many people don't want to be in control of there own destiny, and want God, the State, or a ruthless dictator to do all their thinking for them. Conversly, they RESENT people that stand on their own two feet, eyes wide open, ready to face the consequences of their own thoughts and deeds.

[Ai Phling Pu]

Damn, Chrostas... I guess you find backup in the most unexpected places...

[David]

He hads out money like there is no tomorrow, so of couse he can find backup.

[IDMR]

He hads out money like there is no tomorrow, so of couse he can find backup.

Eight hundred posts? O Monkey Most Great, just what do you do for a living?

[David]

I just wasn't busy last week.

[Darth Wong]

I hate to break it to you, "Ai Phling Pu", but diversity is truly American. America was founded on diversity and plurality, by people who had largely fled the Old World because of its lack thereof.

The utterly imbecilic "American icon" past that you refer to is McCarthyism, where all diversity was deemed un-American (and where the Pledge was mutilated). It was the rise of Old World Christian theocratic intolerance in America.

But hey, why don't you just continue to spout your mindless diatribes about how you're being persecuted if you can't shove your close-minded attitudes down everyone else's throats against their will?

[David]

Hey if that only applies to America, then let us talk about the Canadian icon! Ahhhhh, are there any?

[Ai Phling Pu]

Darth Wong is obviously in need of remedial reading comprehension testing...

[Ai Phling Pu]

Quoting David: He hads out money like there is no tomorrow, so of couse he can find backup

Actually, I was referring to the fact that Chrostas apparently understood the point I was trying to make. I appreciate that, Chrostas.

[David]

Oh okay. I read it all wrong.

[Darth Wong]

Hey if that only applies to America, then let us talk about the Canadian icon! Ahhhhh, are there any?

Bob and Doug McKenzie

It would appear that our national icon is to be a bunch of clowns. Our most famous exports are viewed that way: Mike Myers, Michael J. Fox, John Candy, William Shatner, Jim Carrey ...

[Carcharodon]

I hate to break it to you, "Ai Phling Pu", but diversity is truly American. America was founded on diversity and plurality, by people who had largely fled the Old World because of its lack thereof.

The utterly imbecilic "American icon" past that you refer to is McCarthyism, where all diversity was deemed un-American (and where the Pledge was mutilated). It was the rise of Old World Christian theocratic intolerance in America.

Not that I want to spar with you, Mr. Wong, because I agree with your basic intentions. However, any society that exercises political and cultural independence for a long enough period of time and places value on that independence will inevitably evolve certain cultural characteristics that are both distinctive to and widely accepted within that society. There's nothing inherently wrong with this, as long as the majority of that society's members don't start declaring that their new culture represents the only way or the best way to behave and believe. That's McCarthyism. There's a very big difference between cultural pride alone and xenophobia.

If a society creates something new and laudable and the majority within that society take pride in it, then that's something to be celebrated. Ralph Waldo Emerson expressed this view quite well in his speech "The American Scholar." Every society is entitled to icons that reflect the best of its values or commemorate the best parts of its history. If there's something morally wrong with a perceived icon, that's altogether different from the concept of having icons being flawed in itself.

Diversity is vital to a healthy society, but so is having shared cultural traits (or, if you prefer, icons) that produce a feeling of community and a sense of common identity. This is fully compatible with the pursuit–I would even say with the obligation–of learning about other societies and occassionally assimilating aspects of their cultures. To see what happens without social unity, take a look at the Balkans.

New cultural characteristics are shared with other cultures through the movement of people and the exchange of ideas. That's the way diversity arises in the first place, and it's all good. The more the better. But the society they originally came from can still take pride in the ideas as being "theirs" in the beginning. Every society has that right, not just ours. The only caveot is that every society must acknowledge the universality of this right. We must be as accepting of other cultures and respectful of their icons as we are proud of our own.

If there's any complaint I have about you Canadians, it's that you aren't loud enough. A lot of people around the world think we're too narcissistic down here. Perhaps that's somewhat true, and we should do better. Nevertheless, to all of them, I still say this: When we're arrogant or myopic, then call us on it. Otherwise, who says you can't be just as proud as we are if you want to be? We can still get along. Modesty is a good thing to practice in moderation, but so is displaying a positive self-image to others. Good relations require both.