The fall of my childhood heroes continues (Hulk Hogan)

[mr friendly guy]

So Chuck Norris turns out to be a Christian fundamentalist Tool, Kevin Sorbo likewise and an Anti-semite to boot, the Ultimate Warrior was a homophobic bigot, and now Hulk Hogan hates African Americans. Good thing the WWE body slammed his sorry arse.

http://nypost.com/2015/07/24/why-is-wwe ... -mentions/

What you gonna do when the Hulkster runs wildly racist on you?
If you’re WWE, you’re going to fire the company’s most iconic pro wrestler.
Wrestling legend Hulk Hogan was body-slammed by WWE on Friday when it was revealed he went off on a racist tirade in his infamous sex tape that’s at the center of a lawsuit with Gawker, according to reports.
Hogan is heard spewing hate speech in a conversation about his daughter, Brooke, and her African-American boyfriend, sources told Radar Online and The National Enquirer:
“I mean, I’d rather if she was going to f–k some n—-r, I’d rather have her marry an 8-foot-tall n—-r worth a hundred million dollars! Like a basketball player! I guess we’re all a little racist. F–king n—-r.”
WWE has scrubbed Hogan from several online platforms, according to a report by Wresting Inc: His profile was removed from the Alumni section of WWE’s website, related merchandise was removed from its online shop and Hogan was removed from the cast listing for Tough Enough, a WWE-produced reality series.
“WWE terminated its contract with Terry Bollea (aka Hulk Hogan),” said a statement from WWE. “WWE is committed to embracing and celebrating individuals from all backgrounds as demonstrated by the diversity of our employees, performers and fans worldwide.”
Hogan followed with a boiler-plate apology later Friday morning.
“Eight years ago I used offensive language during a conversation. It was unacceptable for me to have used that offensive language; there is no excuse for it; and I apologize for having done it,” Hogan said in a statement given to People magazine.
“This is not who I am. I believe very strongly that every person in the world is important and should not be treated differently based on race, gender, orientation, religious beliefs or otherwise. I am disappointed with myself that I used language that is offensive and inconsistent with my own beliefs.”
Hogan first alluded to the discord with a cryptic tweet posted early Friday morning:

The backdrop for this controversy is the ongoing lawsuit in which Hogan — call him Terry Bollea in court, please — is suing Gawker Media for $100 million for invasion of privacy, after the website published a clip from the 2006 sex tape allegedly featuring Hogan and the then-wife of his then-best friend. The trial was set to start July 6, but was postponed with an October hearing and no new trial date.
Friday’s reputation-puncturing reveals about Hogan — whose stage persona exhorted kids to say their prayers and take their vitamins — surely help Gawker’s defense.
Hogan has a history with the n-word. Online wrestling forums dusted off a years-old radio interview on DJ Whoo’s SiriusXM show in which Hogan uses the slur several times in telling a story.

DJ Whoo Kidd asked: “You’ve been saying ‘brother’ for years. Any black guy ever say, ‘Yo, you my n—-r, you my n—-r, Hulk?'”
Hogan replied: “Well, Booker T [a black ex-wrestler] used to say that to me on TV, and, you know, every time I pull up YouTube there’s that famous thing that Booker T .. .goes, ‘I’m coming for you, my n—-r.’
“They’re all calling me n—-r, and then I started saying it and you know, I always said it, but now all of a sudden I get heat when I said it.”

I loved how he and the Ultimate Warrior would fight Sergeant Slaughter, Colonel Mustafa and some other guy in a 3 vs 2 tag team match at Summerslam. I know people overuse the phrase "raping of our childhood memories" in regards to remakes and sequels, but this IMO certainly feels like that.

[Purple]

I am always confused as to why people feel bad when the actor playing a role they liked turns out not to be the same person he is playing.

Also, on a tangent I honestly think that it is a travesty to allow companies to fire people over the things they say and do in the privacy of their own homes. Does no one see a problem with allowing employers to control an employees private life this way?

[SCRawl]

Also, on a tangent I honestly think that it is a travesty to allow companies to fire people over the things they say and do in the privacy of their own homes. Does no one see a problem with allowing employers to control an employees private life this way?

Why do you feel that a company needs special permission to fire an employee (or, as is likely in this case, an independent contractor)?

As for why Hogan needed to be fired, well, he's a public figure, paid to promote his employer's brand. You can't maintain and build your employer's brand if the public you're building it with knows that you're a racist asshole.

[Ziggy Stardust]

Also, on a tangent I honestly think that it is a travesty to allow companies to fire people over the things they say and do in the privacy of their own homes. Does no one see a problem with allowing employers to control an employees private life this way?

Were you also one of the people that was complaining when Donald Sterling had his NBA team taken away in similar circumstances?

[Channel72]

So Chuck Norris turns out to be a Christian fundamentalist Tool, Kevin Sorbo likewise and an Anti-semite to boot, the Ultimate Warrior was a homophobic bigot, and now Hulk Hogan hates African Americans. Good thing the WWE body slammed his sorry arse.

Your childhood heroes suck. My childhood hero was always Captain Picard, and so far Patrick Stewart hasn't turned out to be a racist asshole, or really, an asshole of any kind.

Anyway, I don't think this is an example of actual hatred towards black people - Hulk Hogan, like millions of other idiots, is probably a "casual racist" and probably thinks there's no problem with that. Basically what that means is that he thinks he's better than black people, but doesn't necessarily hate them.

[Korvan]

I can't help but feel this outing of public figures over racist language used in private (or not so private) conversations is just a smoke screen. We can all feel better that the bad racists get what's coming to them, while in the meantime racism continues to quietly happen in HR departments.

Now if I became a public figure, it wouldn't be long till I got into trouble. Not for racist language; I grew up not exposed to it as my home town was small enough that we were on first name basis with all of our minorities. Not for homophobic language because in my day those terms were not used casually, but instead used to start fights. However, sexist language is firmly entrenched in me and despite my efforts to avoid using it, I'll still from time to time refer to my girly arms when I fail to open a stuck jar. Or I'll tell a friend to stop being a pussy when he's hesitating to do something (usually something stupid). I'm slowly improving though. Helps being back at school where I'm surrounded by some extremely capable women who are more than happy to show me up when I attempt to "assist" them in assembling some piece of lab equipment.

[Joun_Lord]

I doubt Hogan is actually racist or atleast no more racist then most people. He said some pretty racist things in the heat of the moment. When someone is angry they are going to say some terrible shit. He was apparently angry at the boyfriend so he is going to rag on him, use expletives and bad words to describe him and saying uncouth things about him. His use of the n-word is akin to someone calling a woman the b-word in the head on the moment, doesn't mean they hate women they just might really hate one woman in particular at that moment.

That doesn't really excuse what he said but it doesn't mean he is some terrible person. I'm sure I've said worse in anger, as probably have most people here and everywhere. Right or wrong it is human nature to say naughty things aboot people when we be all angry at them. Or while playing an online game.

Such words as the n-word, the b-word, the f-word and so on have such a bit because they are so taboo and will be the go to word to describe someone who rates your ire even if you don't have anything against 99.99999% of black people, women people, or gay people.

I'd like for this to be a learning experience rather then a witch hunt or a circle jerk as people pat themselves on their back about demonizing the racist but in reality all the education in the world can't stop people from saying bad shit when they are upset anymore then we could stop people from being upset in the first place.

All that said though, its still a shock to the system to hear Hulk freaking Hogan say such a word. He was the Hulkster. He was a icon. He was in Gremlins 2. He was a hero to many kids, myself included, and to hear him say the n-word would be like hearing Superman say it.

Somewhere my 5 year old self in his gaudy Hulkamania yellow muscle shirt is bawwing his eyes out.

[General Zod]

It's disappointing but not entirely surprising. Hogan's had a history of assholish behavior offstage, but maybe this was the final straw for Vince. Gawker's been getting some nasty backlash for publicizing celebrity sex scandals lately though, so this might eventually work out in Hogan's favor.

[Lord Pounder]

He heavily used the N-word which in modern society is unacceptable as well as openly admits he is a racist. He also complains that his daughter is dating/fucking a black guy and that is unacceptable unless said black guy is an NBA star on a seven figure salary. That's unbelievably racist.

I can see why WWE immediately fired him, he was a brand ambassador for them and from what I've read there is worse to come such as a tape of him calling The Rock a "half breed". However to give him the Chris Benoit treatment and erase him from the records is remarkably two faced. Vince McMahon has built a company on stereotypes and bad taste. Remember the Mexicools? Three Mexican wrestlers who rode lawn mowers to the ring. Remember Degeneration X getting up in black face to parody the Nation of Domination (itself another very bad stereotype). Vince McMahon himself has parodied an employee who suffered from strokes and Bells Palsy.

[The Romulan Republic]

He sounds really racist and I don't give two shits about wrestling, but as a matter of principle I'm against changing records to remove him. That's just so... Orwellian and dishonest. We don't approve of him now so pretend he never existed.

Edit: I can sympathize with the decision to fire him though given that from what's been said in this thread he was a representative of the company who's job is to make them look good, and this scandal would damage his ability to portray them in a good light. I don't think being a racist means someone should be unemployed for the rest of their life, but when its a PR job... yeah.

[Gandalf]

He sounds really racist and I don't give two shits about wrestling, but as a matter of principle I'm against changing records to remove him. That's just so... Orwellian and dishonest. We don't approve of him now so pretend he never existed.

It's no more Orwellian than WB suppressing their old racist cartoons or Walmart not selling the Confederate flag. A commercial organisation is faced with the fact that a product of theirs has had its meaning changed, and to continue to sell/endorse it would be a net negative for the company.

[The Romulan Republic]

Its different because in the examples you gave, they're deciding not to display material that is itself racist. That's reasonable and commendable (though I still would say that some copies of those things should be preserved as historical artifacts because we need to remember that the bad parts of the past happened, not whitewash history).

Its a very different thing, however, to try to remove stuff because it refers to someone who said something racist somewhere else.

Surely you can see the distinction.

[Gandalf]

The issue isn't that the things themselves are racist, but their associations with racism in the minds of their consumers. Please pay attention.

How do you feel about networks not showing The Cosby Show any more?

[The Romulan Republic]

You can make an argument that "associations" make it against a company's interest to show these things, but I still feel that there is a distinction between showing actual racist material like the examples you gave and showing something about someone who said something racist somewhere else, and that the treatment of the two should not be identical.

As for Cosby's show, I don't feel very strongly about it either way. I wouldn't want all tapes of the show to be burned, but if a network decides that they aren't going to show it because it makes them look bad or to make a point, I'm not going to particularly hold it against them.

Edit: I would object, however, if the networks deleted any reference to having worked with Cosby in the past to make themselves look good. That would be dishonest.

[Vendetta]

Its a very different thing, however, to try to remove stuff because it refers to someone who said something racist somewhere else.

Wrestling is always a little bit odd when it comes to whether a wrestler is "somewhere else" or not.

If a wrestler is using his stage name, he's using a brand owned by the WWE and not himself and so is effectively appearing as a representative of his employer no matter what he's actually doing.

[mr friendly guy]

I am always confused as to why people feel bad when the actor playing a role they liked turns out not to be the same person he is playing.

Also, on a tangent I honestly think that it is a travesty to allow companies to fire people over the things they say and do in the privacy of their own homes. Does no one see a problem with allowing employers to control an employees private life this way?

The same reason why its "ok" for an employee to do something in his private life, is also the same reason why its ok for a private company to not associate with said person. To suggest the company should not, is impinging on the company's (or their Board's) private business is it not?

[General Zod]

He sounds really racist and I don't give two shits about wrestling, but as a matter of principle I'm against changing records to remove him. That's just so... Orwellian and dishonest. We don't approve of him now so pretend he never existed.

Edit: I can sympathize with the decision to fire him though given that from what's been said in this thread he was a representative of the company who's job is to make them look good, and this scandal would damage his ability to portray them in a good light. I don't think being a racist means someone should be unemployed for the rest of their life, but when its a PR job... yeah.

Hogan owns a shop down in Florida and he's licensed his name out to some businesses so it's not like he's going to be begging the government for aid anytime soon. Besides, the dude's in his 60s and despite being in pretty good shape he hasn't wrestled full time in years aside from one offs. No idea what he was earning from merch sales but he's definitely not the company's top seller right now.

[The Romulan Republic]

I'm not really worried about his well being.

Now, firing some ordinary low-income employee for saying something racist would be a different matter. At that point you'd basically be wrecking someone's life and potentially making them a burden on others for saying something bad.

Edit: Of course, if they're being racist on the job, I consider firing them entirely fair. At that point, its effecting their performance as an employee.

[General Zod]

Not really. Employers aren't legally allowed to tell your future employers why you were fired because it means they can be sued. So for anyone else being fired in a non public matter over racism wouldn't necessarily be a black mark unless you were stupid about it.

[The Romulan Republic]

Its not so much a question of why they were fired being known as it is a question of how hard it can be for anyone to find a new job.

Edit: And how utterly fucked you can be if you're poor, particularly in the United "health care is a luxury" States of America.

[General Zod]

Like I said, unless you're a complete moron it's not. Worst case the employer can say they will not consider rehiring you in the future,.

[The Romulan Republic]

Really? Correct me if I'm wrong, but America's unemployment rate is still rather high, isn't it? It certainly has been for a prolonged period recently.

[Purple]

Why do you feel that a company needs special permission to fire an employee (or, as is likely in this case, an independent contractor)?

What I think is that there should be some protection for employees against willful termination for things they say and do outside of their workplace. Because to not have those means you are allowing the company to censor and control their employees personal life.

As for why Hogan needed to be fired, well, he's a public figure, paid to promote his employer's brand. You can't maintain and build your employer's brand if the public you're building it with knows that you're a racist asshole.

That makes sense somewhat. But again, see it from my perspective. It's very easy to explain a few things away and make excuses. X is a public figure. Y is rich enough to not care anyway. Etc. But the bottom line is that you are allowing the employer to encroach on the employee in his private life and control his or her behavior outside of the time that he is paying for. And there is no actual difference from a moral or legislative standpoint between this and someone firing you because you posted something stupid on facebook whilst drunk one night.

The same reason why its "ok" for an employee to do something in his private life, is also the same reason why its ok for a private company to not associate with said person. To suggest the company should not, is impinging on the company's (or their Board's) private business is it not?

That only goes if you assume that companies are equal to human beings and that the state should not in any way protect the rights of workers. A stance which I find to be abhorrent. Enterprises are not people. And all over the world we have laws that limit the employer and protect the employee from them for a good reason. "We don't like you any more." should newer be a valid reason for termination.

[General Zod]

Really? Correct me if I'm wrong, but America's unemployment rate is still rather high, isn't it? It certainly has been for a prolonged period recently.

These are legal guidelines any human resources person can tell you. It's possible your employer can go flapping their gums but if it ever gets back to you you can sue the shit out of them.

[The Romulan Republic]

Really? Correct me if I'm wrong, but America's unemployment rate is still rather high, isn't it? It certainly has been for a prolonged period recently.

These are legal guidelines any human resources person can tell you. It's possible your employer can go flapping their gums but if it ever gets back to you you can sue the shit out of them.

Okay, are you being an imbecile or a fucking liar? Because I have been clear that I am talking about how hard it can be to get a job and how not having one can screw you over regardless of weather your employer says why they fired you.

Don't act like I'm ignorant and stupid because you don't get it fucking straight.