Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

OT: anything goes!

Moderator: Edi

Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Poll ended at 2014-11-12 05:11pm

Yes
53
60%
Maybe
5
6%
No
26
29%
Don't Know
5
6%
 
Total votes: 89

User avatar
Terralthra
Requiescat in Pace
Posts: 4741
Joined: 2007-10-05 09:55pm
Location: San Francisco, California, United States

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Terralthra » 2014-10-14 04:10pm

You seem to be missing that these are happening in real life. Someone left a dead animal in her mailbox. People call not just her, but her extended family, and threaten them, and tell them how horrible their daughter/cousin/etc. is. And not for nothing, but they also waste huge amounts of other people's time and money calling in food deliveries to the targets' houses. This isn't just "stop reading Twitter."

User avatar
Elheru Aran
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 12878
Joined: 2004-03-04 01:15am
Location: Georgia

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Elheru Aran » 2014-10-14 04:24pm

This behavior has been going on for a while, ever since Anonymous proved it could be done without major consequences for most of the people involved. The GamerGate thing is just the most recent incarnation of this attitude.
It's a strange world. Let's keep it that way.

User avatar
Spekio
Jedi Knight
Posts: 762
Joined: 2009-09-15 12:34pm
Location: Brazil

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Spekio » 2014-10-14 04:31pm

Elheru Aran wrote:This behavior has been going on for a while, ever since Anonymous proved it could be done without major consequences for most of the people involved. The GamerGate thing is just the most recent incarnation of this attitude.
Really guys? You need more screen shots to prove harassment against people in GG? Milo, a reporter from breitart who gave positive coverage was sent a syringe. A lot of people were doxxed, some by Quinn herself. Do you know what most people are doing? Writing e-mails to company reps.

This is really not 4chan doing a raid.

User avatar
Elheru Aran
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 12878
Joined: 2004-03-04 01:15am
Location: Georgia

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Elheru Aran » 2014-10-14 04:36pm

Spekio wrote:
Elheru Aran wrote:This behavior has been going on for a while, ever since Anonymous proved it could be done without major consequences for most of the people involved. The GamerGate thing is just the most recent incarnation of this attitude.
Really guys? You need more screen shots to prove harassment against people in GG? Milo, a reporter from breitart who gave positive coverage was sent a syringe. A lot of people were doxxed, some by Quinn herself. Do you know what most people are doing? Writing e-mails to company reps.

This is really not 4chan doing a raid.
I didn't say the people being harassed are angels themselves. I can see that for myself. They don't need to be fucking with people themselves either. The fact that there are little to no consequences (AFAIK) for that is a problem too, just as much as the initial Gamergate harassment is a problem. (By Gamergate I'm referring to the specific harassment of gamer-chicks, if that's unclear).
It's a strange world. Let's keep it that way.

User avatar
Terralthra
Requiescat in Pace
Posts: 4741
Joined: 2007-10-05 09:55pm
Location: San Francisco, California, United States

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Terralthra » 2014-10-14 04:54pm

Spekio wrote:
Elheru Aran wrote:This behavior has been going on for a while, ever since Anonymous proved it could be done without major consequences for most of the people involved. The GamerGate thing is just the most recent incarnation of this attitude.
Really guys? You need more screen shots to prove harassment against people in GG? Milo, a reporter from breitart who gave positive coverage was sent a syringe. A lot of people were doxxed, some by Quinn herself. Do you know what most people are doing? Writing e-mails to company reps.
"People in GG have been harassed, too" is a tu quoque fallacy. That GGers are being harassed is also bad.

If you believe anything Breitbart.com publishes, you have major issues. Breitbart has a repeated, public history of staging hoaxes designed to make the targets look bad. The purported ACORN videos, the "Friends of HAMAS" hoax, the Shirley Sherrod selective editing...they have zero credibility.

As for Zoe Quinn doxxing someone, I highly doubt that, but you're welcome to produce evidence.

User avatar
Civil War Man
NERRRRRDS!!!
Posts: 3763
Joined: 2005-01-28 03:54am

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Civil War Man » 2014-10-14 05:01pm

I voted yes, because the whole thing has completely ignored the actual lack of ethics in gaming journalism (and journalism as a whole) in favor of focusing almost exclusively on harping on Quinn's sex life and accusations of "SJWs" having persecution complexes while simultaneously crying about being persecuted by the media and the aforementioned SJWs who are all apparently part of some vast conspiracy that exists for no other reason but to silence the GamerGate people.

If there's really a concern about the lack of ethics with gaming journalism, there's much bigger problems than a developer that most people had never heard of until this whole shit show started sleeping around. It may perhaps be an apt metaphor for one of the major ethical problems in the industry (with the reviewer and the developer literally in bed with each other), but it would be a more accurate comparison if it was a story of a gaming journalist who was sleeping around with multiple developers, exchanging sex for more access.

User avatar
Spekio
Jedi Knight
Posts: 762
Joined: 2009-09-15 12:34pm
Location: Brazil

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Spekio » 2014-10-14 05:08pm

I'll repeat myself: I'm not stating that there is no harassment, I'm saying it's coming and going in every direction.
As for Zoe Quinn doxxing someone, I highly doubt that, but you're welcome to produce evidence.
Image
Image

I refuse to link to the doxx, but it's one google search away. If you are not persuaded by the screen shot, I'll pm you an archive today link.

User avatar
Terralthra
Requiescat in Pace
Posts: 4741
Joined: 2007-10-05 09:55pm
Location: San Francisco, California, United States

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Terralthra » 2014-10-14 05:13pm

Screen shot...of what? Her posting a link to someone else's article? It would seem that the article in question did the doxxing, so perhaps you ought to blame Nathalie Collida.

User avatar
Spekio
Jedi Knight
Posts: 762
Joined: 2009-09-15 12:34pm
Location: Brazil

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Spekio » 2014-10-14 05:17pm

If you don't see anything wrong in broadcasting the doxx of a minor, a transgender one at that, we are done.

User avatar
Terralthra
Requiescat in Pace
Posts: 4741
Joined: 2007-10-05 09:55pm
Location: San Francisco, California, United States

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Terralthra » 2014-10-14 05:19pm

I'm pretty sure that article says, explicitly, that no personally identifying information was contained within it for said underage (claimed) transgendered person.

User avatar
Spekio
Jedi Knight
Posts: 762
Joined: 2009-09-15 12:34pm
Location: Brazil

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Spekio » 2014-10-14 05:27pm

There were pics that were removed. You can search the doxx yourself if you doubt me.

User avatar
Guardsman Bass
Cowardly Codfish
Posts: 9280
Joined: 2002-07-07 12:01am
Location: Beneath the Deepest Sea

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Guardsman Bass » 2014-10-14 06:29pm

Did I ever say that I think doxxing is unacceptable under any circumstances? If you're being a reprehensible person spouting slander and vandalizing wikipedia pages with it, then I'm not exactly going to shed a tear if someone outs you - but I'm also not going to link* to your personal information/address/phone number/family members to try and encourage people to go beyond condemnation to outright harassment, stalking, and death threats.

* If you've engaged in criminal activity, though, then I might report you to the police.
“It is possible to commit no mistakes and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life.”
-Jean-Luc Picard


"Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them."
-Margaret Atwood

User avatar
Broomstick
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 27003
Joined: 2004-01-02 07:04pm
Location: Industrial armpit of the US Midwest
Contact:

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Broomstick » 2014-10-14 07:42pm

Jub wrote:Should I feel afraid every time a stranger gets close to me when I'm walking alone at night, or when a less than well kept person approaches me at a bus stop?
Well, if we ever needed proof Jub wasn't a woman (as if that was ever in doubt) there's proof.

I'm sorry it fractures your veneer, Jub, but that is EXACTLY the world for the majority of women. Fear of every stranger. Fear of many acquaintances.

Maybe that has an effect on how they view threats, hm?
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. - John F. Kennedy

Sam Vimes Theory of Economic Injustice

Darmalus
Jedi Master
Posts: 1131
Joined: 2007-06-16 09:28am
Location: Mountain View, California

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Darmalus » 2014-10-14 08:20pm

Broomstick wrote:
Jub wrote:Should I feel afraid every time a stranger gets close to me when I'm walking alone at night, or when a less than well kept person approaches me at a bus stop?
Well, if we ever needed proof Jub wasn't a woman (as if that was ever in doubt) there's proof.

I'm sorry it fractures your veneer, Jub, but that is EXACTLY the world for the majority of women. Fear of every stranger. Fear of many acquaintances.

Maybe that has an effect on how they view threats, hm?
Which is weird, since according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, men are twice as likely to be a victim of violence from strangers, but women are four times as likely to be victimized by an "intimate partner". So a woman should be less afraid of strangers (than a man) but more afraid of her friends and family.

User avatar
Broomstick
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 27003
Joined: 2004-01-02 07:04pm
Location: Industrial armpit of the US Midwest
Contact:

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Broomstick » 2014-10-14 08:54pm

No argument there - but when have people ever been rational?

Also keep in mind that while men are more likely to be victims of violence in general, women are FAR more likely to be sexually assaulted, and even today sexual assault can have life-long negative repercussions to the victim.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. Leonard Nimoy.

Now I did a job. I got nothing but trouble since I did it, not to mention more than a few unkind words as regard to my character so let me make this abundantly clear. I do the job. And then I get paid.- Malcolm Reynolds, Captain of Serenity, which sums up my feelings regarding the lawsuit discussed here.

If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich. - John F. Kennedy

Sam Vimes Theory of Economic Injustice

User avatar
Guardsman Bass
Cowardly Codfish
Posts: 9280
Joined: 2002-07-07 12:01am
Location: Beneath the Deepest Sea

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Guardsman Bass » 2014-10-14 10:22pm

It would appear that people opposed to Anita Sarkeesian have escalated to threats of mass murder and terrorism:
Deseret News wrote:
LOGAN — A prominent feminist scheduled to speak at Utah State University on Wednesday has canceled her presentation after an email threatening a campus shooting was sent to the school.

The message, sent to about a dozen school offices late Monday night, threatened "the deadliest school shooting in American history" if Anita Sarkeesian, a feminist known for her critical look at how women are portrayed in popular media, is allowed to speak at the school.

The email, provided to the Deseret News by USU, purports to have been written by a student with access to a semiautomatic rifle, several pistols and pipe bombs.

"I'm giving you a chance to stop it," the message reads, demanding that Sarkeesian's presentation be canceled.

Sarkeesian was invited by USU's Center for Women and Gender to speak Wednesday as part of the school's weekly Common Hour presentation series. The speech had been scheduled to take place as planned until Sarkeesian contacted the school and canceled Tuesday night.

Sarkeesian asked school officials whether firearms would be allowed in the auditorium where she was scheduled to speak. USU officials replied that, in accordance with Utah law, anyone with a valid concealed carry permit would be able to enter with the gun, according to a statement released by the university.

State and local law enforcement, the FBI and other specialists were contacted as soon as the email was discovered, USU spokesman Tim Vitale said. Those who reviewed the message say it is unlikely a USU student sent it and that the threat is consistent with others that Sarkeesian has received in the past, Vitale added.

The sender has not been identified, and the investigation is ongoing.

"We are an institution of higher learning. We educate people. This is what we do. In this case, we invited a nationally known speaker who is bringing an interesting perspective about an important topic," Vitale said.

Increased security measures were already in the works before USU received the email in light of threats made against Sarkeesian in the past.

Sarkeesian is the founder of Feminist Frequency, a Web series that looks to deconstruct female stereotypes in pop culture, as well as harassment of women online and in video gaming.

The writer of the threatening email calls Sarkeesian "everything wrong with the feminist woman" and blames feminism for the emasculation of Western men. The message also refers to to Marc Lepine, the gunman behind a deadly attack against women at a Canadian university in 1989, as a hero and promises a similar shooting at USU, specifically referencing Sarkeesian, attendees at the presentation, and students and staff at the women's center.

No prior threats had been made against USU in the 17 years Vitale has been on campus, he said.
By the way, if you want to read the e-mail sent in by the anonymous psychopath, it's here.
“It is possible to commit no mistakes and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life.”
-Jean-Luc Picard


"Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them."
-Margaret Atwood

User avatar
Elfdart
The Anti-Shep
Posts: 10398
Joined: 2004-04-28 11:32pm

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Elfdart » 2014-10-14 10:41pm

Terralthra wrote:People in GG have been harassed, too" is a tu quoque fallacy. That GGers are being harassed is also bad.

If you believe anything Breitbart.com publishes, you have major issues. Breitbart has a repeated, public history of staging hoaxes designed to make the targets look bad. The purported ACORN videos, the "Friends of HAMAS" hoax, the Shirley Sherrod selective editing...they have zero credibility.

As for Zoe Quinn doxxing someone, I highly doubt that, but you're welcome to produce evidence.
Indeed. I remember when Andrew Breitbart croaked and the first thing that popped into my mind was that this was just another of his countless hoaxes.

Guardsman Bass, I don't know what's more fucktarded, the death threat itself or the fact that under Utah's gun laws the college was compelled to let people with guns into the auditorium when they know of a specific threat to shoot the people in the room.
"One way we recognize a mass hysteria movement is that everyone who doesn’t believe is accused of being in on the plot. This has been going on virtually unrestrained in both political and media circles in recent weeks."

--Matt Taibbi

User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 20963
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2014-10-14 11:15pm

I think the threats to Utah State deserve a thread in News and Politics. Or perhaps its time for a general domestic terrorism in America thread like the one for North Korea given how much of this kind of shit happens.

Darmalus
Jedi Master
Posts: 1131
Joined: 2007-06-16 09:28am
Location: Mountain View, California

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Darmalus » 2014-10-14 11:18pm

I have to wonder if it would have been better not to cancel and either show them to be impotent (if nothing happened) or show them to be a serious problem that should be cracked down on (if they made good on their threats). But that's easy for me to say since it's not my life on the line.

I have to wonder where these people come from. Are they increasing in number, indicating something in our society is broken and needs to be fixed (and making fighting any particular group futile, like a hydra)? Or are they shrinking but getting louder, like a cornered animal?

User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 20963
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2014-10-14 11:29pm

I can't condemn Sarkeesian for not speaking. Risking her life and the life of everyone who goes to see her speak to make a point is a lot to ask for.

I blame the State of Utah, the piece of scum who made the threat, and the Federal government and American politics in general for not saying fuck the NRA and banning concealed carry nationwide, or at least at events like this and places where a threat has just been made.

If Obama had a spine and a moral compass, he would go on national television and condemn Utah's laws for aiding terrorism.

Block
Jedi Council Member
Posts: 2333
Joined: 2007-08-06 02:36pm

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Block » 2014-10-14 11:46pm

The Romulan Republic wrote:I think the threats to Utah State deserve a thread in News and Politics. Or perhaps its time for a general domestic terrorism in America thread like the one for North Korea given how much of this kind of shit happens.
If it were credible, sure. Did you miss where it's consistent with previous threats to her that weren't carried out either?

User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 20963
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2014-10-15 12:06am

A threat to commit a mass shooting is inherently serious, especially when its so easy to commit a mass shooting and mass shootings happen so often. The fact that other threats were not carried out does not guarantee that this one wouldn't have been carried out. A threat does not have to be carried out to be serious and illegal. And the threats to Utah State were evidently serious enough to achieve the objective of keeping Sarkeesian from speaking, thus silencing a person the person making the threat did not approve of.

So take your smug little question and piss off, you apologist for terrorism.

Block
Jedi Council Member
Posts: 2333
Joined: 2007-08-06 02:36pm

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Block » 2014-10-15 12:48am

I'm not disputing that it was illegal or stupid. I'm saying that calling it domestic terrorism is a pretty big stretch. More like criminal harassment.

User avatar
The Romulan Republic
Emperor's Hand
Posts: 20963
Joined: 2008-10-15 01:37am

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by The Romulan Republic » 2014-10-15 12:58am

This is a case of someone threatening to commit mass murder, apparently because of a position and objective that could be considered political.

I may be stretching the definition, but not by much.

User avatar
Terralthra
Requiescat in Pace
Posts: 4741
Joined: 2007-10-05 09:55pm
Location: San Francisco, California, United States

Re: Is #GamerGate misogyny posing as concern for ethics?

Post by Terralthra » 2014-10-15 02:03am

Spekio wrote:There were pics that were removed. You can search the doxx yourself if you doubt me.
At the bottom of the article, below the part selectively screenshotted above, there's a part wherein further information is revealed of the claimed-transgendered person admitting that he is pretending to be female to gain an advantage online, and clarifies that he is totally a guy.

Post Reply