Patrick Degan wrote:
Atomic bombs and ICBMs. Ever hear of those?
Yeah. Last I checked, they couldn't kill the majority of the planet as in revelation.
"The majority of the planet" at that time being what was known as the Roman Empire —which was not the majority of the planet even then. Also, a third part of mankind is not a majority, which is what Revelation alleges in its so-called "prophecy". Whereas we can actually bring about the deaths of half the present
planetary population —either directly or indirectly— using modern nuclear and bioweapons quite effectively.
Since when have there been regular trade exchanges or diplomatic relations between human society and Hell? What indication is there to show that Hell is keeping up with the modern world?
Why would hell go in for trade exchanges or diplomatic relations anyway? Surely you don't think this would be an appropriate argument for the nonexistence of alien technology, so why would it apply to Hell?
Leaving aside your ridiculous red herring of alien technology for the moment, the fact that there aren't regular exchanges between Hell and Earth points to a Hell which is isolated culturally and politically, as well as scientifically, from a world which has far outstripped it in terms of destructive capability.
Humans can also rise up en masse against whips and chains. They don't control the mind, unlike the incantations in a magick book can do with demons. Really, you're being a bit dense here.
No, I am pointing out that potentially being dominable by force doesn't stop technological progress within a society.
No, you are missing the point entirely. If a demon can be bound and controlled simply by a book of magick words and phrases and not by any physical coercion, that means that it's not capable of managing a feat which oppressed humans are capable of and have demonstrated time and time and time again throughout history —the ability to resist, rise up, and overthrow a master.
The Black Arts can be a useful adjunct in certain applications. It's technology and science, however, which will win the war.
The black arts will give science the data it needs to attack
which will do the actual attacking. What's your point?
Really? All Judges 4:13-16 says is that the Lord "discomfited" Sisera and it seems it's down to his using a sword and Barak who's acting for him. Sisera's forces are destroyed on the pursuit by Barak's army —not Yahweh. That does not contradict the earlier passage in which he wasn't able to drive out the inhabitants of the valley with their iron chariots.
It doesn't say Yahweh was driving anyone out, it says Judah (or rather, the men of) was/were. He intervenes in Judges 4, but only enough to let the israelites win the day rather than do everything himself.
No no no, Mr. Zuul —the idea in a debate is to advance points which help,
your argument. If Yahweh is all-powerful as his fan club's sales-pitch always has it, he's not supposed to either be stopped by iron chariots or need to rely on his flunkies to get the job done. For fuck's sake, Zeus kicked ass when he decided to take on anybody in direct combat and never needed an army of devout flunkies to do his work for him and here we see Yahweh apparently unable to act to the same level of prowess as Zeus.
Somehow, I don't see a modern armoured force in Abrams MBTs getting too "discomfited" by a sword-wielding deity.
It says he made them panic and doesn't say how, just that he did it. I don't see why being in an Abrams would make you immune to panic (or being stabbed in the temple by a woman you've befriended previously).
Maybe because the crew of an Abrams tank, seeing some nutter in front of him waving a sword about, knows that said nutter will wind up making a mess on his treads but nothing more. So what's to panic? Also, I don't see any modern general being dumb enough to let some woman he met only a couple of days before get close enough to drive a nail through his skull (BTW, just why couldn't the supposedly all-powerful Yahweh knock off Sisera on his own?). Nor would that be enough (even if such a ludicrous assassination attempt succeeded) to prevent the second-in-command from taking over and leading his tanks forward with combined air and artillery support backing him up.